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FrolfLarper t1_itw2n05 wrote

Reply to comment by Keeperofthe7keysAf-S in Move over, diesel: Ohio gets ‘first of its kind’ renewable gas station by redingerforcongress

I think Mr. Hoover was trying to say that the amount of cow shit we have methaning out is not natural, it’s because of our industry. So it’s an offshoot of human activity. The more better solution would be to raise fewer cows rather than try and deal with their emissions. Yes, you can whatabout the shit out of this, just trying to make his point a little more clearly.

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shastaxc t1_itwfagc wrote

Your take seems correct. That other dude is really bad at making a point. However, I don't think it's practical to just stop all industrial cow farming as a solution to the methane problem. Burning the methane is a much better solution. And it also solves his hypothetical supply chain emissions problem if you use trucks that run on the methane they're supplying.

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Keeperofthe7keysAf-S t1_itwts45 wrote

Even better is using EVs and burning the methane in a powerplant, that's much more efficient. But anything that gets us off of fossil fuels faster at this point, no need to fret over a perfect solution, we just need a working system of solutions.

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shastaxc t1_itxln28 wrote

You might be right but there might be good reasons for using methane that I don't know about. Is it cheaper than electric? It almost certainly refuels faster. You can move a gas super quickly. Is it more efficient than electricity? Longer trips without refueling is a good thing. These are all perfect for commercial trucking, but not necessarily for a daily commuter. Large batteries for a truck must be expensive, and at some point I think we will start to see lithium shortages, especially if EVs become more popular. Both methane fuel and electric can thrive together.

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Keeperofthe7keysAf-S t1_itxpckm wrote

Longer trips and heavy duty applications like shipping would be the main benefit. As far as efficiency, burning it in a large scale power plant to make electricity to power an EV is more efficient than burning it to directly power a vehicle. But certainly there are applications that make sense.

Keep in mind though methane capture from waste can only scale so much and trying to produce more would defeat the purpose. We won't be in danger of running out of lithium anytime soon, it is one of the most common elements in the planet's crust and there is a lot of it in the ocean. Any shortage is going to be market driven which, while lithium is abundant, accessing much of it can be difficult and expensive. Remember that batteries are almost entirely recyclable though so you get a really long life out of it once you've mined it.

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FrolfLarper t1_itwlo0o wrote

I’m not trying to die on this hill, but just throwing the cow shit in a digester doesn’t capture all their emissions. They burp and fart too. Deep decarbonization will either require dialing back beef/dairy production or massive offsets. Probably both.

BTW I’m not poo pooing the poo poo choo choo.

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Keeperofthe7keysAf-S t1_itw3v3p wrote

That still makes it CO2 sourced from and that will return to the atmosphere anyways. I agree our farming practices are unsustainable but they don't conjure new carbon atoms into existence and not utilizing the resource that exists anyways, and in a more harmful form than the CO2 it is destined to return to regardless because of a different, tangentially related issue is ironically a whataboutism.

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