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quietQuibble t1_j6fl6i3 wrote

Putting down riots with armored vehicles and machine guns ain’t cool, brother.

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Defiant-Passion-5129 OP t1_j6flnb5 wrote

by chance a more history based reddit page would be better to post to my apologies

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PsychophicaI t1_j6fnso5 wrote

Don’t apologize, understanding and accepting reality is old school cool.

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Block_Me_Amadeus t1_j6i67j5 wrote

Not your fault and not your grandfather's fault, but our government's use of weaponry against its own people was horrifying.

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Cross_22 t1_j6oolbk wrote

Very much his grandfather's fault - unless somebody forced him to aim a machine gun at people.

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Block_Me_Amadeus t1_j6opldv wrote

Some individuals feel it's safe to take a stand and refuse direct orders, and others do not. I have never been in that soldier's shoes and I'm guessing you haven't, either, so I can't know what consequences he would've faced.

If you're a member of US military forces and your commanding officer tells you to do something, you can definitely catch a court martial. Folks have been shot by firing squad for dereliction of duty, let alone having the livelihood that's supporting their family taken away.

"I vas just following orders" wasn't valid for full-on N_zi atrocities, but there's a spectrum.

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clce t1_j6jqly0 wrote

I would say the writing was horrified and the need to bring in forces to bring it down was also terrible but they were the good guys. I don't see why that can't be cool. I wouldn't want my neighborhood to be destroyed by rioters and looters

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Defiant-Passion-5129 OP t1_j6flaas wrote

not saying i agree with what it is just stating it happened and he was there my bad.

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APEHASKILLEDAPE t1_j6hloo1 wrote

Burning and looting is even less cool, or should the civilians just fend for themselves

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Different_While_5270 t1_j6g44c3 wrote

Ah yes, the US Army being used against its own people. So cool! /s

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clce t1_j6jqgdp wrote

I can certainly see that perspective. But I think it's a legitimate counter argument to say that they were being used to maintain order which is a legitimate use of the state police powers. We're not talking some Vietnam protest that the powers that be want to bust up. We're talking chaos in the streets and if I live there, your damn right I would want the government to restore order. I guess cool is somewhat relative, but I don't see any shame in someone's dad serving his country and helping to bring law & order and posing with a big ass gun while doing it.

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JetBootsBoosh t1_j6fq3f1 wrote

Not 1970, but the 1967 Newark race riots had the guard called out eventually. I can’t find anything about them in 1970, most of the big social upheavals were winding down by then.

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BartholomewBandy t1_j6ienny wrote

The revelations about Cambodia were in 70. The Kent State massacre was May 4 1970. Shit was still going down.

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clce t1_j6jpxl5 wrote

Yeah, but anti-war protests were not typically put down by the national guard. Plenty of riot gear police, but they're not shooting middle class white kids for protesting the war. Kent State was very tragic of course, but it wasn't national guard brought out to put down a riot. It was national guard protecting a building or something, and a tragic overreaction when one or more of the probably young poorly trained guardsman felt too threatened and fired when they shouldn't have .

But I think most people aren't that aware of some of the riots of the late '60s. They were a complete breakdown of order and the national guard including guns were brought out to try to restore order.

I make no judgment on the whole thing. Just a historic observation.

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Defiant-Passion-5129 OP t1_j6fqba0 wrote

that may be it then to be honest he didn’t have exact year either he’s always been a little hazy. but after his departure from vietnam due to bayonet he healed and got sent back to the guard so sounds right.

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DanDi58 t1_j6fktp4 wrote

WTF riot was it where they had armored vehicles with machine guns?

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LaPyramideBastille t1_j6frc5d wrote

This is not the fond memory you think it is.

And after the footage of Tyre no less...

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Defiant-Passion-5129 OP t1_j6frhbg wrote

no not a fond memory for anybody. my grandfather hated every minute of his military experience but it’s history nonetheless.

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asspancakes t1_j6g23vg wrote

Not the flex you think it is

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KosmoAstroNaut t1_j6iqoi7 wrote

I don’t think he’s flexing the military actions that his grandfather took and their social implications, but rather the fact that his family member took a picture in a cool APC more than 50 years ago. OP clarified this multiple times

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Owlspirit4 t1_j6gi7fq wrote

Government oppression isn’t cool

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BedWilling4093 t1_j6gers2 wrote

Would he have shot citizens if ordered. Always wonder about the mentality of that .,cause seriously shooting your citizens is so fucked. I would just tell them go fuck yourselves and drop the weapon. Police love to hurt people though .you can see how they wanna do it

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6inDCK420 t1_j6i71i6 wrote

After Vietnam it was understood that if a commanding officer gives you orders that go against the values of your country, it is your civic duty to disobey the orders.

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clce t1_j6jr0as wrote

That's a rather erroneous statement. There's no specific values of your country. It is either a lawful order or not a lawful order. Granted, it's sometimes hard to tell, but there is very specific military training on what is and is not a lawful order based on a lot of different factors figured out by very smart and knowledgeable lawyers and experts.

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BedWilling4093 t1_j6lxn0j wrote

It's what I don't understand. Police and armies all over the world do this. If you know Its wrong then why go along with it. Just walk away. I mean who or what are you going against your own people for? Some company ,politics or worse religion. Go fight your own fucking battles .leave us alone

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Donnie_the_Rock t1_j6ij8ko wrote

This isn’t cool. This is sad and dystopian

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JonathanTrager t1_j6fptog wrote

Doesn’t look like much going on. What is a Quiet Riot? 🥁ba-dum-dum🥁

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Affectionate-Grand99 t1_j6fmlgt wrote

I thought it was Vietnam when I first saw this. What happened that required the military and machine guns to step in

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Defiant-Passion-5129 OP t1_j6fmusc wrote

honestly couldn’t say. he was recalling to me the story of this day and someone was on a rooftop of a parking garage shooting at him in he said Jersey. Although his discharge from the military was a bayonet to the forehead in Vietnam so he could be mixing it up

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RadioLongjumping5177 t1_j6fr6j7 wrote

When I went through U. S. Army basic training, we had 2 weeks of riot control training tacked on because we were eventually being assigned to the NJ National Guard in 1970.

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cahillc134 t1_j6i98kc wrote

How did gramps pick up a spot in the National Guard?

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Atlas03 t1_j6jcc40 wrote

That’s not very cash money of him.

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minnesotajersey t1_j6irh9t wrote

If rioters are endangering the lives of others, put them down with whatever you have at hand. Use a freakin cannon for all I care.

Had a friend in the guards during the Newark riots. He had some stories to tell.

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clce t1_j6jro5t wrote

Within reason of course. But I agree. This isn't shooting peaceful protesters at a Vietnam or civil rights march. This was to quell the disorder. And it's worth noting that just because the vehicle has a machine gun on it doesn't mean they were indiscriminately mowing down crowds. I have no way of knowing but it may well be the machine gun wasn't even in commission. It would take a pretty significant top-down order to open fire with a machine gun I'm quite sure

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