Attempting to move a wall outlet in my basement a few inches to the left and am totally stumped. Any help GREATLY appreciated!!

Submitted by JamesHoIden t3_1274od5 in DIY

I need to move a wall outlet in my basement at least 4 inches to the left. After removing 2 screws that attached the metal outlet box to the stud behind the drywall, I was still unable to move the box. It felt like there was something securing the box in place from above. I decided to cut a hole in the back wall of the closet that is located directly behind the outlet to get a better look. I could see from the new hole that unlike every DIY video I watched on YouTube, the outlet box is connected at the top to two metal conduits that appear to run upstairs. I can’t find any answers online on how to relocate an electrical / outlet box that is connected to metal conduits, is it even possible without turning this into a major project? Any help would be GREATLY appreciated! Thank you!

Here’s a couple pics of what Im dealing with:

https://imgur.com/a/6E7wJLp

EDIT:

Thank you everyone so much for the help! A few people suggested I flip the box 180 degrees and reinstall the outlet in the closet on the opposite side of the wall, which I thought was the perfect solution. Unfortunately when I tried this the front of the box didn’t quite reach the wall on the other side. So I ended up getting a couple feet of conduit and 2 elbow connectors and had BARELY enough wire to move the box to the next stud over. This took me literally all day to do and my hands, knees and back are completely destroyed but it’s finally done. I have a tremendous amount of newfound respect for electricians, especially here in Chicago where conduit must be used in all home electrical wiring. Thanks again!

8

Comments

You must log in or register to comment.

rooksb t1_jeck725 wrote

Would be a lot easier if you put a new box where you want it and just put a blank cover on this one and use as a junction box.

38

JamesHoIden OP t1_jecntvd wrote

Thank you for the response. I’m installing built in bookcases and the outlets current location is directly in line with the outside frame of the end unit, I considered just cutting a notch around the outlet before learning it was against code. I assume the same goes for a junction box? I naively thought moving the outlet a few inches would be quick and easy.

2

nhorvath t1_jed1w17 wrote

You mentioned cutting a hole in the closet behind the box. You could flip the box and either have an outlet in that closet or put the blank cover there, and install a new box fed from this one.

8

JamesHoIden OP t1_jed51ww wrote

That’s exactly what I’m trying to do right now! Someone already suggested it, what a great idea. Thanks for your help, I never would have come up with it on my own.

3

Purple-Run2937 t1_jed86ts wrote

Just keep in mind there may be rules for number of outlets needed for every linear foot of usable wall space. Depending where you live.

You could also extend the EMT piping using couplers and a pull through 90. Your conductor may not reach though.

1

PHenderson61 t1_jee7kc2 wrote

“A few inches “ has started many a tussle but it’s eventually gotten over.

2

bridaddy t1_jecn5yw wrote

Flip that box around so it faces inside the closet, use it as a junction box, cover it with a blank plate,and run flexible cable to a new box in the location you want.

10

JamesHoIden OP t1_jecq0bl wrote

That is the plan! Someone suggested basically this same thing, and I really don’t even need the outlet at all, so I think just flipping it around so that’s it’s accessible in the closet will be enough. Thank you so much for the help!

1

Jiggly1984 t1_jeck8on wrote

The only way is to move the conduit or put more in running it to the new location. Problem is it doesn't look like you'll have enough wire. I'll let an electrician chime in but I believe your best bet would be to turn the existing box into a junction box (put a blank faceplate on it, it has to be accessible). Knock out the holes on the side, run wire to a new box. Again, there's probably a better solution but that's my inclination.

8

JamesHoIden OP t1_jecoszj wrote

I’m installing built in bookcases and the outlet is right in line with the frame. I really only need to move it a few inches so I actually think I DO have enough wire to do what you suggested. But apparently I can just flip the box around and re-install it in the closet. If that doesn’t work I’ll pick up some sort of conduit extension and try your idea, thank you!

2

CuriousityJH t1_jeckj0w wrote

Not sure why they used conduit in residential, maybe that's code where you are? If you need this outlet gone on the side it's on now here's how I'd go about it. Release the screws etc holding the box to the conduit, remove the box and flip it 180 degrees so it faces the closet so you can use it as a junction box. Add a new box where you're needing it, if conduits not needed you could use a remodel box that grips / mounts to drywall only (no stud needed). Then run wire from old, now flipped box to your new one.

If conduit is needed, you can come out of the side of the flipped box to the new one.

6

JamesHoIden OP t1_jecn5ya wrote

Wow, never even considered this, I really don’t even need the outlet at all, but from what I understand, it needs to be accessible, so I think just flipping it around would be enough. Thank you so much. It looks like there are screws facing the drywall just above the wall opening. So to remove the box, I just cut the opening a little higher so I can and remove those screws, then pull it off the conduits? Thanks again!

2

Narrow-Chef-4341 t1_jeeetfl wrote

Remember that Code’s idea of accessing a junction box means not cutting holes in drywall.

Having to unload either a closet or a bookshelf to get at the wall plate would pass inspection. Having to unbolt a ‘fixed’ bookshelf or cabinet carcass would not.

2

l397flake t1_jecmbyn wrote

Have you removed(cut) the nails or screws holding the box to the studs? Do that carefully, make sure the breaker is OFF and don’t cut the wires coming into the box. Once you cut see if the box can be moved about 3/4” into the wall. If so it will become a junction box the send the wires to the new box. If I were you, hire an electrician and see how it’s done.

2

JamesHoIden OP t1_jecpkxi wrote

Thanks for responding. Yes I’ve already removed the screws, and I at least know enough to have switch off the circuit breaker. I’ve worked with some electricians a few times so I (hopefully) know enough not get myself killed lol. The box is only held in place by the conduits, but I think I’ve got a couple possible solutions now thanks to these comments, I appreciate the help!

1

fredsam25 t1_jed241v wrote

Flip this box around and make it face the closest. There are fittings that allow the conduit to connect to the box, you'll have to loosen the nuts and take the conduit off the box along with the wires. Cut a hole in the closet for this box. Then flip the box around and put the conduit back on. Now use this box as a junction box for new outlet you want on the bookcase side. Lastly, patch the previous hole on the bookcase side.

2

JamesHoIden OP t1_jed5iln wrote

Exactly what I’m doing! In fact, I probably won’t even add a new outlet. I would have just put a plate on the box, pushed it into the wall and patched over the hole if it wasn’t against code. Got this same idea from a couple other brilliant minds on here, thank you!

1

mdmaxOG t1_jeck9nl wrote

Typically attached on the outside of the box, just cut a big hole and patch it later…it’s far easier and looks better

1

bms42 t1_jecxq9s wrote

Remove any fasteners holding the box and see if there's enough play in the conduit to move it over a few inches. It'll depend on where that conduit is attached to the stud.

If it moves far enough then just shim the stud with 2 more 2x4 scraps and reattach the box (cut a new hole in the drywall for it).

If you can't move it far enough then you'll have to open that back wall further and figure out how to get some play in the conduit.

Weird that there's metal conduit in the wall. That's bad luck on your part.

1

JamesHoIden OP t1_jed4niy wrote

Thanks for the suggestion! Unfortunately there is basically zero give to the conduit. I’ve just learned that to remain up to code / pass inspection in Chicago you MUST use steel conduit for all electrical wiring. So if I go that route I’ll need to extend the conduit, not the end of the world but still very annoying.

1

PLEASEHIREZ t1_jecy0nz wrote

Where I'm from, every junction box needs to be accessible (usually a little dry wall access panel); but we all know some naughty people who bury them behind walls. Depending on where you side....

I'd pop the box circles out on the side where you need the wired to go, put little plastic safety pulls in the holes, run the wire through and into a new electrical box in the location you want. If your wire isn't long enough, I'd wire nut long pig tails in your current box and out the side holes into your new box. Then I'd bury your old box in the wall. I'm bad.

1

therealdilbert t1_jedytnw wrote

if there is no connections inside the box just wires passing through, does it count as a box? at that point it is basically an odd shaped conduit

1

PLEASEHIREZ t1_jeeppvh wrote

If wires simply pass through with no splicing, then you could consider it a conduit. He'll need 4" to make it to the next box, then 4" to 6" wire (depending on your state code for how much wire must extend out of the wall at the desired box location), then another 6" to 12" service loop before the box (nice to have for the future), you're looking at 14" to 22" of wire. At that point you're realistically going to use the current box as a junction as you make some very long pig tails. But again, if he can make it to his next box without splicing/extending then it's all good.

1

therealdilbert t1_jef3kwx wrote

as long as the wires will reach into the new box can he splice the extra length on there?

1

PLEASEHIREZ t1_jeflxeh wrote

If the current wires can reach the new box, then he can pigtail or splice in the new box. But currently he has pig tails in the existing box which leads me to believe he does not have sufficient wire to make it to the new box. In which case he will replace the existing pigtail with a really long one. That new pig tail be done in the current box, and then pass into the new box. I hope that makes it clearer.

1

DTinHPP t1_jedw3eh wrote

Easiest option: don’t move the box, cut a hole in the back of the new bookcases and leave the outlet between shelves. You can plug child-proof plugs and hide it behind your books.

1

JamesHoIden OP t1_jee9a2w wrote

This is what my wife wants me to do, I wouldn’t even need to cut a hole in the back, because there’s no backing to the bookshelves (building them right up against the wall). Unfortunately it’s the outside frame of the end unit that runs right over the middle of the outlet. I tried for hours to slide all the bookcases over a couple inches in either direction to avoid the outlet, but doing so screws up how the corner unit is angled and makes the whole thing look goofy to me.. seeing it every day like that would drive me insane lol. Thank you for the suggestion though!

1

Lawrence108 t1_jedxhga wrote

Drill hole on side of box , run new cable , 4 inches over. Hot patch box with 5 minute. Stuff fries like a rock.

I have a 7 year old handyman business

1

badwhiskey63 t1_jecqs9l wrote

You don't need the outlet anymore? Unless I'm not understanding what you want to do, I'd disconnect the outlet and remove the box. Put a blank face on the box and replace it. Then fill the gap with a drywall patch. You might have to cut a large hole in the drywall to access the conduit connections. The original box will become a junction box.

If you do want to retain the outlet, do what I said then add a new box for the outlet. Knock out the appropriate number of holes in the old box, and run cable (not pain the ass conduit) to the new box.

0

JamesHoIden OP t1_jecs0xk wrote

I had the same idea, but was told a junction box must be accessible to remain code compliant, so I can’t just drywall over it unfortunately.

2

badwhiskey63 t1_jectddc wrote

How are you taking the second picture from the back? Won't you have access from that side?

1

Kiel2040 t1_jeckiig wrote

Easy, just detach the box from the tubes, and place the box at the new position. You will need to open the side holes to pass the cables coming from the tubes. Just mind that you will have exposed cables on that space

−3

roadfood t1_jecpx38 wrote

I bet people are shocked to find out how bad an electrician you are.

1