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Sjuffaluffa t1_j4qqqmr wrote

There is more to be found just across the fjord. Seen several mysterious mounds around Breiliflakene.


[deleted] t1_j4rwuhc wrote



[deleted] t1_j4q1dyf wrote



apocolipse t1_j4romgl wrote

It's worth noting that's about 1000 years earlier than most sources of Old Norse writing, and even contemporary or slightly older than the earliest written Germanic language that we have comprehensive material on, Gothic (which we just have the Gothic bible, from around the 3rd - 4th century AD). That means the language written on it was likely proto-norse or proto-north-germanic, languages we can only guess at reconstructing.


Ferengi_Earwax t1_j4rhqrv wrote

But what does it say?!?!?! I hope it's like those other wooden notes they found that were preserved that was a wife yelling at her husband to come home from the tavern.


_inappropriate_puns_ t1_j4rneqv wrote

> Eight of the runes on the front face of the stone may be spelling out the name of a woman, according to Kristel Zelmers analysis. “The text possibly refers to a woman called Idibera and the inscription could mean 'For Idibera',” says Professor Zilmer. Other possibilities are that idiberug is the rendering of a name such as Idibergu or Idiberga, or perhaps the kin name Idiberung.


Ferengi_Earwax t1_j4rot3c wrote

Yes. This is good to include in the TIL. Those names certainly fit. I wonder if further excavation might fund cremation burials nearby if it's a prominent family name. Be much easier to find if multiple family members were cremated than if it was just one lady named ideberga.


Initial_E t1_j4so30q wrote

Now that we have the right answer, only wrong answers in this thread, please


Sometimesokayideas t1_j4rky0j wrote

Would be worth a small giggle if it's just "Thorsson was here, it was cold and windy"


Ferengi_Earwax t1_j4rl6qj wrote

"Thurkill went to Italy and brought back souvenirs"


huniojh t1_j4uqyis wrote

"We've been trying to reach you concerning your longboats's extended warranty"

Sorry, somebody had to do it. I don't even know if longboats were relevant for the period.


Ferengi_Earwax t1_j4vofmn wrote

Lol this is perfect. Longboats weren't there yet but they certainly weren't that far away in their evolution to becoming the iconic Longboat. They still had boats so it still works.


Seeker2211 t1_j4rr7lz wrote

Been reading a history of the Vikings. Did not know a huge amount of their wealth was slaves. And they believed fervently in magic, the best women were sorceresses.


KILLER8996 t1_j4ssbnt wrote

Yeah A huge amount of ancient wealth in general was slaves


imnotslavic t1_j4symle wrote

The slavs got their name because of what they were known for in late antiquity & early middle ages. They were often slaves for realms like the Abbasids and the Franks.


Termsandconditionsch t1_j4tlbo8 wrote

Not really. It’s an autonym from the same root as slovo (word). Most likely it worked the same way as for the Greeks - they split the world into those who could speak properly, and barbarians.

Theres a reason German is Niemcy (mute) in Polish and a couple of other slavic languages..


wolfy994 t1_j4uqr6u wrote

Yes, although it is possible or even probable that the word slave was derived from the word slav as slavs were the most common type of slave in that period.


GolemancerVekk t1_j4ul56w wrote

Also in languages with a sizable Slavic influence, like Romanian.


Seeker2211 t1_j4t28vb wrote

I had little knowledge of Viking culture / Kings / Empires. Did not realize HUGE numbers of slaves, just like roman empire.


imnotslavic t1_j4ta1zo wrote

Pretty much any Empire that has existed has utilized slaves, or slave-esque laborers through sharecropping or serfdom.


[deleted] t1_j4uewz0 wrote



christian4tal t1_j4ulanb wrote

You semi-jest of course but in doing so you also remove focus from the real slavery problems of today: Millions in Asia, Africa and the Middle East held in slave or slave-like conditions. Not to speak of sex-trafficking all over the world. Americans prisons are a minimal problem in this context.


One-Appointment-3107 t1_j4vnbw4 wrote

There’s an estimated 50 million people living in slave like conditions according to human rights organizations and the number is on the rise


pxl8d t1_j4s9omr wrote

The völva I believe they're called! The seeresses are so cool to read about


Seeker2211 t1_j4sdlgv wrote

In their world, magic worked, and worked fighter would DREAM of going into battle without at least a few charms and spells to bring victory.


And-ray-is t1_j4t0bjx wrote

Yes, but what was their definition of magic? You have to ask yourself that

Was it all just chants / rituals or was there real world applications. Like what they ate for nutrition or for hallucinations, meditation before battle and training etc. Would love to be a fly on the wall for those times.

Definitely not living in them


Seeker2211 t1_j4t2whn wrote

If you believe it DOES work ? You go and pay 12 silver coins to the "sorceress" lady puts a curse on your romantic rival...and you get the girl, however that happens, then didn't the curse work ?

If you don't get the girl, get a refund, right ? Fair is fair.


The_Human_Bullet t1_j4t710c wrote

> Did not know a huge amount of their wealth was slaves.

You didn't know this? Slaves have been a pretty staple thing throughout human history, only until very recently.


Rugbygoddess t1_j4ug3ub wrote

Wait til you hear about the industrialized prison system


Seeker2211 t1_j4vota0 wrote

"Industrialized prison system" in no way similar to viking slaves at all, but you keep spouting ignorant stuff...


Riplexx t1_j4ugou3 wrote

There are more slaves now, then ever in human history


RevolutionaryLook585 t1_j4uli73 wrote

There are also way more people now than at any time in human history.

If this this accurate and it's 2000 years old, then the population of the earth at that time was around and 200m.

It's a very misleading statement, but obviously modern day slavery is horrific and should be condemned and annihilated.


Riplexx t1_j4umq9r wrote

Millions in slavery don’t care that there are billiona of people. Their life is horror show.


Raudskeggr t1_j4ugisk wrote

But these were not "Vikings", lets be perfectly clear. This is from 600-800 years before the beginning of the viking age. The fact that this stone has runes (albeit crudly carved) suggests that whoever carved it was, or had close ties to, the Northwest Germanic people of the age; but much much earlier than the Norse culture romanticized in stories of Vikings.


Seeker2211 t1_j4vqk21 wrote

Agreed, my understanding is that viking "age" grew gradually during and after the decline of Roman Empire, and in fact a lot of the raiding happened 'cause the Roman "authorities" were lapsed/gone.


Idreamofknights t1_j4t4igv wrote

More than that. To use magic of spells, concealment and visions was the domain of women, it was seidr. Men who did that were dishonorable. Male magic was of battle, to embody a warrior spirit like the ulfhednar or to craft enchanted weapons.


Geiten t1_j4tv4ez wrote

I think that is too one-sided, and probably comes from the stereotype that viking society was mainly concerned with battle. Male magic was also communicating with dead relatives to keep them at peace and I believe controlling the weather.


RE5TE t1_j4txav3 wrote

> stereotype that viking society was mainly concerned with battle.

Viking society was preoccupied with plunder, not battle. If I remember correctly, farms were given to the eldest son, so as not to split them up. Lots of small farms can't feed enough people.

If you're not an eldest son, you need money to buy land. Norway in particular does not have a lot of settled arable land. So you join a group heading south to plunder.

Battle is not necessary, especially when you reach countries full of unarmed farmers. Vikings sailed up the river to Paris and essentially demanded a ton of gold and silver. If you're a fat farmer it was just better to pay them to leave. They were usually pretty good at leaving so it worked out for everyone.

Do you want to fight Sven who literally rowed across the ocean to cleave in your skull, or just pay him some money? Also Sven is 6ft tall and ripped, you are 5ft 5 and armed with a pitchfork.


Idreamofknights t1_j4txhbs wrote

I see the communion with relatives as more of a expression of religion, and I'm curious about the controlling weather part. But the part about spells and ritualized magic being the domain of women is true, both to heal and to curse. There were men who did magic, but they're shamed by their society as argr, dishonorable and unmanly, and even Odin himself is shamed like this because he uses it to see his visions, while his wife Freya is hailed for it. Magic is widely considered a very gendered concept in Norse society by many scholars.


[deleted] t1_j4r0wkw wrote



Beat9 t1_j4sjhia wrote

Congratulations! You have found a Runestone!


coachhawley t1_j4tzgya wrote

The amount of quarters I spent playing Gauntlet could pay for my kids college lol


Raudskeggr t1_j4uj0aa wrote

For those curious what the legible portion of it says, the runes spell out this (assuming phonetics consistent with the Elder Futhark it appears to be):

>I D I B E R U G

As the article speculated, it might be a name. But we don't know.

From the nice photograph at the top of the article, there is more carving on the stone, but it doesn't tell us a lot:

> I? Z B ? L A E

These letters probably don't spell out anything meaningful, at least in a literal sense. They could be intended for another purpose; they could be initials of names, they could be intended as "magical" (or have some other ritualistic/religious purpose), or they could just be complete gibberish.

I personally think the theory of it being a grave stone, naming the dead seems like the strongest explanation, as that does seem to be a name; though we cannot be certain even of that. The rest of it? We can only speculate.

But what it says on the runestone is not what makes this find most valuable; the age is the significant part. Finding an example of runic writing that far north, that early. We don't know much the development of runic writing; but this helps add to our understanding. IT most likely did develop from a north italic or etruscan script; We find some very old germanic artifacts using such scripts. But we have yet to find anything that might show us a transition from that to Futhark. previously we don't see anything that looks like north germanic runes earlier than 150; which would put this artifact right on that same cusp.


dragonflamehotness t1_j4ux969 wrote

Aside from the negau helmet what are other germanjc artifacts with italic inscriptions?


Raudskeggr t1_j52ilzp wrote

Not a lot. A couple of spearheads and a broach, as far as I know.


qleptt t1_j4sscvv wrote

An American here. We go to this farm every year for pumpkins and in the past years there has been this solid thing of quarts or marble slab that was literally just sitting on the side of a barn where the parking lot is and it was full of runes. A very weird thing but it wasnt there this year.


Hushwater t1_j4rqmye wrote

Did they find it in a hole or a place called Hole?


doctorcrimson t1_j4uaw2u wrote

Be cooler to find artifacts from the era of change over to more modern languages, like a Rosetta Stone for the Norse.


Linden_Lea_01 t1_j4udgsz wrote

What do you mean? Modern Scandinavian languages are directly descended from Old Norse, and Old Norse texts can be read and understood very well.


LateInTheAfternoon t1_j4uligh wrote

*fairly well. There are still a lot of conundrums. More to the point, the language here is not Old Norse but proto-Norse for which our knowledge is very limited partly due to the relatively few samples we have of the language, partly due to how much Old Norse has deviated from proto-Norse.


maanofculture t1_j4tl07l wrote

Honest question here. What exactly is a rune stone?


Frgty t1_j4u93r0 wrote

I'd say that's a reasonable assumption, and a good place to look for them.


pm_me_ur_demotape t1_j4v3vjc wrote

I am confused about it being possiby the oldest ever but only being about 2000 years old. Or I just don’t really know what runes are.


abdiel0MG t1_j4wmgli wrote

I wanna know the stats. I've been dying to upgrade my runes!


Ach_Du_Lieber t1_j4sz533 wrote

Well, I believe in Norway too. And I’m not even an archaeologist.


thecowintheroom t1_j4v2x6c wrote

I designed those bendy things, fjords they’re called. Quite nice fjords.


OldRuskiNoir t1_j4tu45w wrote

Was it a Ber? Maybe I can finally can make my infinity!


Akki_Fan t1_j4u4xru wrote

This is definitely the proof and evidence of my religion ~ every religious businessman priest ever.


jereezy t1_j4uirj5 wrote

Headline sucks. Archeologists believe...what exactly?

  1. That they found a rune stone?
  2. That it's in Norway?
  3. That it's the oldest?

WrestlingLeaks t1_j4skipu wrote

If they use GPS they can make sure if they in fact are in Norway or not


TargetOfPerpetuity t1_j4q1kr8 wrote

Being that it's lines scratched into rock, would it be difficult to produce similar runes today, and age them to look as old as these do?


ActivisionBlizzard t1_j4qopzb wrote

No, not at all.

But what would be difficult is finding a grave that’s two millennia old, putting your fraudulent runes tone into it and then covering it back up to the point that a professional archaeologist can’t notice.


booga_booga_partyguy t1_j4tpoc9 wrote

More critically, why would anyone invest that kind of time and effort to pull off a prank with little payoff?

Just gaining the expertise needed to carve the right kind of runes that are era appropriate alone will require at least the equivalent of post-grad level of knowledge.


Ephemeral_Wolf t1_j4ucq2u wrote

I imagine IF anyone were to go the trouble of something like this, it would be an archaeologist themselves looking for the credit of a big find?


booga_booga_partyguy t1_j4ug36a wrote

Possible, but again, way too much effort for relatively little tangible gain.


Ephemeral_Wolf t1_j4ug8dw wrote

"fortune and glory, doctor Jones"


booga_booga_partyguy t1_j4ugggo wrote

That flavour of archeologist would spend more time breaking half the artefacts in the cave to beat the Nazis to a particular find over wasting time creating an elaborate forgery.


LupusDeusMagnus t1_j4qqhj0 wrote

Not impossible, but it’s more difficult than you’d imagine, and the context of the finding would need to corroborate it.

Runes vary a lot geographically and over time, so if you find some runes that look completely different from the ones that you’d expect to find, it’s either a very strange carving or a forgery.


InspectorG-007 t1_j4rczus wrote

Ronald Weasley... It's, " Fus Ro DAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh!"