I realize this topic is sensitive and this is likely a dumb idea for reasons I’m unaware of at this time (sound pollution, parameters around the federal funding, etc) but…
Is it crazy to consider utilizing this area (or at least a portion of it) as an urban dirt bike hub? It could create jobs, a safe place for the culture to thrive, vocational/career opportunities and (if done right) attract business.
That’s the main criticism I would expect.
A dirt bike cycling course would work though. No motors and less noise. I like your idea.
I’d be fine with the dirt bikes if they were the electric kind
It wouldn’t work dirtbikes already use the road just now the commuters are screwed and nobody will use it
The way this sub selectively chooses to use or not use the word NIMBY is fun to watch.
Aren't the residents in that area the ones who are riding the dirtbikes all over town?
The residents who are at the meetings talking about what they want in the space are probably not the dirt bike riders
Every person in west Baltimore rides dirt bikes? Or just the majority of those residents? Lol
Whew Chile this screams micro aggression.
Lol.
JFC have you ever met a black person or are they all just one to you?
I've met several. Such kind youths always offering to ride my bicycle for me when I pass them on the street.
They let themselves into my cars and house several times too.
Oh! They were so excited to meet my aunt that they knocked her over while she was carrying her newborn. I'm sure it was a mistake that they never gave her back her purse......
Yeah. I'm not racist boss. It just looks to me like a lot of the dirt bike kids are coming from west Baltimore. Don't make it something it isn't.
Two things pretty much always come up when the topic of a dirt bike park is mentioned and it's really unfortunate but the sad truth.
.
Just like skaters and skateparks. They built that park by the science center, but I’d rather hit up the street spots so I see what you’re getting at. As for number 1, this is the real problem. A friend of mine tried to sell his dirt bike, dude tried to steal it but wasn’t anticipating my friend to have a big turboed car. Called the cops and chased him to a dead end. They ended up finding a dude with a trailer that had a couple more bikes in the back already
I dunno, the hampden skatepark gets a lot of use. Seems like the only people really using roosevelt park sometimes. I get wanting to street skate as well, but If I still skated I would love to go to a skatepark nearby.
>A large majority of the dirt bikes you see being illegally driven around the city are stolen.
"This confirms what I want to believe so I will believe it despite evidence showing about one in five are stolen."
Do you have the date on your claims I’d love to see a source?
“Of the 420 dirt bikes police have seized since the launch of the task force, 88 were stolen, said Baltimore Detective David Jones. Many of the stolen bikes have been ripped off from dealerships and private owners in the suburbs around Baltimore County and from as far away as Pennsylvania and Virginia.”
So that’s about 20 percent that were stolen. Link below:
Yeah I read this in 2017 when it came out. 20% isn’t a “large majority”
If 1 in 5 cars in Baltimore were stolen, would you say the same thing?
I would say 20% is not the majority or a large percentage. I would also say it also doesn’t substantiate the claims made here .
It’s way more than that. They can’t officially count the ones with the serial numbers ground off as stolen
that's only the percentage of bikes seized. I think the percentage would skew higher if they recovered more bikes.
I’m asking for facts and hard numbers. Not what you “think”
You're not asking for facts and hard numbers and you're not asking for what u/Moongdss74 thinks so what are you asking for? Are you asking for people to define entitlements again?
Yes he’d absolutely say the same thing, because one in five is not in any way a majority
It’s less than 50% so it can’t be a majority at all, let alone a large majority. It’s not even halfway there
I only everyone in this thread made up numbers. They do it daily. That’s why I request sourced data, not lies and feelings
I heard that over 104% of claims made in the sub are fraudulent
Lies
Would it make you feel better if whoever upset you edited their post from “large majority” to “roughly 20%”?
Is that your real issue here?
The real issue is no claim made here is backed by facts.
I hear you, and I agree. Throwing incorrect numbers around to back up your claims is wrong.
You have been successful in demonstrating to readers that possibly 20% of the dirt bikes are stolen, rather than “a large majority.”
Personally, I don’t think whether or not the bike was stolen is “the” problem. “The” problem is kids riding dirt bikes illegally in the city and endangering the public.
I feel like those who’ve taken it upon themselves to prove to the world that only a few of the dirt bikes are stolen got lost down a go-nowhere alleyway (motorcycle theft).
Isn’t the real issue the fact that the dirt bikes are ridden illegally?
That plus 20% stolen makes the OP’s venture one absolutely no one is putting any money into, ever.
The 20% stolen is just sugar on top of why no one wants to invest in something like this.
> “The” problem is kids riding dirt bikes illegally in the city and endangering the public.
How many people in the public have been hurt by them?
Who is them?
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Those 2 things have nothing to do with which other. Because plenty of people have had these every same idea, regardless of the 20% or what you feel.
What two things do not have anything to do with each other?
But that’s not the problem the commenter cited. The comment starting all this back and forth over numbers cites as literally the #1 issue the idea that a “large majority" of the bikes ridden illegally are stolen. When someone begins with a false premise people who disagree with their conclusion are going to question that premise. That is natural. If you don't have a factual premise your argument is a house of cards.
If it’s a red herring (or “sugar”) why even bring it up?
IMO that claim reads like an ad hominem. And here's why: Let's say we knew for certain that 100% of the bikes being used were bought legally; would that make the street riding any better/safer? Of course not. Unsafe riding is unsafe riding. (aside: I've been riding motorcycles for over 15 years and I'm not aware of anything proving a stolen motorcycle is less safe than a legally purchased one. Seems like that would be covered in the MSF Motorcycle Safety Course. The pavement hurts just as bad when you land after a high-side at speed regardless of how you got your bike)
If the issue upsetting folks is unsafe street riding, then providing a non-street place to ride is a good starting point. So debate that idea on the issues that you can verify; not dubious numbers and ad hominem attacks leveled at the riders.
I’m pretty sure you and I are on the same page about whether the bike is stolen or not has no effect on the fact that it’s being ridden illegally and dangerously. It doesn’t.
The sugar on top part, I’ll explain.
OP is making a suggestion to try and make some positive moves in this city with regards to this particular issue.
The poster you’re referring to entered the discussion, implied that this topic and this particular solution has been discussed before, and listed two things that always come up.
One of those things was over exaggerated.
You or someone else pulled some statistics and proved that rather than “a large majority,” only 20% of these dirt bikes are stolen.
Congratulations to whoever that was. Seriously.
However, that does absolutely nothing to change the fact that this topic and this particular solution has been discussed before and two specific things always come up.
To simplify, no one is investing in a bike park (OP’s suggestion) if there’s a possibility 20% of the bikes in there are stolen. That’s like throwing money away.
I don’t understand the race baiting.
Fair enough. Thank you.
Just Google "Baltimore stolen dirbtikes" and you'll get what you're looking for.
I did. There’s nothing with any official data backing your claim. Just vague stories. Do you have something with numbers because I’d like to see numbers.
Bull.
Shit.
> A large majority of the dirt bikes you see being illegally driven around the city are stolen.
So is there any actual stats on this or is it just one of those assumptions that's made because of 'who' is ridding the bikes?
Just because the person riding it paid for it doesn’t mean the bike isn’t stolen. And sure, I’ll make an assumption on the who. I’ll assume the people who brazenly break the law by riding non street legal bikes through the heart of downtown in large groups right in front of police officers are more likely to be ok with stealing or receiving stolen property.
> And sure, I’ll make an assumption on the who
Nice of you to admit it at least...
Try googling? Yes when the dirt bike task force confiscates bikes anywhere from 25-50% are stolen bikes. Not that you couldn’t have looked that up yourself.
It doesn't matter if they are stolen or not. https://www.motorcyclelegalfoundation.com/what-does-a-dirt-bike-need-to-be-street-legal/
Exactly. Most people don't seem to understand that every single dirt bike (except those that have undergone conversion kits) is illegal to ride on public roads. Dual-sport bikes are obviously an exception.
Hmm Not seeing anything citing 25%-50% figures
Of the 420 dirt bikes police have seized since the launch of the task force, 88 were stolen, said Baltimore Detective David Jones. 21%
Police seized a total of 15 dirt bikes and ATV’s of which six were stolen and three had obliterated serial numbers. 60%
During their investigation, officers recovered two dirt bikes. One of the bikes had been previously reported stolen in Southern Maryland. 50%
Or. I just know how math works.
> Or. I just know how math works.
Discarding over 95% of your data because it doesn't fit your claim is not, typically, how math works.
Where is the cited sources
Your own numbers average out to about 43%.
Not a “large majority.” Not even a majority. But hey, you “know how math works” so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Where the fuck did I say “large majority”. Cite that for me. Thanks. And by the by… 43% is HUGE. If 43% of cars on the road were stolen that might make the news at least or something.
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did you really just waste a minute of your time to write the dumbest comment i’ve ever read?
Ad hominems don’t prove shit. Show me this “large majority”.
you do realize you just demonstrated exactly how smart you are. thanks for that!
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Bro you are the most annoying poster on this sub.
Data is not everything. When you learn about data you will learn this.
Data is everything. Bs numbers and feelings aren’t
Notice how the best they got is that "most" just gets bumped down to 30%
So where’s the Google source
I love how there's no attrition to that stat, just 'police say' and now suddenly ya'll willing to believe everything the BPD says....
Also the OP said 'most' and 29% is not 'most'.
Yeah, that doesn’t substantiate any claims made. This is from 2013 there’s no one data. “Police say” well where’s the hard numbers… police say a lot of things
What dirt bike task force?
https://www.wbaltv.com/article/officials-form-task-force-to-address-dirt-bikes-in-baltimore/7101650
It's old, prob not active anymore. But it existed supposedly.
Thanks to the absolutely wonderful Mr's Mosby and company the police are not to interfere with their activities. All they can do is watch and monitor them like they do every week at Pratt Street.
By now where they congregate is very well known.
Last week there was a cop heading north on MLK Jr. Blvd, flanked on both sides and behind by a group of about 15 guys on dirt bikes popping wheelies and what not.
Yeah I saw them give the police the finger on Pratt st last Thursday. They know the police can't do anything and take full advantage of it.
The claim was that “a large majority” of the bikes are stolen. Your claim is it’s 25-50% of them. So which is it? Because 25-50% is not “a large majority.“
Nah, it’s just easier to call you racist. Thanks though!
It's not racist to call out people who are deliberately being obnoxious, not in the least. It doesn't matter if they are black, white, polkadot or whatever. Dumb is dumb and needs to be dealt with accordingly.
I get so sick to death of people throwing out the word "racist" in an effort to take away someone's credibility just because they are of a different race than the folks doing dumb stuff. I know personally I will call stuff out regardless of what color someone is because again wrong is wrong.
Unfortunately there is so much division in this country either they have the mentality that black people can do no wrong, or they feel that all of us are a problem. There simply isn't any nuance no middle ground at all. Like somehow we can't help but do things to piss everyone else off and that's just not true. Just because something is a part of local culture, doesn't mean that you just accept the negative aspects of it or condone the actions of the people doing it.
Lol. I was being sarcastic and making a joke about the lightly veiled racist comment above, and exactly how unhelpful that is.
For getting so upset about division, you sure seem to be trying to drive a lot of it at someone who agrees with you.
This is text communication so sometimes things that are intended don't come across as intended. Happens to me all the time.
Also, to be honest I would have assumed that the bikes were stolen as well and I think that's a reasonable assumption to make as well. Doesn't have to be a matter of race at all, in this case though all of the young men I've seen doing this whether here in Baltimore or in DC are black.
Needless to say that if they were white or hispanic the issue would still be the same.
> I would have assumed that the bikes were stolen as well and I think that's a reasonable assumption to make as well.
No it's not.
>Needless to say that if they were white or hispanic the issue would still be the same.
No it isn't. I've been riding for 40 years, from dirt bikes to street bikes to cruisers. When I was a kid I did all the same things these kids are doing now on public streets. Hell I rode my dirt bike to elementary school. I've had many angry screaming people come out to yell at me in the street over that I was doing, and you know what none of them ever accused me of... stealing my bike. I did however see a kid who legitimately borrowed a friends bike get stoped by the school administrator who demanded he tell him 'where he got his bike from'. But that kid was darker than me.
I've been at bike nights showing off my bike and would get questions about wether or not I did my own build, while my ridding acquaintance sitting next to me got questions of 'where'd you get this'. You can guess the difference between to two of us.
I've run from the cops breaking up street races a couple of times. And each time cops waved me through the permitter they had set up, while the stopped the rest to check their paperwork. You can guess the difference once again.
I could go on and on with examples I've actually seen. But there is definitely a general assumption made that black riders steal their bikes and it is not the "same" and made for the rest of us.
If someone is going to say that "most" of a group of black people have stolen something without any proof, you're damn right I'm going to call that racist and that's not where the "division' is coming from.
Perhaps the "division" is the assumption black people only steal stuff in the first place.
They’re mostly stolen, if u live in the area for more than a year and actually know locals of all races you’d know already. Not everything has numbers and data to be true
I understand that it does sound like something someone would throw around just to point the finger, but it's true.
There are no stats in that story.
You need hard stats to make the connection here?
No one has hard stats on the current percentage of stolen dirbtikes on the road. You can however reference the dozens upon dozens of articles regarding them being stolen and found in Baltimore.
Yea I need hard stats to assume "most" of them are stolen like OP said. But let me guess, you can just 'look at them and tell' huh...
You're really pushing this race narrative.
It's an easy assumption to make that bikes being used in illegal activities and recklessly driven around the city were illegally obtained and not legally purchased for several thousand dollars at a dealership.
“It’s an easy assumption…”
That’s the point.
You’re reaching. Everything needs to be collected and reported in spreadsheets to be true lol
Lol
Race-baiting is so gross
Yea it is, assuming a bike is stolen because a black kid is riding it is certainly gross.
Who did that?
The [unavailable] OP did and all these people that agreed with them.
I must have missed that part
Maybe an actual lawyer could chime in but I imagine that would be a liability nightmare for the city.
Not a lawyer, but work in insurance. Can confirm it would be a liability nightmare
If set up correctly, it would fall under Maryland's recreational use statute, which would mean that the city would only be liable if it injured someone through the willful or malicious failure to guard or warn of a dangerous condition. And they could have people sign waivers.
You still have a security issue. Are we paying the BPD to manage it?
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No.
Because dirt bike riders don't ride dirt bikes to ride dirt bikes.
They ride dirt bikes because it's a fun "fuck you" to the normies.
The fact that it's dangerous, illegal and inconvenient is the point. Or at least part of it.
That's the problem with all the people trying to find ways to accommodate the riders. They don't want to be accommodated. They WANT to stand out. It's part of what makes the whole thing fun.
An argument could be made that "well, if we make it safe and boring they'll lose interest". But that assumes effectively being able to get them to go to the place where it is safe and boring. And in case you haven't been paying attention, the the only thing the BPD is effective at is submitting overtime slips.
So... don't waste the time and effort. If we want these folks to stop riding dirt bikes we need to show them that life is better when they don't.
If you’d have told 20 year old me I could ride a dirt bike wherever I wanted through a major city disobeying all traffic laws and suffer no consequences, well, I’d have taken you up on that offer. Because despite how I feel about them now, it certainly looks fun as shit. When people talk about the squeegee boys and finding them alternatives I get it. Not with the 12 o’clock boys, they need consequences.
Right?
The thing that cracks me up, though, is all the suburban pearl clutchers who complain while also buying Harley shit.
Good luck keeping it safe! Who is going to agree to manage that operation? Seems like a recipe for going out of business / lawsuits
Dirt bike courses exist already and this isn't an issue
Yeah for ppl that bring their bikes there on a trailer, not minors driving them on the street without license & without license plates. And not located in areas of high violent crime & lawlessness. Who is gonna work at these places and how are ppl going to pay to get in and how are the employees going to be kept safe in an area loaded with guns, hard drugs, and general lawlessness / lack of respect for human life. Ppl put bullets into each others’ heads multiple times per week in this part of the world over trivial stuff, are they gonna wear helmets and respect safety rules and not bring guns/drugs? Literally problematic at like every possible decision idk how anyone thinks this is an executable idea
so... Thunderdome it is!
Alright now I’m totally on board
That’s why liability waivers our thing
Can have 1,000,000 waivers per participant but they can still sue, and would need to go to court with a lawyer. Also no insurance company is going to work with them, or only offer skyhigh rates. It is a seemingly good idea on surface level but even a tiny exploration of its general execution leads to very obvious problems
People are always going to try and get over whenever they think they can get away with it, but, it doesn’t mean it’s going to happen or that it can’t be done
Practically anything can be done with enough resources thrown at it but that doesn’t mean that it should be done. Simply being possible does not automatically make it a good idea
Being as it’s been done before in other places (Cleveland and been talked about doing something similar in others, it’s worth the trying. Clearly it’s a good idea.
Never happened in Cleveland didn’t even get started
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You don’t ride obviously. Dirt biking legally at parks is a hobby id have trouble affording at my salary. It’s close to owning a small boat
>a safe place for the culture to thrive
you assume they ride dirtbikes through random routes of the city because they have nowhere else to ride. that is false. if that were true, they would never joyride through the harbor, but they're out there all the time in the summer.
their hobby isn't riding dirtbikes. their hobby is stunt-riding to be seen. the more dirtbike culture is supported, the more will ride on busy streets. the only advantage of a bike park is that it removed the excuse of "there is nowhere else to ride" so that police can get them to stop riding dangerously through busy places.
but really, why should the city spend so much money on a bunch of assholes when there are people starving? a few weeks ago I had to give a guy my coat because he was wearing a long-sleeve t-shirt and shivering like crazy while it was 35 degrees outside. if we had that much flexibility with the highway-to-nowhere funds, we could set up low income housing or community gardens so that people in the neighborhood can feel a greater attachment to the area and want to fix up more houses. dirtbikers should be at the bottom of the list of people the city bends over backwards to help.
Seriously this. If you have ever explored the woods in places like Druid hill or lake Roland, you won’t find evidence of dirt bike use. These kids aren’t interested in anything but riding wheelies down the street
Some parks have evidence but they’re unlisted parks Down around linthicum Brooklyn area.
It’s also lot scarier to ride in woods high speed and do wheelies
Now that you mention it, I've yet to see a dirt bike on a wooded trail in Druid. They seem to prefer to turf the ball field near the Susquehannock Pavilion in Druid Hill.
I'm only here to signal boost this great nonprofit that works with youth that are into dirt bikes. They're learning STEM skills, how to build bikes, and practicing the hobby safely.
The value of that land is way too significant to give up for recreational open space that only has one use. I think you and a lot people, as this isn't the first time I've heard this suggestion, jump to this idea because it's getting stuck on what the current value and use of the land is: vacant lots of no productive value; empty; nothingness. in reality, those lots should be of some use that would provide revenue to the city and provide some sort of economic activity. providing greater revenue to the city would do more for residents of West Baltimore than a pile of dirt to ride their dirt bikes. Additionally, who's to say this would entice dirt bike riders to use it and stop using the streets as their personal racing circuits(which I assume is the reasoning for your suggestion)?? That's not guaranteed to change their minds.
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Why are you challenging me on this!? I don't think my comment implied that I wouldn't say the same things about those places (Well, maybe not the cemeteries...c'mon, man).
I CANNOT WAIT for the Maryland Stadium Authority to release the agreement/plan with the Orioles & Ravens on what they are going to do to develop all those empty lots! I would love for some of the golf courses to be repurposed into more housing! You picked the wrong target if you think that I am picking and choosing which underutilized land in the city to highlight. Good grief.
I think unfortunately part of the allure of riding the dirt bikes is the nuisance it causes.
I don’t think they would go anywhere near a sanctioned dirt bike area.
>I think unfortunately part of the allure of riding the dirt bikes is the nuisance it causes.
I mean, same for Harleys but we still apply laws to them.
>I don’t think they would go anywhere near a sanctioned dirt bike area.
It might make enforcement easier. Plus, maybe the key would be making the arena kick ass. People go to tracks to race their cars that they definitely like racing on streets, yes?
How are they going to get to the dirt bike park? Do all these kids know people with pick up trucks and trailers or are they just going to ride there illegally? They’re off road vehicles, no turn signals or lights, no insurance and no license required to ride. These kids blow stop signs, pop wheelies and tear ass down the streets. We don’t need to pander to them we need to start impounding their shit.
Exactly. If the bikes are legally purchased find out who bought them and hold them accountable for them being used illegally.
Honestly, I would go as far as to make them illegal to sell in the city or nearby as well.
Dirt bikes and atvs have a vin number just like a car, When they are stolen, the thieves grind off the serial numbers. There is no way to track them back to the original owner
Good point but I'm talking about the one that are actually legally obtained. I'm trying to give people the benefit of the doubt that have posted about most of them being bought and not stolen.
Mentioned some ideas around the incentives and planning piece by offering onsite storage. Completely agree with enforcing on illegal on street BS in conjunction with offering legit alternatives. These are basic behavior change principles.
On site storage lol. They will definitely get stolen eventually & these ppl aren’t idiots they know this
This couldn’t be some small scale rinky dink bullshit. The purpose would need to be create a facility that would become a destination for the region.
It’s a unique idea so I’m not trying to tear u down. But unfortunately making it regional (like Hatfield McCoy trails in WV) will make it too expensive for most of the riders in our city even Philly ny nj crews
Owning a dirtbike and trailer and truck and riding legally is a lot of money and work. When I had a boat I had to tow it down to slip and launch no way I was paying slip fees. If I had the option to jump in boat from house and cruise where ever no rules that make it lot cheaper all u need to buy is a boat
I am going to say it again hopefully those in the back can hear me. I honestly think that this issue is being made sensitive in a way that's unnecessary.
There young men are:
feel free add any more things you can come up with.
It's clear by any one that's experienced them that they DON"T merely have a love for dirt bikes, what they want is ATTENTION and they don't care about their own personal safety or that of other people.
I repeat, this isn't a situation where providing a place to safely pursue their sport is a wise choice at all. I truly wish that people who comment on them needing a safe place to ride their bikes would stop being so naive. I get that they have the best of intentions and all but it's just not based on reality. Even if you did build such a track, they would have to get their bikes there and back home. This is different from something like a skateboard or roller skates which you can just bring on the bus or in a car.
What I do believe is that the Department of Recreation and Parks, (like so many other departments in this city) needs to be thoroughly investigated by someone who is actually trustworthy. We need more rec centers, swimming pools, community gardens, etc. Places for young people to go and not be bored half to death.
Agreed 100. Something is going on w a lot of these agencies. Lot of them like dot are pursuing some high minded bullshit and not focusing on the basics.
Because having somewhere to ride the dirt bikes is not the reason they are a problem. It’s the culture surrounding the reasons the dirtbikes exist, and they don’t exist to compete in the X games.
So you don’t like the people riding them and their “culture.”
Awww there’s always one racist
Yeah, it's the person who has a problem with an activity "because of the culture."
Idk what you wanna hear fam. The culture of the dirt bikes in our city is one of gangs and kids without families to support them.
Do I wish that wasn’t the case? Yes, but giving these kids a dirt bike track wouldn’t solve the problem of systematic racism and lack of opportunity for these people.
But go ahead, keep thinking I’m racist, have a great day!
The same thing exists in cities all over the country. It's not exclusive to Baltimore. And I don't really know or give half a fuck what you call yourself, but claiming that because a kid rides a dirt bike s/he is part of a gang and doesn't have a family to support them is one dumb generalization. These guys ride past my block all the time. I see white dudes riding with them and older dudes riding along with the teens and 20-something’s. They seem like they’re having fun.
People don't ride dirt bikes around town because they lack opportunity any more so than people street race cars because of lack of opportunity. You're just jonesing to shit on someone doing something you dislike.
Bruh I can hear you mouth breathing from here, maybe call your cousin for a date night or go clean one of your guns. Gang doesn’t mean violent criminal, it does however mean association of people.
I didn’t say a thing about skin color, however like all gangs or groups or squads, the culture of dirt bikes in baltimore is a family that these people lean on the exact same way hells angels, the crips, knights of Columbus, the local intramural sports teams,or kappa alpha sorority, because they want to belong to something. I find the structure of all of the organizations very beneficial to mental psychology, even if the actions of the orgs are not necessarily lawful.
Fact is, dirt bikes in the city, whether ridden by perfect citizens or not, are a nuisance. This is very similar to evenings on ritchie highway is a shithole filled with tuners, a lot of city is a shithole with 12 o clock boys, and that’s why anyone with a brain can accept that it is what it is, but you’d rather tell me I’m racist than look at something from outside your tiny ignorant lenses. Good luck out there my friend, life isn’t gonna get any easier for your grumpy ass if you don’t step off from your high horse a bit.
If you actually ever got off your high horse, you’d realize you’ve been riding a donkey your whole life claiming you’re on a Clydesdale.
Dude, you are a coder who was just in the Denver sub bragging about how much you water your lawn. Stick to your flip-flops and fescue in the county and quit flexing like you know shit about a city you can't even handle living in.
They’re not doing it because they like riding dirt bikes, they’re doing it because they want people to see them. They want the attention. Watch them, they’re always looking around to see if they’re getting attention.
Some of these riders u see have thousands of followers just to put in perspective. It’s fame
I mean, we build spaces specifically for people to get attention all the time.
I just can’t understand the idea to coddle these criminals
I don't think the people riding dirt bikes illegally through the city just want a place to ride safely....
Not only that, but how do you expect people to get the dirt bikes there to ride them in the first place? Not like they are going to load them up on a trailer and drive them to it.
Riders like attention/people watching them that’s why the never ending calls to set up a track for them are dumb
Unless you could set up stands and get people to watch but even then maybe at best
I admire the attempts to create a legal and safe dirt bike experience but it seems a large part of the appeal is the risky and illegal nature of flying through city streets.
Because they don’t like lawlessness they should get out of the city?
I don't fully buy the skatepark/dirtbike comparison. Skateparks take up a relatively small amount of space, skateboards aren't noisy. But mostly - someone riding their board to and from a skatepark wouldn't be noticeable at all. How do people think these people are going to get to and from these hypothetic motocross tracks lol
That would be a very unsafe place, opening the city up to so many lawsuits.
That was one of my thoughts, but like you said, noise pollution. That's what stopped the racing at RFK stadium in DC
I am a biker .... dirt biker as a kid in Baltimore City and grew up to ride bikes on the roads.
I can almost guarantee you that, you could build the best off road dirt bike area in the city, but the illegal riding would continue. Not every would have access to this new area, as it would be illegal to ride there.
I remember one BCPD officer who caught us coming out of the woods alongside Nortwood Elementary School said .... " don't you dare let me catch you riding that bike on the street, I do not even want to see you sitting on it, coasting down the street. Now push that bike home! "
I had just come out of the woods, hit a bump and got some air when I saw the cop car. He motioned me to come over, and started the encounter by saying .......
" Now tell me you were NOT riding that bike out of the woods! " I knew he was being real cool and was going to give us a break.
Maybe next we can build a city gun range so murderers have somewhere to shoot without hurting anyone.
Its an idea that sounds good, to some, but would simply not be confinable. Look at how the approval of graffiti has not been able to be kept from spreading, like a cancer, to the rest of the city. I am all for vocational programs, including motorcycle repair, but to allow it to be part of an otherwise illegal and uncontrollable context would be unwise.
Not only that, but it would encourage the "whites only" motorcycle groups to demand their bit of the cash.
Lets pressure the Balt public schools to re-establish auto mechanics, and include motorcycles.
This may be a bit of a tangent, but various parts of the city have started small programs to teach kids science, mechanical, and engineering skills based on dirt bike usage:
Though I agree with you (and Baltimore has tons tons tons more going for it as well such as arts, music, science, medicine, ports and trains), from my perspective, a lot of the denizens of the city, and the surrounding counties, are opposed to their use.
I expect it's a nice to have for the end users but it's not going to change the behavior of riding around in groups because that in itself is a big part of the thrill of riding the bikes and buying one.
I have had a similar sentiment for a long time. A dirt bike hub is needed and could be a great addition if properly planned and implemented. Unfortunately nothing in this town is properly planned or implemented.
Actually there is a great nonprofit providing opportunities in many facets of dirt bike culture and mechanics and it should he expanded
This should’ve been the focus of the whole thread lol
Exactly
B360 is a great organization
Of course I see the stunting and generally disrespectful/unsafe BS and know that is part of the allure. This type of approach would obviously require partnerships/strategizing between private business and city government, incentives (vocational training, free/safe bike storage) and a big picture approach with an emphasis on holding events to draw on crowds from out of town. To even have a shot at this space serving as a replacement/safer option for illegal riding would probably require incorporating access to a local track/course for free. I am also fully aware there is a zero percent chance of this happening. Just some general pipe dreaming.
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Can we put jumps that would go over the intersecting bridges?
Yes it’s a crazy idea. But I like the outside the box thinking. We should use it for a subway line. Maybe cap it and build some mixed use building and parks on it.
How about, hear me out, LEAVING IT AS IS?! Dirtbikes already all over the road now.
It’s a crucial route back to west side from downtown. I commute from Wes side to work without that road me and lot of others would be screwed and add 20 min to our commute and we already live in city.
The people proposing solutions don’t even live in the area. r/BmoreDOT said they don’t write thinkpieces on the highway to nowhere and two weeks later promote a thinkpiece on the highway! Leave shit alone sometimes and get back to the basics
The people displaced aren’t magically going to be made whole. This whole highway to nowhere thing reeks of white guilt not gonna lie.
20 minutes? I took the Franklin St. surface level the other day the entire length of the highway and it took 6 minutes at most.
Even mentioned having downtown blocked off IE the F1 race we had to have the dirt bike culture safely parade through downtown
It’s a tough call. Most riders wouldn’t be interested but it would be a shame to leave behind the handful that are into racing legitimately. I would hate to waste the opportunity to teach a teen who may be interested in excavation, motor building/ mechanics,racing or the a/v component of documenting races. So many positive skills can be learned from this type of atmosphere
i've reached out to city hall to have a course built in Druid Hill for dirt bike usage.
No, that's an incredible idea.
U gonna get a true yup response asking that question to this Reddit. Sad how this Reddit has become a bull horn for yuppie and suburban whites to find solidarity in not understanding this city. You don’t like this place - please get out.
Dazzling-Zone t1_ja9w779 wrote
That’s an interesting idea, I’m not sure the residents in the area would want that though.