Community Colleges, State Universities, and UConn

Submitted by BobbyBuzz008 t3_113yq30 in Connecticut

In Connecticut, we have two separate higher education systems: the Connecticut State College and University system (ConnCSU), and University of Connecticut system (UConn).

The ConnCSU system is comprised of roughly 55,000 systems and has 12 community colleges, 4 state universities (Western Connecticut State University, Central Connecticut State University, Southern Connecticut State University, and Eastern Connecticut State University) and the Charter Oak College which our states online college.

UConn is comprised of roughly 34,000 students and has its Storrs campus plus five other regional campuses not to mention several other graduate campuses such as the law school campus, UConn Heath which itself has around 8 campuses and facilities, not to mention other graduate campuses for the school of social work and the school of business.

However, with the recent budget debate the President of UConn has been making a lot of inflammatory statements, such as the emails she has been sending out to the student body basically saying that the state is trying to destroy UConn and she has launched a drive to mobilize the student body using #SaveUConn as a hashtag. Yet Lamont had proposed a increase to UConn’s budget in his budget proposal, and the only difference is UConn isn’t going to have access to the pandemic funding from the federal government anymore.

I am a proud graduate of the community college system, the state university system, and of UConn and I know both systems inside and out and I love both systems really much. But I am deeply frustrated that UConn gets most of the funding to the point that they spend money like a drunken sailor yet the ConnCSU schools are operating on such a tight budget that there isn’t even any room in some department budgets for copy paper. Case in point: the President of UConn gets two separate Presidential mansions (one in Storrs, the other on the west end of Hartford) and UConn just completed their fifth engineering building, a building they don’t even need. At UConn they have 1 employee in a management position making six figures plus benefits for every 128 UConn students (as of 2018). UConn literally has a army of Deans and Vice President’s and there is so much overlap and redundancy in their management.

The state allocates on a per student basis $11,000 for every UConn student, $7,000 for every state university student, and $4,000 for every community college student. The ConnCSU system is literally double the size of UConn yet ironically receives less than half the funding tha UConn receives. 92% of ConnCSU students are from Connecticut and 95% of graduates from ConnCSU schools stay in Connecticut which is a lot higher than UConn’s 72% in state and 78% rates respectively.

I’m not saying that UConn shouldn’t have more funding. What I am saying is we should not forget about our state’s community colleges and state universities, which graduates are double that than UConn’s and which employs more people and has double the facilities then that of UConn. UConn already saw a budget increase of 25% since Lamont took office while ConnCSU have seem significantly smaller increases. It angers me that in her testimony before the Appropriations Committee, UConn’s president said yesterday the state needs to invest more in “its one state public university” when we clearly have an separate system that is much larger. Did she forget we have four other universities which has a student body larger than that of UConn’s? It also angers me that while UConn spends millions of dollars on new construction on seldom used buildings, there’s talk in our community colleges of eliminating tenure professors and even getting rid of department chairs all together.

We have a +$3 billion dollar surplus in our state budget, and at the end of the day UConn is going to get what it wants because UConn always gets its way as they are the fourth branch of state government, but it shouldn’t come at the expense of the ConnCSU system which has unfortunately been the case for so many years.

Now, before someone comments saying “why are you this posting on Reddit” I think it is important for people to know what is going on in our state budget and there are a number of legislators (such as u/SenatorDuff) who subscribe to and read this subreddit. I am expressing an opinion which is one that most people seldom get to hear yet a lot of people share.

I have written to my legislators on this issue already, and hopefully I will have inspired others especially if your a community college or state university student or graduate to also reach out and advocate for our state to invest in both systems fairly and equally. UConn deserves more funding but not at the determent of ConnCSU.

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so2017 t1_j8tz5k2 wrote

UConn gets 776 million from the state over two years for 32,000 students.

CSCU gets 755 million from the state over two years for 85,000 students.

Totally messed up.

OP - you should send this to the CT Mirror.

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ragggaerat t1_j8ui5bm wrote

Theres a reason for that disparity but if you say it you get downovted. But i 1000% agree. State shouldnt step in cause soemhow UConn has manged to turn pandemic era relief into a staple in its budget. The quality of student that goes to UConn vrs CSCU is noticable. One might even argue that if this 3k increase goes into place the type of student UConn attracts might choose a flaghsip somwhere else. Ik my validitrian went here. would she if another flagship like pennstate was a similar price. Idk its hard to quite state but that disparity in funding didnt just come outta nowhere. A state like Ct needs a UConn to attract certain types of individual. There are so many reputable colleges in sorroudning states. We might have a legitimate brain drain if Uconn looses its competive price edge. I dont know how UConn is run but there should be no price hike as well as no increase by the state. Some people needa get fired come programs needa get cut. Unless similar colleges like pennstate and Rutgers get similar tuition increases i dont think they should>

Edit
Just came to say im talking about high acheiving and not class. How many senators went to community colleges. This isnt about class. AOC was poor and went to boston college. Connecticut spends more to attract people like her . High achieving regardless of class.

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mommy2brenna t1_j8v294h wrote

> The quality of student that goes to UCONN vs CCSU is noticable.

Would you like to expand on that rude, sweeping, generalization?

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dziuniekdrive t1_j8v5gkm wrote

Not OP, ,but for accounting majors BIG4 hire out of uconn, not ccsu.

Regional and local firms have a bigger presence at ccsu.

Anecdotal evidence from 10 years ago.

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Bust_A_Nutmeg t1_j9agbk5 wrote

To back up this anecdotal evidence: all of my friends with at least a 3.3 in Accounting at UConn ended up at Big4 firms, my friend with a 3.8 in Accounting at ECSU ended up at Blum Shapiro

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fprintf t1_j8we8tk wrote

I don't know, you have all sorts of measures to pick from. SAT scores, place in graduating class, ability to attain academic or other scholarships, and more.

UCONN is far more competitive to get into in the first place. And as an instructor I can tell you without a doubt the quality of the students in my experience is far better than the CCSU and ECSU students I have known or even the Quinnipiac students I have taught. In my current class of sophomores I am blown away by the observable differences, both qualitatively (higher grades for same material) and quantitatively (writing and logic abilities).

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JCCR90 t1_j8wdds1 wrote

Don't want to offend anyone but it's night and day in my experience. One uconn alumni we hire in private equity fund accounting is easily worth two from the regional schools in as far as productivity and room for promotion goes.

The discrepancy is even more pronounced 5,10,15 years after school. All the uconn hires who've left our firm are Assistant Controllers, Controllers, Directors, Vice President, CFO now and the regional school grads hit a cap or had a much much longer road to the same promotions.

Does this mean there aren't superstars at the regional schools, absolutely not, but if we're talking about the average 💯.

I would much rather be taken care of a doctor or nurse who did their undergrad or nursing program at uconn for sure.

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ShamusTheClown t1_j8wc69o wrote

He's saying that Uconn keeps out the Poors, and thus is more cultured.

As a Uconn Alum:

Uconn's undergrad education is shit, and not any better than a state school.

The reason you go there is 100% for Networking and Job Opportunities. So his point is somewhat correct: the difference is a Class Barrier.

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fprintf t1_j8wesbm wrote

No it isn't. UCONN has objectively higher quality students looking at acceptance criteria. It is a legitimately difficult school to get into for many high school seniors who end up going to the other state school systems. Now if your argument is that more students from Simsbury, Avon and Glastonbury get in to UCONN and fewer from poorer towns like Bristol, Berlin, Norwalk then you probably have a point. But that isn't UCONN's problem to solve, that is either the town (because our k-12 is town based) or a larger state problem to fix education at that level before they get to UCONN.

UCONN has selective admissions, at least it has had that in the past 20 years. When I went to college 30 years ago UCONN was where you went as your safe school. No longer, for many kids it is their primary destination, partly because it is up to 1/2 as expensive as private schools.

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lazy-but-talented t1_j8wo5b1 wrote

as a poor kid that graduated uconn you just simply have to get good

my undergrad was good and got me a job in my field before I graduated after applying to two places

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CoarsePage t1_j8uwz0y wrote

I've got coworkers from central and from UConn, I'd take the central guys anyway. The only aspect that UConn is superior is their post grad degrees.

Your other point about the brain drain, I don't think it's too related to going to school in CT. It's about retaining them after graduation. For that you need engaging jobs and greater access to housing. Some of which CT offers, some not so much.

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STODracula t1_j8wl23s wrote

Central is great, but their president.... She was the dean at my university and got the boot after a 2 week student+employee strike. From what I read, she hasn't changed.

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CoarsePage t1_j8xahip wrote

Yeah Toro is trash, but by and large the staff and institutional ability are good.

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LordConnecticut t1_j8wit9q wrote

This theory is dead in the water, a huge amount of waste occurs in purely administrative areas, that students never see or interact with.

UConn spends more in certain administrative categories then Ivy League schools do, so no none if it is warranted.

They even fleece their students for egregious amounts. For example, parking costs to park in agricultural Storrs, are far higher then what Yale charges to park in downtown new haven. There is plenty of space in Storrs, yet they charge like they couldn’t fit one more car in, not to mention pushing student parking to the periphery of campus while keeping central parking for administration. It’s disgusting.

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AtomicStromboli t1_j8ualb1 wrote

These are the kinds of posts I wanna see in r/Connecticut, well written

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Gooch__Gobbler t1_j8u0cy4 wrote

As part of the UConn alumni, this whole situation feels like the UConn administration is trying to shift the blame onto the state for the mismanagement of their own finances.

Since graduating nearly 7 years ago, the in-state cost of attendance has increased from $23k or so (during my senior year), to over $30k last year when my younger sister graduated. How can they justify a 30% increase over 6 years with the same quality of education and the campus life not being much different? It’s absolutely ridiculous how the university is trying to blame the state for their own shortcomings.

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yolagchy t1_j8vdlhb wrote

Could not agree more! I have spent 6+ years at UCONN getting my Ph.D and I can tell you there is so much corruption and mismanagement going on! In particular, SoE Dean is incompetent, that is where cleansing should start from. I am sure UCONN can be a lot more efficient and productive, and there is room for that to happen. I am not against new engineering buildings, I love them especially the last one (science I), but I can’t say same things for the scientists in there. Last time when I heard, management was cutting subscriptions to scientific journals and only few were left freely accessible. And guess what? Accessible journals were all used by dean of SoE or Radenka. I hope best for the UCONN but with the current management I just can’t see much improvement happening. Painful it is!

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HazelFrederick t1_j8up0uo wrote

They justify it because fixed costs have gone up without the state matching the increases. Same with the rest of the system. They justify it because math exists. It’s not “mismanagement” it’s just reality.

And no you can’t just dip into the endowment as most funds are restricted by donors for specific purposes.

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reefsofmist t1_j8uyaw2 wrote

Their fixed costs did not increase 30% it's bullshit and everyone knows it

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OutTheOfficeWindow t1_j8v3hy3 wrote

Maybe not 30% but I bet a lot more than one assumes. They just opened a massive science building which requires upkeep and staff.

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ShamusTheClown t1_j8wbm3o wrote

"Oh no, our fixed costs keep going up because we keep constructuing more expensive giant buildings. Why wont the state help us with this unforseen burden??"

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DystopianRealist t1_j8vujsw wrote

While the cost of a bachelor’s degree has been going up at extreme rates nationally, UConn tuition is getting to the point where going out of state can be more affordable, and at equally good or better universities.

Mismanagement and poor development choices have been an ongoing problem at the “snores” branch.

I’m too tired to dig into comparisons right now, but if I recall SUNY out of state is cheaper than UConn in state. Amherst, UMass as well. I use those for proximity and similar cost of living in the states.

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LordConnecticut t1_j8wjhji wrote

No it’s mismanagement. When you renovate a building, only to completely rip out what you did and renovate it again in a year, with high end materials, it’s mismanagement.

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B1NG_P0T t1_j8uee1g wrote

I'm a professor in the CSU system - really appreciate this post. Shit's looking pretty grim for us.

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Dale_Wardark t1_j8t8uld wrote

UConn is a great institution that has good programs and provides high quality education to it's students. That said, it's incredibly frustrating living in the town of Mansfield and watch UConn piss money away and watch buildings that they wanted built constantly have to pull new business tenants because rents are so high. It's frustrating watching them throw their weight around the town like they own it with little regard for people who live here. Traffic is awful around campus, the drivers are pretty bad, and to top it all off, the college barely spends money with business in town. UConn should think about trimming its own budget before complaining it doesn't get enough money. Tuition is pretty insane over there already.

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Bust_A_Nutmeg t1_j8u5qaj wrote

Counterpoint: Mansfield would be Eastford if not for UConn

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Dale_Wardark t1_j8u7k4o wrote

True and as I've had pointed out to me in the past, people could move to a smaller town. But there should be a medium of coexisting with the college and the town retaining some autonomy and levels of small-townedness. I think it adds to the draw and charm of UConn to be such a good school that is also in a small town.

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Bust_A_Nutmeg t1_j8u8tp6 wrote

I disagree wholeheartedly. Mansfield has caused countless headaches for UConn over the years and by most accounts hates students. While the school predates nearly every family in town. UConn drives the bus and should not have to compromise to weirdo nimbys who move to a college town expecting the state flagship university to defer to them. Ultimately this won't happen because Storrs never split off from the rest of town and now never will

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STODracula t1_j8wlj17 wrote

And THIS is part of why UCONN keeps having to raise tuition because they burn money like there's no tomorrow. They add new buildings constantly without regard to their budget.

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daybeers t1_j8u04fx wrote

S tier post; 100% agree. Thank you.

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charmed_fandomgal t1_j8um458 wrote

I completely agree with everything you said except that the new building was not necessary. If you ever saw what use to be ims then it was definitely needed. A lot of what goes on in that building brings in funding from companies Edit: punctuation

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LordConnecticut t1_j8wjpbs wrote

It would have been cheaper to fit and renovate IMS. Not even Ivies go on the building sprees UConn does.

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charmed_fandomgal t1_j8wkrfi wrote

I don’t know that it would. They would have had to pay someone to remove everything and put it somewhere else for who knows how long and then pay someone to put it back and pay to renovate the building which they are doing anyway but everything new has been in the works for 10+ years. It’s not like it’s suddenly just been decided. And that building brings in money to the school as well

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LordConnecticut t1_j8wu60t wrote

There’s a lot of assumptions in this post that are simply untrue. It’s a massive expensive to construct a new building from top to finish.

There’s a reason why people that flip houses don’t demolish them, they gut them and renovate the interior. The vast majority of the cost to construct a building is in the exterior, especially a commercial grade building, the excavation, the foundation, the fireproofed stairwells and outer shell.

You realise they pay someone to do everything for a new building too right? The fact that things take 10+ years should be an indication that there’s a problem.

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charmed_fandomgal t1_j8xfwla wrote

Idk what assumptions you think I have. You didn’t tell me anything I didn’t know

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Odd_Total_5549 t1_j8vez0r wrote

I’m on the student senate at one of the CT community colleges (don’t wanna dox myself and say which one). For the last month or so we’ve been debating whether or not to fork over $11,000 of our student activities budget to pay for insurance so we can start a basketball and soccer intramural league for the students. We were going to do flag football too but it would have been too expensive.

There’s a massive demand for sports with the students that have been polled, and the coordinator has referenced some data that athletics programs can be huge for retention. Remember, we’re talking about community college where keeping kids showing up is a massive deal. One completed semester can give someone who thought they had no shot at college the confidence to get their degree.

The money we’re thinking of allocating would represent about 20% of our semester budget. This budget is the money that pays for all student activities, every single club or event is funded by this money. Hopefully the fact that we’re about to use 20% of that money just to cover 11k, which would be pennies for most schools, so we can have something as fundamental to a school like UConn as an extremely modest athletics program (kids wearing reversible jerseys twice a week and playing in the high school gym down the street) can give some perspective at the gap in funding here.

Just today the faculty advisers were lamenting that class sizes are being raised from 25 to 30 students in the fall, and that classes will be canceled more quickly if not enough students have enrolled before the semester.

Honestly the complaints you’re saying UConn is making sound painfully tone deaf. I graduate this semester and have applied to UConn, so maybe if I go there I’ll start to understand why their president needs two mansions. But for now, yeah seems kinda shitty.

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ragggaerat t1_j8vnkn9 wrote

Ive been secretary of some UConn clubs. Thats not the way funding works. Theres a vote by students for senators. Senators choose to increase tuition so stuff like jerseys are attanable. My highscool teacher said the same thing. Popular misconception. At least with the satellite campuses. Most of the monye for clubs comes from students tuition directly. Sorta like a gym. everyone puts money in it but only a tiny percentage uses it.

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BobbyBuzz008 OP t1_j8whdg1 wrote

I was fortunate to serve in the student senate at my community college as well as at UConn and funding and the structure of the student governments is different.

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ragggaerat t1_j8xfans wrote

its literally not. Lol im getting downvotes. but we had 20k for the whoel regional campus to spend on clubs. 20k that came from fees. we had a vote and up those fees every every year

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jeangrey99 t1_j8v2t2o wrote

One of the best posts I’ve read in this group. Well written.

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HazelFrederick t1_j8uppd1 wrote

Thank you.

What people need to realize is that even if enrollment hadn’t declined, fixed costs have shot up. There isn’t too much you can do about either reality except A) pay for the difference, B) hope and pray trends reverse or C) not have public higher education.

Even after amortizing across a graduate’s entire adult life and accounting for inflation, the return on investment for every tax dollar spent on public ed education is paid back severalfold thanks to higher tax receipts, better health outcomes and lower crime. We need to fund higher ed, fully and equitably, if we’re to maintain our quality of life.

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CoarsePage t1_j8uxblo wrote

Look at long term trends in populating growth, the number of traditional college age people isn't rising.

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JCCR90 t1_j8wdp3h wrote

Thats why there's talon of consolidation in the regional schools, fewer and fewer college freshman in the horizon.

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LordConnecticut t1_j8wjuq9 wrote

Fixed cost have not gone up for any reason other then mismanagement.

Tuition has increased by 30 percent in ten years. Fixed costs have not grown that much so where has that money gone?

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STODracula t1_j8wp198 wrote

Looks at $100 million student rec building from 2019 and $250 million new housing breaking ground now, and knows fully neither are "fixed costs". Well, the rec building is now a fixed cost. Paying for the gym equipment maintenance, the pools, personnel, etc. for that building is now clearly a fixed cost.

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btudisca95 t1_j8vom0x wrote

Wow this post hits the nail right on the head! I have worked for both university systems now and I will say the CSCU system vs UConn are so vastly different it’s amazing that CSCU even survives. I currently am back working for the CSCU system and worked there previously before going to UConn and it amazes me at how fucking wasteful UConn is. They are however the 4th branch of state government basically and the second they whine they get what they want. This is very reminiscent of when Herbst was UConns president and lost her mind because budget cuts weren’t gonna allow her salary to reach a million a year.

If you look at the state employee expenditures the top 10 highest paid state employees are all UConn or UConn Health employees. The real issue is that the state just shovels money into the burning fire pit that is UConn Health. It’s unprofitable, it’s expensive, yet no one wants to admit that it’s just a useless taxpayer expense.

We are the 3rd smallest state in the country but we have 2 completely separate public university systems, larger states like Massachusetts and even New York don’t have 2, you get one SUNY or UMASS. Someday the state will realize that it can’t just keep lighting money on fire and force something to be done.

However, back to the original intent of this post, as a CCSU graduate and now a current staff member I think that the state of CT really needs to reconsider its investment in the 4 CSUs, COSC, and the Community Colleges, as stated, they provide the highest number of graduates compared to UConn and they also provide the highest number of graduates who remain within the borders of the state and contribute to the economy more than UConn graduates do.

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Mysterious-Wolf-2243 t1_j8w80dv wrote

Trade schools help more than community colleges. Shouldn't we we just abandon community colleges too then by your silly logic

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KaladinsDad t1_j8wcxpq wrote

CT has a state-run votech high school system.

CTECS already exists.

Also the Community Colleges offer trades certification. Three Rivers just finished a new welding facility on the Grasso Tech campus. (HS by day, CC by night.)

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Mysterious-Wolf-2243 t1_j8wdvf0 wrote

Sounds like the same training with more cost and needless classes to me

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KaladinsDad t1_j8whhtf wrote

Are you saying get rid of the state votech High Schools? Or the trade offerings at Community College?

Unfortunately the state votech schools reject people (not enough spots) so some people need trade skills after HS, and cant get it during.

High school graduates in CT are allowed to attend the CCs for free. Seems like a good benefit to get people in trades or other certification jobs.

CCs offer things like dental hygienist and medical coding and billing that the votech system does not as well.

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BobbyBuzz008 OP t1_j8witat wrote

Community colleges are extremely vital and offers tons of certification courses from nursing to accounting to paralegals to manufacturing. We have a lot of high tech manufacturing companies in CT which are highly dependent on community college graduates, and people who graduate from our community college manufacturing programs have a 100% job placement rate before graduation.

UConn has its role as a research university and ConnCSU has its role as teaching colleges and university’s. I strongly disagree with your various comments that UConn is superior. It’s not. You can’t really compare UConn and ConnCSU because they are so different and they have different functions and they serve different purposes. UConn certainly has a lot of advantages as a research university but the state universities has a lot of other advantages over UConn as a teaching university.

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Mysterious-Wolf-2243 t1_j8wjeeb wrote

You'd rather be taught by community College professors lmao UConn has top notch scholars in their fields

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BobbyBuzz008 OP t1_j8wlze7 wrote

UConn does indeed have a lot of top notch scholars, but for the most part as a UConn student you won’t have access to them in your freshman or sophomore years.

As a student at any public higher educational institution in Connecticut, your classes are the same regardless whether you start out at community college and transfer to a four year university or if you start right at UConn. At UConn as a freshman or sophomore, you are literally paying $30,000 per year as a in state student to take the exact same classes, using basically the same exact textbooks, in a lecture hall with 300 other students learning the exact same material than you would at community college except your not paying anything because we have free community college for in state students and instead of being in a lecture hall with 300 students your in a class with 20-25 students and you actually can speak with your professor during office hours instead of waiting a week to speak to a T.A. at UConn.

And honestly, the liberal arts and social sciences programs are better at ConnCSU than at UConn for undergrad. If I had a child in college who wanted to major in English or become a teacher, I would tell them to go to CCSU. It’s much more affordable, class sizes are much smaller, and you have more employment opportunities than you would at UConn if you plan to stay local. On the other hand, if I had a child in college who wanted to obtain a degree in the sciences or a mathematics degree, UConn is obviously the better option.

It depends heavily on your major and what your priorities are in choosing your school especially as a undergrad. I think it’s insane that UConn students who attend all four years of undergrad have to take on $120,000+ in expenses now. I personally don’t see much value in that especially in your first two years where there is literally no difference in your classes and quality of your education between UConn and community colleges. But some people value “the college experience” and they really want to go to a big university with D1 sports and something going on all the time even if it will close them $60,000 extra to do it. It’s a legitimate value but not one that I or a lot of people share.

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LordConnecticut t1_j8winm9 wrote

I have seen this waste first hand. To add you your “spend money like a drunken sailor”, it’s true. They renovate and re-renovate buildings, pave and re-pave roads and redesign them, construct new buildings with lavish materials etc.

They recently had completely renovated a space in the central warehouse building for the parking services department. Less then a year later, they tore it all out and renovated again for the planning department. It looks like it’s out of a danish furniture style magazine. This is repeated around the university and most of it is in non-student spaces.

UConn spends money like it’s Yale or Harvard, and has a multi-billion dollar endowment to tap.

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JustADudeBeingADood t1_j8ycl1t wrote

Maybe UConn should consider it's administrative bloated costs. Crazy how much cheaper college used to be 40 years ago. If we forced colleges to cut back expenses they would. Of course no leader would ever voluntarily accept cuts against their own organization.

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Ziggy1433 t1_j8whs1p wrote

Dump football, that would be a start.

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tmp930 t1_j8uohdl wrote

I sympathize with your point, but isn’t the whole idea to have two tiers of universities? It would make more sense to have one large system, rather than two equal systems?

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BobbyBuzz008 OP t1_j8uuhc3 wrote

We used to have three separate systems. Governor Malloy tried to combine the state college colleges, the state universities, and UConn into one system back in 2011 but UConn said no (because UConn have veto powers over the Governor /s) so that is why we have two systems now: UConn and everyone else.

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pridkett t1_j8uvvor wrote

That's the way it is in most states - you have multiple tiered systems. The top tier is the "University" then the "State" system, then the community colleges. While there are a few states where the "State" system rivals the "University" or is better, like Florida and definitely Ohio, if you look at states like Minnesota, Washington, California, Texas, Colorado, etc - they all have similar tiers (this is done from memory, so I could've made mistakes here).

The general difference is that the "University" system is designed to be a research focus, while the "State" systems do more education and some research, and the community colleges are almost exclusively education.

The primary job of faculty at UConn is not teaching. That doesn't get you tenure, that gets you a professor-in-residence position.

(note - lots of generalizations here)

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woofieroofie t1_j8v6c99 wrote

It's a shame the other state schools get overshadowed by UConn, particularly because there was a post here a few months ago about WCSU experiencing a financial/enrollment crisis, and now UConn is complaining about money. I attended one of the CSU schools and had an advisor who was outspoken about his dislike of UConn. He regularly said the only difference between CSU schools and UConn is that UConn is a D1 school. I don't know how big the difference in academic quality is, if there even is one. I never felt like I was in a disadvantage when mingling with UConn graduates.

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JCCR90 t1_j8websv wrote

Southern Connecticut SAT range is 900-1130 25th - 75th percentile.

UCONN SAT range is 1230-1430.

Im sure if you exclude research and research facility costs from uconn subsidies the per pupil spending would be much lower.

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JCCR90 t1_j8wc1th wrote

UCONN is research university as well so much of their research funding is captured in the per pupil figure which is misleading.

Also throw in the subsidy for housing costs. UCONN houses most of its students while regional schools are largely commuter students.

With all this being said though it makes total sense to spend more for the elite state school because school rankings matter. I would wager uconn alumni drive more value to state economy than regional university and community colleges do. There's a reason why average SAT scores differ the way they do between CT state schools.

We've hired several fund accountants over the years at our firm and there's an incredible difference between those we hire from uconn vs southern/western. My 2c for what it's worth.

Edit-for clarity and as a factoid I pulled the below from US Weekly

Southern Connecticut SAT range is 900-1130, 25th - 75th percentile.

UCONN SAT range is 1230-1430, same percentile range

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STODracula t1_j8woj3z wrote

As someone who went to a lean running public university (UPR) and then UCONN, it's like night and day in terms of spending and what I consider downright luxuries for students. I know administrative expenses are part of it, but UCONN keeps adding buildings without regards for need or expense. The rec center that cost $100 million added to the student fees (and probably tuition but you won't hear them say it) and it looks like a luxury spa. I'm not saying they don't need fun things to do, although I've been there and they already have plenty, but that building is bonkers. To this day, my undergrad school barely has some ping pong tables in the main student building and the 2010 rebuilt pools for the Central American and Caribbean games (state paid for that one), but hey, $4,940 tuition sure beats $18,524 when the degree is accredited the same and the education equal.

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jlevnhv t1_j8xpqaa wrote

Great post, and I agree with much of what you say. UConn certainly does have quite a lot of bureaucracy, wasteful spending, etc.

However, I do think we need to think about what these schools provide and who they're for. I say this as a former student of both CCSU and UConn.

  • UConn's mission is to be a top-flight research and public university, attracting high-end students both locally and from across the United States
  • UConn also wants to provide the "full college experience" in terms of dorms, Student Unions, people living on campus and having that whole thing.
  • ConnSCU's have a similar-ish thing, but almost all of them are also commuter-first universities. Most kids don't live on campus, but in surrounding towns where they grew up, maybe with their friends or parents.
  • Community colleges are often attended by people returning to education or working full-time and working on an education. They don't want or need on-campus leaving (afaik). They need a schedule that works for them and is flexible and also affordable.
  • Ideally, you have flexibility to move between the different "tiers" of education in the system, though I prefer not to think of it that way since its not really better or worse, just different experiences.
  • Community college is free in Connecticut now. That's amazing. Maybe we do need more funding but you have to admit this is a great step.
  • Tuition is also much cheaper for ConnCSU -- 11K for SCSU right now, 18K for UConn, not considering room and board, other fees, etc.
  • As far as bureaucratic waste, I mean... that's large scale academic institutions for you. I worked at Yale. Its not exclusive to UConn. I suspect this is a nationwide problem, if not even bigger.

I would like to see more equity for sure, though. I was more just explaining why I think there may be an "appropriate" divide in spending between different systems due to those different needs. And I think UConn should look out for the entire state education system, though its hard because institutions tend to look out for themselves.

Anyway, great post. Just wanted to add some thoughts.

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Mysterious-Wolf-2243 t1_j8vtbgv wrote

You realize UConn is a research institution that does more than teach community College students right? Please tell me you understand the difference

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