You must log in or register to comment.

xPlus2Minus1 t1_j1n9tns wrote

Me, John cage's 4'33 on repeat


TheRebelChemist t1_j1o53dk wrote

Asked Siri to play this.

Took me way too long to realize the music was never coming.

Edit: and then I lost all function of my eardrums at 4:33 when a different song came on.


GalacticShonen t1_j1oc7ea wrote

The silence, or the sounds in the silence, was the music :)


ariolitmax t1_j1pk6ks wrote

It makes a lot more sense live. A lot of tension forms in the air, as every creak and sniffle in the audience seems amplified a hundredfold.

In fact, there was a follow up piece written, with the very catchy name

One^3 = 4′ 33″ (0′ 00″) + 𝄞

It’s essentially the same idea, but with a microphone pointed at the audience to literally amplify the noises they’re making. So in my mind the piece is very much about the noises you make, and your experience within silence, rather than the silence itself


elpajaroquemamais t1_j1q9jpm wrote

The way most musicians shuffle through their papers between movements. 😂


AnAquaticOwl t1_j1oa9c1 wrote

Yeah. There isn't really a difference between music and "noise". Noise is arguably something that's unpleasant to the listener, but what's unpleasant to one person can be enjoyed by another. Hell, Noise *is* a genre of music.


GalacticShonen t1_j1oclsa wrote

For sound or "noise" to be "music" you need an artist (intention of stimulus) and an audience (perception of stimulus) which you could argue is a form of organization/pattern/structure


AnAquaticOwl t1_j1odhfa wrote

That's an oversimplification. John Cage argued that music could be defined as sound organized in time, which would imply that someone was deliberately organizing it but what about naturally occurring music (birds for example)? Does it need to be organized deliberately by a human?

What about artists who record random sounds from the environment and use that as a composition? Cabaret Voltaire used to record the sounds of the construction site across the street from their studio, NWW's Soliliquy for Lilith is composed of a feedback glitch, and Einstuerzende Neubauten's Steh Auf Berlin begins with the sound of a jackhammer to give a few examples.


GalacticShonen t1_j1ofqb9 wrote

It totally is a simplification but its a framework that works. Birds making the sound are still an "artist", or specifically from a cognitive science perspective, an agent that produces or modifies the stimulus.

Those artists using random sounds are still an agent putting intention into a stimulus through its presentation.

There doesn't need to be a separation between "artist" and "audience" either. By observing a stimulus, you yourself modify the perception of the stimulus through a psychological phenomena known as predictive processing.

One of my research areas is in music psychology, just my 2 cents. Definitely an interesting discussion


Feynmanprinciple t1_j1ozb83 wrote

I recall seeing an interview from a shakuhachi master about his approach to playing, and John cage was among the audience. The monk spoke about there only ever being one sound, and playing the shakuhachi helped one realize this. One of the musicians asked what the sound was, and the shakuhachi master clapped his hands and said 'that was it'.

I believe John cage got his inspiration for 4'33 from the komuso tradition, and music students have been joking about it between themselves ever since. But if you actually check out suizen it's a well explored form of meditation.


_mach t1_j1ov5xr wrote

> John Cage argued that music could be defined as sound organized in time, which would imply that someone was deliberately organizing it but what about naturally occurring music (birds for example)? Does it need to be organized deliberately by a human?

Did John Cage mention "human" though? You seem to shift the goal post there.

>What about artists who record random sounds from the environment and use that as a composition? Cabaret Voltaire used to record the sounds of the construction site across the street from their studio, NWW's Soliliquy for Lilith is composed of a feedback glitch, and Einstuerzende Neubauten's Steh Auf Berlin begins with the sound of a jackhammer to give a few examples.

there's nothing random about those sounds, though - they were clearly organized into appearing at a specific point, in a specific context.

The Nurse with Wound example is interesting, but it's literally noise organised in time...


AnAquaticOwl t1_j1prykw wrote

The other user mentioned humans. "For sound or "noise" to be "music" you need an artist (intention of stimulus)"

"there's nothing random about those sounds, though - they were clearly organized into appearing at a specific point, in a specific context."

Sort of. A construction site is indeed just random noise...but what if I individually recorded each machine - a jackhammer, an excavator, men yelling, a dude with a rivet gun - and assembled them myself into the sounds of a busy construction site? It's *exactly* the same as a random site you might pass on the street but now it was assembled with intention. Is one just random noise and one noise music?


"The Nurse with Wound example is interesting, but it's literally noise organised in time..."

But it's mostly organized by sheer chance. Sure Steve is controlling the effects pedal to change the oscillations, but he's not creating the sound. Coil made heavy use of random, unpredictable glitches in their music too (they even had a word for it - Elph).


Boyd Rice's last album was just four long, unchanging tones.


grill_em_aII t1_j1ovqt6 wrote

The downvotes are so weird on this


GalacticShonen t1_j1ows60 wrote

I had a smiley face and maybe people thought I was being condescending so I removed it. I just really like this topic lol

Music education is also super behind neuroscience and psychology so there's a lot of growing pains in our discipline, adjusting to these new models of cognition and culture.


Impeesa_ t1_j1p3ghw wrote

Me, an intellectual: playing the extended club mix so it's a less repetitive loop.


_PineBarrens_ t1_j1pfbd7 wrote

Came here to say something along this line - repetition and organisation are hallmarks of traditional forms of music such as western classical.

20th century music on the other hand throws out these ideas and you get artists such as Halim El Dabh presenting field recordings as music.

The intention / agency is what really matters.


MaximumEffort433 t1_j1nelei wrote

I'm subscribed to both r-GetMotivated and r-adhdmeme and let me tell you that scrolling my feed can be a wild ride.

For those not in the know, ADHD is like a cacophony all the time, that's the default, and organizing an entire symphony orchestra is a terrifying enough thought that it makes me want to hide in the corner! 😅 Don't get me wrong, the sentiment of setting out to have an organized and orchestrated day is a good one, but what's interesting to me is that for this person being organized is the starting point, whereas for me being organized is a task in and of itself.

There's a kind of common joke among a lot of ADHD people, if not in word then in spirit:

>"Getting things done is simple, just break them down into smaller tasks."
>"But then there will be twice as many tasks!"
>"No, that's not-"
>"Do you know how much more work that would be!?"

Here's a gif explaining what I'm talking about.

That's all, that's the comment, how not all advice is universal, that what may seem like a small step for one might be a whole project for someone else.

Also if you like "start your day with a symphony" might I also suggest Brian Tracy's take: "Everyday start your day by eating the frog, whatever the worst thing is on your list, do that first, the rest will be easy by comparison."


curlyfat t1_j1npzif wrote

ADHD is like only having a kazoo and the only music you have is a full orchestral score. Lol!


MaximumEffort433 t1_j1nvmq2 wrote

It's trying to conduct the instruments instead of the orchestra, though the word "trying" implies a conscious effort when really it's more of an inability to do otherwise.


DerToblerone t1_j1nx98v wrote

It’s trying to conduct an orchestra, except every horn player is a golden retriever, half the violinists are squirrels, you’ve got a hotdog as a baton, and instead of a score you’ve got a Paw Patrol coloring book that isn’t colored in.


Jimbodoomface t1_j1o11ek wrote

Came to the comments to see if this had already been crossposted to r/adhdmeme


MaximumEffort433 t1_j1ocka6 wrote

It'll get there, I just figured this audience might have enjoyed the story, I'm not sure that normal people know how stuff like this sounds for us and it's an interesting juxtaposition, telling someone with ADHD to conduct a symphony with their day is a little like telling a double amputee to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.


dan_de t1_j1oyy01 wrote

I am so grateful someone else feels this way. That would take up my whole day!


AgentChris101 t1_j1pul0k wrote

Well as a composer with ADD this makes me feel a bit better. :p


HenKinkley t1_j1ntof5 wrote

“Bring da motherfuckin' ruckus” - Wu-Tang Clan


Yankton t1_j1oiaf8 wrote

Wu-Tang Clan ain't nuttin' ta fuck with!


Long_Educational t1_j1nqj2q wrote

My ADHD child like brain is walking the halls banging pots together and singing off key.


EdwardLewisVIII t1_j1neb2l wrote

I feel like I'm Free Jazz, lots of practice, little organization, no repetition, or pattern. I'm okay with that.


sidjo86 t1_j1ofkvq wrote

Bring the mutha fuckin’ ruckus!


Yankton t1_j1oicta wrote

Wu-Tang Clan ain't nuttin' ta fuck with!


thenewarkansans t1_j1ny79c wrote

Sometimes a ruckus is the best kinda song


viperex t1_j1prspe wrote

I've never been in a position to agree with this


RanCestor t1_j1nbqz7 wrote

My friend tried to explain me that the music genre "Noise" is what he uses to reset his musical experience.


Wuntoothrie t1_j1njn7q wrote

Several Species of Small Furry Animals Gathered Together in a Cave and Grooving with a Pict

Can't it be both?


Bazzatron t1_j1nnqlc wrote

Today is going to be little Timmy's first day practicing the cannon part for 1812 Overture.


StrayRabbit t1_j1o9gdy wrote

Bring da motherfucking ruckus!


Yankton t1_j1oibws wrote

Wu-Tang Clan ain't nuttin' ta fuck with!


tysons1 t1_j1oauqg wrote

I sure as shit don't want my life to be synonymous with military music.


YoM0mma t1_j1oebav wrote

i get what you're trying to say but music comes from noise, whether organized or not. I have definitely heard noises that have repetition, are organized and practiced and in the moment will not sound good. For example fire alarms, sirens for emergency vehicles, and songs that straight up do not sound good due to personal preference. What can be taken from what you are trying to say is that all noises have meaning and a purpose whether you like it or not, and it's up to one's self to educate themselves about the meaning, so then maybe you can outweigh the hate in life with love.

No one can choose the life that they have been given, but they can make the best of what they got.


GsTSaien t1_j1ok8ir wrote

Oh no let's not go there, if you read into music definitions you will see only debate.


nanadoom t1_j1om6p2 wrote

My life is a lot like experimental jazz, choas and random notes, but some people swear its music


kartoonbaab t1_j1oms0g wrote

Ngl, I feel this person thinks death metal is noise when it's music. Idk why I thought that but....yeah.....take it as you will lol.


bakinpants t1_j1p267c wrote

The difference between music and noise is the beholder.

This is a classic "rock music is just noise" bs post dressed up in a cheap dress.

Life is not a symphony. Life is crashing waves and we just survive them.


MyCatsNameisGibson t1_j1pyezq wrote

I totally agree with you. These kinds of sentiments are pretty, though incredibly vacuous.


Porcpc t1_j1pb7em wrote

well then... bring the muthafuckin ruckus


lemaquilleur t1_j1pucf0 wrote

Uncle Ruckus enters the chat WHAT


mWade7 t1_j1ngjwh wrote

Somehow, somewhere along the line, Yoko Ono slipped into the band playing the soundtrack to my life… :-/


mcstafford t1_j1nw1ef wrote

I'm not sure whether that's from Djane, or Jane's perhaps mid transition.


thewillofthed t1_j1o0wrv wrote

It's melody, harmony, and rhythm. The only fundamental that I've observed translate literally to life is rythym


Harak_June t1_j1o2tz1 wrote

An experimental arrangement.


KN_Knoxxius t1_j1o519u wrote

But don't forget we all need a little chaos in our lives once in a while to know we're alive. Embrace the ruckus.


vector_o t1_j1o8z2x wrote

It's gonna be jazz


sexymcluvin t1_j1o9j2i wrote

I want mine to be a jazz improve


Lazengann_overload t1_j1o9yru wrote

My life is the sound of a bag of spanners falling endlessly down an up escalator.


Nealium420 t1_j1ohfq1 wrote

Music are the wiggles in the air, man.


DanimalPlays t1_j1oi66z wrote

But what if I came to bring the ruckus?


MungAmongUs t1_j1oivdi wrote

Thelonious Monk would like a word.


Sok_Taragai t1_j1ojbmv wrote

My life is EDM by Jason Mendoza. It sucks.


ijke t1_j1ol0y8 wrote

I’ll do it tomorrow.


Zero_Burn t1_j1ooqn6 wrote

My life is chorus of disparate voices screaming, and that's just what's in my head.


Wuh-huW t1_j1oq0kz wrote



wellshire t1_j1oqj8i wrote

If what you say is true, the shaolin and the wu tang could be dangerous.


cashewbiscuit t1_j1os6le wrote

Well, I'd rather my life be like a jazz performance


Peepeepoopoopedia t1_j1otial wrote

"Whenever I think of having bad habits, I just stop and have good habits instead!" - this absolutely nonsensical "motivation"


lamp817 t1_j1otiv1 wrote

Yeah today will probably be a ruckus with a sublet hint of a beat in the background


Beaser t1_j1oxsuq wrote

Bring the muthafuckin ruckus!


SemichiSam t1_j1oyuuj wrote

Ruckus! Thank you for asking.


WWDubz t1_j1oz4yu wrote

Cowabunga it is


NerfShields t1_j1ozoxc wrote

idc what you say Jayne with a D, Wu-Tang once told me to BRING DA MUTHAFUKKIN RUCKUS


guilho123 t1_j1ozzxy wrote

Jokes on you i am into black metal


SwampGypsy t1_j1p0rbj wrote

I make a ruckus just getting out of bed.


33mondo88 t1_j1p1mmr wrote

Really kool perspective, spot on ✊


Cane-Dewey t1_j1p5g5t wrote

Can you describe the ruckus?

One of the greatest movies ever. Be like Ferris. Go out there and get shit done.


cbpcgroup t1_j1p5jkk wrote

There’s a few cool music videos on


23trilobite t1_j1p75v1 wrote

Complex music sound to normies like cacophony…


Taodragons t1_j1p7gog wrote

It's like nuts and bolts in a blender, but sometimes I can get it to pulse "We will rock you". Those are good days.


stackered t1_j1palk2 wrote

My life is jazz then. Way more interesting than the same old tune repeated


DikkDowg t1_j1peamn wrote

Life is better when it resembles grindcore - absolutely chaotic but barely being held together by just enough structure.


bakinpants t1_j1pgmaq wrote

So this is still nonsense. Who are you to tell someone else's brain what is valid? Your perception is broken


Piyhe t1_j1pks1g wrote

I guess my life is electro jazz and polyrhythms


Atrainlan t1_j1pl0qm wrote

Is today going to be a ruckus or full of fuck ups?


Alukrad t1_j1pled0 wrote

I like techno...

So i guess my life is nothing but a chaotic mess.

Don't feel like it is...


kubadawarrior t1_j1pomey wrote

I like experimental techno so i suppose organised chaos sums me up alright.


Gwtheyrn t1_j1puzrh wrote

I'm into punk rock, so cacophony and ruckus it is!


RebelBass3 t1_j1pvzkd wrote

“Can you describe the ruckus, sir?”


ParsleyFamous t1_j1pw0nh wrote

Miles Davis asks, "why not both?"


zaphod4th t1_j1pwc2u wrote

ruckus sounds like fun !


DeadlyPancak3 t1_j1q22wa wrote

People with ADHD out here making jazz


zuluwalker t1_j1q315b wrote

Everyday's improv jazz night


Chuckw44 t1_j1q58dp wrote

This is why I have always said Phish is not music, lol.


OwlReasonable9906 t1_j1q784k wrote

I get what they’re driving at but why did they have to use fun words like cacophony and ruckus? Have me second guessing a bit lol.


KennyTroy t1_j1q8y8q wrote

Another difference, the sound of silence, a key component to quality composition.


Buris t1_j1qb6oi wrote

Can I get some quiet once and a while?


NeverWakingHare t1_j1qbf15 wrote

that first half is just a argument I have with my family when I listen to music with no lyrics


Bikelikeadad t1_j1qduhs wrote

I have absolutely no musical talent whatsoever. Suddenly that explains a lot.


Nightingaile t1_j1o5rn3 wrote



YouAreNotABard549 t1_j1pahgq wrote

I don’t see how this applies here. They’re just talking about something that works for them.