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[deleted] t1_iujm20m wrote

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explainlikeimfive-ModTeam t1_iujmfyr wrote

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JuliaX1984 OP t1_iujmezk wrote

I would like to know what, if any, explanation they give for how it works. Yes, I'm curious what mechanism is given for how magic spells produce effects. Do they really give none? Nobody asks them for one?

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FractalCurve t1_iujs5to wrote

Magic. You've said it yourself... I don't understand what more you think you're going to get.

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JuliaX1984 OP t1_iujupyw wrote

So do they have any reasoning for how they think they produce results?

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soundman32 t1_iujmb2p wrote

The same way than any voodoo nonsense works, as in, it doesn't work. It makes me sad that so called modern people have no idea that this kind of this is as much nonsense as Fortune telling, astrology or ghost hunting.

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JuliaX1984 OP t1_iujmt7m wrote

But what's their explanation for how it works? Why would anyone do it if they can't explain how they think it works?

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soundman32 t1_iujnfo9 wrote

If people believe it works then they have no need to question why the idea is unfeasible. In their eyes, it just works. Its like believing in a higher being, they don't need proof, just faith, despite incredible amounts of evidence to the contrary.

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CaucusInferredBulk t1_iujt92y wrote

So first off it doesn't work, unless you have VERY wide definitions of magic and "work". But there are several general patterns of belief. (to clarify, im describing all of the things below as they are believed, im not claiming them as fact or my personal beliefs)

  1. Just directly influencing the universe via willpower. This was what was advocated for by Aleister Crowley, one of the more seminal semi-modern western occultists. Parts of it were watered down to the point where some of his "spellbooks" said things like "I was hungry, so I went to the store and bought some food and ate it, and that was a spell, because my willpower made those things happen". But also he claimed things that we would more readily identify as "magic"

  2. Causing spirits/demons/genies/gods/etc to do work for us. Either by trading them energy/soul/value/sacrifice for them to do the work, or as a reward for worship or by enslaving them via some mechanism (or relying on a new or ancient contract/treaty)

  3. its "nature". Crystals just store energy. things have resonant frequencies. Just because people don't understand it doesn't mean its not real. Amethysts prevent drunkenness/hangovers (the word literally means "not-drunk")

  4. Hacking the matrix. The universe has rules, and tools, and you can sometimes usethem in ways others don't understand. This can sometimes evolve into actual science. Before people understood magnets, or electricity, or lots of pharmaceuticals, people were doing these things and calling it magic/alchemy. But sometimes its "god left behind some passwords (spells) and I figured them out".

  5. Sympathetic magic. If you really squint at this you could pretend its quantum theory. I do something to object A, and something similar will happen to object B with which its entangled.

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JuliaX1984 OP t1_iujuka1 wrote

Well, for example, by what mechanism do amethysts prevent drunkenness or hangovers?

What's the basis for the theory that crystals store energy?

By what mechanism does sympathetic magic cause something to happen to object B? How does the effect or energy get from A to B?

If this is real, why don't witches cast revenge spells on evil dictators or run a pro bono service to curse abusive partners or make people in poverty win the lottery?

If this is real, aren't revenge spells and love spells as bad as assault/battery and rape? No matter how attracted a person is to someone, it doesn't give a partner the right to override their right to make their own choices by influencing their mind.

I'm trying to reconcile people talking as if it's real with the way it's handled. Even if there's no scientific explanation, there must be a purported explanation of how it does what it does.

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CaucusInferredBulk t1_iujvd4b wrote

some things have slim basis in truth. Crystals do resonate and transmit energy. But believers give them attributes which haven't been proven out. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crystal_radio

How do entangled electrons communicate over vast distances? If you can answer that question you will be rich and famous for the rest of your life. But the fact that we can't explain it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I don't believe in sympathetic magic, because ive never seen it performed. But the fact that we don't know how it would work isn't necessarily sufficient argument against it.

Some of your questions there aren't really about how, they are exploring philosophy/morals. If magic were real, yes there would be crimes associated with love potions.

Why don't X do Y - Thats part of why people don't believe. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/may/12/new-york-psychic-arrested-zoe-fortune-teller

At a fundamental level its faith. And ignorance. But most people are also ignorant of the way their car works beyond the high level basics too.

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explainlikeimfive-ModTeam t1_iujmrep wrote

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