Submitted by F1NNTORIO t3_zmisk3 in Futurology
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Comments
hoffster247 t1_j0b7oez wrote
Unless the toaster was gas powered?
Surur t1_j0b7sqt wrote
A plasma arc could do it....
Whatareyoudoing1111 t1_j0b7uyz wrote
Maybe toaster with lasers would do that. But 5 seconds to boil water sounds dangerous. Although maybe under vacum it could be faster. Like a kettle with pressure cooker features.
hoffster247 t1_j0b7z5q wrote
Even if the kettle was induction powered it wouldn't work that fast, you'd need a nuclear kettle.
ELearnerBypass t1_j0b86pu wrote
This would probably work
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0b89av wrote
Can I get lasers at bunnings?
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0b8heu wrote
Kettle: you're thinking too small, you want boiling water on tap
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0b8t5q wrote
William Osman made toast with lasers
hoffster247 t1_j0b8vjz wrote
Yeah, 3 phase though.....
kagemushablues415 t1_j0b8x2y wrote
They have this in Asia...kinda. There is a reserve tank that keeps the water hot, and then you can press a button to flash boil it. Zojirushi is the brand from Japan that does this really well
sandtymanty t1_j0b8xe6 wrote
An auto wash and dry toilet bowl first over anything else please.
mrjake118 t1_j0b96uq wrote
I've got one. It's not boiling (because it would probably explode every time you use it otherwise) but it comes out about 175 degrees. Perfect for green tea, rinsing dishes, or filling a pot for a faster boil.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0b9aj5 wrote
Oh yeah true. Can I get toaster on tap too?
[deleted] t1_j0b9bzr wrote
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F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0b9dqj wrote
I think Japan has this too 😂
Murray_PhD t1_j0b9o9s wrote
A toaster that gets hot enough, fast enough, to toast a slice of bread, would likely be so hot that it would carbonize the bread (fancy term for burn the shit out of it lol.)
You would need to lower the pressure greatly for the water to boil that quickly, without risk of rapid deconstruction of your kettle. Even then when you went to poor it out it would cool rapidly because of that pesky law of thermodynamics and the fact that it boils at a much lower tempature at the lower pressure levels.
tl:dr Physics!
rorykoehler t1_j0bahne wrote
I have a 5 second kettle. I think it's 3000w. I put in just enough for a cup of tea and by the time I get the tea bag in a mug and grab the kettle it's boiled. 2 litres takes a bit longer but not long at all.
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0bas92 wrote
How many atmospheres of pressure do you live under such that 175° isn't boiling!
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0bb5js wrote
I'll answer my own question, 9 bar or only 9m of water.
RedditVince t1_j0bc0ov wrote
175 F is not boiling for water, I presume the op is using F.
Stopa42 t1_j0bdlvs wrote
Physicist here. To boil 1 litre of water you need 4200 J of energy per degree of Celsius. So to heat water to boiling temperature from room temperature, you need approximately 4200 J/°C * 80°C = 336 kJ of energy. To deliver that amount of energy in 5 seconds means you need to supply power of 336 kJ / 5s = 67.2 kW. With standard 230 V outlet this would be 67.2 kW / 230 V = 290 A of electric current. Using 3phase plug for 360 V would require 186 A. Cables in walls are typically rated for a few tens of Amperes, definitely not hundreds. This is why circuit breakers are typically rated for ~20A. Running such a high current through the cables would literally melt them.
TLDR: You most definitely can have a 5-second kettle but it would set your house on fire.
EDIT: Electric vehicle superchargers are usually rated for 50-100kW, so you could make a kettle that plugs in EV supercharger and boils water in less than 5 seconds.
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0bduvd wrote
It was a joke, apparently not obvious enough.
mrjake118 t1_j0bev6k wrote
Water boils at 212.
SubaruSufferu t1_j0bg462 wrote
It boils at 212 for those who are not using the freedom unit
LanceCriminalGalen t1_j0bh3lk wrote
Modern HTST pasteurization equipment can reach near boiling almost instantly. Something like this could work for boiling water on tap.
LanceCriminalGalen t1_j0bhd9q wrote
What brand? I want one!
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0bi794 wrote
Ooo smart stuff
[deleted] t1_j0bi9dl wrote
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0bikyk wrote
When shall we rise out of the dark ages and into futuristic housing with supercharged cables and appliances?
pab_guy t1_j0bipge wrote
Nah just use a supercapacitor it's fine.
Rogermcfarley t1_j0bjhp9 wrote
It's the dark ages to utilise more power. Need to use less power not more wherever possible.
prescience6631 t1_j0bjzmt wrote
Setting my house on fire for 5-second kettle is a reasonable tradeoff, where do I sign up?
If I nuke my neighborhood can I have 5-second pizza or hot pockets?!
Robot_Noises t1_j0bk268 wrote
Come to the UK, we have 3kW kettles on tap.
VukKiller t1_j0bk7he wrote
Now make it wireless.
jnmtx t1_j0bkknp wrote
A handheld butane culinary torch can make toast. Takes about 10sec per piece of bread. video: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W3qfbw3WnmI
TronyJavolta t1_j0bkwbb wrote
Why did she throw the salad in the air?
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0bl34k wrote
I love when people advocate against technologies on the internet and don't even get the irony of it.
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0blm5i wrote
Well, duh, you obviously need to use a 4-dimensional toaster to evenly deliver toasting all over the bread thickness, then it won't carbonize.
jnmtx t1_j0bln5d wrote
“FASTEST KETTLE … De'Longhi KBLA3001.R Active Line Kettle … Boiling the full capacity [1.7L] takes just over three minutes, while it takes two minutes for one litre and a speedy 45 seconds to boil enough for one cup.”
price 35 - 40 GBP (43 - 50 USD)
swiminpool t1_j0bm49q wrote
What, he’s gonna write you a fuckin letter or something? Lol
Rogermcfarley t1_j0bmgpx wrote
I'm a strong advocate of technology. I'd rather have working fusion technology, machine learning that will help us create better scientific studies and unravel the vast complexity of human biology so we can treat more health issues. Technology that creates sustainable consumerism and technology that eliminates the need to deforest the rain forests, to stop using flourinated gasses and nitrogen based fertilisers. If that means my kettle doesn't boil in 5 seconds that's the sacrifice I'll gladly make.
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0bn74r wrote
Then why would you advocate against boiling kettle in 5 seconds? Having faster energy delivery does not have any anti-preservational qualities in itself. For what it's worth it the other way around, from charging cars to warming houses, if our power grid could do more we would be able to replace fossils faster.
1stdayof t1_j0bneko wrote
Getting the water to boil requires the same amount of energy whether that's completed at 10A or 200A.
Rogermcfarley t1_j0bo475 wrote
It does but it requires an infrastructure change that's arguably unnecessary and I refer you to my previous point on consumerism.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0boaxe wrote
Thats too long! 😭
rorykoehler t1_j0botup wrote
This one https://severin.com/site/en/produkt/en159_coffee_tea/en166_kettles/wk-3418-digital-electric-kettle/
It''s 1.7L but i boil 2L at a time because yolo.
[deleted] t1_j0bpj34 wrote
Tree-farmer2 t1_j0bpmom wrote
The real limitation of electricity replacing fossil fuels is that storage is much more challenging.
Tree-farmer2 t1_j0bpvz5 wrote
>Although maybe under vacum it could be faster.
But the lower temperature may defeat the purpose
ryan__fm t1_j0bqaio wrote
That's assuming the liter of water is in a kettle-shaped container, right? If a coffee machine can constantly get cold water to very high temperatures very quickly because it's a small amount at a time, wouldn't it be possible to design a kettle so that more of the water's surface area is in contact with the heating elements? So essentially instead of boiling 1 liter of water in a pot, you're boiling something like 1/10 of a liter of water in 10 smaller pots?
edit: I think I get it... I suppose what I'm describing would be possible if you could supply that much power to it that quickly. Coffee machines use a lot of power but over a longer period of time
protoman888 t1_j0bqbxu wrote
It's possible... just you need to produce a high amount of heat/energy which would require an industrial spec device- not suitable for mass consumption- economics dont work which is why we don't have 'em!
protoman888 t1_j0bqggn wrote
and integrate AI into it which knows when I want my cup of tea
jdbrew t1_j0bqnac wrote
Now there’s a question. At what distance from a nuclear bomb with the heat from the explosion perfectly cook a hot pocket
mcarterphoto t1_j0brkhp wrote
While it's not going to get ya to 5 seconds, a big issue with kettles is how full they are. My wife fills ours up all the way and boils it, uses one cup of water. I boil a cup at a time which is very quick and beats standing there waiting for a whole kettle to boil. And... the more you boil water, the "flatter" it tastes (to some people anyway).
(I've got one year of college, my wife has a PhD, but I still can't get her to go to "cup at a time").
lostnumber08 t1_j0btyz4 wrote
The simple solution is to have fire-proof houses. I need tea immediately!
[deleted] t1_j0bvabb wrote
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mascarenha t1_j0bzo2z wrote
Toast it on an open flame over your stove. Maybe takes 10 seconds.
timelesssmidgen t1_j0c11bs wrote
How about with a big old capacitor inside the kettle which trickle charges in between use?
jrp55262 t1_j0c1cwb wrote
What you describe is basically an electric tankless water heater. Here are some specs from one manufacturer. The beefiest one they've got requires a 150A electrical connection and it still only raises the input water temperature by 98F; assuming that the incoming cold water is about 55F that gets you up to 153F... which might steep a cup of tea but is still well shy of boiling.
lewisc1985 t1_j0c2g5i wrote
That’s 98 degree delta at 2.5gpm, mind you. If you lower how many gallons are going through it, it can get much warmer. I have a 18kw unit that can do 70-80 degree delta with three 20 amp breakers at a much lower gpm.
chcampb t1_j0c3ct9 wrote
I'm gonna go with "The Laws of Physics" on this one.
But to get around your question, you can get hot water in about the time it takes to get to the coffee maker at most workplaces because it has a little hot water nozzle on the front. So it heats up over time and then keeps it hot for you, that solves the 5s timer.
And in restaurants you can use what is called a Salamander which does something similar - it heats up to ridiculous temperatures over time, and then you just put stuff you want toasty underneath. For example I just watched a video where they made a bechamel with a poached egg underneath, then got the bechamel toasty so fast it didn't cook the egg.
You can do something similar with a kitchen torch (which, if you have a special someone, and want to be fancy, make them creme brulee with a kitchen torch... besides being delicious it is impressive as hell).
AndyTheSane t1_j0c5vhj wrote
I suspect that with toast, there is a hard limit based on heat transfer through the bread - you could no doubt burn the outside of a piece of bread in less than a second, but that wouldn't give the same toast texture.
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0c6ns0 wrote
There are many real limitations, and storage is one of them, but many of people are clueless to how much the grid itself and its limitations in power delivery and (!) conversion are a problem. The only difference with storage is that overall we already know how to do it. If storage would be magically solved tomorrow you would still need to upgrade and partially rebuild the whole grid to make things work.
Surur t1_j0c6x40 wrote
That is why you need electricity, like when they make panko.
ReaperofFish t1_j0c77et wrote
When we have individual fusion generators with superconductor wiring in our homes.
A_Slovakian t1_j0c9r18 wrote
The current grid could never support everyone having a 5 second boil kettles or a 10kW PC or what have you. It would cost billions to upgrade the grid to support that and doing such a massive infrastructure project would release millions of tons of CO2 into the atmosphere.
A_Slovakian t1_j0ca4gs wrote
Tough one for toast. You could easily increase the temperature in your toaster but all that would do is toast the top layer and by the time that toasted flavor penetrates deep enough to make good toast, the top layer would be burnt. Cook times and temperatures are a balancing act. You need to heat to penetrate the food without burning the outside layers. You could absolutely toast the top layer of bread in 5 seconds, but the rest of the bread will just be soft bread, which you don't want
timbe3 t1_j0cc2bv wrote
This can be easily accomplished by ensuring that each slice of bread has the exact same density and composition.
Meaning, it's not the toaster that is inconsistent.. it's the bread. It may be possible to overcome this with a variety of sensors that guage the bread's dimensions, mass, thickness, etc.. but, that begs the question. Would anyone actually pay hundreds of thousands for a toaster that could analyze Martian soil?
timbe3 t1_j0ccfim wrote
New start-up, KTL enters the chat
timbe3 t1_j0ccj9t wrote
For the amount of energy needed... Wouldn't that requires a capacitor bank the size of a car?
Zanshi t1_j0ccol6 wrote
I expect slices of the same loaf to be of similar density and composition , if it’s toast bread then dimensions as well.
Really only thing that changes is starting parameters of the toaster, as it is already warm after toasting the first batch, rather than starting from cold
timbe3 t1_j0cdomv wrote
I'd be willing to bet that there is quite a big difference (relatively speaking) between each slice in both size and weight.
Also.. just for fun I found this :
timelesssmidgen t1_j0cez2w wrote
Wikipedia tells me super capacitor energy densities are around 0.01 MJ/kg (no idea if that's reasonable for consumer grade stuff) So to store 336 kJ you'd need 34 kg of super capacitor. Not nothin' but if you really want that cuppa right now you might go in for it. Electrolytic capacitors are more like 0.00001 MJ/kg, requiring 34 thousand kg. So... I won't be installing that under my sink.
badumtussssss t1_j0cf5s6 wrote
A tangential question.... How about instant charging of phones and small electronics?
MeGrendel t1_j0cfpia wrote
No matter how high you heat your toast or kettle, there is an upper limit to how fast that heat can be conducted through the medium (bread or water).
At a certain limited, you either just char the surface of the bread, or vaporize the water in contact with the heating element, while the inner bread or water still remains ambient.
As water is liquid, that high of a temperature WOULD result in a faster boiling time, but it would be a violent process. Not something safe for the kitchen.
jawshoeaw t1_j0cgntr wrote
I believe the national ignition facility may be interested in your above grant proposal.
Nyrk333 t1_j0chkpj wrote
Why accept the limitations of the house wiring? You don't need to *source* 336 Kj of energy in 5 seconds, you need to *deliver* that much energy to the water in 5 seconds...
If your kettle had a large capacitor that charged up over, say 30 minutes, and maintained that charge. You could pour water into it, retreat to a minimum safe distance, and trigger the kettle remotely with an app on your phone....
ThePowderhorn t1_j0cj4vg wrote
I'm content to read the results of that experiment from hundreds of miles away.
ThePowderhorn t1_j0cll0s wrote
Count me among the clueless. One of the things that's been percolating in my mind as more and more devices run on DC and batteries is when the electric grid as it currently exists will be an anachronism for its then-current (no pun intended) use cases. Your mention of conversions brought this to the fore.
I get that pretty much everything short of solar is turbine-driven, which if I recall correctly is why we have an AC grid (high-school physics was a while ago, so I don't remember why). Since solar is the only residential-scale generation option, at what point does it start making sense to keep small-scale (say, neighbourhood level) DC needs separate from the AC that industry is designed around? I can't imagine there's anything to be gained from DC-AC-DC conversion.
edit: typo
Stopa42 t1_j0cmpor wrote
It's called induction cooker.
monkeynotes303 t1_j0cp1j6 wrote
On demand hot water boilers are a thing, but not boiling and not 5 seconds. OP needs to up his electrical, it's possible to do, but sounds like you need a new electrical panel, more copper in your walls, an engineer, and a word with the utility company.
steed_jacob t1_j0cqvqw wrote
Nuclear fusion will have this figured out in a few years don’t sweat
Procyon4 t1_j0cr7hf wrote
Drop it right on top of the hot pocket to ensure the proper molten magma temp inside to burn all your taste buds
Got_ist_tots t1_j0crq95 wrote
Ooh can even have bubbly water too!
alexjaness t1_j0crs49 wrote
yes, but they will still somehow be frozen in the middle
ThePowderhorn t1_j0cse8k wrote
I'm starting to feel like I was sold a bill of goods on sliced bread.
MarredCheese t1_j0cu3qw wrote
Yep. You can get this without installing anything too, if you prefer. I have a Zojirushi water heater sitting on my counter. Pretty efficient since it's got vacuum insulated walls like a thermos.
X2ytUniverse t1_j0cu4o3 wrote
I'm not a physicyst, but I've got a feeling 5 second water or kettle would probably either melt, or explode instantly. Besides, that much thermal energy would definitely burn the toast surface instantly, while not doing anything to the insides, and water would probably just instantly evaporate.
PM_ME_YOUR_WOLOLO t1_j0cuuq8 wrote
I had to look this up because I didn't remember why either https://energyeducation.ca/encyclopedia/Alternating_current#:~:text=Alternating%20current%20(AC)%20is%20the,transmitting%20electricity%20over%20long%20distances. but apparently it's more efficient (less energy loss in most circumstances)
stellarblackhole1 t1_j0cuz7y wrote
Would it be cheaper and more efficient to lower the atmosphere of the kettle in order to induce boiling at that point?
GuyLostInTime t1_j0cvr3u wrote
good reply
X2ytUniverse t1_j0cw3i1 wrote
I don't want to say for sure, but I'm pretty sure there was 2014-ish youtube video about that, might've been one of the Vsauce channels or something. Think they determined that its actually impossible.
[deleted] t1_j0cw4qz wrote
If this isn’t already in one of Randall Munroes books, expect it to be very soon!
Liquidwombat t1_j0cxwx1 wrote
If you’ve got enough energy to dump into it, it absolutely is, it’s just not realistically practical to do so. it would take a “kettle” that draws about 330,000 W to boil a liter of water in five seconds
Stopa42 t1_j0czn91 wrote
I'm not sure if vacuum pumps are exactly cheaper and more efficient at making water boil (evaporate in full volume instead of just surface) but it would be quite pointless. It's not the vapour bubbles that cook your pasta or brew your tea, it's the water temperature. That's why Papin's pressure pot is a thing, the high pressure increases the temperature limit and allows you to cook watery food at temperatures above 100°C.
Txcavediver t1_j0d8z4g wrote
Water boiling in a vacuum will actually cool off the water. You can freeze water by letting it boil in a vacuum. The energy is removed during the phase change.
rixtil41 t1_j0dar5w wrote
Instantly vaporized if someone walks in front of it.
Murray_PhD t1_j0db6a6 wrote
Well, I never thought about that. I mean, would a slice of toast fit in a four-dimensional toaster? Would you need a four-dimensional piece of toast?
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0dc6g6 wrote
All renewables require a DC-AC conversion. And we would need tons of them. And they use rare metals.
Broadly conversion also means voltage transformation. If you want to run more current (because we make more electricity, because we need more electricity, because we charge cars and shift from cooking with gas to electric etc etc) then you either need more wires (and more towers, and transformers) or you need better wires and better transformers.
There is additional problem with maintaining electric frequency. Currently it is done via fossil generators, nuclear is not suitable for that purpose because of how it's generation is used. Renewables are expensive at that. In future of renewable energy it has to be done with storage. If storage is used for it then storage would not just be a 'backup battery' now, it would become a grid forming part, with added requirements.
I googled a good article about that, here: https://www.greentechmedia.com/squared/dispatches-from-the-grid-edge/solving-the-renewable-powered-grids-inertia-problem-with-advanced-inverters
thefarstrider t1_j0dco4h wrote
> EDIT: Electric vehicle superchargers are usually rated for 50-100kW, so
you could make a kettle that plugs in EV supercharger and boils water in
less than 5 seconds.
Patent that shit my friend. Brits would install the chargers even without owning an EV.
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0dd61t wrote
You talk like you've never seen a 4-dimensional toaster!
Obviously the toaster itself is regular, it's the heating element configuration that delivers the power in 4 dimensions thanks to the Physical Effect of the Updog.
ThePowderhorn t1_j0ddzp1 wrote
Thanks for the link! Usually I have a distance excuse to not do further research, but given that I get my power from Austin Energy, learning more should be rather doable.
Chikkuri t1_j0df6es wrote
we need a fire proof house
CruxCapacitors t1_j0dfu7a wrote
I wouldn't call water at 175° C "boiling".
jeffbloke t1_j0dg81j wrote
so basically, we can already do it but having the equipment available to do it is a massive, constant, ongoing death hazard. sweet.
ManBoyChildBear t1_j0dgsi8 wrote
technically its boiling at 212 for F and C
Dlee8113 t1_j0dkwjl wrote
Yeah, was gonna say I swear I’ve seen a vid on like flash cooking a frozen pizza
Phoenix042 t1_j0dlszk wrote
Looks like about 12 would do it, according to this graph
p1mrx t1_j0dn03n wrote
Electric vehicle batteries regularly deliver 150+ kW, so it might be more practical to design a superkettle into the car's electrical system.
BlurredSight t1_j0dnj44 wrote
Yeah, instant water heaters (usually tankless and electric) can do this but not boiling but around 150-170 F
cesrep t1_j0dotpg wrote
Because that's not how bread and water work.
If you want toast, you wouldn't use a blowtorch. Intense heat applied briefly is going to burn the bread long before the heat transfers from the outer layer to the inner ones. Too low a temp, and the bread won't actually toast, just get warm and eventually dry.
Same deal with water. You have to maintain a temperature so that it can conduct to the rest of it.
Basically, toasters and kettles are already the Goldilocks thermal solution for those specific materials. So unless you wanna invent self-heating bread or highly thermally conductive water, you gotta be happy with what we've got.
sebastianKH339 t1_j0drkqt wrote
5 second toaster would destroy the outside of your bread, and leave the inside cold
sebastianKH339 t1_j0drt6z wrote
should be using hotter water to properly steep green tea
sebastianKH339 t1_j0ds3m8 wrote
laser toaster would work less effectively than a normal toaster
denzien t1_j0dsp5h wrote
Not quite ... liquid water can reach 212°C as long as there's at least 20 atmospheres of additional pressure on it.
At standard atmosphere though, adding more energy just speeds the vaporization. This makes water useful for controlling cooking - as long as liquid water exists in a pan, the temperature of the pan can't exceed the boiling temperature at your elevation.
There's a method of cooking bacon that submerges it in a little water. Bacon undergoes the maillard reaction (browning) at [a fast rate around] 300°F. As long as there is water in the pan, browning of the bacon will not occur. The fat, however, renders out at 140°F. So this method uses water to provide the energy to render out the fat safely delaying the maillard reaction until the water has all evaporated. The pan will then increase over ≈212°F very quickly, so best to be careful not to burn it.
PsikoticWanderer t1_j0duw2u wrote
I am an electronics engineer. AC current travels long distances on a conductor while losing very little energy. DC current loses energy in the form of heat as it travels on a conductor. Centralized power grids liked we have today based on DC are not possible.
When AC shorts to ground a local thermal event occurs causing localized damage. When DC+ shorts to DC- it heats the whole conductor path from the point of contact back to the source and damages or destroys all conductors in that circuit. In the event of a short AC repairs will be much cheaper.
Google Edison Tesla, they had a years-long feud over AC vs DC power grid. An elephant may have been involved.
PM_ME_YOUR_WOLOLO t1_j0dv3kp wrote
Thank you for the explanation! Yeah I do recall learning about Edison and Teslas feud over AC vs. DC. I’m a software engineer so this isn’t my wheelhouse at all
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0dv7f1 wrote
Toastiness FTW!
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0dvghp wrote
Cant wait to install my replicator
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0dvqdh wrote
Phew. Thanks bro. 3 years tops yeah?
mrjake118 t1_j0dwb0b wrote
Not according to the multitude of charts that pop up on the Google image search for tea steeping temperatures, but I'm not much of a perfectionist. As long as it's not bitter and only slightly caffeinated, I'm happy with it.
[deleted] t1_j0dwmcc wrote
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IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0dwmku wrote
Respectfully as you're obviously big on the physics, you're wrong about the maillard reaction. Similar to pasteurization this can occur at lower temperatures over longer time, sous vide black garlic is a good example of this.
Timoman6 t1_j0dx1gr wrote
Still too cold
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0dxiw8 wrote
Self heating bread! Yes! How can we genetically engineer the bread to start heating when you snap it like a glowstick??
sebastianKH339 t1_j0dxqwl wrote
my bad, I was thinking of oolong tea (90/91°c)
bcredeur97 t1_j0e07i0 wrote
Is it not possible to charge a bank of batteries or supercapacitors using lower current overnight and then blast it in 5 seconds from the batteries in the morning?
denzien t1_j0e0o9r wrote
That's true - it can occur at lower temperatures, but there is a practical minimum temperature is there not? Is it lower than the boiling point of water at 1atm or does the explanation still hold true in the abstract?
PsikoticWanderer t1_j0e7gap wrote
I do software too. Test dev for an automotive manufacturer so I get to build test stands and program them. Fun stuff.
denzien t1_j0eb593 wrote
Not at 0.4659 atmospheres. Our friend here is somewhere in the Andes mountains, probably.
Jetm0t0 t1_j0eb902 wrote
How much energy/heat loss is there from the boiling reaction? I am taking physics soon and couldn't find an answer yet.
epSos-DE t1_j0ee39d wrote
ADDitionally energy state intertia is hard to break.
​
Acceetation requires more energy than the steady system of incremental steps.
​
Fast heat-up does requiere additional acceleration effort of the process.
​
Slow build-up and then a faster heating up could work and maybe shorten the total time by about 25%-30%
​
Like a boost at 60°C to 80% is much easier than working with cold water.
MrWigggles t1_j0eghn1 wrote
Can water actually heat in 5 seconds? Water can only absorb so much heat in a given amount of time.
H_is_for_Human t1_j0egkhp wrote
That's called a bomb.
Tree-farmer2 t1_j0egvx8 wrote
Didn't DC motors at the time cause sparks and AC solved this?
Tree-farmer2 t1_j0eh3u3 wrote
Why isn't nuclear suitable?
little_lamb_chop t1_j0eha5r wrote
Someone on YouTube tried to make it possible: https://youtu.be/dDLw1Rx_cAI https://youtu.be/UUPSGvWr6xE
bbear122 t1_j0ell82 wrote
What’s Updog?
PM_ME_YOUR_WOLOLO t1_j0enmd6 wrote
Oooo that is pretty cool
boonepii t1_j0eo3ad wrote
How does induction work then? I hear it boils water in seconds.
onewilybobkat t1_j0etwke wrote
I lost it at this
itzak1999 t1_j0euai2 wrote
That is just a steam sauna
Amreissa21 t1_j0eufox wrote
At my parent’s house, they have an instant hot water dispenser. It’s like any other filtered little water fountain that sits right next to the sink and connects down through the counter into a water line.
I know nothing at all about the science behind it or how it works, but the water comes out literally steaming just one second after I turn it on.
It has two nozzles on top, one that’s room temp, one for the instant hot. It is more than hot enough for tea and is ready in just a few seconds.
Body_By_XboX t1_j0eux00 wrote
Because someone would come out with a 4 second toaster, and that is just too fast
[deleted] t1_j0eyx3w wrote
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thedreamlan6 t1_j0f0c0t wrote
Just use a liquid nitrogen bath and a high conductive sleeve, like a wet paper towel or something. Meet in the middle and put a cold tap water wet paper towel around it and put it in the ice box. Come back in 15 minutes.
realstreets t1_j0f18pb wrote
But what is the point of abundant energy from nuclear fusion if we can’t use it to supercharge our household appliances to save us 30 secs each morning?
Half-timeHero t1_j0f2qvs wrote
Additional potential problems:
Besides the power wires you would also need to consider heat transfer and the durability of the heating elements. Transfering that much energy into water within 5 seconds likely isn't even possible as the heating elements would need to be so hot it would flash boil the water immediately next to them, forming a protective layer of vapor, killing your heat transfer and probably melting the heating elements.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0f337z wrote
Wouldnt liquid nitrogen make the aluminium brittle?
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0f396k wrote
Excellent. Now tell me how your parents make toast
Affectionate-Memory4 t1_j0f6866 wrote
Plasma is easy. Just put a pair of grapes together in your microwave, touching each other, right in the middle of the turntable. Cover them with a glass if you value your microwave, and don't do it at all if you actually value your microwave. Or do it anyways, I'm not your mom.
HooverMaster t1_j0f6yi6 wrote
transfer of heat. It would result in steam explosions with the kettle and with cold bread center or burnt outside with the bread. Aside from the fact that most devices are limited by the amperage of standard outlets so they just can't output more power even if it was convenient.
HooverMaster t1_j0f77y2 wrote
1atm but in north america. specifically merica
Cool-Radish-1132 t1_j0f7ozi wrote
In order to heat a kettle up to the boiling point of water (and sometimes even hotter), it is theoretically possible to heat a kettle up to boiling temperature in five seconds but it would require a tremendous amount of energy equivalent to a hand grenade. Same goes for the toaster, it takes a tremendous amount of energy to heat it up to the desired temperature and even then, through all of that
It takes time to transfer heat into the desired object.
fludd121 t1_j0f923i wrote
Sadly, what makes toast so great is a chemical reaction known as the Maillard reaction -- it's the same chemical reaction involved in giving grilled red meats their signature "crust," or caramelizing onions. As with both of the other two examples, the conditions at which the Maillard reaction takes place are often pretty restrictive when it comes to time and temperature, and adding more temperature doesn't always increase the rate of the reaction in a controllable fashion, especially when you consider that bread is mostly air and air is a rather impressive insulator.
oregonadmin t1_j0fepdg wrote
Your hot pockets will still be cold in the middle.....
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0ffa5a wrote
Wouldnt that make wine? Or plasma wine?
Affectionate-Memory4 t1_j0ffdcd wrote
Nope, the grapes are about the right size and shape to act like a 'lenses for the microwaves. The point where they touch gets really hot and produces plasma.
hgq567 t1_j0fh9ja wrote
Could you use a capacity+battery bastard to trickle charge when you aren’t using it?
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0fhbqr wrote
The minimum for practical purposes is 60c or 140f, it will take 3 months to "cook" garlic at this temperature, but the result is pure black garlic, not burnt at all, but perfectly sticky sweet.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0fhjmv wrote
Plasma bomb?
Affectionate-Memory4 t1_j0fiszt wrote
Nah, it's just going to make some little clumps of plasma that float around in your microwave. Those are stupidly hot though and could scorch the inside of the microwave. It shouldn't explode, but your microwave will be unhappy.
Calligraphee t1_j0fjsn5 wrote
I feel like Randall Munroe (of XKCD fame!) would be able to answer this on his What If? site; it's full of stuff exactly like this. Here's one that answers, from how high would you need to drop a steak for it to be cooked when it hits the ground?
Stopa42 t1_j0fmtk7 wrote
That's just a technical issue though. A kettle with a resistive heating element running through the whole body of water you would not even create that high of a temperature. Think about it as several standard kettles connected in parallel.
KindaSortaGood t1_j0fr60p wrote
Sounds like the entire UK power grid would implode if a 5 second kettle were invented.
Either that or we would have major advancements in adoption of electric vehicle charging tech.
yyytobyyy t1_j0fw75r wrote
Just an electrical correction.
Combined voltage in 3 phased circuit for 230V phase voltage is 400V. For old 220V circuits it's 380V. 360V never existed.
Current in 3 phase circuit can't be just added together when using combined voltage.
However, with resistive AND balanced load (implying perfect 3 phase kettle), you can just calculate single phase current and divide by 3. So the current for 67.2kW in 3 phase circuit would be ~97A per phase.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0fzz3j wrote
How do I make plasma bomb?
NoMoreNoxSoxCox t1_j0g28v3 wrote
Amperage ratings on your house circuits. It's possible, just not economical. You don't want to pay for a $40,000 kettle or toaster in your house most likely. (Numbers are wild ass guesses loosly founded on some electrical infrastructure knowledge).
marcveldus t1_j0g2etz wrote
Well, toasters and kettles typically use heating elements made of metal, such as nichrome or stainless steel, which heat up relatively slowly compared to other materials. To achieve a heating time of five seconds, a toaster or kettle would need to use heating elements made of a more efficient and expensive material, such as tungsten or molybdenum, which would make the product more expensive to produce and less practical for consumers.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0gbn4v wrote
Yes I do want to pay darlink
desrevermi t1_j0gpp50 wrote
Home economics math applied to cooking -- a lot of us have seen people try to make this reasoning
"Why cook this cake at 350° for 15 minutes when I can have it ready in 30 seconds at 9000°?!"
denzien t1_j0gsee8 wrote
That definitely sounds like it has a name - but I wouldn't call a 90 day cook time practical for most people 😄
Stopa42 t1_j0gsnzn wrote
You are of course right. It is 230 V * sqrt(3) ~ 400 V. I don't know how I came up with the 360 V. I don't use these values very often so they are not really imprinted well in my memory. The point stays the same, although circuit breakers rated close to that value are actually commercially available so we're not that far away I think.
IGetNakedAtParties t1_j0gt4tf wrote
If you have a sous vide it's set and forget. "Black garlic" is the name, the cooking method is just called ageing, as it is basically accelerated ageing, pasteurization kinda covers this too.
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0gvztw wrote
Not much, what about yourself?
YawnTractor_1756 t1_j0gw63q wrote
Because its production is very stable. You cannot crank it up or down on demand fast.
F1NNTORIO OP t1_j0i0ax3 wrote
Hahaahaha yuuuuuus
Tree-farmer2 t1_j0i6lc8 wrote
Isn't that the same for coal though?
desrevermi t1_j0intzz wrote
I've seen this kind of logic IRL.
I just walked away. Wonder if anything in a two block radius still exists there...
r2k-in-the-vortex t1_j0mt7j6 wrote
I recon this could do the job https://www.eaton.com/us/en-us/catalog/electronic-components/xlr-supercapacitor-module.html maybe two of them. A bit bulky and expensive for a kettle of course, but it's hard to argue with 5s tea...
[deleted] t1_j0ub7vu wrote
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hoffster247 t1_j0b7a93 wrote
Kettle- 240 volt isn't enough, toaster, won't be warm on the inside, you could potentially incorporate a microwave I to the toaster but the it would have to be closed instead of open?