PSA alerts on the airwaves and in the headlines everywhere. So I go into Hannafords and like maybe 1-in-10 are masked. Then I go to Walgreens and there's like 8 folk in the pharmacy line, all maskless, some coughing (including the people behind the counter), and I walk out thinking WTF?
So much for common sense. This bug is as highly contagious and hits kids hard, yet people just don't seem to GAF.
Stay safe out there!
Washing hands doesn't work on airborne viruses and staying home when sick doesn't work on asymptomatic spread. Not to mention, hand-washing was about as popular as wearing masks until the 1860s when our life expectancy "suddenly" doubled. We need to be able to evolve, and considering my survival (and the survival of our species) is rooted in interdependency, I think it's pretty fair to be frustrated.
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If you see yourself as the center of the universe, this is a very valid view.
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When other people die this doesn't offend you. But the people that die ARE offended. That's the subtle difference
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The voice of reason.
It's called public health for a reason.
Though you're mostly correct (about it being a social thing - and I'd use SARS in asia for comparison), people coughing for any reason in public should be of concern. This coming from a heavy smoker who's lungs are a phlegm factory.
Could be allergies, could be anything, including a germ. A cough, or two, into your arm is one thing, fine. Being a walking cough machine is another; socially speaking, despite what you (the cougher) may think/know.
I'm not shaming anyone F2F. This post is not shaming so much as calling common sense into question. And, FWIW, you're right; it is simple. Like carrying a gun, protecting oneself is a personal responsibility. Just stay outta my space and we'll be fine.
The CDC says its fine to go to work sick, just cough into your sleeve. Biden says back to work!
I agree.
I know many people who have had kids in the hospital because of RSV. Whats become clear is this country doesn’t give a damn about kids or the elderly
Our society never really cared about kids, specially poor ones. And most are just awaiting the day boomers will be dead-n-gone.
So, despite the strain on health-care professionals , here we are.
How does this reflect society doesn’t care about kids or elderly?
If society did then they would wear masks and get vaccinated to help the most vulnerable populations
Nobody takes personal responsibility to not harm kids. If it was legal these people would smoke and blow the smoke right in the kid's face.
Did you sleep through the pandemic? You obviously mean the Maine government lol
You mean the 50% of people who couldn’t be mildly inconvenienced to wear a mask? Or the ones who trusted Qanon over doctors for vaccines?
People are too pandemic-fatigued to care about RSV. Hardly anyone is masked anymore and no one wishes to because no one wants to have to do the thing they don't want to do again.
That, and I have to wonder if some people just think "Ah, it's a child's disease. Children are always so germy and they get sick all the time. Adults don't get RSV so I shouldn't worry."
> Hardly anyone is masked anymore and no one wishes to because no one wants to have to do the thing they don't want to do again.
I hear ya. I almost feel like I'll be living the rest of my (senior) life mask-in-hand :( There ya have it... germs - harder to dodge than bullets.
I live in the city of 100,000 people. I wear my mask going to the grocery store even today. Everywhere else not so much unless it's a crowded place and I can't get in and out quickly
So are we just supposed to wear masks for the rest of our lives?
honestly can't say. But wearing them indoors might be the smart move insofar as RSV and winter months are concerned.
My post was not a CV19 thing - most of us are vax'd and would only get marginally sick if infected; omitting the impact of long-covid, which is a real thing to consider. WRT covid we each take our own precautions, while hoping we collectively are not straining the care-system beyond its means.
If some people want to, to reduce risk of illness, is that a concern?
Sure if they want to wear a mask that’s totally fine and a personal choice. However, going back to a full time mask mandate again would not sit well with half the population for obvious reasons.
Obvious to Darwin, sure.
I mean, it’s like 33% that vote Republican, not half…
Vaxxed or unvaccinated I highly doubt the US is gonna go back to a mask mandate. Heck even Joe Biden almost never wears his mask anymore. You do you though and I’ll gladly not wear one even though I have been vaccinated.
To be fair, Biden lives in a very controlled environment where everyone is constantly tested. They call living in the White House "living in a bubble" for good reason. Furthermore, he literally has the best healthcare of anybody in America.
And still got Covid...
True, Biden and Jill both got it. I haven't had covid, and neither has anyone in my immediate family. We're all vigilant about masking.
So were they?
Not really. Biden tested positive four days after returning from his Mideast trip. Look at the photos, he's not masking indoors and sitting very close to people. https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/13/politics/gallery/biden-middle-east-trip/index.html
Yeah, and the bummer is if you wear a mask you're gonna live longer so you're gonna have to wear a mask even longer than if you didn't. They got you coming and going.
I still mask whenever I go into buildings. I don't care what anyone thinks of me, I used to get sick every month. I've only been sick 4 times in the past almost 3 years and the most recent one just last week and I believe I picked it up from being maskless at an indoor banquet. I'll keep masking until we're no longer allowed to, it's just easier for me.
I hear ya - thanks for sharing!
After COVID I became convinced that my estimations as to the quality of people in general was far, far above what it actually is.
"Roaches for Raid" comes to mind :)
Not sure why you're surprised.. As soon as it wasn't mandatory during covid, most people stopped. I've given up on Americans a long time ago.
> I've given up on Americans a long time ago.
It just seems like the % of 'stupid is as stupid does' is racing to keep up with infection rates :)
I've just given up. Everything is dialectically broken at this point and politicized in the most braindead way. I used to get frustrated but now I just wear the damn mask and don't expect much. There's confederate flags and swastika flags flying around and people think Trump is the child savior from heaven (who was friends with Epstein). Not sure how to navigate these times otherwise..
Its more the pity that besides covid, germs like RSV can become politicized in the MAGA arena. I just don't get the adoration of TD - never up before 11AM, then always on 'executive time' or out playing golf. Never did one thing he claimed he'd do, save for fleecing people. Shit, even the 2A crowd admit he's a gun-grabber!
Meanwhile, the maga-verse paints liberals as leftists, which neo-lib, 3rd way, blue (corpo) dogs, certainly are not; and anybody whose not a christo-fascist as a socialist! Like who needs a functioning USPO, or paved roads, or health-care .... privatize and pave the Earth!
We're F'd , even w/out climate change huffing at our doors; these Fox-addled maga-naughts are just fine w/billionaires deciding our collective fate.
I hate being so cynical :(
and downvoted for honesty that happens to be negative or by weird "patriots"?
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By the entire world, you mean the west. Also not true, lots of my friends in the EU mask and I see them at art events and shows on social media full of a room of masked folk. Germany and other countries are reconsidering mask mandates.
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It varies extremely from country to country even in the west. Also lots of countries in Asia wear masks before covid and especially now to prevent the spread of disease. You're generalizing billions of people (20% of which of the world's population live in China).
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Right, Asia is a small chunk of the world with over half the population of Earth. I guess it's insane to consider what they're doing over there here because this is the USA! I guess Germany requiring them in stores and public transit,, Cyprus requiring masks, France requiring them in some places, Australia considering it, Italy as well, etc is irrelevant as well. As winter progresses, I guarantee we'll see mask mandates, maybe some in municipalities here but of course nothing federal. It is an issue here as it is in other places but you're being really US centric..
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I live in the US and am replying in a thread about said topic in a country where discourse about wearing masks is way more fried and stupid than other areas of the world. It's simply not politicized nearly as much as it is here. If this was a thread about healthcare, I would be talking about healthcare. You have presented "two facts" - the world is over it, look at a soccer game. I responded with western countries with mask mandates in effect right now and reminding you that the east exists and has objectively responded to covid better than us because they don't have conversations like this.
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Why are you disregarding half the world's population because they're not in the west? Also I named several western countries with mask mandates active now, some of which I mentioned will require stricter ones in the future (i.e. Germany, Italy, France). After a quick google search, I saw Germany (and other EU countries require masks in some public places right now and are thinking about imposing a stricter mandate as winter cases go up). Which is why I saw everyone wearing masks in social media at events in Germany, Denmark, etc. What the fuck is your point? I'm not even saying it's just a US issue but I live in the US so I'm talking about it in the sub of my state in the US. What point are you arguing? Give up because some other countries suck at it too (even though most of the world things we're a dumpster fire right now)? You literally have rebutted with no facts other than it's not just the US, look at soccer game, world over it. I'm glad you feel comfortable speaking for the population of the world.
Wait, isn't RSV an issue BECAUSE of a lack of early immune system development in kiddos? Why does this have to be so politically driven? If you are fully vaccinated and boosted, why wear a mask? Also, I don't think anyone judges anyone else for wearing a mask in public. It is a personal choice. I think people that wear a mask may just be sensitive because they judge the 90% of the population that doesn't wear a mask. Finally, I'm all about people wearing masks if their doctor recommends it. Something tells me most people that wear a mask are asking Dr. Google or Dr. CNN.
> Why does this have to be so politically driven?
I really wasn't trying to make it political versus common sense. The only thing that drags politics into it is folk clinging to the "i'm not wearing a chin-diaper for any reason" - to which I could care less, providing they keep their shedding to themselves.
As of today, people are not seeing a need to mask up for RSV, which is fine I suppose. My point was noting that this year that bug is on the rise, the situation could change quickly, and wondering if common sense will prevail.
Which I'm taking, from this post, to be a no.
Wearing a mask gives people a sense of control. Remember how wearing a mask was only to prevent spreading? Now we have people straight up admitting they wear one because they feel safer.
Wearing a mask currently means that you have Covid and feel like it’s ok to shop as long as you are masked. It’s code for: “stay far away from me”.
Maskless coughing is code for: I’m in denial and don’t want to test or wear a mask.
What about just wearing a mask to prevent getting and spreading disease in general..
Almost no one is doing that anymore :/
I am. I haven't stepped into a public place ONCE without a mask since March 2020. Why? I have family that's immunocompromised, and now they're basically prisoners of their home because the general public won't mask. They can't go anywhere, and worse, they can't vaccinate due to the same health issues.
It's no way to live. It sucks that healthy people just don't care.
I hear you, both me and my spouse have autoimmune diseases and my mom who lives with us was dx'd with cancer last year and has been getting treatment for most of this year. Masks for us. But yeah, it feels like the general population gave up entirely.
No one's done it before COVID, either.
Yup. Maskless is now the testimony to "I'm tougher than germs", and, sadly, many/most may be right; though w/out consideration to those who may not be.
I'm stenciling "MAGA" on my mask to keep everyone TF away :)
I would stencil MAGA on my N95 mask in my own blood before paying a single cent for a maga mask :) Nor would I trust it to keep the boogers away.
Based on the evidence I'd say your jargon packed ramblings aren't endearing you to anyone. You're angry about politicization while accusing those who don't wear a mask of being "MAGA". Make your own decisions and quit applying your petty resentments to "Americans".
> jargon packed ramblings
yea, whatever ...
I'm not angry about politics, I'm pissed off with inaccurate labeling and agit-prop.
And yea, my comment about the MAGA mask was over the top and I'm not in any way suggesting that non-maskers are hard right conservatives; just a small subset.
But trying and assert that there is no correlation between maskless people (indoors) and that subset of r/HermanCainAward contestants will leave you 0 legs to stand on.
My 'petty resentments' to you are, to me, what's been dragging the country down; for decades. But hey, you're entitled to your opinion as to what qualifies as "Americans", even for a 2yr old account with barely any karma.
Hey, Davit, my apologies for the last reply. Just caught me in a foulish mood. I know a lot of people who are conservative and are good, decent folk; we can politely disagree and still get along enough to play cribbage or shoot at the range.
Didn't mean to make it personal. I hope you stay healthy
You, too.
Seems like common sense is in short supply these days. Thin the heard through natural selection...
> common sense is in short supply these days.
Germs, and non-adaptive people, are Nature's population controls; is what i said in another reply. Also noting the strain it presents on everyone trying to address other, non-covid, medical needs.
A month to see a PCP, 3mo or more for a vet, a dentist, longer for a specialist's procedure. The exodus from medical is hard felt. Hope that you don't need an ambulance.
Won't be long before some Equity-owned med center has AI bots giving us our examinations :-)
"Prepare to bend over (and cough)!"
Sort of off-topic, but can a person get RSV twice in consecutive months?
My read is that it can infect both kids and adults repeatedly during the winter months. That having it once does build up some resistance. That its harshest for already compromised people but no such thing as long-RSV like there is with covid.
It may be 'common' as another stated, but that makes precaution no less necessary; specially as there is no vax, unlike flu/cv19. Combined with its spike in children due to other factors and being easily passed (repeatedly even) between child and adults this winter could prove stressful for a lot of people.
Oh wow okay. Will look into this, thank you!
My whole family had it. Wife down for 5-6 days I was down bad for a solid week and our boy is 2 weeks in and only just feeling back to normal.
thanks for sharing (that info - no pun intended:)
Wish I had different info to share. We’ve been getting notes home from the school the past month basically saying “if your kid is at all sick, keep them home”
Honestly? I wouldn't assume everyone knows about it.
I haven't been wearing a mask because frankly I haven't really heard anything about it. It might be on the "airwaves" but (like most people under 40) I don't listen to the radio or watch regular TV. I don't see anything about it on the PPH homepage. Haven't heard anything about it from the kid's school.
I'm not saying it's not an issue, and if I search for the headlines I can find them, but I don't think it's as everywhere as you think, especially for people who aren't regularly consuming a lot of local news (which I would assume is most people).
The president and CDC says its fine, we don't need masks.
I was speaking about Maine exclusively and though you may be right (not needing masks indoors to stem RSV) I suspect that's about to change. I'm seeing a lot of unhealthy looking people around my parts and a big uptick in sneezing/coughing.
I forgot the /s
ah, gotcha !
Yeah, sorry its frustrating. We have been at 500+ covid deaths a day, notice they basically stopped reporting in October, and the CDC hasn't mentioned masking on their website since September. Rolling right up to the holidays with no reporting but we can imagine the death toll will be large.
Can't have people not going out shopping or flying around. The elephant in the room is that Covid is disabling people, each time you get it it gives you a little (or a lot) more organ damage including your brain. When you tell people this, their eyes glaze over. We are fucked, this is the beginning of the end.
Enjoy it I guess by going out and coughing on people and spreading it to your family. Make sure to complain about how China isn't making your electronics fast enough because they are trying to actually prevent a mass die off event. /s again in case it wasn't obvious.
I try to keep from getting dramatic about it just accepting that its here, not going anywhere and that most healthy people seem to be surviving it well enough. In some queer way, that was the conservative (scientific) POV from the outset, but not to their credit that it was vaxing that made minimizing even your sad stats possible
If if means more isolating w/a close circle and avoiding gatherings, keeping distances, masking up, whatever; no hardship for me. Issue is the strain a cavalier POV takes on the health system; making dr/dds/eye appointments and procedures and the like. To say nothing of real, non-covid, emergencies. Or the tax/costs of treating people with severe covid.
And, as you say, the prospect of long-term effects of multiple infections is likely going to be consequential. And its not on people's minds unless their already noticing brainfog:)
Germs, and non-adaptive people, are Nature's population controls.
I'm 200% okay with wearing a mask in public for the rest of my life if it means countless people get to live longer healthier lives, including myself, and its disturbing to me that its uncommon to think this way.
I agree. 200%.
For what it's worth, thank you for being this way.
I didn't think that it would be this hard of a lift for people (10-15 minutes of mask wearing at the grocery store/pharmacy/unavoidable-indoor-space).
I have lost family from covid in multiple ways. Some have passed from the disease itself, other's have shown very clearly that their convenience is more important than my ability to draw breath.
I would "stay inside forever" as many have suggested I do since the beginning of covid, but unfortunately that's impossible to accomplish without being independently wealthy.
wearing a mask in public, indoors, is a courtesy; specially if your coughing or potentially shedding. It's like farting in a closed space. Just don't, please.
This thread and comments are absolutely wild.
Turns out a couple years of getting blasted by propaganda leads to a LOT of cognitive dissonance, who knew?
The main narrative being flipped right now with everyone piling on support for the Chinese COVID protestors must be absolutely surreal to some of y'all.
Mask this, mask that. Truth is, we have data from different places over the past couple years, and these different places took vastly different approaches to how they handle public health mandates and whatnot. Pretty much everywhere is trending towards less forceful measures because guess what, the collateral effects of draconian "health" policy like lockdowns, forcibly masking, forcibly medicating, etc, are overall more detrimental than the benefits they provide. Read that again if you have to. The collateral damage from draconian pandemic response is more damaging to our society than a coronavirus.
So while China does the thing all those darned conspiracy theorists said was going to happen, and the mainstream narrative tries to get you to quickly forget that they pushed that Australia and others were being proactive by building involuntary quarantine camps just a short while ago, maybe this is the opportunity to break cycle of sunken cost fallacy and re evaluate some things.
Remember how masking stopped the flu in it's tracks last year? Flu is coming back now because we arent masking, is that right? So why is it that the flu is also making a resurgence this year in Japan as they continue to diligently mask as is their cultural custom?
I appreciate your inputs, but you're assertion says that masks not only are not effective but they're also detrimental. You're going to have to back that up with some stats - links please
Masks are detrimental to children learning to speak and understand languages.
Masks are detrminental to unspoken communications and connections that are inherent to social human life and interaction. Don't underestimate the subtle yet important impact the occasional unexpected smile shared between two strangers has. It's hard coded into us.
Masks are detrimental to societal cohesion due to the volatile political dogmas associated with the desire to force others to conform.
Incoherent conditional masking requirements leads to things like service industry workers subconsciously becoming faceless service providers to customers instead of valid individuals working a service based job.
All but the most diligent mask wearers subject themselves to increased risk of exposure to whatever they may touch by constantly fidgeting or adjusting their masks with dirty hands.
Immune systems don't work outside of your body. The damp warm environment of the inside of a mask does not have its own immune system. Prolonged use results in your air filtering through a petri dish on both inhale and exhale.
An airborne virus like Sars Cov2 will not be restricted or effectively filtered by loose fabric weave or surgical paper mask materials. Go outside in the sun some cold morning and exhale. See that vapor? It's always there in your breath, you just can't always see the vapor condensing midair due to the cold. But guess what, that moist vapor that's always there is what airborne virus transmit by. Go exhale in the sun through your cloth mask and see how well it stops the airborne virus. Sure you catch some of the moisture on the inside of the mask. Something something filter urine through a cheesecloth and its probably safe to drink right? No. You are left with a contaminated cheese cloth and a puddle of piss.
The amount of pollution generated by the massive amounts of disposable masks made over the last couple years far surpasses the amount of pollution you prevented by sucking on cardboard straws.
Taking a brief step away from masks for a moment, let us consider that pandemic response actions led to record increases in homicide rates, suicide rates, homelessness, mental health crisis, widespread deferred preventative and/or elective healthcare, severe distrust of various institutions, an erosion of individual liberties, an overall regression of morality and ethics, and a large uptick in overall non-covid all-cause mortality.
1st - I get your assertion WRT masks and kids in classrooms, exposure (to teachers, staff, ...) notwithstanding
2nd - I agree that unless you're wearing a [K]N95 mask exposure to nuclei from evaporated envelopes will get to your mouth/nose. N95's are what keeps virii from being inhaled.
But even a simple surge mask will stop the envelopes from spewing if you yourself happen to have virii/germs. So, they do serve a purpose of keeping others safe(r) around you should you be infectious.
If you are trying to assert that masks serve no purpose, or are even counter-productive to fighting virus, I think you're full-on wrong.
Masks are a component,along with >= 6' distance and good ventilation, to keeping the social safety net intact.
If you're looking for a return to 'normal' - well good luck with that. Years ahead are going to make 2020-2022 look downright appealing. Normal jumped the shark and headed south.
Additionally, even you are ready to sacrifice old and immuno-compromised people on the alter of "adapting to it", unless you can provide a verifiable link to the contrary, long-covid (and repeated exposure to SRV) and the associated effects are reasons to avoid getting these sicknesses.
>But even a simple surge mask will stop the envelopes from spewing if you yourself happen to have virii/germs. So, they do serve a purpose of keeping others safe(r) around you should you be infectious.
This is like going swimming with jeans on and pissing in the pool, and expecting that you are doing everyone a favor by wearing jeans because you think you are getting less piss on the people swimming around you while you also yell incoherently about the guy pissing into the pool from the diving board.
Truth is, in this analogy, everyone has been swimming through other people's piss for eons. Its literally why we evolved sophisticated immune systems. Good news though, we now have the technology for you to opt out. Grab your submarine, wear your N95 mask for durations and applications that even OSHA would have been uncomfortable with 5 years ago, and take advantage of your individual liberty to protect and manage your own health.
Don't insist that everyone else conform to your faux consensus manifested by the largest propaganda blitz we have ever witnessed/experienced.
>If you're looking for a return to 'normal' - well good luck with that. Years ahead are going to make 2020-2022 look downright appealing. Normal jumped the shark and headed south.
Are we still talking about the prolonged negative affects of irrational and detrimental pandemic response aspects like masking? Because it feels like you are about to tell me how I can't use my own electricity that I pay for because climate crisis or something.
Or is this more along the lines of Bill Gates saying "I call this Pandemic #1, wait til you see what I call Pandemic #2" except without the accompanying solicitation of products/services/philanthropic quasi-celebrity persona?
> Don't insist that everyone else conform to your faux consensus manifested by the largest propaganda blitz we have ever witnessed/experienced.
I appreciate long and thoughtful replies, even though I may not agree with them. But you are basically saying "free the germs, don't bother with vaccinations" because of detrimental effects of dealing with it, because its fruitless to try, and doing so makes you a pawn of big gov propaganda. And, mostly, because you don't like anyone telling you what you should or need to do. Maybe you should try NH, or AZ, or ID for more sympathetic audiences.
You've beefed up all your talking points to reinforce why you're right and I'm wrong; why anyone recommending social protections are wrong.
Not the "the prolonged negative affects of irrational and detrimental pandemic 'response'" so much as the prolonged negative effects that people like you, disinclined to vax or mask just because 'beliefs', are exacting on the community writ large.
There's nothing irrational about protection though it does have its downsides. I'm no fan of big pharma, or the government FTM, still, sometimes you bite the bullet and do what's right. The CV19 vax is not immunity (yet) but mitigation, RSV has no vax, Mpox is here as are a host of other germs easily spread in our globalized planet.
But no, you pat yourself on the back for being a 'free thinker' while 2 minutes perusing your post history, and all the negative points all your replies generate, illustrate how off the mark you are trolling for nobody's benefit but your own.
>I appreciate long and thoughtful replies, even though I may not agree with them. But you are basically saying "free the germs, don't bother with vaccinations" because of detrimental effects of dealing with it, because its fruitless to try, and doing so makes you a pawn of big gov propaganda. And, mostly, because you don't like anyone telling you what you should or need to do. Maybe you should try NH, or AZ, or ID for more sympathetic audiences.
Nice try putting words in my mouth. See look I can do it too. You are basically saying "if you don't wear a mask I think you are a second grade citizen that deserves every bit of contempt and I will take joy in mocking your death." See not very nice is it? Don't conflate being confronted with inconvenient detrimental effects of masking/pandemic response with calling for sneezing into people's faces.
But look at you, going and telling other people where they should live to be more like their kind. Ain't that cunnin. Won't you pretty please allow me to live here sir?
>You've beefed up all your talking points to reinforce why you're right and I'm wrong; why anyone recommending social protections are wrong.
Is this your way of saying you have trouble debating the points I made but your propensity to haughtiness precludes your willingness to try or be persuaded?
>Not the "the prolonged negative affects of irrational and detrimental pandemic 'response'" so much as the prolonged negative effects that people like you, disinclined to vax or mask just because 'beliefs', are exacting on the community writ large
Who is exacting what exactly? Is this a "this is a pandemic of the unvaccinated" quip? In December 2022? Are you sure?
>There's nothing irrational about protection though it does have its downsides. I'm no fan of big pharma, or the government FTM, still, sometimes you bite the bullet and do what's right. The CV19 vax is not immunity (yet) but mitigation, RSV has no vax, Mpox is here as are a host of other germs easily spread in our globalized planet.
There is nothing irrational with taking proactive measures for your individual health and/or expressing your ideas/opinions on best measures. That is not an invitation for coercion or bypassing informed consent. That is not a justification to exile anyone from society that does not conform to your specific ideologically motivated proactive measure regiment, no matter how much you believe your views are consensus. You make a great argument against globalisation though I guess.
>But no, you pat yourself on the back for being a 'free thinker' while 2 minutes perusing your post history, and all the negative points all your replies generate, illustrate how off the mark you are trolling for nobody's benefit but your own.
Lol
Don't bother responding, or take the last word if you do, regardless
I don't know where you were during 2020 but I'd bet it was not as a 1st responder, or care-giver or even a F'in prison hack.
2020, pre-vax, was a culling; try to deny it. And even after the vax, it continued; due to folks who didn't see the need to comply w/basic social standards. And to a lesser extent it continues still. All because "muh freedoms" standing atop cardboard boxes filled with quasi-facts.
There are always exceptions based on medical limits. But if its just on principle and one don't want the vax? Fine, don't seek help if you get infected. Don't want to wear a mask indoors when bugs are on the rise? Fine, stay 6' away TF from me; I'll buy you a beer and we can beef on.
Yea, not happy to say it, but your prevailing 'tude is the same as the 2020 version. It got people sick then and can still get people sick now. Their ability to survive notwithstanding.
Yes, I'm antiglobalist; all its done is give the filthy rich more reach to feast off the bone of the poors, somewhere.
AFAIC, CV19 was released with intention; the designs of some folk(s) who want to see a few billion less people walking our planet; and profit off their pains.
It doesn't matter what i feel or think. My words speak for other simple people. Who don't really give AF about the current corrupt system or the show-runners in charge. As it is about keeping myself, those I care about, out of the ER and in decent enough health when 1 bad bill could bankrupt them.
Please stay healthy and uninfected. My well-being may depend on it. If actions, or lack of them, expose risk to those (strangers) w/out their informed consent cuz one's shedding while standing in the checkout line and too close, for instance, then yea, Houston's got a problem.
> the collateral effects of draconian "health" policy like lockdowns, forcibly masking, forcibly medicating, etc, are overall more detrimental than the benefits they provide. Read that again if you have to. The collateral damage from draconian pandemic response is more damaging to our society than a coronavirus.
Well, says you; thankfully we'll never know, considering a vaccine was produced and (most) people followed guidelines. Still, over 1mil USA'ians died and millions more impacted.
What CH and AU are doing may be overboard, I can't say cuz I don't live there. But frankly I think you don't know shit and only cite words that match your belief system.
Good luck, pard. Hope you don't make r/hermancaineaward or become a zombie dying on the hill of "sunk costs"
It doesn't surprise me that you are familiar with that subreddit I guess. It's a pretty dark place, having that much hate and haughtiness to be able to find joy in the deridement of others people's deaths.
It's that same attitude and sentiments that has propelled the prevalence of coercion, exploitation, and manipulation of individuals into forfeiting their own right to medical autonomy else have the quasi-consensus society exile them.
Sounds like a lot of words right? Here is a simpler way to put it. When the haughtiness that is widely exhibited in that subreddit is applied to real life, to the point that even The White House is promoting apartheid-like conditional access to society, we call that - Crimes Against Humanity.
r/hermancaineaward is no diff from other subs; there's always a fair share of a-holes who like to gloat. Most though see it as lamentable were it not for individual intransigence. Not unlike r/leopardsatemyface
Few are taking joy in the suffering of others in ways that you suggest, but being you, that's the first place you look to demean it.
> coercion, exploitation, and manipulation of individuals into forfeiting their own right to medical autonomy else have the quasi-consensus society exile them.
On one level, you are not wrong; on another you appear to want to forgo the price being in said society requires, while reaping said benefits. Like a fascist on their soapbox exercising 1A only because the rest of us tolerate it .
> The White House is promoting apartheid-like conditional access to society, we call that - Crimes Against Humanity.
I loathe Biden, and Dems in general, but that sentence? Wow! Sure you don't mean Netanyahu and Israel?
RSV is an incredibly common virus. Most people have had it in their lifetime. The only reason it’s blown up the way it has is bc of the staggered effect of kids not being exposed to this common virus for like 2 years.
Masking was absolutely necessary during peak covid. However one of the backend issues from all that protection is kids are only now getting exposed, which means a confluence of a LOT of sickness, hitting kids’ immune systems which are weaker (to this virus), and a shitstorm of hospitalizations.
Adults should be fine if you get it. It’s a bad cold
Heya, thanks for the reply and information. As someone old who's been informed on flu and pneumonia I'm surprised to first learn of it now; and not even last winter, despite my recent arrival from VT.
I grok ya on kids, on the flip side of protection causing different issues and their immune systems AOT adults. Since RSV can be passed easily between adults and kids, behavior of both are affected.
With the reality being 'what it is', would you agree that masking up (indoors) during peak winter is necessary? So far, the consensus is no. I was thinking that could change sooner than later. Are you saying NBD?
It’s really personal preference at this point. Masking will definitely help stay more protected, but eventually you or your kid(s) will get RSV. Again, the reason this is a “surge” and all over the news isn’t bc RSV is a big deal (normally) it’s bc of confluence of events and all the hospitals blowing up with admissions all at once. O don’t think the majority of people will return to masking nor do I think masking requirements should return. But if individuals want to continue to do so, that’s perfectly acceptable.
> but eventually you or your kid(s) will get RSV.
Word.
And your pointing out the burden of this confluence of events (this winter) was my reason for posting. Ascertaining if people are willing to mask up (indoors) to reduce the expected stress on the health-care system.
The reason it's blowing up is that widespread and repeated covid infections have damaged people's immune systems so they're more likely to get RSV and flu, making it more likely they get passed around to vulnerable people like children and elderly.
I suppose that’s a theory, but it’s not proven. Lack of prolonged lack of exposure to common viruses that’s normally have been well tolerated has certainly impacted the severity and intensity of cases
That is also a theory that has been debunked. Just so you know. There's no such thing as an immunity gap.
Yes, thank you for saying this.
We've all known for some time that covid causes damage to the immune system, yet some feel the need to craft ludicrous explanations for unprecedented illness among young people (who experienced massive exposure to covid).
The immune system "gap" discourse is absolute nonsense anyway. Those types of population level changes take generations, not say-- 2.5 years.
Just curious where you're pulling your info from? My SO is an a Pediatric ICU doctor, who has been and is currently in the thick of everything. Literally THE person taking care of all the RSV/covid cases. So I'm just interested to know where you heard that the Immune system gap is "ludicrous" and specifically how covid causes long term damage to the immune system?
Wrong. There’s zero science that says everyone who gets COVID has a damaged immune system.
In fact, the more germs you are exposed to, the stronger your immune system tends to be. People who wore stayed home, didn’t interact with others in person, and were hyper conscious about germs are going to struggle to fight off this winters standard bugs.
Nope. It's the opposite with covid. The more covid re-infections you get, even "mild" ones, the worse it tends to be for your immune system, tending to make you more vulnerable to other viruses as well as to more covid re-infections, and to long covid damage to your cardiac system, your brain, and your respiratory system. It's possible it can even re-activate viruses you've had previously, and as you say, RSV is an incredibly common virus.
Repeated covid infections are not equivalent to kids getting beneficial exposure to antigens by playing in the dirt, or coming home with a little runny nose from daycare every so often, or overcoming allergies by gradual repeated exposure.
It's starting to sink in, with those who are paying attention, that covid takes a cumulative toll on all systems of the body including immune response. Apply these effects across the huge population of people who've already had at least one infection, add in our inadequate vaccination/booster numbers and antipathy to mitigation, and you've got problems.
Look, I'm not here to argue about it or try to convince you or anyone else. It's complicated. Wait and see. Then, some day, remember what I said. But here's one summary of some current findings including several on immunological effects. I hesitate to post it because URLs generally just get ignored or cause more arguments but what the heck.
https://jessicawildfire.substack.com/p/you-may-be-early-but-youre-not-wrong
https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2022/11/07/COVID-Reinfections-And-Immunity/
*I never said EVERYONE. You threw that in.
There's not a single scientific study showing that the majority of people who get COVID and recover have long term damage to their immune system. It's outright fear mongering from people who need to cling to something to dwell on.
Frankly, the mental health issues stemming from this fear mongering *at this point* are worse than getting COVID. Be happy, live your life, and stop the handwringing.
So as I predicted, you ignored the URLs which consisted of lists, summaries and analysis of recent and ongoing studies. Which you demanded I produce. All of which are published in reputable scientific journals. OK. My mental health is fine. But then, I'm not living in denial. You seem oddly triggered that an internet stranger is suggesting that all is not hunky dory if you're really so confident that it is. Wait and see. Just remember I told you.
No, I read them - they are essentially arguing that there is no herd immunity, which also is an argument against the effectiveness of the vaccines. They also confirm what I said - the majority of people who get COVID recover just fine.
Again, your focusing on the uncommon cases, and potential ‘what if’s’, and things we don’t understand, and drawing conclusions off that.
> People who wore [masks or] stayed home, didn’t interact with others in person, and were hyper conscious about germs are going to struggle to fight off this winters standard bugs.
No we're not, because we're still masking up (in public), still social distancing and still being vax'd . People doing none of the above are more likely to get infected; whether its a mild case or otherwise.
Your assertion that exposure makes our bodies more resilient is not untrue. That said, antibody resistance to CV19 will be different than resistance to RSV; or to flu virii, or herpes or any of the litany of other viruses (AOT bacterial) floating around out there.
I guess my assertion is improved resistance to germ A does not imply greater resistance to germ B. And, we're just talking respiratory virii here. And, FWIW, despite repeat exposure to germ A producing improved resistance down the road, you are not the same person down the road; you get older, weaker, .... you change (along w/your immunology).
What you're suggesting is akin to saying hey, I got malaria in SA, but skip the preventions, if I get hit again it won't be so bad. Except it is, and depending on the env, availability of medicine,.... could be much worse.
No. I’m saying that interacting with the word builds your immune system better than isolation. I think that isolation and being fearful leads to unhealthy mental state.
Ah shit...here we go again. The "iT's JuSt A cOlD!!!!!11" Darwin denial anti-vaxxers love to spew out.
I didn't think it would rear its ugly head in 2022, but here we are...
I was wondering about envelopes, antibodies, and genomes (oh my) to understand differences/similarities so decided to dive deeper and do a netsearch on the issue and came across what you refer to, i think:
Yea that’s a good summary
If you’re wearing a mask at this point, I assume you are one of those people who would yell at me for walking outside without a mask. I treat*you accordingly.
*missed word
Outside? Keeping your space? No problem, friend; smile on :)
I mask up indoors only, only talking indoors, and in crowds; like supermarkets and pharmacies, standing in line at the chinese restaurant, the corner store ...
As for restaurants and sit-down dining? I'd likely take a pass if the waiting room is packed and maskless; eating at a table safely spaced and well ventilated? Once in awhile works OK.
Stay healthy, pard!
Cool - you have every right to do what you feel is best for you.
Unfortunately, you didn’t allow the same rights to others.
> Unfortunately, you didn’t allow the same rights to others.
WTF you talking about? I'm not imposing anything on anyone. You have the right to be un-vax'd, unmasked, whatever; even if you lack the common sense to do so (IMO).
Just stay in your lane and its all good; I DGAF
I'm living proof your assumption is wrong.
You’re in the minority, for sure.
So you've actually been "yelled at" by people about not wearing a mask outdoors? I've never seen that happen IRL, not even on social media.
Yep. I suppose ‘scolded’ might be a better term, but yeah. I was told by order of the Governor that I should be wearing a mask outside if I might ‘walk past a person’. Never mind there was never any science being that.
I remember back in 2020, yeah, that was part of the general guidelines for social distancing. It changed about a year later, though. I've been following the guidelines very closely. Nobody has ever "scolded" me or said a single word to me about wearing a mask outdoors.
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