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CrDe t1_ixk8xhc wrote

It depends,
I have been an ecologist militant for years now, so it pain me a little to admit that so-called green tech aren't so green.

For instance in sweden wind turbine freeze during winter and they have to use anti-freezes that are not eco-friendly.
In France they want to install sea wind turbine but to do that you have concrete the sea floor. They want to do that in areas to would damage the marine ecosystem.
They do kill birds, it's not that much of an ecological disaster when it's pigeons or non-endangered species but when it's in areas with endangered birds it's an other matter.
In Switzerland in winter trough condensation they collected water droplets that turned into ice shards during the night and started to throw these ice shards in the road nearby. People got wounded.

But the main problem is that it's not so cost effective. I don't have the graph in mind but in energy you put in watts for production, exploitation and decommission of wind turbines compared to the watts you get in return is not high. Among the lowest in fact.

If you put them in a windy desert they are great, otherwise it not the safe and clean tech you may want to believe.

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RecognitionOwn4214 t1_ixl3i0t wrote

As always: perfect is the enemy of good.

Wind is cheap compared with fossile and fusion. It's the smaller evil (if any) in any case.

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Pablo-on-35-meter t1_ixl4xr4 wrote

Indeed, All this nonsense spreading around is upsetting. YES, ofcourse there are disadvantages. So... Start using less power in order to minimise the negative effect. As somebody who has been living on solar power for over 20 years now, I can tell you that it is amazing how little power you actually need. E.g. neighbours have 2 fridges and a freezer. We survive with a small (camping-style) fridge/freezer. Do you need this huge plasma TV? Do you need to wash at 90 degrees C? We survive very comfortably with a 5kWh battery set which has been in service now for 6 years and not degrading because we take care.... Do you need this big SUV while a smaller car can do 5 liters/100km?? Or use excess solar/wind power for an electrical car? And then, when you have minimized your consumption, then select the source with minimum environmental impact and for the time being, that is solar/wind. Or sometimes hydro power.. But please stop this Facebook stuff and have a look at realistic cost/benefits. ALL costs and ALL benefits, not just slogans.

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Liquid_Cascabel t1_ixlk4wh wrote

>But the main problem is that it's not so cost effective. I don't have the graph in mind but in energy you put in watts for production, exploitation and decommission of wind turbines compared to the watts you get in return is not high.

Not true, you tend to earn it back in under a year (design lifetime: 20-25y) and developers will naturally seek out the windiest areas to improve their ROI.

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WhenCaffeineKicksIn t1_ixmmfyb wrote

The problem here is not the overall power amount, but the power density. What a wind turbine produces in years, a regular steel or aluminium mill (or a production line for fiberglass which the same turbine blades are built of) consumes in days or less.

Basically, one cannot fabricate new wind turbines and even replace decommissioned ones using wind electricity only, another high-density energy sources are needed for it.

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Liquid_Cascabel t1_ixn11h7 wrote

Why would you have that as a requirement anyway?

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WhenCaffeineKicksIn t1_ixn8mox wrote

Partly because of "sustainability" component, partly because of general considerations.

A bit offtopic on the latter: the current "green energy" movement seems to be much more political than rational, onten pushing for the so-called "eco energy sources" without any regard on how these will integrate into the overall electric consumption balance. For example, one of the crucial elements of last-year Texas energy crisis was over-reliance on the renewable energy sources (solar and wind) while decommissioning the ecology-unfriendly coal and gas plants which served as balancing reserves, so at the moment of partial power outage due to freezes the rest of electric grid couldn't refill in time, which caused a cascade effect. It wasn't the only cause (cue the state economy on expensive gas supplies and historical electric network desync on a federal scale), but it can be considered as a "last straw" in that particular event.

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Top-Average5 t1_ixl0n82 wrote

Isn’t it also impossible to recycle them and they just bury the giant blades in the ground once they’re worn out or damaged

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alvangee t1_ixl2g0o wrote

I hear about vibration issues. They vibrate pretty heavily and this disrupts life of all fauna on and in the ground around them.

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RecognitionOwn4214 t1_ixl405w wrote

Ever seen a coal excavator or oil platform? Seems common for all energy forms besides solar.

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