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maddrops t1_j3393by wrote

The officers involved were probably justified in shooting the guy with the huge machete, but it's worth remembering that a better outcome would be if nobody ended up dead. This outcome should be seen as deficient even if the actions of the people involved were completely by the book.

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Mobile-Strength1548 t1_j3krumf wrote

It was a knife btw not a machete. The 911 caller misunderstood it to be a machete thus a lot of articles states that but it was found out that he only had a knife. Still a deadly weapon but I still feel like one or two shot could have put him down and not kill him.

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kiwi-cucumber t1_j339413 wrote

There’s plenty of cop violence and negligence in this world, but this situation didn’t sound like one of them.

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Cheerfail t1_j33zmsg wrote

Someone is dead at the hands of police--it's a failure of the system.

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TheTr7nity t1_j33wvhx wrote

CPD is one of the more professional and progressive police departments around. Looks like activists reaching for something, ANYTHING, to be mad about.

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Dewhiteful t1_j35vwkp wrote

I think of it more as a coping mechanism, the manifestation of some shocked and/or grieving people needing to redirect their emotional energy to something they think is productive

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Chunderbutt t1_j33r5km wrote

Sounds like the guy was harming himself, police came and finished the job.

A wild guy with a machete is a threat to the public, but it's definitely not a win when the police fail to stop him without killing him.

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noob_tube03 t1_j32xvxw wrote

Only thing the CPD needs to be held accountable for is their comically low traffic citations.

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unresolved_m t1_j32y8w0 wrote

Should those be comically high instead?

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AMWJ t1_j3323er wrote

Yes please!

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unresolved_m t1_j332dhe wrote

lol - are you a cop?

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AMWJ t1_j332pvs wrote

I'm not a cop. To be honest, it's not cops I want to be bestowing comically large numbers of traffic tickets.

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unresolved_m t1_j3355cs wrote

If not cops, then who? I thought they're the ones giving out tickets.

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AMWJ t1_j33f2wy wrote

They are the ones who currently give out tickets, but others, who might not be armed with lethal weapons, could do it instead. The city has many employees.

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pob3D t1_j332sue wrote

You have to tell me if you are.

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unresolved_m t1_j334x9u wrote

Sure am. How did you figure that out?

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massmanx t1_j343oeo wrote

I’ll assume you are one based on the response.

Honest question for you: could the city automate bus lane violations and just mail tickets based on license plate?

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Daenyth t1_j36u7jz wrote

It's illegal in MA to have automated tickets. The law needs to change first

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maxwellb t1_j36ursy wrote

No, that would require a change in state law.

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unresolved_m t1_j344ox6 wrote

>Honest question for you: could the city automate bus lane vIiolations and just mail tickets based on license plate?

I think city could do whatever it wants to do. Its the question of who's asking and how much power they got, really.

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unresolved_m t1_j344hgb wrote

Based on the response that got me "you hate cops". Right.

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massmanx t1_j345zo7 wrote

I was unsure if there was some kind of law in Massachusetts that prevents it since we don’t seem to have red light cameras and use human meter maids for those types of violations. But thanks for your response

Edit: removed rude remark on my part

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unresolved_m t1_j346l1u wrote

Why remove the rude remark? You should've kept it - rude remarks make you look smarter. Happens all the time on Reddit.

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noob_tube03 t1_j3309iw wrote

For the amount of infrastructure Cambridge spends money on to reduce cyclist/pedestrian deaths and promote traffic easing, they should consider just increasing PD presence for much cheaper

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unresolved_m t1_j330ikl wrote

I thought there's already enough PD presence as it is? I see cop cars all around.

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noob_tube03 t1_j336oj5 wrote

hence...... holding them accountable for the low citations?

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unresolved_m t1_j3376iu wrote

How would doing higher citations make cops better?

Is that like beating homeless people to improve morale?

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noob_tube03 t1_j338glr wrote

Hey I'm not the one who reduced the city wide speed limit and spent hundreds of thousands on traffic easing. I'm just saying, if the cops did their job, perhaps these other initiatives wouldn't be needed

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thatguy10095 t1_j338y8p wrote

Cop presence doesn't reduce crime/citeable offenses. More citations just means more money goes to the city in fines.

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noob_tube03 t1_j339qje wrote

Not sure how you get people to not park in the bike lane without fines, but sure.

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thatguy10095 t1_j33aeq0 wrote

Protected bike lanes would definitely be a place to start. Fines are only a deterrent if you don't have the money to pay them. Maybe some sort of strike system where you get your license suspended if you're cited enough times. But more cops wouldn't necessarily fix the issue.

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maxwellb t1_j36vm4c wrote

There is a three strike system already, though I don't think it includes obstructing a bike lane. You could advocate for changing the state law to include bike lane obstruction, but you then have to take responsibility for suspending licenses of the various gig workers that rely on their car to survive, and I feel like that's probably too unpalatable.

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thatguy10095 t1_j36xf7r wrote

I don't have to take responsibility for anything lmao, the drivers who continuously get citations to the point of suspension would be responsible for themselves. We don't say the state is responsible when someone gets their license suspended for breaking other road laws, this would be no different.

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maxwellb t1_j36xlpb wrote

We do though (maybe you personally don't), just like e.g. people hold politicians responsible for ruining lives with penalties for nonviolent drug offences. Crucially the current rules only suspend licenses for moving violations, which have a very different risk profile.

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thatguy10095 t1_j36y58j wrote

I blame politicians for not taking action to right the unjust laws, but I still hold the offenders responsible for their own actions. I may agree that the law is unfair, but I understand the consequences associated with breaking it. And in this case, I can blame the politicians for not taking action that would make parking in the bikelane more difficult to do (such as protected lanes), but if there were a law in place that lead to drivers licenses being suspended I would still hold the offenders responsible for their own actions.

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maxwellb t1_j36yeht wrote

I agree. To clarify, what I'm saying is I think there would be too much push back because of that issue (combined with drivers who push back on accountability in general) for it to get traction.

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unresolved_m t1_j339pm8 wrote

So cops should punish more people. Got you.

Not something I agree with, but its a unique approach nonetheless.

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noob_tube03 t1_j33abfl wrote

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. If there is no enforcement, laws are all about the honor system. If these changes are for safety, presumably they're being done because people were being unsafe. If too many people are speeding, just dropping the speed limit without enforcing it isn't going to do anything

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unresolved_m t1_j33afd9 wrote

My point is that you cops to be harder on everyone and I don't think that that's a good solution. Looking at your post history and your love of guns I can see why you would think that way, though.

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noob_tube03 t1_j33cm0q wrote

I think you're just hating cops to hate cops. Like, I'm all ACAB too. But at the end of the day, we have them. And so yeah, I want them to do their job. If speed is an issue, give out speeding tickets. If blocking the bike lanes and running cyclists off the roads is an issue, impound their cars and take away their licenses. Police are still the enforcement of the laws. They're pigs, but until you replaces they with robots then you still gotta ask them to do their job. Equating speeding tickets to beating the homeless pretty much gives me all the perspective I need from you 🤣

Hell, that's why I'm pro gun. Because I don't trust CPD to do their job lmao. Cops have zero accountability

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unresolved_m t1_j33dt6o wrote

There you go with your blank statements.

I don't hate cops. I got nothing against them. I don't remember calling on anyone to kill a cop either.

But saying that cops aren't aggressive enough as it is a bit like saying that morale improves with beatings.

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noob_tube03 t1_j33f1jo wrote

https://www.reddit.com/r/CambridgeMA/comments/wmqo3d/are_there_any_plans_for_cpd_to_start_enforcing/

​

"cpd should do their job" = "cops should be more aggressive, like increasing beatings to improve morale". but yeah, no bias there

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unresolved_m t1_j33gg07 wrote

> This is pretty troubling data and likely makes our streets more dangerous for cyclists and pedestrians.

Maybe the Officers are afraid of being labeled as racist or as racial profiling for pulling over drivers?

Sounds like I'm not the only one thinking what I'm thinking.

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Anustart15 t1_j3440x6 wrote

>So cops should punish more people.

For traffic violations? Absolutely. There is 0 enforcement and people just do whatever the fuck they want driving (and cycling) around here and it's dangerous

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unresolved_m t1_j344z9k wrote

Is that why I see so many cop cars around?

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Anustart15 t1_j34h35q wrote

Just because they are around doesnt mean they are pulling people over for traffic violations. I watch people very blatantly break the law in front of cops without any repercussions all the time

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unresolved_m t1_j3538ps wrote

And yet I was told I hate cops right in this same thread. Go figure.

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Anustart15 t1_j355jy3 wrote

Not sure what that had to do with what I said, but okay

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unresolved_m t1_j356pnh wrote

No, its just funny, because the responses in this thread are all over the place.

I was initially told that I hate cops (there were a whole rant how I'm a part of ACAB), others say cops aren't doing enough and thus guilty and so on and so forth.

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zeratul98 t1_j334sqi wrote

We don't need more cops, we at most,need them to actually do their jobs.

And citing someone for parking in a bike lane doesn't require carrying a gun. Hell, it wouldn't even require cops if we could create a bounty program like some other cities have

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noob_tube03 t1_j336kln wrote

That is literally my point. The CPD should be held accountable for not doing their job (at traffic enforcement).

That said, stripping a CPD of their gun if they're only on traffic enforcement creates a huge amount of issues. For example, it gives them a good excuse to increase head count as they would claim needing x number of people for patrol vs y for traffic. If you just treat them the same it keeps the budget down. Plus, if a traffic stop is done on someone dangerous, it feels like a waste for them to need to call in backup. Not every traffic stop is citing someone parking in the bike lane.

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Bounty programs are ripe for abuse. Traffic cameras aren't legal in Cambridge/MA, so a bounty program likely wouldnt be either

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zeratul98 t1_j345ce8 wrote

>For example, it gives them a good excuse to increase head count as they would claim needing x number of people for patrol vs y for traffic

Good thing they don't get to set their own budget

>Plus, if a traffic stop is done on someone dangerous, it feels like a waste for them to need to call in backup

This is rare, and another weak argument. Without more clarification, your argument implies police should be more armed and/or they should travel in larger groups. If you don't agree with either concept, why is the status quo the right level?

>Bounty programs are ripe for abuse

Everything is abusable. It's about balancing trade-offs. I struggle to imagine what kind of terrible abuse someone could do with this though. No one's going to be dragging cars into bike lanes for the sake of getting a cut of a ticket

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jmreagle t1_j344oic wrote

Who has a bounty system?

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zeratul98 t1_j346xdb wrote

NYC has bounties for reporting idling vehicles. I believe they are currently in the process of expanding it to include those parked in bike lanes

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maxwellb t1_j36we54 wrote

I think given the composition of the supreme court, any rule blocking officials performing traffic stops from carrying a gun is unlikely to survive.

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crazicus t1_j33hggw wrote

Infrastructure is there 24/7, cops can’t be

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BuckyWunderlick007 t1_j32z0iv wrote

They don’t enforce traffic laws out of fear of being labeled inequitable in their enforcement.

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posthaste99 t1_j3509hq wrote

How is it people actively in crisis get killed but mass shooters are often walked out alive? Like what do cops actually do?

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odLott t1_j37gon8 wrote

Justice for Sayed means there is an investigation into the shooting to determine whether lethal force was justified or not. It seems that this will take place, so the department is being held accountable. Not sure what the point of this sign is, other than they seem to have reached their own conclusions without all the facts.

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AMWJ t1_j332ikh wrote

That was fast.

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Harmony_w OP t1_j3339kb wrote

My thoughts. It had been less than a day since the incident.

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JamesHerms t1_j35cf6y wrote

suicide-by-cop. [usage note] The person must (1) evince an intent to die; (2) consciously understand the finality of the act; and (3) confront a law-enforcement officer with behavior so extreme that it compels that officer to act with deadly force.

—Black’s Law Dictionary, 11th ed.

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viva_purehearted11 t1_j3dmqb9 wrote

This incident is definitely alarming especially because it took place in a progressive neighborhood like Cambridge. A man in distress who was agitated got even more triggered when cops showed up. Why are cops viewed antagonistically? Is it not important for anyone to feel relieved about seeing a cop? I can't help but wonder how the situation would have changed if instead of cops EMT had showed up in response to the 911 call.

It is really not acceptable to say that the cops could not defuse the situation without killing a 20 year old man in distress.

Justice for Sayed is not punishing the officer but a serious overhaul of high emergency situation protocols and trainings.

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bagelwithclocks t1_j37uzuf wrote

Most reliable suicide method.

CPD: "Don't kill yourself, thats our job".

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[deleted] t1_j343ryf wrote

[deleted]

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fordag t1_j347qwr wrote

According to reports I have read they did first use Less-Lethal attempts to stop him and they failed. Tasers are not magic they don't stop everyone.

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some1saveusnow t1_j35mb2l wrote

Please tell this to the legions of anti police on Reddit who surely lack the myriad skills and physical abilities to perform any of the maneuvers they conjure should be employed in crisis/high adrenaline/armed and attacking situations.

“They signed up for the job”.

Well someone has to, and it’s never the hyper critical of police crowd.

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Harmony_w OP t1_j345brr wrote

Exactly this. There are so many ways to disarm people. Look to cops in other countries as an example. Why are American cops so quick to end a life?

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fordag t1_j347xn2 wrote

How would you disarm an extremely agitated and violent man wielding a machete?

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splashybather t1_j349ijr wrote

Look into how British police (who don't carry guns) disarm people with knives every day without killing them.

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fordag t1_j34rwm2 wrote

Knives are not machetes.

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sub-dural t1_j37x0je wrote

Not all knives are machetes, but all machetes are knives.

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Cheerfail t1_j345js5 wrote

It's a broken system that needs massive reform. This guy needed help, not bullets.

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Cheerfail t1_j38kc92 wrote

"The Black Response Statement: Justice for Arif Sayed Faisal

Dear Community,

It is with heavy hearts that we write to you today. Arif Sayed Faisal, a 20 year student and Cambridge Community member, was murdered by the Cambridge Police Department while experiencing a mental health crisis. The police were reportedly called to protect this man from harming himself, yet they ended up killing him. Being in crisis should not be a death sentence.

Everyone deserves to live a long and fulfilling life. No community should have to lose any member in such a violent way and certainly never someone so young. Our thoughts are with the family, the Bangla community, the larger Muslim community, individuals who have experienced crises, and the larger Cambridge community who feel sadness and disappointment tonight.

The Black Response stands in solidarity with the Bangladesh Association of New England (BANE) who are organizing a protest against police brutality. We offer our resources and services to them in this effort. We wholeheartedly support and endorse this event. We encourage everyone to stand as a unified community at City Hall at 3:30pm on Monday, January 9th.

The Black Response is an advocacy organization that has been advocating for the City of Cambridge to create an alternative public safety program for over three years. The National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) and many others also continue to advocate for systemic change in the way we respond to crisis calls. Clearly, we need another form of community safety altogether–one that focuses on taking care of each other and providing a loving response to people in crisis. The police should not be involved in crisis response. If you see someone in crisis, please DO NOT call the police; call 988, or any of the resources listed below.

We want to thank Cambridge HEART as well as the countless other organizations, including the Islamic Society of Boston (ISB/ ISBCC), the Muslim Justice League, the Asian American Resource Workshop (AARW), and others who are working to comfort the community during this time of fear and grief.

No one, especially not a person in crisis, should have to fear for their lives in this time of need when they are most vulnerable. There is no justification for the murder of Arif Sayed Faisal. There is no narrative that can justify this violence. It was the police who brought guns, not Faisal. It was the police who committed harm to the community, not Faisal. He needed help while in crisis; we should be able to provide that help with and through services.

We demand justice for Arif Sayed Faisal! We encourage community members who witnessed what happened on Wednesday, January 4 to publicly post video footage, photos and share their accounts; the police cannot investigate themselves for the profound harm they have caused. We want peace for our community. We need services for people in need. We will work with renewed vigor and urgency to assure that we have access to a community safety infrastructure that meets the needs and prevents further tragedies like this from occurring.

In mourning and in struggle,

The Black Response Cambridge

Resources Don’t call the police, call these organizations instead: Dial 988 988 is the easy-to-remember number that reaches what is commonly referred to as the Lifeline—a network of more than 200 state and local call centers.

Cambridge HEART (info@cambridge-heart.org) It is an alternative public safety program. Centering marginalized people, Cambridge HEART builds local capacity to disrupt cycles of harm by responding to crises, conducting research, and facilitating community cohesion. Although Cambridge HEART is not yet accepting emergency crisis calls, they are responding to non-emergency calls and performing aftercare. HEART intends to ramp up its capacity to respond to emergency crisis calls this year. https://www.cambridge-heart.org/

Black Line: 1 (800) 604-5841 “BlackLine® provides a space for peer support, counseling, witnessing and affirming the lived experiences to folxs who are most impacted by systematic oppression with an LGBTQ+ Black Femme Lens. Call BlackLine® prioritizes BIPOC (Black, Indigenous and People of Color). By us for us.” More information here: https://www.callblackline.com/

Wildflower Alliance: 888.407.4515 “Our peer support line is answered by a trained peer supporter who has their own first-hand experience with psychiatric diagnosis, trauma, addiction, and/or other interrupting challenges. This line does not collect personal information, perform assessment, or call crises. By phone every day: 7pm to 9pm Monday through Thursday; 7pm-10pm Friday through Sunday.” More information here: https://wildfloweralliance.org/peer-support-line/

Trans Lifeline: 877-565-8860 “Trans Lifeline’s Hotline is a peer support service run by trans people, for trans and questioning callers. Our operators are located all over the U.S. and Canada, and are all trans-identified. If you are in crisis or just need someone to talk to, even if it’s just about whether or not you’re trans, please call us. ” More information here: https://www.translifeline.org/hotline

The Network/La Red Hotline: 617-742-4911 (voice) • 800-832-1901 (Toll-Free) “The Network/La Red’s 24-hour hotline provides confidential emotional support, information, referrals, safety planning, and crisis intervention for lesbian, gay, bisexual, queer and/or transgender (LGBQ/T) folks, as well as folks in SM/kink and polyamorous communities who are being abused or have been abused by a partner. We also offer information and support to friends, family, or co-workers on the issue of domestic violence in LGBQ/T communities. More information here: http://tnlr.org/en/24-hour-hotline/"

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