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heidismiles t1_j9pz00j wrote

>Mr Eastman asked the experts how they would respond to what he said was
an argument that "in the case where child abuse is fatal, obviously it's
not good for the child, but it's actually a benefit to society because
there aren't needs for government services and whatnot over the whole
course of that child's life?"



>"The outrageous accusation that somehow I and members of my district
support the extermination of people or support child abuse when I've
staked my entire political career arguing for the opposite is not
acceptable in this body," he said.


If you didn't want to be accused of saying those horrible things, then you shouldn't have said those horrible things. 🧠


9035768555 t1_j9q3zq7 wrote

Why don't they seem to get this? My father is still boycotting coke because he thinks they were mean and told him he was racist a couple years ago.

If you want me to believe you aren't racist, maybe you shouldn't have told me shit like if I ever came home with a black boyfriend to not bother coming home.


InsuranceToTheRescue t1_j9q4lln wrote

These people fail to realize that 99% of the time a statement starts with, "I'm not racist, but . . .", that it's racist to begin with. Non-racist statements very rarely, if ever, need a qualifier explaining that they're not.


aecarol1 t1_j9qc0yi wrote

I'm not racist, but hearing the laughter of playing children makes me smile.


amibeingadick420 t1_j9qiqlx wrote

Why all the hatred towards mute children that are incapable of laughter?


MoonChild02 t1_j9rozjl wrote

Not just mute children, but children who physically can't smile, like those with Moebius syndrome.

That was a huge story when I was a kid. IIRC, Michael Jackson helped Chelsey Thomas's family pay for her surgery, and the Ronald McDonald House Charities helped her family out, too.


submittedanonymously t1_j9r5ngf wrote

I’m not racist or nothin…. But Dualie drivers that roll coal are assholes.

Hey, this is a fun trend.


mces97 t1_j9r48g3 wrote

Someone did that to me the other day. Saw a post and somehow it got back to Jews. And this guy kept saying they. I tried to explain why it's wrong to say they. And he said, I'm not antisemitic, two of my good friends are Jewish.


Xaxxon t1_j9ru4zb wrote

“I’m sorry but…”

You’re not sorry.


Rs90 t1_j9qd1nh wrote

Because they believe others feel the same but are too afraid to say it. That's what people meant when they talked about Trump and the GOP emboldening these kinda people. They genuinely believe everyone WANTS to say it out loud but are afraid people will "be a bummer a bout it".

Everyone has dealt with people like this. As a Virginian and a male I certainly have. I've had men come say some sexist shit to me only to act all pissy the moment I tell em I won't have that kinda talk around me. Same with racists. Come up and say some shit just to get all butthurt when they realize I'm not a racist fuckstick just cause I'm Virginian.

These people wait til they feel safe then show their true colors. Not cause they believe they're wrong. But cause they believe YOU will think it's wrong and make a thing out of it. Which I will til the day I die.


thraelen t1_j9qpqox wrote

My husband experiences this all the time. I’ve never heard his dad or brother say anything bad, but when I’m not around, he comes home and tells me all the terrible stuff they say. He constantly tells them he doesn’t agree and that it’s super wrong, but they just keep doing it. If they know they should censor themselves around me, they clearly know they are saying vile things.


Rs90 t1_j9rkfik wrote

Sorry to hear it. My father was the kind to take me to bars as a kid to flirt with bartenders and say shit like "woof, look at the tits on her". So I know the types. Took me a long time to shake it off and speak up about it. It sounds like it really bothers him too. I hope he finds a way to broach the subject someday but I know not every battle is worth fighting.


DarkWasp14 t1_j9rxbe3 wrote

I’ve personally ended relationships with people over this, it becomes a boundaries issue since they can’t stop bringing up terrible subjects. If they know it makes him uncomfortable and they keep doing it, I wouldn’t blame him for wanting to spend less time with them.


mces97 t1_j9r438b wrote

Because he thinks it's a good thing when children die of abuse.

When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time. - Maya Angelou.


MoonChild02 t1_j9rrgy1 wrote

I didn't know that was a Maya Angelou quote. I've heard it for a long time, and thought it was just one of those quotes passed around by civil rights organizations. I had no clue it was Dr. Angelou who said it. Thank you for naming who said it.


mces97 t1_j9rro4k wrote

No problem. 🙂

Looks like we both learned something today. I had no idea she had a PhD. I always knew her as Maya Angelou. Never heard the title doctor when people spoke of her.


MoonChild02 t1_j9rykc6 wrote

She had over 50 doctorates. They were honorary, but she definitely deserves the title for all the work she did. She even taught both guest classes and semester-long classes on civil rights and writing at a few universities.


mces97 t1_j9s59h4 wrote

I must be honest, I knew very little about her. I just always liked that quote. I knew she was big on civil rights.


washington_jefferson t1_j9q7l2g wrote

Your dad should track down the ad team at the ad agency that came up with the commercial. Maybe a Coke marketing exec as well. For Coca Cola itself, it’s time to move on.

Hell, I think people got “mad” at Pepsi foe when they did a Super Bowl ad where Kendall Jenner hands a cop a Pepsi to “smooth over” police brutality. So, maybe your father shouldn’t drink Pepsi either?


DerCatrix t1_j9q9q1u wrote

People did get mad but that’s cuz the ad was tone deaf as hell


9035768555 t1_j9qi723 wrote

My father doesn't care about police brutality.


walkandtalkk t1_j9q5w66 wrote

I listened to his comments. I did not listen to 30 minutes of context, but I considered his tone of voice and the fact that he doubled down after a clearly shocked person in the room asked him to repeat his comments.

He was not simply playing devil's advocate. He wasn't just paraphrasing some opponent's argument. He was suggesting that the position was correct: That fatal child abuse is better than severe but non-fatal abuse, since the latter will cost the state money in lifetime therapy and medical care.


CheeseStandsAlone262 t1_j9qu8cc wrote

That's exactly the calculation that insurance companies make though. I work as an internal auditor and I've audited an insurance company. Cases where the patient almost died but then lived a long time afterwards by far cost the most money.

But holy shit, that's the sort of thing you bury in a comment on like the seventeenth sheet of a government budget Excel spreadsheet. Not say in a public meeting.

But perhaps most importantly, it's also not supposed to be an argument for killing those people, holy fuck


walkandtalkk t1_j9qv5e2 wrote

One would also hope there's a difference between the actuarial considerations of an insurer and the priorities of a lawmaker.


DefinitelyNotAliens t1_j9r65p4 wrote

There's been some studies that show preventative care costs more in some instances, because memory care and drawn out end of life care is more expensive than people dying early of massive heart attacks. Like, a healthy person with Alzheimers is hella expensive, y'all. My grandma was super healthy and literally the only thing wrong with her for the last 20+ years of her life was Parkinsons. She cost someone a whole lot of money.

That isn't a reason to cut preventative care. Also, there's the argument it doesn't actually cost more because increased productivity in their healthy years and things like adults may have been caring for them in other situations in lieu of work, etc.

Still, 'it's cheaper if they die quickly at 68 and not at 96 years old after nearly 25 years of Parkinsons care' isn't an excuse to not give people good healthcare. It just means we need to plan for aging populations and allocate funding for it.

And if preventative care leads to longer lifespans, the government needs to change pension allocations because the average pension is drawn on for 18 months. My grandpa draw for like 40+ years. They may need to plan on longer retirements, not advocate for people to die.

Just because those numbers are there doesn't make them a cost-savings suggestion.


ScienceLivesInsideMe t1_j9rwwru wrote

Not a chance. When you have every poor person in the country using the er as primary care, and then when they go onto renal failure stay on dialysis, or having heart attacks and living on a vent for 20 years. No way.


MidLifeHalfHouse t1_j9qevf8 wrote

Ironically, this would be a perfectly accurate and reasonable statement if phrased:

>"in the case where child abuse is fatal, an unwanted “child fetus” is aborted, obviously it's not good for the child, but it's actually a benefit to society because there aren't needs for government services and whatnot over the whole course of that child's life?"

But I guess it is more moral to wait until a child is born and then beat them to death which will obviously be on the rise with more people having kids they don’t want and thus abuse.

Party of “family values” indeed.



zsreport t1_j9qcayu wrote

I bet this guy is also very anti-choice and applauded the Dobbs decision.


MidLifeHalfHouse t1_j9qfv83 wrote

That’s what bothers me the most is his lack of self awareness of it all. If tax money is the most important thing to him and most Republicans, make abortion more accessible so dependence on public aid would decrease, not to mention future incarceration.

When I say this to conservatives their usual response is “why should I have to pay for someone else’s kid?” Lol. Basically “I want everyone to do what I say without me having any consequences” they say as they accuse women for needing to “suffer consequences” for having sex.


Pure-Kaleidoscope759 t1_j9rez2b wrote

It’s not about the sanctity of life. It’s about punishing women for sex and poverty.


smitrovich t1_j9sofsa wrote

> I bet this guy is also very anti-choice and applauded the Dobbs decision.

It's almost like being "pro-life" has nothing to do with protecting life and everything to do with controlling women.


EasterBunnyArt t1_j9qjfl5 wrote

Devil’s advocate:

While he is technically correct that a dead child does save the taxpayer money, why stop there? Why not just remove all government support and taxation the . Let people fend for themselves?

Oh wait, we are supposed to be civilized and care for each other….. that awkward moment when you publicly reveal your contempt for human life is awkward…..


Valyrian_Kobolds t1_j9qkk2p wrote

It doesn't save money though, people produce more in value than they take on average. That's kind of how productivity works.


EasterBunnyArt t1_j9qmq1s wrote

I mean, tell him that. Clearly he believes in magically productivity….


ScienceLivesInsideMe t1_j9rxd8c wrote

These people believe on literal supernatural fairy gods. They are not living in the same reality as many of us


Astrium6 t1_j9qsk9i wrote

Clearly the most effective method of reducing government spending is omnicide.


Danivelle t1_j9q71y6 wrote

That is utterly disgusting! What is wrong with this fool?!?


rubyblue0 t1_j9ptyz4 wrote

So, what’s his point? That murdering children isn’t so bad because it saves tax payer money, so let’s be more lenient on child murderers?


Grogosh t1_j9py1gc wrote

His point is his stance on doing nothing to help children is cost effective in multiple ways


ThrillSurgeon t1_j9stgdx wrote

Often, profit determines behavior.


cedped t1_j9tea0b wrote

That would be the case if humans were logical and not emotional beings. We often go to significant lengths and lose a shitton of money and resources just to fuck with someone we hate. What you also refer to by profit is basically greed.


ItIsYourPersonality t1_j9u0mww wrote

What’s the point of having any government at all if we’re just going to let capitalism decide policy. Just let the free market do it at that point, we don’t need politicians.

I’d rather politicians do their job, but if that’s too much work for them we can just eliminate their jobs.


finnlaand t1_j9v41w6 wrote

If that child grows up working and paying taxes its an even better investment.


Jonruy t1_j9qx979 wrote

He was trying to take a swipe at abortion, he just did so in a way that was so bad that even all the other Republicans aged to censure him.

If you start at the position that an unborn fetus is indistinguishable from a child, then an abortion is the same as fatal child abuse. Therefore, if abortion can be pitched as something that saves welfare policies by not having to pay for unwanted children, then so can infanticide. Checkmate, Atheists.


overlyambitiousgoat t1_j9s9xtb wrote

Thank you! I was trying to figure out where in the hell he thought he was going with that line of argument.


gravescd t1_j9uvxa3 wrote

I would 100% believe that a Republican lawmaker came out as pro-child murder. It's really not a stretch anymore.


Nithorius t1_j9t1wr8 wrote

The argument makes no sense because even if it was the case that fatal child abuse is a benefit on society, there are no policy prescriptions that could come from that. If you leave abusers alone and they don't end up killing their kid, well now you have more potential criminals to deal with (because children who are abused don't tend to turn out well), and that also has a cost.

Not to mention the fact that someone who is fked up enough to kill their child when they could just abandon them instead (which is also illegal but not as bad) is probably a threat to society in many other ways.


Sinhika t1_j9uxdhf wrote

Instead, he came out sounding like a Nazi, confirming to all but deluded MAGA-hats that the Republicans have gone completely off-the-rails fascist and literally espouse genocide.


Pulguinuni t1_j9tjpfo wrote

He’s been an anti-choice advocate for years, is not the first time he’s been censored. Apparently he was tryin, and has in the past, to compare abortion with child abuse, his intention backfired and never got his whole point across.

He is an awful human being.


SpaceTabs t1_j9tsb1w wrote

He probably saw the huge list of reports on child maltreatment in Alaska native communities and said not my constituents.


Squez360 t1_j9psih3 wrote

He said the quiet part out loud. Republicans only cares if the baby is in the womb, but after that they dont give a shit


FaustsAccountant t1_j9q0f0a wrote

The last paragraph in that article

“Mr Eastman, who is from Wasilla, became the first Alaska House member in history to be censured over a separate incident in 2017, when he claimed some Alaskans tried to get pregnant to take advantage of travel funded by the US health care programme Medicaid for medically necessary abortions.

"You have individuals who are in villages and are glad to be pregnant, so that they can have an abortion because there's a free trip to Anchorage involved," he told Alaska Public Media at the time.


Bellsar_Ringing t1_j9qc7uj wrote

I couldn't help wondering if "individuals who are in villages" is racist code for Alaskan natives.


bubblegumdrops t1_j9qb9ao wrote

Now I’ve never had an abortion but from my understanding it’s definitely not worth a free trip to Anchorage.

If I didn’t try to joke about people like him I’d be banging my head against the wall 24/7.


MeatsimPD t1_j9q3co5 wrote

They don't care about the baby in the womb, they will provide and actively deny medical care to pregnant women.

What they want is to control people and to drive their ideology to such extremes as to create a canyon between themselves and the rest of America. Extremists are easier to control, they don't engage in critical thinking, they don't question, they believe and they do as they are told


walkandtalkk t1_j9q6kxf wrote

The core of the "pro-life" movement—maybe not the lay activists, but the true theocratic ideologues who push it—is not concerned about the fetus or baby itself.

They believe that God decides when life and death occur, and that, by permitting abortion, people are overruling the will of God. It is about defending God's prerogative over life, not about defending lives.

Hence, if a child dies an hour after birth, fair enough. God willed it. But aborting the child before birth, despite knowing it would die? That's interference.

Once you consider that the religious far-right's abortion activism is grounded in a specific reading of the Bible, and not in concern for the individual fetus or child, it makes much more sense.


miryang_miryang t1_j9qqia2 wrote

More power to them but it sure made things awful for my wife and I when she needed one for medical issues last year and we had to drive across two states to get to safe clinic.

That’s what pro choice literally means. Infuriating.


Permit_Responsible t1_j9pvi45 wrote

Not enough. Disgusting. And then his follow up question after already being told the loss of a child is immeasurable was “does that $1.5 million get higher or lower depending upon the age at which the child is killed?” WTF is wrong with some of these people.


UncannyTarotSpread t1_j9pzpqv wrote

He’s a member of a death cult that worships Mammon?


KpcAu t1_j9q1xnl wrote

The death cult that worships money, more like

Edit: ok Mammon=money please spare my inbox


fsr1967 t1_j9pvsjp wrote

What a complete and utter piece of shit.


FizzgigsRevenge t1_j9rhaor wrote

Give it five years and this'll be mainstream GOP opinion.


fsr1967 t1_j9rjt12 wrote

That's horrifying. And likely true.


ITriedLightningTendr t1_j9tq855 wrote

"let old people die for the economy" is already a thing


Sinhika t1_j9uxmuh wrote

Fucking Nazis. There's a lot of Republican politicians that need punching, it seems like.


mewehesheflee t1_j9psqk5 wrote

When people show you who they are, believe them.


o_MrBombastic_o t1_j9pxrfh wrote

Not even the first time he's been censured for morally repugnant remarks he'll get reelected like last time


loverlyone t1_j9pqw9k wrote

And is he pro forced-birth?


ramot1 t1_j9pv2g8 wrote

He is a republican, so yes.


FaustsAccountant t1_j9q0s76 wrote

Kind of..? Last part of the article, he thinks women in (remote) villages have abortions to get a free vacay trip to Anchorage


gonzar09 t1_j9q2mba wrote

Yes, because that's why any woman wants to take a trip anywhere; to have invasive surgery that morons will attempt to block, despite her needs. Not to have fun, or a meaningful outing with family, or to simply relax.

Seriously, what dimension do these people live in?


thankyeestrbunny t1_j9pt9xz wrote

republiQans, this is you. Now.


[deleted] t1_j9q138v wrote



dan0o9 t1_j9qcb84 wrote

A meaningless gesture which he's already received before? He's accepted as one of them otherwise they would have had him removed.


lonehappycamper t1_j9pu0hi wrote

Here is the sociopathic idea 'we should govern without emotions' on display. They want to value lives in dollars only


ioncloud9 t1_j9q4rdo wrote

Everything is about money to these corporate fascists.


Tubesockshockjock t1_j9q3d4h wrote

What if, and I'm just going out on a limb here... But what if that child grew up to be a taxpayer? I feel like that possibility might just wreck that dude's mind, if it occurred to him.


Randadv_randnoun_69 t1_j9q1n53 wrote

Is anyone surprised? The GOP is pretty clear on their view of child casualties from school shootings, underage workforce labor, chemical spills, childcare, teen(and younger) pregnancies... whatever.


MarcSneyyyyyyyd t1_j9q5amh wrote

I can think of a few ways he himself can save taxpayer money...


abduktedtemplar t1_j9pxqcr wrote

Just another day in the life of an American Republican politician.


kstinfo t1_j9qf9fs wrote

People voted for this guy?


OrcWarChief t1_j9qlljc wrote

Words have consequences, you twat


FlashpointJ24 t1_j9ques3 wrote

How much longer until someone suggests simply euthanizing foster kids, because it's cheaper for the state?


Nerdlinger t1_j9pstrh wrote

I'm surprised he didn't go with the "I'm an unrepentant optimist. I was just looking at the seldom discussed upsides of murder" excuse.


earhere t1_j9q9agj wrote

This shouldn't surprise anyone, but if the population keeps voting in these fascist chuds, then they get the world they deserve.


Zealousideal_Plan408 t1_j9qcrjp wrote

dafuq. does he not remember that abused children have abusers. abusers that will cost society a great deal.


Euripidoze t1_j9qjn7l wrote

I’m impressed. Republicans can usually do literally anything and not get censured.


joym08 t1_j9pwipf wrote

The least they could do.


bigbangbilly t1_j9r2hy2 wrote

That is some Malthusian fiscal Modest Proposal on the wrong side of Poe's Law


Alaskan_Lost t1_j9sy0qz wrote

I will say this and with my mean every word of this with my entire heart: Alaska is one of the most racist, god loving, terrifying, substance abuse, child beating place I have ever been and tho I will always long for Alaska and the things from when I was a child I will remember that Alaskans scare me. Not some, not a few, most. I have my own kids and I'm married and there is no way in hell I would take my children near that place. I would avoid it like I do Florida. Except Florida is less horribly racist.


notunek OP t1_j9szdyi wrote

If racism, substance abuse and child beating goes with god loving, it kind of puts me off god loving.


RodenbachBacher t1_j9sdhgc wrote

In case anyone was curious and didn’t want to read the article, yes, he is a Republican.


MoonageDayscream t1_j9qz58h wrote

Well Wasilla isn't sending their best. Bet that guy has some skeletons.


hurdurBoop t1_j9r5wsc wrote


well golly gosh darn then why doncha just get yer kill on with the kiddies ya know?


vlsdo t1_j9rf5xl wrote

I'm guessing he didn't account for all the taxes that child would have paid throughout his life if allowed to live and grow. He thought he was doing a gotcha, but really just showed himself a ghoul


DazedWithCoffee t1_j9rmjv9 wrote

If the systems we put in place don’t exist to protect people from at least wrongful death, then what exactly is the point of the systems we fund with taxes


finnasota t1_j9rvrri wrote

He was making a prolife statement. As in, he doesn’t care about nonabstract suffering, he only cares about fantastical wrongdoings.


Algum t1_j9rzr11 wrote

Sorry, bud. You're no Jonathan Swift and that ain't a Modest Proposal.


Showerthawts t1_j9s6976 wrote

Don't even need to guess which party, do I?


L0rd_OverKill t1_j9s8t4f wrote

So…? Censured for saying the quiet bit out loud?


SphericalBasterd t1_j9spkqr wrote

Breaking out my excel spreadsheet to calculate the govt. cost savings on fatally abused conservative lawmakers.


Makrovich t1_j9ssljy wrote

Let me guess since the title didn’t make it clear; republican?



Sinhika t1_j9uwsr0 wrote

As the Republicans keep showing us who they really are... That's some flat-out Nazi shit he's spewing.


Rattleball t1_j9xgtu8 wrote

I bet this guy is pro-"life"


Pure-Kaleidoscope759 t1_j9regpr wrote

It’s disgraceful, disgusting and shows his contempt for poor people.


Fancy-Werewolf-3422 t1_j9rher3 wrote

And here lies the problem, if you are going to make utilitarian arguments, you best be prepared to defend yourself!! With finite resources one can agree that triaging limited resources to those that have the greatest potential for survival is a necessity ( like some hospitals were forced around the globe in overwhelmed areas at the absolute worst of Covid) but outside of such moments anyone who is not a robot or complete sociopath, the idea of letting children die because it’s cheaper in the long run… well maybe keep said thoughts to yourself! Pro choice or pro life, this is one argument that can only live on paper and argued in biomedical ethics classes.


clementine1864 t1_j9rzg80 wrote

Just reading his comments is nauseating ,he ought to be a cheerleader for abortion, no useless dependents on the state .


Blexcr0id t1_j9t2avb wrote

People vote for this piece of shit.


jetbag513 t1_j9unqw6 wrote

Censured? Oh, well that'll teach him.


showmiaface t1_j9vpuph wrote

"You're not're just an asshole."


Supervillain_14 t1_j9t9f7z wrote

You don’t censure that piece of shit-you put it all the way out. The fuck?