When you spent 2,000$ over the last year and still haven't seen one GB arriveSubmitted by CertainlyBright t3_z5lkvv in MechanicalKeyboards
xyxjj t1_ixynbe7 wrote
Reply to comment by Marvelm in When you spent 2,000$ over the last year and still haven't seen one GB arrive by CertainlyBright
because if we stopped the group buy model it's more likely that the ya'll wont be getting the keycaps you want:
Suppose a gmk groupbuy moq to even get them to run it is 500, and suppose we're talking about a small time vendor that can only afford to buy 500 units (for simplicity in this discussion), and that the vendor will always buy 500 units per run
With a groupbuy model:
There's be X + 500 units floating around in the after market, anyone that wants a set will get a set if they're around for the group buy, so X is the number of people that bought into the groupbuy
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With a groupbuy model:
There'd literally be only 500 sets available period. You'd then be subjected to the whims of the 500 people in the entire world that managed to get their hands on a set
​
and that's just for base kits. What about childkits like novelties, alternative mods/alphas, child kits for exotic keyboards etc? where are you gonna get keycaps for those then?
[deleted] t1_ixyphei wrote
[deleted]
Marvelm t1_ixyo033 wrote
The point is that every normal business ever FIRST produces stuff THEN sells it. Make them take a loan, get money, do whatever they have to to produce the set if they feel like it's worth it.
If the sets they produce are good, they will sell well, period and then they will get the funds to keep producing them till there is a need for them. It's not rocket science. Good products sell well, if you're confident you have a good product, get the funds, make the product and then sell it.
TimbersawDust t1_ixyzuko wrote
This is a terrible idea. Even if I take months and craft what I think is the perfect keyset, and hell even if I do an interest check and get 1000 entries, there is no guarantee of a return on investment. I’d also have to pay interest on said loan which means the cost of these sets would be higher than they are now. People who run GBs knows that they are in terrible shape right now, and they also know that the alternative is much riskier and worse for everyone. Terrible idea.
Marvelm t1_ixz02ud wrote
Excuse me, so how do you think small companies or one man craftsmanship stores or whatever else run their business?
TimbersawDust t1_ixz08w7 wrote
You are comparing apples to oranges. Running a keyset group buy is very different from anything you are suggesting. The group buy model for keysets has been around for years and has only really become a problem since lead times have gotten out of control.
Zelda2hot t1_ixz0c02 wrote
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Marvelm t1_ixz0o9l wrote
You're only saying that because you're used to it. You still haven't answered the above question. There is always risk in producing something. Going the group buy route is safe because it basically eliminates the risk for the creator because he knows upfront what the demand is.
Then you also admit it's a problem. A problem should be solved and it won't solve itself, the lead times are already absurdly long and they will only become longer and longer.
TimbersawDust t1_ixz1na5 wrote
The above question is irrelevant to this conversation my man. Since you think you are reinventing the wheel here, I’ll answer it. Small business take out business loans. That being said, if I was running a small business, and my customer were willing to pay me up front (similar to a group buy) and I didn’t need to take out a business loan, I would 100% do it. But why aren’t small businesses doing this? Because their customers won’t pay for it. In the group buy model that we have here, they do. That should tell you straight up that these two things are very different and that a solution for a small business is not going to automatically be a solution for a group buy.
Keyset designers are 100% never going to take out a business loan. It will never happen. And as I’ve said before GBs are in shambles right now, but I’m not going to advocate for something that is arguably worse.
SpunkyDred t1_ixz0b2o wrote
> apples to oranges
But you can still compare them.
QWERKey-UK t1_ixywjpq wrote
>Make them take a loan, get money, do whatever they have to to produce the set if they feel like it's worth it.
That's really easy to say when you have no intention of doing it, and are just arguing on the internet.
Marvelm t1_ixyxadm wrote
What kind of logic is that? Companies in EVERY industry work like that, big or small. Brb I'm gonna order a pair of shoes and then wait 2 years for them to be made and delivered. Sounds absurd, doesn't it?
QWERKey-UK t1_ixyyjv4 wrote
>Companies in EVERY industry work like that
No, they don't. They do massive amounts of market research, and if they did this research on the custom keycap market, they would see that it is actually very small, and very niche, and even if they did risk financing the manufacture of a custom keycap set, they would only do so on the premise that most only sell a few thousand sets... because that's a fact, if you bothered to research it.
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