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needleinacamelseye t1_jdxwrjd wrote

This article in the Sun from a few months back estimates $7.5 billion in private & public money would be needed to renovate all the city's vacants.

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[deleted] t1_jdxx3c4 wrote

[deleted]

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kermelie t1_jdy1jqp wrote

Less than the 6 billion the federal government is paying for the Baltimore tunnel that’ll let trains go fast on the one mile stretch.

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Available_Ratio8049 t1_jdxwk51 wrote

From city gov website:

"As of February 15, 2022, there are 14,989 vacant properties and only 1245 of those are owned by the City government. Properties that are privately owned must go through due process before the City can act to demolish those properties or make plans to take ownership and bring them back into productive use."

So, let's assume that to renovate or demo/rebuild those properties costs on average around $100k to $500k each, for an avg of $300k each, you'd be looking at around:

$4,500,000,000

Aka $4.5 billion.

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ConcreteThinking t1_jdzic1a wrote

And there is the cost of interest on the debt and the little problem of finding someone to buy them. I don't think there are 14,000 homebuyers waiting to buy a renovated rowhouse for $300,00 in the city neighborhoods where the vacants exist. A few of them on the edges but not 14,000 of them.

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addctd2badideas t1_jdyc60p wrote

It has nothing to do with the money to renovate them. There's a long and arduous process for the city or any of the various nonprofits doing similar work trying to either rehab abandoned homes or demolish them to build larger buildings or green spaces. Many of them still have owners and you still have to go through the courts accordingly and it takes literal years to do so.

This older, but still incredibly relevant 2016 episode from Planet Money describes the process in detail.

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app_priori t1_je00398 wrote

The city needs to get its crime problem under control first. I honestly think if the city conducts a lottery and gives renovated houses away to people for free, it would be a great way of building back the tax base. But the city needs to ensure residents' safety first.

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Typical-Radish4317 t1_je0904g wrote

Crime is directly tied to material condition. You can't "solve" crime when a quarter of your tax base lives in poverty. You either have to fix the reasons that they are poor or push poor people out of the city. Baltimore isn't attractive enough to push poor people out of the city. This idea would go towards improving the material conditions of it's residents so lol good luck getting that approved.

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ScootyHoofdorp t1_je0h13t wrote

It's not that simple, and it never has been.

NYC - Poverty level: 18%, Violent crime rate: 256

El Paso - Poverty level: 19.1%, Violent crime rate: 296.5

Baton Rouge - Poverty level: 24.4%, Violent crime rate: 291.4

Baltimore - Poverty level: 20.3%, Violent crime rate: 497.9

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Typical-Radish4317 t1_je0i4er wrote

Look at where the crime is happening and what the income levels are in those areas..it really is that simple.

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ScootyHoofdorp t1_je0xzwz wrote

It's not, and I just gave you the data to prove it.

Obviously poverty is a factor, but it is far from the only one, as you suggest. There must be a reason that Baton Rouge has more poverty and less crime. There must be a reason San Diego has below average poverty, but above average violent crime rates. It is unavoidable that there are regional, historical, cultural, and other factors at play here. Refusing to address any of those while we wait for this country's economic system to magically become more fair is to permit more unnecessary slaughter.

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Typical-Radish4317 t1_je0z44m wrote

But you didn't. You are generalizing statistics for a whole city. If you look at Baltimores affluent areas you'd be like wow Baltimore is a pretty safe city. If you look at west and east Baltimore you be like holy smokes this place is a war zone. The difference being those who live in abject poverty vs high income earners.

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ScootyHoofdorp t1_je1amar wrote

Wow, ok. I don't think you understand how statistics work.

Explain to me why Baton Rouge, which has higher poverty than Baltimore proportionally, has lower crime that Baltimore proportionally. Baton Rouge has more poverty, so by your logic, more areas of the city have low income, so there should be more crime. But, in fact, there's 40+% LESS crime! Make that make sense...

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Typical-Radish4317 t1_je1ca0c wrote

Which area in NYC compares to Sandtown/ Winchester? You're saying poverty levels are the same. but lol you are using baton rouge as a talking point when baton rouge is incredibly violent. I'm not sure where you pulled your statistics from. But tell me why you think Baltimore has such high violent crime if it's not poverty

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ScootyHoofdorp t1_je1ro2s wrote

You've made it clear that you cannot answer my question. My numbers come from FBI crime data. They're correct.

And I'm not sure why you need me to repeat myself. I said that poverty is a big part of the story here, but that there are other factors at play, which the data makes very obvious.

I'm sorry you're unable to see that.

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Typical-Radish4317 t1_je2vb7k wrote

Lol you cannot answer my question. Look at any city you mentioned and look at which part of the city has the highest rate of crime. Shocker its the poorest portion.

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norebonomis t1_jdy2tkq wrote

So is it a good time to find a place to squat in or???…?.?..

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WendysNumber6 t1_jdzz6hg wrote

I don't know why you would even want to renovate ALL of them.

Yes many of them are beautiful and historic but our population has declined substantially and there's no rush to move back.

Unfortunately a mix of target renovations and a lot of demolition is the practical solution

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Jrbobfishman t1_jdyiqbl wrote

4% of the money sent to Ukraine.

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WendysNumber6 t1_jdzzb4r wrote

You ever notice right wingers never had an issue with the military budget until we spent it on a country that is actually fighting for freedom?

Meanwhile the rest of us have been asking to spend the military budget domestically for 30 years

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Jrbobfishman t1_je3bzu2 wrote

Or there is just some people in the middle who don’t want to spend any money on other shitbags wars

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