How to watch and analyse arthouse cinema?

Submitted by lonzosch t3_yi442v in movies

I’ve been trying to get more into arthouse cinema but it’s honestly hard to ever pin point whether or why I like or dislike a film. Like sometimes I’ll watch a film and feel like I should like it and then someone tells me it’s shit and then my opinion changes, or I’ll think it’s bad and someone will tell me it’s great and my opinion changes. So if anyone has any tips on watching and analysing arthouse cinema would be great.

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StabnShoot t1_iuh63ek wrote

Kinda depends on what you mean by "arthouse cinema" in this case.

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lonzosch OP t1_iuh66vb wrote

Anything. Character studies, art films with abstract imagery, those that more focus on expressing themes and ideas

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StabnShoot t1_iuh73xd wrote

I see films as an experience first and foremost. A film succeeds when it makes you feel the intended emotions.

When it comes to action movies or horrors it's easy enough to tell if they were good for you, but when it comes to more experimental films it gets trickier.

Funny Games isn't exactly what I would call a "fun" film, but it succeeds in making me feel like shit so for me it's a success.

Then again, it's not as easy as making an intentionally shocking film with the intention of shocking the audience.

Themes and craft are very important. The theme of a film is the statement it's trying to make, it's the voice behind the people who made it.

Conversely, some films don't really have a strong theme or any theme at all, but they still stand out due to how they're made, in terms of visual style, entertainment value, technical aspects etc. (a good example of this is 2018's Mandy)

But in the end, films are a subjective matter. The most important thing when you watch them is how much you enjoy them and what they tell you.

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No-Tune-868 t1_iuh80iv wrote

Not sure how important theme is. Every movie has one more and cant think of a movie ive liked cos of its theme.

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StabnShoot t1_iuh84h9 wrote

I don't want to sound mean but if you think a movie's theme isn't important then maybe you don't really like movies.

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To_The_Past t1_iuhneac wrote

That's tangible vs less tangible details. I never though about the editing in Bloody Sunday or Being There but those films wouldn't work without masterful editing.

The filmmakers commitment to themes determines so much of the mise en scene, editing, plot focus and motion, characterisation, acting choices, and more. You take the theme out of your favourite movies and you simply won't have the same movie at all.

What a film makes you feel and the parts that jump out to you as what you liked, and what made it work that way, are two very different angles.

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No-Tune-868 t1_iuhnuw6 wrote

Not sure ur addressing my point at all. Every movie has a theme. And lots of shit movies have the same themes as great movies. Fact.

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To_The_Past t1_iuhob85 wrote

Same only applies here in the absolute broadest strokes (like plot, lots of good and bad films with the same basic plots). How they develop and explore that theme is tremendously important to the film you get, in virtually every aspect of the film, and there are also other variables as well as theme.

Replace the basic themes in Blade Runner and you simply don't get Blade Runner. You get something completely different.

A lot of shit films have the same type of editing as good movies too, that's just a fact too. Doesn't mean editing isn't critically important to the movies you like working as they do.

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No-Tune-868 t1_iuhonay wrote

Then ur proving my point. I didnt disagree with how themes are explored affects quality. I disagreed that themes affect quality.

And of course if u replace themes ud get a different movie.

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To_The_Past t1_iuhp7gl wrote

>I didnt disagree with how themes are explored affect quality. I disagreed that themes affect quality.

I disagree that this is a meaningful distinction, let alone one that I proved. You said you're not sure themes are important - bad movies have the same basic themes as good movies, after all! My contention is that they are, and that bad movies have them too is a bad argument.

Bad movies often have the same basic editing or plotting as good movies too, but this doesn't mean editing or plotting are unimportant, that's a bad argument. Editing, plotting - and themes - and getting them right in the execution of a movie - are crucially important. Even if they're not the tangible things that jump out to you as why you liked the movie, they are crucially important factors that resulted in that end.

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No-Tune-868 t1_iuhq2vu wrote

Yeah i read what u said last time. No need to repeat urself.

Im still right and ur still moving away from the point onto editing and blah blah blah.

Sophistry at best.

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To_The_Past t1_iuixe0z wrote

I don't think you understand what either me or yourself are saying. Editing is used as an analogy that illustrates why your argument doesn't make sense. You're not right, you have decided that you have to be right but are unable to articulate your position coherently and have it withstand any scrutiny, and this is frustrating you. Have a nice day.

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BEE_REAL_ t1_iuh414i wrote

Criterion Channel has most of what's considered the greatest non-English language films of all time, as well as as a lot of the really old English classics. Criterion also has some writing usually about why those movies are considered great/important

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The_h0bb1t t1_iuh4yer wrote

It's a personal thing that you need to learn to embrace, and then try to explain. In the end it's all about being entertained. Did it entertain you? What about it entertained you?

Liking a film is often a gut-feeling. You probably like something before you can actually pinpoint why exactly. Take some time after a viewing to reflect on what you liked, which specific scene or moment, and what you felt exactly. There is still a grey-area where you might appreciate certain aspects of a film, but they fell short in some way.

Don't "ignore" other opinions. There is nothing wrong with being 'influenced' by other opinions. They can often teach you different insights. And if you really, really like something, you'll stick to that opinion no matter what. Ignore random user-reviews? Maybe. But if someone can explain to you in earnest why they dislike or like something and you'll agree with them, then there is nothing wrong with that.

I'd rather say that you'd read or watch critics who review movies from an honest and knowledgable perspective that can explain their opinions. They don't even have to be people you agree to about a film. Watch deconstructions. In-depth reviews. Honest takes on movies.

You'll learn how to express yourself about films that way and eventually really hone in on what you like. Which will change over time, and there is nothing wrong with that. But it's all about being entertained.

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coffeeNiK t1_iuhz6sh wrote

It sounds like a shitty answer but honestly - exposure and revisiting. Just watch as much as you can and try to think about what you did afterwards. Allow yourself to feel however (and that includes hating what you watched). You're not going to detect any changes if you're watching for it but upon revisiting something you hated the first time, you might find yourself enjoying it.

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UntidyBargain t1_iuk61et wrote

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with changing your opinion on a film based on talking with someone or reading essays. We can certainly appreciate art through our own internalization but it’s also wonderful to hear a different (and hopefully informed/intelligent) perspective. They can re-enforce our opinions and bolster confidence in our understanding or challenge us to re-examine. I love art essays and analysis.

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TheRealClose t1_iuh2l0o wrote

Don’t let what anyone else tells you influence your opinion. Then it’s not your opinion.

I love to watch movies as blind as possible, and just let myself be surprised by the story and the filmmaking aspects.

I recommend isolating yourself as much as possible so that your attention is immersed in the film. Make the room dark and silence your phone. This is why I love going to the cinema so much. It’s much easier to isolate and lose myself in the film.

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AnderHolka t1_iuhe9s7 wrote

I think your implied question is: how do you better articulate what you like about a film?

I have a few films in my favourites that are divisive. Morbius, Crimes of Grindelwald and Age of Extinction to name a few.

Morbius I like just for Matt Smith's character. I love fun, over the top villains.

Crimes of Grindelwald is in a similar boat. Moreso because it for me falls into that sweet spot of campyness.

Age of Extinction puts Optimus into the role of main character that the first 3 Bayformers films missed. It did so by giving him villains that challenged him personally. Galvatron (though he could have been booked better) especially because after 3 movies of Prime protecting Earth from Megatron, they revive him as Galvatron and choose him over Prime.

I feel like this type of analysis, even if it's just figuring out basic reasoning for why you like a movie will help you be more confident about the movies you like.

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cupofteaonme t1_iuhrsdm wrote

Best recommendation I can offer is to simply watch more and more films, try not to think too much, and let the emotions of them, or the images or sound or what have you kind of wash over you to the extent that you can. And then read, read, read. Look up serious criticism about film. Not Letterboxd or YouTube reviews, but actual criticism by great writers and thinkers like Pauline Kael, Andrew Sarris, Jonathan Rosenbaum, Melissa Anderson, etc. Read histories of cinema, too, especially various waves of cinema like the German Expressionist period, Italian Neorealism, the French and American New Waves, etc. You'll learn a lot, and it will all help situate you in the history of the medium, its evolution over time, what sorts of techniques filmmakers have attempts and why, and how receptive audiences have engaged with works in ways you might otherwise have missed.

If you can get the Criterion Channel, I also highly recommend that. They've got excellent curated collections of films, to help you dive into a certain actor, director, style, movement and more. Often with very good introductory videos by scholars to help get you started.

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lonzosch OP t1_iuhu5lh wrote

I’ve tried getting it but Criterion Channel is sadly unavailable in Australia, I do have Mubi tho if that’s something

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cupofteaonme t1_iuhuf0w wrote

Mubi is very much something! A ton of great films on there.

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GordonPompeii t1_iui6npb wrote

Read a variety of subjects pertaining to the art and artifice of cinema. Everything from the abstract, the technical, narrative theory & storytelling, screenwriting, but also read or watch interviews with people that work in and/or teach film (don't just limit yourself to writers and directors here), read/watch a variety of different film critics and essayists as well.

One of the worst pieces of advice I saw in this thread was to not listen to others, and I'll advise you to not listen to that. You'll gain invaluable perspective and insights exposing yourself to different viewpoints, you just need to make sure that those viewpoints are intelligent and informed (even if you disagree). Read from folks that are more lucid and intelligent than your garden variety 'critics' like Chris Stuckmann, Jeremy Jahns, 'Screen Junkies' and the like. In other words, you can and should learn from others, but they should have something more valuable to say than "this movie was cool", if your intentions really are to learn how to think about and analyze film beyond the surface. Obviously, stay away from the toxic asshats like critical drinker, nerdstalgic, mauler, etc.

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OldBobbyPeru t1_iuiayzn wrote

Take this free online course: https://ocw.mit.edu/courses/21l-011-the-film-experience-fall-2013/

Watch as many films as you can, and over time your understanding will improve as you become more film literate. When I did this, I got a lot of the films from my local library. I augmented each lecture by watching more than the two films assigned for each lecture. I immersed myself in film history, and soaked it all up, and it's still ongoing, although I've seen over 2,000 films since I started with the course.

You may come to find that you don't always agree with the consensus whether or not a film is 'great.' That's ok, in fact, that's good. Critical thinking is what's needed.

Film is a subjective medium, and everyone sees films through their own mind's eye and their own things that they bring with them. It's ok, and preferable to form your own opinions. As you get more film literate, you'll find it less important what others think of a film. All that matters is what it means to you.

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zimaskies t1_iuh2bee wrote

*analyze

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lonzosch OP t1_iuh2jde wrote

i’m australian

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zimaskies t1_iuh2vbg wrote

so?

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lonzosch OP t1_iuh2wlq wrote

so i spell different

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zimaskies t1_iuh2y29 wrote

Do you say colour or color?

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lonzosch OP t1_iuh2ysc wrote

colour

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zimaskies t1_iuh32b8 wrote

Alright mate, have a gday, about to cook on da Barbie

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Hudds83 t1_iuh3kxy wrote

I didn't take long for a serious discussion to derail into idiocy as usual

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zimaskies t1_iuh3qpl wrote

I like learning other peoples culture

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AnderHolka t1_iuhf4wl wrote

Australia has many cultures. First there's the Aborigines who have over 200 language groups. Then there's the British who arrived and set up the colonies.

Various other European countries added their bits when they arrived. And in the last couple of generations, many migrants from the rest of the world arrived.

So in terms of culture, there's a lot of diversity, but the main things to note are the beach (nearly all of the population live within 50km of the coast) and sport (footy [Australian Rules and Rugby] and cricket are the main sports.

Some also follow the Bushmen legends. Similar to cowboys, tales of early colonial life and lore. Ned Kelly is a noted figure.

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