Submitted by the_falconator t3_108d8vn in RhodeIsland
Comments
Critical-Paramedic89 t1_j3rmb98 wrote
Jesus christ
the_falconator OP t1_j3rqbjc wrote
I raised these concerns in another post about the Cranston St. Armory. There were some on here that accused me of making stuff up and being heartless, but there are very real issues going on there.
hcwhitewolf t1_j3rti7v wrote
There definitely are but the concerns voiced here are just more publicly visible due to the news coverage of the Cranston Armory shelter and homeless encampment closures. The concerns seem to be common across shelters where there are issues of drug/alcohol usage, sexual violence (very often between occupants of the shelter), and sanitation issues. These aren’t new issues that only are happening here. Maybe they are worse, but maybe they also aren’t.
I have a friend who lives out in Columbus, Ohio who used to be a social worker, where he often worked with people in shelters. From all the stories he told me, it wasn’t uncommon for there to be fights, people getting kicked out for doing drugs in the shelter or coming back to the shelter high or drunk, the staff would clean areas of the shelter just for the very next person to trash the area just to spite the staff working there.
The reality is that unfortunately some of the people staying in shelters are just not good people and they ruin it for every other homeless person who is genuinely just trying to get by. The actions of those people hurts the image and further stigmatizes homelessness and it’s a problem, and not one that can easily be fixed.
Phllop t1_j3ru8ob wrote
Do you believe it's the same occupants causeing the issues that are the ones complaining? I don't understand what point you are trying to make.
the_falconator OP t1_j3rug15 wrote
I think a big problem with the Cranston St facility is that many of the people that are staying there are people that have been kicked out of other shelters for the issues you bring up. Fighting, sexual assaults, drug use in the shelter.
hcwhitewolf t1_j3ruqlb wrote
It’s possible some of the people complaining also contributed to the problem. There are a lot of people in general who lack self-awareness.
It comes down to what do you do with the people causing problems? If we are genuinely trying to give everyone shelter, you can’t just reasonably kick them out back onto the streets.
Proof-Variation7005 t1_j3rv5mb wrote
It's so weird how this last-minute plan that was thrown together at the last moment has issues. It's almost like McKee through the bare minimum of resources and planning into something to try and get people off his back or something.
Phllop t1_j3rx21t wrote
Okay well we are certainly on the same page there. I just don't know how to solve the problem outside of Amos doing something about it. Maybe it's not fair to lobby complaints against them as I'm sure it's a challenging task, but I do believe they are responsible for maintaining the facility so I think it's reasonable to voice concerns to them regardless of who's fault it is.
Proof-Variation7005 t1_j3rxmlr wrote
I wouldn't criticize Amos House as much as I'd focus it on McKee and Saal. This was thrown together last minute and I'd imagine Amos House doesn't have nearly the staff/resources to properly manage it.
This was a project that could've been planned and managed 6+ months before winter with multiple bids. Instead they announced it with nobody contracted to run it and no plan.
listen_youse t1_j3s1a4x wrote
>It kind of sounds like some of the people staying in the shelter need to learn to behave themselves a little bit better.
Why has no one thought of this before?
TheOGJayRussle t1_j3s5107 wrote
…..as they stick dirty needles in their arm…
commandantskip t1_j3sakz5 wrote
The amount of nothing Saal has gotten done over the past year is staggering.
Proof-Variation7005 t1_j3sep9i wrote
I'm not going to lie. His ineffectiveness borders on being impressive. It's like if you hear someone went bowling and got a 0. It's bad but you wonder how the fuck they managed to pull that off.
distortionisgod t1_j3soykt wrote
Oh yes. Every person experiencing homelessness is an IV drug user.
/s if it wasn't obvious
FrequentAnnual1262 t1_j3su93r wrote
Suggest folks read James O'Connell book, "Stories from The Shadows," for humanizing insight into homelessness. O'Connell is a MD who comes from Newport, he now is a leader in Boston's homeless effort.
There are no easy or one sized answers to this need, most have complicated long term issues. Then there is the NIMBY attitude that prevails. Need to keep in mind that they are all human beings not political commodities.
FrequentAnnual1262 t1_j3svz49 wrote
Every person is basically a good human being, these folks have a whole host of medical, psychological and sometimes addiction issues whose needs are often difficult to deal with. As a society we try to fit square pegs into round holes, it doesn't always work that well.
An issue is funding. I was involved in the deinstitutionalization efforts in the 80's. When they downsized Medical Center & Zambarano the money was supposed to follow the to the community to meet their needs, it didn't .
The money followed the Developmentally Disabled folks when they closed Ladd due to parent advocacy, the homeless do not have advocates.
Fgw_wolf t1_j3syy01 wrote
That’s most of americas problems honestly. No one easy answer and multiple broken as fuck systems involved.
the_falconator OP t1_j3t55rj wrote
Not every person is a good human being. There certainly are homeless that are good people down on their luck. Being homeless doesn't mean you are a bad person by any means, but there are bad people that are also homeless too. Bad people exist in the world and yes some of them are homeless and causing problems, often for other homeless people.
FrequentAnnual1262 t1_j3t9j1r wrote
Told you last week my beliefs, you disagreed with my points, no need to rehash the same old.same old again. The Judeo- Christian POV would disagree with you most homeless have fallen through the proverbial "safety net", most need a multi service intervention that is unique to their needs. But does not exist...
TheOGJayRussle t1_j3tegtf wrote
jt_tesla t1_j3thbif wrote
Damned if you do - have a makeshift homeless shelter that was put up maybe lacking enough planning but necessary because of the weather conditions at the time. Damned if you don’t - if you spend all this time planning while keeping the place closed.
The problem is out - the true measure of worth is how the city, Amos house and everyone else involved will respond.
An issue that has yet to be resolved is what do you do with the folks that have mental issues, refuses to follow rules and/or has drug addictions? Kick them back out in the streets?
stan_milgram t1_j3tl8yt wrote
Most of them are mentally ill. It’s not as much about bad behavior as it is a woeful lacking of adequate mental health care.
stan_milgram t1_j3tlnjp wrote
Exactly. Shelters are a bandage over the gaping wounds of the mental health crisis and terrible economy. Both of these things are related, in many ways.
TzarKazm t1_j3trccm wrote
> It’s possible some of the people complaining also contributed to the problem. There are a lot of people in general who lack self-awareness.
That is almost certainly the case. I worked in a Juvenile detention center in the early 90's and frequently the messiest people were the biggest complainers about mess.
TzarKazm t1_j3tsc82 wrote
Would you be surprised to find out that the US doesn't even break the top 50 countries in rates of homelessness? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_homeless_population
It's really not fair to make this one of "Americas problems" when it is a problem throughout the world and America does a better job than most.
the_falconator OP t1_j3twvvg wrote
Yeah, I brought up all the points that this article makes. You said I was making shit up. Now this article comes out and the same points I raised are being brought up by other homeless people.
FrequentAnnual1262 t1_j3tx7in wrote
You alleged that a sleeping homeless person was raped by another man, and I queried if you contacted the police about this crime.. and then you went silent.
the_falconator OP t1_j3txghe wrote
Yes providence police were contacted, he was arrested, did a little time in jail and is now back out on the streets.
FrequentAnnual1262 t1_j3txtqy wrote
A little time in jail for rape?? More absurdity..
the_falconator OP t1_j3ty5dy wrote
I agree, but that's on the judge. I assume that he or she agrees with you that everyone is good on the inside and it was just his substance abuse issues causing him to rape.
FrequentAnnual1262 t1_j3tyfjj wrote
I assume means crap.. either you know the details or do not.
Do not misquote me, I never said that.. but of course in your limited mind, you probably read something completely different. Reading comprehension is a great quality.
the_falconator OP t1_j3tytlr wrote
I know he got arrested and convicted, and I know he's out now because I see him on Cranston St.
Fgw_wolf t1_j3tznfu wrote
Okay? Just because the US “does a better job than most” doesn’t mean we even do a good job. It also doesn’t thrill me that it’s even issue. We have the #1, 2 and 3 best military in the world imagine if we focused on social issues instead. So kindly fuck off with your platitudes and downplaying the issue.
Previous_Floor t1_j3ur3oj wrote
>I think a big problem with the Cranston St facility is that many of the people that are staying there are people that have been kicked out of other shelters for the issues you bring up. Fighting, sexual assaults, drug use in the shelter.
I saw an interview on the news with the guy running this place. He made it very clear that this is not a shelter, they don't have the resources to be a shelter, and its only purpose is to allow people in for a short period of time so they don't get hypothermia out in the cold.
impact4 t1_j3vh83p wrote
Yup. People don't like to admit that there are those amongst the homeless who refuse to be helped or better themselves. Doesn't mean we shouldn't try to help them, but the homeless certainly aren't all perfect angels either.
pmk0286 t1_j3xl7tb wrote
Boot out the violent/sexual predator types on to the street with a “DNN” do not narcan order.
the_falconator OP t1_j47mbz7 wrote
It's basically running as a shelter. People are living in there, they only call it a warming shelter to get around the more stringent regulations that a shelter has to follow.
the_falconator OP t1_j47n4gg wrote
You have people who have begrudgingly followed the rules at shelters in the past but are now going to the armory because they don't want to follow the rules and they can get away with being drunk and high at the armory. The city doesn't really have a say, this is a state run facility, with people coming from all over the state. The tent camp in Woonsocket that was cleared out last week they sent them all down to Providence to stay here, but it is burdening the city with numerous Fire/EMS/Police responses to the armory every day.
hcwhitewolf t1_j3rirdb wrote
It kind of sounds like some of the people staying in the shelter need to learn to behave themselves a little bit better. All these concerns are directly related to the actions of the occupants, but they are blaming Amos House for not fixing the problems the occupants caused.