Submitted by overdoing_it t3_y4l9oc in newhampshire
sunset at 5pm is closer than you think...
What ever happened to changing to Atlantic time or doing permanent daylight savings? There was some trigger law going around New England states that once we all adopted it we'd switch. Who's holding us up?
I'm not a fan of the time change, but if you look at the map on this page,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daylight_saving_time_by_country
In fact, there are lots countries that are far from the equator, whether north or south, that do in fact change time by season. So I don't think that aligning with the rest of the world is a good argument to make.
A bill passed the Senate. It is pending in the house & if it passes and the President signs it…Then it will be the last time we “fall back”. Next day light savings when we “spring forward” (March 12, 2023) will be the time moving forward from there.
I didn't know that until today... cool I hope it passes.
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Daylight savings is an outdated concept. Stemming from farm work and war time work hours. It's ridiculously outdated. All it does now is effect mental and physical health.
Same I fucking hate the sun setting at 4:30, I struggle enough with 5 months of sub 40 temperature nevermind leaving work to darkness
I work 10’s. Starting November I’ll see sun on days off and breaks until February. Cue SAD
You are thinking of the Sunshine Protection Act! It has not passed in the house yet. You can track progress on congress.gov
Good questions & who opposes this? why are they against it (bc surely not good points)? And do they ever talk to their constituency? I literally have never met anyone who likes the time change!!! Have anynof you???
The only argument I've seen is around sunlight and sunset times in the winter. There would be some places that would have a sunrise until almost 10 am and sunset would be around 8 pm. Personally I'd be okay starting work in the dark.
The bill for permanent daylight savings was passed by the Senate, but the house has made no moves to talk about passing it too - if it does pass, it takes effect in November 2023
Probably the only thing Marco and I agree on.
I feel that like every other civilized country Iceland we should end DST and never start it again.
Have you looked at a map lately? North America, Europe, and a few other areas still have DST. South America, Africa, Asia do not. So as far as civilized, as in first world countries, you are wrong
Well, shit, apparently I had some bad information, thanks. (Still think we should boot it tho)
I had to check myself, so no harm done.
I think I was reading something about how the EU was standardizing it a while ago, and my brain decided to keep thr "EU removes differing DST standards" and forgot the "creates single DST standard" part.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daylight_saving_time_by_country
The map there would make your selections of what you consider a civilized country somewhat unique.
Of course, when Gandhi visited England and was asked what he thought of Western civilization, his reply was the he thought it would be a good idea. But I think that the reason that Europe has seasonal time changes and India does not has more to do with the latitude then the level of civilization.
The correct solution to this on going problem is to stop switching to and from daylight savings and stick to standard time. This video is an oldie but a goodie in how it covers the litany of problems associated with swapping back and forth. DST Explained
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Agreed keep DST.
As someone who has lived in New England their entire lives, no, we fucking don't. Not one single person I know wants it to be dark at 3:30 in the afternoon.
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It gets dark later in the summer, not the winter. We're on standard time in the winter, summer is the adjustment.
A lot of people also don’t understand why standard time is better for all of society, they just like having more light after work.
Separate questions:
Should we switch every six months? and, if not,
Which one should we stay on.
The second question is location specific. What's ideal for a state near the eastern edge of a time zone is different from what's ideal for a state at the opposite edge.
Switching is not healthy for our bodies, it should remain standard all year. Longitudinally, it's not much of a difference. Latitude differences are more pronounced between the seasons.
You seem to have missed the point of my comment. Because switching is not healthy on our bodies, you should argue for keeping it the same all year. Then separately, there's the question of which time zone it should be on.
The idea that longitudinally it's not much of a difference doesn't make sense. That's the reason that we have time zones, and normally, from one edge of a time zone to the next it makes exactly 1 hour of difference, which is exactly the size that we're talking about. And in fact, the Eastern Time zone extends over a little bit longer east to west difference than that.
There are legitimate arguments for what you are advocating, if you slow down and think through them carefully you'll have a better time convincing other people.
>You seem to have missed the point of my comment. Because switching is not healthy on our bodies, you should argue for keeping it the same all year.
That's literally what I wrote:
>Switching is not healthy for our bodies, it should remain standard all year.
The OP is not making an argument for time zone demarcations, they're arguing for retaining daylight saving all year. You'll always have variations between the farthest edges of one zone to the opposite edge of another. You'll also have a 1 hr difference between two areas right next to each other. There's simply no way around that.
The OP's argument would affect areas of different latitudes most significantly.
>>You seem to have missed the point of my comment. Because switching is not healthy on our bodies, you should argue for keeping it the same all year. > >That's literally what I wrote: > >>Switching is not healthy for our bodies, it should remain standard all year. >
The difference between those two is exactly what I said it was. You included the word standard. You might have a reason to prefer a standard time over daylight savings time, but avoiding switching is doesn't tell you which time zone you should prefer.
>The OP is not making an argument for time zone demarcations,
I know, it was you that said that longitude doesn't matter which is simply absurd.
> You'll always have variations between the farthest edges of one zone to the opposite edge of another. You'll also have a 1 hr difference between two areas right next to each other. There's simply no way around that.
Yes, but the abrupt change between adjacent areas and different time zones was not the issue I raised. > >The OP's argument would affect areas of different latitudes most significantly.
I think in this sub we're talking about New Hampshire. The difference in latitude from one end to the other is not much. The difference in longitude isn't much either, in fact the whole state is quite far to the east within it's time zone. Which is why it's interesting to consider either permanent daylight savings time or standard time and joining the Atlantic time zone for New Hampshire.
Thought it was pretty clearly implied standard meant daylight standard time but ok
People that advocate for daylight saving all year usually don’t see the forest for the trees. They don’t consider how it would impact the rest of the country, time shifting doesn’t operate in a vacuum and only affect NH. Sunset isn’t until almost 10pm in parts of the PNW and upper Midwest, it’s so weird going to bed with the sun still up and then it rises late in the morning. Then factor in world times and it’s more of a mess
Anyways this has sucked up more time than I care about it lol
> Thought it was pretty clearly implied standard meant daylight standard time but ok
<sigh>. There's no such thing as "daylight standard time". There's standard time and there's DST = daylight savings time. In other case, you missed the point of my comment, which was to separate the choice between those two, and the choice of whether or not to switch twice a year. Regardless of which you thought you were specifying, you were not saying the same thing as I was.
> People that advocate for daylight saving all year usually don’t see the forest for the trees. They don’t consider how it would impact the rest of the country, time shifting doesn’t operate in a vacuum and only affect NH. Sunset isn’t until almost 10pm in parts of the PNW and upper Midwest, it’s so weird going to bed with the sun still up and then it rises late in the morning. Then factor in world times and it’s more of a mess
If NH moves to the Atlantic time zone that is not going to affect the PNW and Midwest. I sure am glad that you see that your time here is wasted.
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His second point is not the topic from the OP, not to mention it’s irrelevant
The daylight is the same amount whether there are timezones or not... It just moves the daylight earlier or later in the day.
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Standard time for the win. Didn’t we try permanent DST several decades ago, and after a couple years collectively decided DST is awful year-round?
New England needs to move to Atlantic Time.
I thought it’s happening next year. Didn’t senate already pass and waiting for Biden’s signature?
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Really? Why is the house holding up? Wasn’t support unanimous in the Senate?
Fucking politicians.
Personally, I agree, but then again, I know people who have to go to work earlier in the morning than I do and really hate having the morning commute in the dark. I think the bottom line is that they're simply is not enough light to satisfy everyone in New Hampshire in the winter. I'm certainly in favor of workplaces having flexible hours, when that's feasible, so that people can choose to drive home while it's still light, if they want to.
Yeah it's not going to please everyone with every schedule.
Daylight savings seems pretty useless though, changing the clocks twice a year. It used to be shorter and we'd fall back in October, then they extended it. Plenty of countries and some US states don't do it at all and just use the same timezone all year.
No way the House touches this until after the midterms. Maybe in the lame duck? Call your Congressperson.
Going to Atlantic would make sense, but also be an enormous pain in the ass. In an increasing volume of remote workers, 4 time zones is enough thank you
It’s closer to reality than in the past, but still hasn’t been approved.
I’ve been experimenting with the thought of “it’s not even dark until 8!” to encourage myself to still do activities until I would during the lighter times of year. Before you know it, it’s actually a true statement! Plus sunset still has dusk light after for a bit so “dark till 8” is also not super far off. Maybe I’m just crazy but I liked the spirit of it the past 2 winters. Maybe it helps someone this year :)
Nor an I. I was under the impression the decades long effort to get away from Daylight Saving (no S) Time was gaining traction and perhaps we’d do away with it. However, it seems we’re no closer to ending this ridiculous, arcane practice than we have been.
Yeah gets dark early enough as it is. What a fail. More light at the end of the day actually prevents accidents and its safer for everyone. Their are old people that need all the light they can get to even drive. Not to mention all the lights being kept off an extra hour saves energy as a whole.
Lol as if this shithole country can do anything anymore besides send more blank checks to the fucking Ukraine.
Username checks out.
I actually welcome it!
Quieter evenings, dark nights to enjoy under the stars, less pressure to do more after a day at work of doing more, no need to start your day in the dark. After a summer when it stays light until 9pm, it's a nice break and feels right for the colder weather.
I’m weird too! I won’t stop working when there is daylight available.
Pretty sure that takes more of a toll on my physical and mental health than a clock being set back an hour.
So because some self consumed dips don't like it when they get out of work at 5 and it is dark outside we need to change time zones? What about those who work earlier or commute earlier and are in the dark longer?
Just grow up and deal with the changing of the seasons and concentrate on something more important. Which is pretty much anything
Time is pretty important. With permanent DST our latest sunrise would be around 8am instead of 7am, and earliest sunset of 5:30pm instead of 4:30. Supposedly it would help reduce accidents with less people driving in the dark.
Also no need to change clocks twice a year would be nice
lol this just shifts the dark commute to the morning instead of the evening.
I’m also guessing you don’t have kids who’d have to get to school in the dark.
I had to get on the bus in the dark when I was in school, at like 6:45am. It wasn't a big deal... it was light out by the time we arrived. It still would be with permanent daylight savings, but just early dawn.
So because you had to get to school in the dark makes it right? And what about the kids that walk or ride bikes?
I used to drive home from work in the dark, it wasn’t a big deal. See how your argument can easily be flipped?
I think very few kids in NH must be walking or riding bikes to school, especially in the winter which is the only time we're not on daylight savings time (Nov-Mar).
Maybe in some of the cities but those usually have street lights too.
But you want it daylight saving time all year, so while it’s more pronounced in winter, it also affects fall and spring. It should be standard time all year.
Standard time all year would have sunrise at like 3:30am in the summer and set at 8. We're over an hour ahead of Ohio and other western parts of the Eastern timezone for sunlight. So yes, DST all year or Atlantic time without daylight savings, it would be the same thing other than naming.
It would be 4:30 at it's earliest, and yes, that's early, but that's just how it is this far north. What you're also not considering is this doesn't just affect NH, it's everyone globally in each zone.
Civil twilight starts 4:30am in late June which is about the time people would say it's getting light out. Actual sunrise is 5am by which time it's fully bright.
But anyway if the compromise was no more daylight savings but standard time all year, I'd still take it to avoid the clock changes.
So if there is standard time all year you do realize that in the Spring you will have 4am sunrise, meaning as well the little birdies will be singing earlier which many people, not myself, do not enjoy.
School hours are physiologically stupid. See: getting kids out of bed before 8AM on weekends and vacation. Most parents aren’t home at 2PM necessitating daycare.
Geographically, we belong on a different time zone than Tampa FL.
School hours are stupid in America, but not for the reason you mentioned. 😂
CobaltRose800 t1_isf6xz5 wrote
Supposedly the Senate passed a bill making daylight savings permanent in 2023, but the House hasn't taken it up. Personally I'm for getting rid of it altogether, if only to get on the same page as the rest of the world.