gamers need to understand that a criticism of a product is not a personal criticism of you as an individual

Submitted by speckledpotatocunts t3_10pq2os in gaming

Gamers act like any criticism of their favorite game is a personal insult against them or their family. I don't know where this crusader like fervor comes from, but it's ridiculous.

It's ok to disagree with critics, but too often people resort to viciously attacking any critics - and that's not even counting the "Bwah? You don't like my favorite game I've never played? RACIST. SEXIST. BURN THE WITCH!!!" type people who are a special breed of insane.

When I see someone say Elden Ring is boring or has bad gameplay or is too hard or whatever I don't feel personally insulted. I might correct someone if they are factually wrong, I might disagree or say like "I didn't personally see this" but like... that's it dude.

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Cliffbreaker-d t1_j6lu14h wrote

It's not just gamers that need to learn that.

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Cmdrdredd t1_j6lxk2q wrote

All sports fans lol

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Hbimajorv t1_j6lwx6g wrote

I'd say this works in reverse as well. I played and enjoyed gotham knights and saints row last year, but you couldn't talk about either of them here without 90% of the community telling you they are trash and you giving these companies money is part of the problem. People are allowed to like what they like for their own reasons. Humans really really like to portray themselves as individual thinkers but are so quick to fall into hive mind tendencies. Fascinating until it's dangerous.

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[deleted] t1_j6lsn1c wrote

that'll never happen, marketing departments are hacking your brain making you think your identity is associated with brand

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Jedi4Hire t1_j6lsqd4 wrote

Its not just gamers.

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fork_on_the_floor2 t1_j6m2lgq wrote

This was my exact thought. Go to a band subreddit and shit on one of their albums. Shit on somebody's favourite movie. Talk shit about how Breaking Bad or The Wire wasn't actually that good..

People hate criticism of the things they love, no matter how valid the criticisms may be.

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chandlerwithaz t1_j6ltt0f wrote

lol i can never defend kingdom hearts i know the story is really dumb, but i love it personally

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squarefan80 t1_j6lvqd7 wrote

the first kingdom hearts was legit incredible! the other 37 games were so collectively convoluted and unintelligible you need a fucking flow chart and cliffs notes to understand wtf was going on with any certainty.

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Milla4Prez66 t1_j6lx9o6 wrote

The first two were awesome and some of the best games Ive played as a kid. Then they made me wait forever for 3 and all my hype for it slowly withered away in time. Not to mention all the unnecessary handheld spin-off games that released on a different handheld device every time that helped make the plot even more confusing.

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chandlerwithaz t1_j6lxtww wrote

i agree that the spin off were unnecessary but some of my fondest memories of kh are from playing 358/2 days

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Milla4Prez66 t1_j6ly3am wrote

I have no issues with the quality of those games, it just annoyed me that we kept getting more of them instead of KH3 and that I had to buy a new handheld device if I wanted to play the new game all the time. I honestly really liked Birth By Sleep, but it was also like the only game I played on PSP.

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chandlerwithaz t1_j6o9boo wrote

yeah i do appreciate that the remasters out alot of the games on one system

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chandlerwithaz t1_j6lxqzl wrote

here is my opinion i think the first game is a very great concept and story, game play is eh. 2 was very good in gameplay and story got a little weird. the spin offs either have good mechanics, good story or good visuals. 3 was trying to do too much im still excited for the future and i still have to finish melody of memories.

my favorite in terms of story is 358/2 i think i have very fond memories of the game and it was the only one where i truly felt hurt. kh3 made me cry but it is because i was so happy to see my days trio

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ohtetraket t1_j6mtwpk wrote

>here is my opinion i think the first game is a very great concept and story, game play is eh.

Really? I think the gameplay was very fun not as deep and fun as 2s but still very solid foundation. You notice the age of the game immediatly but imo the only eh gameplay "feature" was the camera xD

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chandlerwithaz t1_j6o980h wrote

the camera and the platforming was not very thought out. and i believe warp gummi blocks were a final mix feature in the original you had to physically fly between every world. correct me if i am wrong there.

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Hbimajorv t1_j6lxsae wrote

I played everything you could on ps4 over the course of about 2 years recently (a couple missed games because missing hardware) and I couldn't really tell you what it was truly about. I'm not sure the devs know.

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ElAutismobombismo t1_j6nafzf wrote

I honestly don't know what the problem was, the story was pretty simple if you just played the games in order, like any story. at least until the one right before kh3, but people have been parroting the 'kh story' meme since kh2 and it baffles me.

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HowWeDoingTodayHive t1_j6nb1j9 wrote

I mean the combat mechanics are absolutely solid, and it looks really good, so there’s always that. I skipped like every cutscene in the 3rd game, had pretty much no idea what was going on and still had a great time.

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leashninja t1_j6m4spe wrote

Yeah I go on the Halo Story sub whenever I feel like angering a mob. They don’t know or see it that clearly, but they’ve extremely tribal there to the point they will personally attack you in groups over a opinion on a games story.

It’s a sports fan sub with mob mentality. It’s no wonder the state of Halo’s story has never been so bad. Their audience will fight to the last dorito to defend bad practice.

The culture there is when you can’t attack a well formed argument, you attack the person instead.

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speckledpotatocunts OP t1_j6m55qr wrote

Do they spam "SkiLL iSsUe" like a band of screeching inbreds? That's what happens when I criticize a game even if it's extremely easy and I've beaten it lol.

Such an asanine comment - even if I hadn't overcome the specific challenge, gameplay criticism is completely valid

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Astrojef t1_j6mc0b3 wrote

My favorite game can beat up your favorite game

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tea_snob10 t1_j6lts3h wrote

It has to do with the fact that we can't admit we enjoy what we enjoy for mundane reasons. It's okay to enjoy a bland open world with nothing to do like Forspoken or checklist open worlds like AC Valhalla. They're mediocre sure but no fan admits this because this means they enjoy mediocrity and that is an unacceptable thought, so self preservation kicks in and you get a less than polite reaction.

This isn't limited to games either, it applies to practically everything. I had a decent time with the Uncharted movie, it was absolute garbage, but I had a decent time nonetheless cause it was mindless fun. However I'd never recommend it to anyone cause I know it's like a 2/10 at best and is a waste of time. It's just that I personally on that day, didn't mind the movie being braindead and can accept that it was garbage that I had fun with.

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Sabetha1183 t1_j6lw0ap wrote

I never really understood the whole "just admit the thing you like is bad" mentality.

If I thought it was bad, I probably wouldn't like it. Granted I think people have a hard time understanding that even a 5/10 game is average(or supposed to be on a 10 point scale) and can still be enjoyable for what it is.

I'll play a game and think it was flawed but fun and give it a 6 or 7 but I wouldn't look at a game and go "I enjoyed that well enough, 2/10 it's garbage".

That would feel a whole lot like that 2/10 isn't actually based on my opinion of the thing, but rather some other arbitrary standard I've imagined for it.

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tangential_quip t1_j6lybly wrote

There are objective measures that can be looked at beyond one's subjective enjoyment to make an evaluation. For example, I like the movie Ultraviolet. But it's story incoherent, the CGI is horrible even for 2006, the acting is wooden, and by any standard of filmmaking it is a bad movie. Those aren't arbitrary measures. But for some reason I enjoy it as stupid mindless fun.

I don't need to justify my enjoyment of that movie by claiming it is "good" because it isn't. It is very possibe to distinguish between the overall merit of a game, movie, show, etc. and one's own subjective enjoyment of it.

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tea_snob10 t1_j6m05j7 wrote

It's not admitting it's bad, it's understanding that there are flaws and that those are the flaws that make other people dislike the game/book/song/movie/show. We don't accept that what we like or what we consider good, is flawed or has flaws as well.

Take RDR2 for example. I loved it. So did the critics, so did millions, but many gamers simply did not. Why? 'Horse-riding simulator'. Hearing this, the fanboys come running in defense of their beloved game, oh the characters, the narrative, the worldbuilding and the graphics. All true of course but what's also true is that you do in fact, spend half the time on horseback riding around. This is objectively true. And I, as a fan, can see why for some it just doesn't appeal.

>That would feel a whole lot like that 2/10 isn't actually based on my opinion of the thing, but rather some other arbitrary standard I've imagined for it.

It's not arbitrary, it's acknowledging that the flaws do in fact exist. You may not mind them at all and have a great experience but this does not take them away. You enjoying Forpsoken immensely thanks to the spell depth and combat does not take away from the fact that the open world is lacking. For you, that may not have been much of factor because you just don't care and therefore say it's a 7/10. Another person may hate Forspoken for exactly that reason and say it's a 2/10.

We take criticism for things beloved poorly because we hold them on a pedestal and deem them flawless in our eyes. Either I like a bland open world or you are wrong. Either I like the 'horse-riding simulator' or you are wrong. Either I like shallow combat system or you are wrong. You can enjoy things that you enjoy for the reason you enjoy them, but others won't for their reasons. The average person just doesn't have the self-esteem to like what they like despite all things which is why there's so much toxicity around media of all forms.

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Sabetha1183 t1_j6m7ucc wrote

If you're giving something a 2/10 and calling it garbage, that's not really just acknowledging the flaws anymore. That's just calling it bad.

There's also a difference between "I can see why somebody might not like this" and "this is a flaw of the game".

Sure we can say that RDR objectively has a lot of horse riding in it, but as to it being a flaw? Well, what happens if you think it's a flaw of the game and I think it wasn't merely tolerate but was actively a good part of the game that made it better?

Is one of us wrong? What exactly is the deciding factor in choosing who is wrong? If neither of us is wrong, then "just accept it's a flaw and you like it" feels like it kind of falls apart here.

That's what I'm getting at. Now granted a lot of people struggle to accept "People like different things, and some might think something you like is actually a flaw".

I think it also works both ways, and a lot of people struggle with the reverse: Some people might think something you think is a flaw, is actually a strength.

Ultimately at the end of the day people just ought to not care as much what random people on the internet think of the thing they like.

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speckledpotatocunts OP t1_j6ltyvf wrote

I guess I don't really believe in guilty pleasures, if you enjoy a thing that's cool regardless of if I like it or not. But conversely, I also think it's fine to dislike a thing everyone else seems to praise.

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tea_snob10 t1_j6lwta5 wrote

This a good worldview however objectively true (and untrue) things do exist as well.

Sekiro is another great example. The game inherently demands you master, not just learn, but truly master it's unique combat system. There is no grind for xp like previous souls games to bail you out and so lots of players embraced the challenge and finished the game and found an unparalleled sense of achievement, however others could not come to terms with their inability to master the combat and therefore began blaming the game for being 'too hard' rather than coming to terms with the fact that they were simply, at that point, unable to master the system.

I myself haven't beaten the game because of exactly this reason. It's far easier to blame something else than to accept your own inability or failure and work on it. It can't be, it just cannot be that I'm not good enough or that I couldn't get the combat, therefore its the games fault.

Edit : Spelling

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Lee_Doff t1_j6n9bxl wrote

the only thing bad about uncharted is that it wasnt a series.

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Longjumping_Hawk_951 t1_j6ndmwl wrote

Don't say "gamers" man... It's reddit. Reddit breeds festering pools of fucking hate. Fuck Reddit.

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Glass_Windows t1_j6m6yvx wrote

is this inspired by your last post on reddit?

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speckledpotatocunts OP t1_j6m74p8 wrote

Where people acted like Dicks, refused to accept mild criticism, cried "trolling" and "skill issue" and insulted me? Partially.

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Glass_Windows t1_j6m7ew1 wrote

yeah ik, that's why I answered your questions and tried to help you out, as the forest doesn't have much of a tutorial, which is a good and bad thing, Sons of the Forest comes out in 3 weeks and promises to be better than The Forest in Every single way

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speckledpotatocunts OP t1_j6m89p4 wrote

Honestly the problems were things that could be worked around but you shouldn't have to account for poor gameplay to get the full experience, know what I mean?

Like the game wants to be realistic but people have to understand you are controlling the game with a mouse or a controller. So the game needs to compensate a little for the degree of separation to help immersion and realism. I mention hitboxes a lot but they really do need improvement. I genuinely hope they fix a lot of those issues because I really do like the game, but it's frustrating. I find it's one of the few western horror games that's actually scary.

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Glass_Windows t1_j6m8z9w wrote

I mean if you don't like it, you don't like it, the sequel comes out in 3 weeks, so stay tuned for that, and is going to be better in every single way

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Noxeron t1_j6mf598 wrote

Instead of saying "this game sucks, it's boring, and too hard!", try "this game isn't for me, I don't find it interesting and the difficulty doesn't match my playstyle".

If you go on and say that games I like is objectively shit, you are wrong and should feel bad.

You can criticise all you want, but hopefully you realise that your thoughts are just your own opinions and people will disagree with you.

Tl;dr Just because you think a game is bad, doesn't mean it's bad.

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Uniquorn2077 t1_j6mg231 wrote

Games and hardware. Same same.

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Kohli_ t1_j6miao3 wrote

I would like to add that gamers should stop to pretend that a game is either perfect in every way imaginable or its trash entirely. I saw a lot of rants about modern games being trash with an old far cry game being the example for the best game imaginable while the later ones are just dogwater and the franchise should just die already. Honestly, what is wrong with this kind of gamers, i really enjoyed Far Cry 6 and those guys be like: "Trash, don´t play that game". same thing goes for assassins creed, i am currently playing valhalla and i like it, its a fine game. Sure there are always things that are not 100% but a game is not trash if thats the case.

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Snkr_connoisseur t1_j6mymka wrote

Some people genuinely believe that their opinions are the only “correct” ones

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moleman0815 t1_j6n0d2i wrote

You can criticise any Assassins Creed game from the bottom of your heart and make it the worst game ever made, i will still play it with a big smile on my face, because i like it.

It's the same for music. I like some bands that others hate, the music stays the same and i still like them, don't care.

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Lee_Doff t1_j6n8y0x wrote

you mean like even though i couldn't give a shit how muscley abbey is, i'm not allowed to hate her solely because she sucks...

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Virgin_saint99 t1_j6n9ln5 wrote

Depending of what they are criticising, they could directly be insulting the fan base for liking it. Like, games with lewd fan service would be the great example of it.

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asunamyag t1_j6nosnf wrote

Good grief, just say “I didn’t like [game]” and you get downvoted into oblivion. Unless you’re complaining about Breath of the Wild’s breakable weapons.

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speckledpotatocunts OP t1_j6npj64 wrote

Lol I got down voted for criticizing a single mechanic in a game I liked, it's insane

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ccg5058 t1_j6o6gl8 wrote

Congrats you get a gold star.

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HotPotatoWithCheese t1_j6p82lb wrote

It cuts both ways. You've got people who shit on anything no matter what because they've seen a Youtube "review" or because it's from a specific company. And then there are those on the other side that will act as if you offended their ancestors for criticising a game they like. Yet these hypocrites are the first to join the former group in shitting on a game if it's something they also don't like. You're an incel if you dislike TLOU2 and if you buy any EA games then you're a pebble brain and deserve to lose all of your money.

It is quite pathetic. It's like people these days have no clue what nuance is. What, you're telling me that you can think that TLOU2 was a very flawed game while having female friends in real life? how can this be? You can dislike EA as a corporation while appreciating aspects of a game they published? What is this witchery?

It's also quite astonishing how many people have such surface level knowledge of the gaming industry and cannot even seperate, for example, developer from publisher. But that is a discussion for another clock.

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Toby_The_Tumor t1_j6lx14l wrote

I've always taken that"dude" approach to my opinions and tastes. I knew several friends who didn't ever play the game, I can sum up most responses with "whaat? Man, that sucks, I wanted to talk about it"

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OddyTerra t1_j6mepuq wrote

Yeah agree. Elden Ring is crap only fun for misogynists.

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FrogQuestion t1_j6mla1u wrote

This comes from that not everyone is fully analyzing what theyre doing all the time. Sometimes they like game and want to like it together with others.

What youre deacribing OP is a more objective and logical way of looking at it, which is the ying to the yang that is just enjoying something and having good feelings. The latter of which isnt allowed on the internet anymore since we got fake intellectualism forced on us by political extremists on the internet.

Ive even seen people who think to notice i dont understand something about a game and feel the need to "correct" me on it, like the bad guy's intentions, or what a system is used for. These people disturb me in having my own experience with a game because they think their views are more important than me enjoying entertainment like i want to.

Nay the real problen here is that people like OP are afraid that these uninformed opinions will make their videogames worse, and casual. We've had very vocal opinions about casualization the last 10 years, but still many games come out that make the mistake of dismissing the experienced gamer, and focusing on the casuals. So it doesnt matter.

Chill out. Pamper the inexperienced gamers. Ask them what they like and dont like. Let them form their own opinion. Share their enthusiasm. In a way they are our little brothers and sisters. We should cherish them and their pure heartedness.

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MBlacki t1_j6ni8zk wrote

Just like the things I like or get out. Simple

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brian11e3 t1_j6ns3da wrote

I respect people's opinions that like RDR2, but people don't respect my opinion that I think it has a sup-par story and atrocious controls.

The double standard is hilarious.

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TheGreatMrHaad t1_j6lubfj wrote

I bet you weren't gaming in the early days of online multiplayer

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speckledpotatocunts OP t1_j6luu54 wrote

See that's the thing sport. I was. In fact I remember when games could first do online multi-player.

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Lee_Doff t1_j6n9rhy wrote

it was just as bad as the current days. 12 year olds screaming at their moms to fuck off. aint nobody got time for that shit.

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