Submitted by BmoreCityDOT t3_znin03 in baltimore
XanderCruse t1_j0ih3fu wrote
Reply to comment by PoopIsAlwaysSunny in We're testing out scooter no-parking zones. by BmoreCityDOT
Agreed, they shouldn't be on the sidewalk. We as a city need to invest more in bike/scooter infrastructure so we can avoid this conflict point. In some places, riding on the sidewalk is the only safe option for the scooter operator.
PoopIsAlwaysSunny t1_j0ikcda wrote
More infrastructure would be nice, but first it needs to be made very clear that riding on the sidewalk endangers pedestrians and is strictly not allowed.
If the sidewalk is the only safe option, they need to get off and walk with the scooter. It is not their right to endanger pedestrians for their convenience.
bmoreDOT replied to me with a link to a video on their new initiative which seems to address this.
squidonthebass t1_j0inmo6 wrote
> If the sidewalk is the only safe option, they need to get off and walk with the scooter
As somebody who rides the scooters a lot - including through areas where it's just straight up not safe to ride on the road - I think it's fine to have a middle ground on here. If there's nobody on the sidewalk, it's fine to ride the scooter. But if you come up on a pedestrian, you give them plenty of space or get off if you can't.
I know there are people that do not ride the scooters with that much respect to pedestrians and I absolutely think it's unacceptable, but I also don't think it's fair to blanket ban riding on sidewalks at all either.
TL;DR just don't be a dickhead when you ride a scooter?
bookoocash t1_j0ioufz wrote
>but first it needs to be made very clear that riding on the sidewalk endangers pedestrians and is strictly not allowed.
I use the scooters occasionally when my bike is in the shop and I’m 99% certain it literally says to not ride them on the sidewalks on the scooter itself, so there really is no excuse.
moderndukes t1_j0m1nbw wrote
More infrastructure wouldn’t just be nice but it is the thing to solve the problem. Riders feel far safer riding on the sidewalks than they do on the streets in the city - if they felt safe on the streets, they’d be riding on them instead. Bike infrastructure is the only way to actually change it for the better.
PoopIsAlwaysSunny t1_j0m6xzt wrote
Riders feeling safe is not an excuse to make pedestrians unsafe. Yes, improved infrastructure would help this, but even with that there would be dickheads who want to ride on sidewalks. I've seen people ride down thames st in front of the restaurants, as if that is safe or necessary when the promenade is on the other side of the street.
moderndukes t1_j0m7tnu wrote
I’m not saying they’re right or wrong, I’m explaining why it’s happening and what the solution is.
PoopIsAlwaysSunny t1_j0m99d8 wrote
I think DOT has a good potential solution, if you look at the video they linked. GPS that detects sidewalk vs street walking, notifies the rider and nearby pedestrians audibly, and I didn’t see this but hopefully shuts them down if continually ridden on sidewalks.
moderndukes t1_j0mbb0u wrote
You’re really not understanding me. Here’s the sequence causing this issue:
- People want to bike or scooter.
- People try on the streets.
- The streets don’t have proper bike infrastructure, people feel unsafe.
- People bike/scoot on the sidewalks where they feel safer.
- Pedestrians feel unsafe on the sidewalks.
You’re trying to solve the problem allllll the way down at step 5 and only for the pedestrians, when that doesn’t address what caused that to happen: the issue of bikers/scooter…ers feeling unsafe on the roads. The lack of proper bike infrastructure is the cause. The effect of not building it while banning them from sidewalks is people will just completely stop biking/scooting at all.
PoopIsAlwaysSunny t1_j0mne5h wrote
No, the cause is scooters thinking their convenience trumps the safety of pedestrians.
You’re the one trying to solve the problem by prioritizing improperly. If scooters don’t feel safe on the road, they can walk on the sidewalk. That’s a perfectly valid choice they have.
Making pedestrians unsafe isn’t an option.
I’d rather scooters be banned completely than ridden on sidewalks. They are dangerous to pedestrians and drivers.
moderndukes t1_j0mrcqu wrote
Dude what did bike lines do to you that you can’t even understand that I’m just saying “install bike lanes and the issue gets solved?”
> I’d rather scooters be banned completely than ridden on sidewalks. They are dangerous to pedestrians and drivers.
Ohhhhh you’re just a NIMBY about bike lanes, this all makes sense now.
PoopIsAlwaysSunny t1_j0mvbhx wrote
No, I want bike lanes everywhere. Hell, I want plenty of streets closed to cars.
But regardless of everything else, sidewalks have to be safe for pedestrians.
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