Comments
Guygan t1_j5oy8nh wrote
That’s according to public records.
There is at least one landowner I know of that’s bigger than this but their holdings are hidden by owning through trusts and other entities that disguise the actual beneficial owner.
keysandtreesforme t1_j5p2ivi wrote
Do tell
They_said_Maine t1_j5p6m2f wrote
John Malone?
fredezz t1_j5p7fls wrote
Maybe "Carnac" has the answer
bigbluedoor t1_j5p978p wrote
honestly don’t love that vast swaths of the state are privately help like this. the land owners could do some really gnarly stuff if they wanted with little we could do to stop them
terminalE469 t1_j5pa5i0 wrote
im jealous of people out west that have greater access to atv and snowmobile trails because their access to them doesn’t hinge on the schedules and whims of logging companies.
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5paegd wrote
Fuck the landowners, all my homies hate the rich landowners
hyzerflip207 t1_j5pc5ai wrote
That’s not true. They need to follow regs just like everyone else.
Seyword t1_j5peabj wrote
The Irving family recently sold the most expensive piece of Maine real estate in all of 2022. Can’t recall the address at the moment but it sold for $8+ million. Was worked on by a team of architects/builders over the course of 15+ years.
King_O_Walpole t1_j5pgfvh wrote
Delusional sounds about right
Guygan t1_j5pgzpy wrote
I’m only delusional when it comes to cartel apologies.
chefmtm t1_j5pon0b wrote
Is this Irving from gas stations?
enjoiart t1_j5pon57 wrote
Yes they follow the laws that they want to. The rest they will circumvent, like clear cutting laws.
acister t1_j5prpb9 wrote
Bunch of thugs
Hockeyjockey58 t1_j5q728j wrote
Yes. It’s a family business for lack of a better term that has business in everything from forestry to railroads to oil and even shipbuilding.
Hockeyjockey58 t1_j5q7b0a wrote
FWIW, when you cross the border up there, the Northwoods opens up to farmland. Privately held land is sometimes part of the conservation equation. The fact that Irving makes its money in forestry is mainly why the Northwoods stays as woods.
200Fathoms t1_j5qa351 wrote
Don't they also own a huge swath of New Brunswick, too?
hike_me t1_j5qc2dg wrote
The land that was suitable for agriculture was cleared and developed as such. That’s where potatoes are grown in northern Maine.
When Maine sold off vast tracts of state held forestland, they assumed the timber barons would clear it and then sell it off to homesteaders. Turns out it was shitty farmland so that didn’t happen.
As you go even farther north into Quebec you eventually arrive at the St Lawrence valley, which has good farmland.
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5qcphs wrote
What would you and your homies do with land?
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5qcueu wrote
Tree are not an ecosystem like the forest they clearcut.
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5qd02g wrote
Nothing! As god intended
truththeavengerfish t1_j5qf1c4 wrote
They pretty much own the entire province. Nor do they pay taxes.
truththeavengerfish t1_j5qf7yq wrote
The trees are being planted so that they can clear cut again. It’s bullshit p.r.
200Fathoms t1_j5qfjgo wrote
Ain't life grand?
SobeysBags t1_j5qk3wb wrote
One of the richest families in the world, worth $8.4 BILLION. They own so many businesses there are researchers who dedicate their whole careers in discovering what they actually own. They are building Canada's new naval fleet in a plant in a new Halifax yard that makes Bath Iron works look quaint. They have fleets of ships supplying their oil refineries and oil storage plants. They own tire companies, trucking companies, pulp and paper plants, railways, logistics companies, Kent (Canada's version of Lowes), agricultural companies (cavendish farms), they even make diapers and tissues. The list goes on.
Yet they are synonymous with avoiding taxes. You'd never know there was a family of Canadian billionaires floating around New Brunswick and Maine.
leroydudley t1_j5qqr3h wrote
Its forestry
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5qv5r3 wrote
What's the difference?
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5qv9d5 wrote
They even don’t live here and the properties basically exist as a giant tax dodge
In_betweener t1_j5qxy8e wrote
truththeavengerfish t1_j5qyssv wrote
Oh no doubt. I just don’t like the whole “trees planted” spin.
Volator t1_j5r3hzu wrote
It's the best part of the state. And they let the public use it (for a small fee in the NMW). It's a great resource. If the state owned it they'd never log it, the roads would get all f-d up and it would be useless.
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5r59zt wrote
Come with, and you'll be, in a world of accurate accounting!
The secret is not to attack land owners. The secret is to audit tax cheats. Accounting is my #1 highest priority when it comes to solving the woes of the modern citizenry.
Notmystationbro t1_j5r7mvn wrote
All rich people use tax loopholes written by both parties to avoid paying “x” taxes
Notmystationbro t1_j5r7rtu wrote
Hence why the planted a shit ton of trees
Notmystationbro t1_j5r7zdt wrote
And in 100 years from now when those trees are mature to cut down they’ll plant more and the cycle repeats itself. You do know that trees are a renewable energy right?
Azr431 t1_j5r90tj wrote
lol not even close to reality. The logging/paper product companies out west were always amenable to outdoorsmen. As they sold off parcels to private land owners, many of those private owners have closed off access in many ways. Look up the Wilkes brothers from Texas and the shit they’ve done in Idaho
Azr431 t1_j5r9a3j wrote
Billionaires shouldn’t exist
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5rbvzn wrote
Do you think planting trees just magically brings back all the biodiversity?
Notmystationbro t1_j5rcxfk wrote
Over time yes of course it does
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5rd0qk wrote
Well no, landholding and tax cheating goes hand in hand. At least when you own estates that can be seen from space. Nobody needs that much land, break up the manors.
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5rdf5a wrote
How? Who owns it? These are the types of questions accountants can help you answer.
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5rdmti wrote
Says who? Because I have seen christmas tree farms and they are not diverse.
terminalE469 t1_j5rgkp4 wrote
i meant public land but yeah. we have those assholes here too
SobeysBags t1_j5rhc3q wrote
The Irving's are also the 5th largest land owner in the USA.
EdSmelly t1_j5rm4st wrote
You know that there all exactly the same kind of tree, right?
josh_was_there t1_j5rmf2x wrote
Wood stoves are more green than solar panels
Notmystationbro t1_j5rncc7 wrote
Ok and your point?
marrymejojo t1_j5rxvs8 wrote
How else would it be held? Honest question. I mean we have parks. Public land. It's hard fought land though. Tje majority of land will be private owned.
saigonk t1_j5s1g7y wrote
Explain why?
CombinationSea6976 t1_j5s9gyx wrote
Was that the property in Orland?
hike_me t1_j5s9u6i wrote
They’re talking about federal land (like BLM, National Forests, National Recreation Areas, etc). Out west hunting, ATVing, snowmobiling, etc is generally done on federal land. BLM generally allows more permissive use (like jeep trails and boondocking)
hike_me t1_j5sabhl wrote
Out west a huge percentage of wilderness / undeveloped land is federally owned. Over 60% of Utah is federal public land, over 80% of Nevada, 45% of California, 52% of Oregon, etc
Azr431 t1_j5t3wd2 wrote
Ah yeah, the public lands out west are great
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5t9kn0 wrote
The maps pretty clearly lay out who owns it. I’m starting to suspect I’m speaking to a butthurt absentee landlord on the run from the IRS
Seyword t1_j5ta0ce wrote
Yeah that’s the one. 135 Hartview Cir
PGids t1_j5tbryv wrote
> They are building Canada’s new naval fleet in a plant in a new Halifax yard that makes Bath Iron works look quaint
Full transparency, as far as shipyards go BIW is quaint. When you have one customer and one customer only, who pays handsomely, you don’t need a ton of room to attempt to crank out two ~600ft hulls a year vs what you need to build super freighters
I’ve been in a variety of heavy industries since 2015 including BIW, and as far as sheer acreage of an operation they’re peons. I worked a power plant in Texas whose coal pile alone was probably 80% of the size of the Bath yard
20thMaine t1_j5tbx10 wrote
How about a nice little hedge, with a low impact trail running down the middle?
gjazzy68 t1_j5terd4 wrote
You explain why they should.
saigonk t1_j5thkxp wrote
Good retort there. If someone makes money it isn’t a crime and it isn’t wrong, it’s how they act as a person. I don’t fault anyone being rich, they either earned it, got lucky, or were given it. All of which you or I could also do in one fashion or another.
Being jealous of those individuals is understandable, they have so much money, why don’t they give to things I want, etc.
It’s “what-about-ism” at its finest.
CombinationSea6976 t1_j5ti4i5 wrote
I live here in Orland and have for many years. Million dollar real estate properties are popping up here all over the place nowadays Used to be a not so popular town. I’m puzzled as to why all of the sudden interest here.
Seyword t1_j5tisjh wrote
Looks like he owned close to 500 acres there, not sure if it was all sold with that house. My guess would be that people were able to buy the land relatively cheaply and the spend their money on the build.
bortvern t1_j5tjk9e wrote
It's kind of an inherent problem with being wealthy. Most people don't make enough money to make "tax optimization" a worthwhile endeavor, but at a certain point the money saved by minimizing tax liability far outweighs the money spent getting there. From the perspective of the wealthy, they are compliant tax paying entities, and any perceived inequity is the problem of the lawmaker.
CombinationSea6976 t1_j5tm5t6 wrote
Correct. The $8.2m property that sold in Orland was owned by Penny Candy Cove, LLC
Muted_Discussion_550 t1_j5tmrv6 wrote
Trickle down capitalism has failed that's why there shouldn't be billionaires someone who has that much money should be deemed a national security risk they can buy politicians lobby for whatever they want whether it be to keep minimum wage down or to keep cigarettes on shelves billionaires are for the most part are turning this world into a coffin
SobeysBags t1_j5tn3lz wrote
True, to be fair the shipyard in Halifax essentially didn't exist up until about 10 years ago, when the Irving's won contract to essentially rebuild the entire Canadian naval fleet over the next 20-30 years. It's crazy what they have built on the Halifax waterfront. So essentially they currently only have one customer for this particular shipbuilding plant, but they do have other shipbuilding plants.
CombinationSea6976 t1_j5tnb0q wrote
The old timers here in Orland largely worked at the paper mill in neighboring Bucksport. Many families pooled together and scraped up money to by land and make seasonal camps on Toddy pond, Craig’s pond, Alamoosoock lake, Heart pond, Jacob Buck’s pond in Bucksport just to name a few. Mostly generationally owned which now seem to be being snapped up for incredible sums of money by folks from away.
saigonk t1_j5to4zu wrote
And what would you propose is a solution?
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5to7dc wrote
I think you have far to much faith in "the maps" i know peolle who make maps. The records in this state are incomplete, inaccurate, missing or never existed. It is definitely not laid out clearly.
gjazzy68 t1_j5tpjtj wrote
It's not! And I will try to explain you why. Your response is a classic one, that's why I was curious to hear it first. And I get it. Most people work their daily grind, thinking one day they would be filthy rich and get out of that. Capitalism is brilliant that way, make other people work to death, based on a dream. And if suddenly people can't become a billionaire for some reason, that would be the killing of that dream. And hope is important to get by.
But, being rich and being a Bilionaire is two different things. To help you visualize 1 million seconds is 12 days, 1 billion second is 31 years. It would take me, with a very good salary if you consider the American average, 6 THOUSAND years of hard work without spending a single dime to reach a billion, but only 8 years to reach a million. And although a million doesn't have the same power as it used to I'd gladly retire now, in my mid 40s, if I had a couple of that in my savings.
Nobody makes a billion by chance, and even a lottery billionaire, which is extremely rare, won't be able to hold that money for very long if they are honest folks. Because people are only able to keep their billionaire status by exploiting other people, evading taxes, buying political influence, and benefiting from inside trading information. And that's why they shouldn't exist.
If billionaires didn't exist there would still be rich people and poor people, there'd still be inequality, but it would be just a little harder for a very few group of people to keep control over the world.
Muted_Discussion_550 t1_j5tviy5 wrote
Ain't got one chief
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5txi60 wrote
Yeah that’ll stand up in court. Come back from Florida and shovel your driveway like a man!
TarantinoFan23 t1_j5tzt1d wrote
Why would I be in court? I don't even know the case. I spent last 2 days shoveling.
I am sorry, but can you be a little more clear with your insults?
Claudius-Germanicus t1_j5u1nhz wrote
If being a square was a crime, they’d have you booked for life
tomhsmith t1_j5udjza wrote
So what does someone do if they want to retain their company and their company becomes worth billions? They'll pay a huge amount of taxes once they sell or die.
gjazzy68 t1_j5v3v2k wrote
They should be paying those taxes alive.
bigbluedoor t1_j5vlryb wrote
over thousands of years maybe, and that’s assuming they stop clearcutting today
True_Cheetah_6618 t1_j5vqqic wrote
Fuck them
TimothyOilypants t1_j5w6642 wrote
Nationalize their businesses. Seize the means.
HumpSlackWails t1_j60nqfh wrote
How many of those trees are still growing?
What percentage are sold for wood pulp?
chefmtm t1_j63a2yh wrote
Wow No idea, thank you
Branaghan t1_j5omf7n wrote
*acres