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fromcjoe123 t1_ismz94g wrote

It's a privilege to have a consulate, not a right.

Shut it down and bar entry to the UK to any of its members.

China will just have to conduct its diplomatic business from their embassy.

This would be a diplomatic incident if any Western nation pulled this shit in China, I'm not sure why the UK should treat this event any differently.


kittenconfidential t1_isn11e3 wrote

well, they publicly let putin get away with murder a couple of times now, so… fecklessness in the face of fascists is probably a good starting point


Arild11 t1_isnjqt4 wrote

Not much you can do about Putin, as he never leaves Kreml. But the FSB in the UK has been practically neutered since the attempted poisoning of the Skripals. The level of counter intelligence they've been facing is debilitating.


axonxorz t1_ispfuxg wrote

Don't know what's worse: FSB agents acting on foreign soil with impunity, or that apparently the UK's intelligence apparatus was/is able to curtail it at their whim.

I know counterintelligence is a thing, but I don't know how to read that sequence of events as anything other than MI5 dropping the ball and having to overcompensate.


Arild11 t1_isv651a wrote

I don't think anyone expected the FSB to act as utterly brazenly as they did, spraying nerve gas in a major Western town. That was unthinkable even during the height of the Cold War, and the KGB wouldn't ever have done it.

Dropping the ball means someone had an idea they had gone rogue state.


Danimalsyogurt88 t1_isngps3 wrote

If memory serves right Turkish diplomatic staff did this in the US. Where a security detail roughed up a protestor.

It didn’t lead to a diplomatic incident.


Dougalishere t1_isnhksn wrote

They legit charged into a group of protesters and started attacking them. On national TV and in front of US police.


KJBenson t1_isnlha8 wrote

In front of the police you say?we’re just lucky the police didn’t join in.


IAmInTheBasement t1_isqm3sd wrote

That would have been an even more interesting story if the protesters were packing heat and defended themselves with deadly force.


Dougalishere t1_isrvupg wrote

Not really, would have turned into some horrific bloodbath with a bunch of people dead. Not a whole lot interesting about that.


MajorAcer t1_isss9me wrote

That would be horrible...but horrible things can easily be interesting.


BisquickNinja t1_isnsj26 wrote

I'm guessing it didn't go much higher as the leadership at that time had ... nice feelings... for Erdogan.


WarLordBob68 t1_isq3z43 wrote

That’s because Trump was President at the time.


Danimalsyogurt88 t1_isqdgye wrote

Yeah, I call bullshit on that.

Any US President would’ve done the same for a strategic ally.


Sadiebb t1_isqok6q wrote

It wouldn’t have happened under any other President


d0ctorzaius t1_isqk71i wrote

>it didn't lead to a diplomatic incident

Tends not to when your leader is financially compromised by the other country's leader.


Oscarcharliezulu t1_isngtff wrote

They’ve got a brute squad? Inconceivable! I thought the Chinese loved free thinking and the right to have an opinion.


jordantask t1_ispugfw wrote

China LOVES opinions!

The CCP is fabulous is an opinion.

China is the greatest country on earth and can do no wrong is an opinion.

Hong Kong and Taiwan are part of China is an opinion.


Oscarcharliezulu t1_it5dsg3 wrote

I think I’m China ‘opinion” is defined as “mandated facts” :)


Jebusura t1_isnpycl wrote

Truss can't answer difficult questions at a press conference. She isn't the one to handle an unusual and urgent diplomatic issue


thatnameagain t1_ispobkn wrote

Just to be clear, this is being reported on because it IS a diplomatic incident.


Watdabny t1_isnbxge wrote

I was thinking that maybe any foreign national that visits any country should, as well as being subject to that country’s laws, also be subject to the laws of their home country when visiting. That’d make it interesting if any one with seditious intentions were subject to the same punishments they’d receive at home


WilliamMinorsWords t1_ismuwf6 wrote

That's truly disturbing.


theFrenchDutch t1_isnnhun wrote

The crazy part is how english police actually entered the embassy grounds to pull this guy out, which they are technically not allowed to do, I think ?


Matshelge t1_isnogp2 wrote

Technically not, but also dragging anyone in is also against the law, so this is an issue for the courts and China can shut down their embassy if they feel they are not getting justice.


Nanyea t1_isnq5z7 wrote

UK can shut down the Chinese embassy for kidnapping people off the street...


Risley t1_iso86g7 wrote

They should just deport all the nationals that were present at the consulate.


tall_strong_master t1_isob224 wrote

That would accomplish surprisingly little. China would just shuffle the perps around like a cups game, and probably harvest the organs of the victims.


Risley t1_isobgso wrote

At least they are out of the country. DEPORT THEM.


alose t1_isqc2ac wrote

Not all of them likely have diplomatic immunity. Throw them all in jail and let the court settle who gets to leave and who doesn't.


Such-Wrongdoer-2198 t1_isoirpz wrote

I was going to say: that does sound an awful lot like kidnapping. Also, couldn't the intervention be justified on the basis of "hot pursuit"? I realize that may not work on international claims, but as others have mentioned, what's China going to do about it? Close the consulate?


marcusaurelius_phd t1_isnqyc4 wrote

They certainly can enter if there's an emergency, and the diplomatic immunity means those who hold it can't be prosecuted but that doesn't mean they can't be stopped from murdering someone.


Banana-Republicans t1_isnwg68 wrote

Diplomatic immunity does not, in fact, mean you can’t be prosecuted. It means that it is a pain in the ass to do so.


marcusaurelius_phd t1_isnzn7p wrote

They can't be prosecuted unless their government lifts the immunity.


Chimaerok t1_iso2n3n wrote

Pretty sure having video evidence of them kidnapping a foreigner into their embassy to torture and/or murder him gives the UK the right to say "Those people are not diplomats"


danbeardan t1_iso8dis wrote

At which point they would be expelled, not prosecuted.


Playful-Technology-1 t1_isoab9j wrote

They can be prosecuted even without their country lifting the immunity. What diplomatic immunity grants them is the chance to only be prosecuted by their own country.

If a diplomat commits a crime in their own country they can be prosecuted and, if they are charged with an infraction or a crime abroad, they can choose to be prosecuted by the country they're in. Examples could be something so minor -parking ticket- it's not worth the hustle (and it's better to keep cordial relations), something so ludicrous that there's no way the accusation will stand or when they fear worse repercussions from their own government in the case they were brought to court over there.


Tef-al t1_it0ielb wrote

Or kill a motorcyclist then flee back home where they won't face charges


Playful-Technology-1 t1_it0locq wrote

Yes, it sucks when you're against someone who's rich and powerful and you're not. Most times, when we're talking about countries that have transparency laws and take seriously accountability and foreign reputation, it works, if we're not talking about those countries, it still sucks that you're against a diplobrat, Trump, Koplowitz, Hearst, Onassis....

Law is clear, they do have to face charges when they're in their own country. It's not like there's any that country doesn't have a precedent on letting the rich and powerful getting scott free .


Dat_Boi_Aint_Right t1_isp0mg7 wrote

Can and can't don't have the same meanings at a sovereign level. They can be prosecuted, but they almost certainly won't be.


Chimaerok t1_iso2de5 wrote

So technically under UN law / law of nations type stuff, embassy land belongs to the country whose embassy it is. This is a show of good faith, and also lets those working in the embassy abide by the laws of their home country.

What the Chinese did here, then, was kidnap an English citizen across international borders to torture him.

When a foreign country is kidnapping your citizens, that is what I do believe the UN calls "I don't care if it's your embassy China you are violating every notion of peace ever conceived"


NorthernerWuwu t1_isoaeo6 wrote

No whataboutism here but the UN hasn't done fuck all in the past when countries have done exactly that and often to many, many people.


Dat_Boi_Aint_Right t1_isp0uh0 wrote

The UN isn't a governmental body in that sense. It doesn't ever do anything,ember nations might do something under the color of the UN.


Downtown_Skill t1_isnw08z wrote

Someone mentioned earlier that consulates have different laws than embassies although that was another comment and I never verified because verification is for nerds. /s The claim though was that embassies are sovereign territory where consulates are not.


Averiella t1_isor6q4 wrote

No they both have similar protections, but neither are truly sovereign territories. The 1961 Vienna Convention sets out rules governing consulates and embassies, and guarantees the “inviolability” of diplomatic premises. What this means is the host state can’t barge in without permission but it doesn’t mean the things that happen inside aren’t subject to the host state’s laws. The rule that allows consulates and embassies to act with their own laws is essentially a courtesy in some ways.

For a more historic example, the saudis who tortured and murder Khashoggi could have an international arrest warrant issued against them. The saudis wouldn’t hand them over but they wouldn’t be able to go anywhere else.

Another example of it not being sovereign territory is a baby born in a U.S. embassy does not have U.S. citizenship.

But they DO still have special protections and rules — for example an attack on an embassy is considered an attack on the country it belongs to.


Thisoneissfwihope t1_isnw9ef wrote

The rules are different for consulates and embassies, iirc, so maybe it’s allowed.

I also suspect that there’s some ‘risk to life & limb’ exception that applies too.


LeastRacistGamer t1_isozi7v wrote

When I was in London I got chewed out for trying to take a picture of the embassy's garden. They take their shit seriously.


Monkey_Fiddler t1_isnz4uv wrote

Whatever the technical legal situation is, those officers won't be extradited to China to face trial there (human rights grounds are the obvious one, if we even have an extradition treaty).


CrucialLogic t1_isnzpqj wrote

Extradited to China? A police officer who was rescuing someone being attacked by foreign embassy workers? Technical or not, they'd never be extradited in any such circumstances and it's ridiculous to even bring up the idea.


cincimedes t1_isoqp2t wrote

It was a consulate so it doesn't have the same protections as an embassy. Not sure what they would have done if it were an actual embassy. I would like to think that they would have rescued him anyways but who knows.


[deleted] t1_isnn12y wrote



theFrenchDutch t1_isnnbka wrote

How the fuck is that related AT ALL to the Chinese embassy beating up someone in the UK ? What are you trying to say ? That it's somehow justified ? What reason do you have to change the subject ?


ProgressiveSpark t1_iso1i1g wrote

Its not a justification, just an observation

I dont understand why youre so offended


Risley t1_iso946r wrote

Because beating up protesters is never an answer


Chimaerok t1_iso2zjm wrote

Video evidence of Chinese "diplomats" kidnapping someone they have no authority over to beat him in the street and drag him into a building to torture and/or murder him

This fucking dumbass redditor: "But Hong Kong bad!"


radiantwave t1_ismvsl0 wrote

Simple rule of bad governments... If you cannot make fun of your leaders, criticize your leaders, or vocally dislike your leaders... You don't have leaders, you have jailers.

The ability to admit error or fault is the number one best trait in leadership. It is a sign that they are willing to improve and do better. Perfection is delusional when it comes to leadership.

There are some who are better than others, but none are perfect... Even the best are wrong about half the time.

This is why the best leaders surround themselves with people smarter than themselves... And they listen to others


ramhusk t1_ismx12f wrote

“Beware the king who cannot tolerate the fool”


gaynazifurry4bernie t1_ismwot1 wrote

>This is why the best leaders surround themselves with people smarter than themselves... And they listen to others

Like President Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Camacho?


KingGreasyJr t1_isn0itu wrote

Not Sure was a national treasure. And to be fair he was thrown to the wolves until his ideas were proven to the masses


deftoner42 t1_isn1rbd wrote

But brawndo has what plants crave! That guy wanted to put toilet water on em.


KingGreasyJr t1_isn1xbc wrote

Hard to argue that point. He did make the stock thingy go to zero and do the lay off thing

He did admit it may have been his fault though. The irony is not lost on me


TokiWaKita t1_isnldm7 wrote

> The ability to admit error or fault is the number one best trait in leadership.

Would be, if the media and the opposing party wouldn't immediately spin it as weakness and incompetence.

In today's climate, can you imagine a major political figure flat out saying they made a mistake?


TogepiMain t1_iso85r2 wrote

Nope, but I'd trust them as president more than any of the last dozen guys, that's for damn sure


VentureQuotes t1_isqihom wrote

Brutal that in the Netherlands it’s still illegal to insult the monarch 😬😬


Bilbog_Fettywop t1_isn7qfr wrote

During the Qing Dynasty, Sun Yat Sen, the dude who would eventually go on to topple the dynasty and bring about a new government, was similarly dragged to the Chinese consular grounds without anyone knowing and was about to be shipped off to China for execution.

Not saying that the protestor is going to do any of that in the future, or that other government embassy grounds are exempt from similar fuckery, but it's kinda fitting. Same witch different hat and all that.


Balrok99 t1_isnhpdf wrote

Well except the Republic of China was not so great.

They might have overthrown the Qing Dynasty but the country was still a mess.


1AMA-CAT-AMA t1_isnxc34 wrote

Are you saying current China and Taiwan would be better off had they continued the status quo with the Qing Dynasty?

People on both Taiwan and the Mainland revere Sun Yat-Sen for a reason. He might have been an idealist and didn’t accomplish all his goals immediately but he did start china down a different path.

That’s like invalidating the articles of confederation because the country was still a mess during that too.


Balrok99 t1_isnzdv3 wrote

In my opinion it would be better for the sake of the entire world if Taiwan was "officially" part of China. ( I know everyone has opinion that and t his is my own )

I know they hold Sun Yat Sen in high regard not denying that. Just saying that the Republic of China was not the best successor to Qing dynasty. Which is why Civil War and many rebellions happened. Also he was president of the ROC just for a very short time and also leader of KMT for very short time.

Makes you wonder how would the events played out if he stayed in power a bit more.

But we should not try to change the history for it might be be much worse than what we have now.


Locke_and_Lloyd t1_isou1n8 wrote

Only until China decides that they also have a right to control Mongolia, Bhutan, Nepal or any other country they want. They will never stop trying to conquer. It's no different than letting Hitler take a few countries in the late 1930s.


M3SS3NG3R t1_iso5e6o wrote

Sure ROC wasn't perfect. But with 20/20 hindsight it is still miles better in comparison to the China of today. Just look at what they were eventually able to accomplish. IMO it would be better if China is officially no part of ROC. Then both can at least try to have a healthy relationship (even no relationship is healthier than what we have) and China can finally focus on self improvement instead of blaming their shortcomings on everyone else.


SomethingElse521 t1_ispgtgn wrote

> But with 20/20 hindsight it is still miles better in comparison to the China of today

It was literally a feudal dictatorship what the fuck are you talking about lmao


M3SS3NG3R t1_isph5rb wrote

When you compare garbage to shit aka the CCP it still smells better KTHXBYE.


SomethingElse521 t1_isph8h1 wrote

Most enlightened western redditor.

Your argument is literally "the thing that was so unpopular and horrific in China that it was violently overthrown is actually way better than the thing they have now that the vast majority of the population likes"


TacoMedic t1_isyt9mm wrote

Yeah the RoC was fucking awful until the '90s and didn't really develop itself into a decent nation until the early '00s. It's now a great nation (from an outside perspective, I've never been), but there's a valid reason as to why the CCP and KMT were at war. If the KMT had been a decent (read: non-corrupt) government, the CCP would have never gained the support that it did and China/South-East Asia may be republics today.


M3SS3NG3R t1_isyxgmf wrote

Well I've been and in fact my father was involved in the movement that eventually led to the RoC of today. For whatever its fault the RoC never billed itself a bully on the international stage. That for me puts it above the CCP already. Feudal dictatorship? Absolutely. Take a good look at Emperor Winnie and tell me that isn't a feudal dictatorship. So really, pot calling kettle black pretty weak illustration on how the CCP of today is any better than the RoC of yesteryears.


Bilbog_Fettywop t1_isni4gy wrote

Tip if you're not a native English speaker.

When you say "Well except..." it is usually to make a counter-point to something said before, like in my comment. Except ;) there is nothing in my comment saying anything about the government that would come after.


SexyOldHobo t1_isp6ffs wrote

There’s a reason the communists have the mainland and the US backed regime is isolated on a little island.

Like it or not, China had a revolution one way, it’s was massively successful, and millions of people in China have been lifted out pf poverty since then. Modern China is a stable state the successfully meets the needs of its citizens

Also the Qing dynasty was weakened by a century of extreme violence (much of it directed by the British against the Chinese during the opium wars), hardly the actions of one man


Sinhika t1_ispx0wg wrote

Modern Taiwan is also a stable state that successfully meets the needs of its citizens. Nobody actually wants a failing archaic monarchy back.


Virtual-Stretch7231 t1_isnvhsb wrote

This is even more of an issue than people may realize. This is Communist China imposing the restriction of free speech on a western country and violently. The UK should not put up with this authoritarian crap. An embassy is a privilege, and is there for goodwill and trust. Not to drag in your own citizens and assault them for freely protesting. They aren’t diplomats, they are oppressors. Declare them all persona non grata and kick the freaking door down.

Also fuck you Xi, you insecure piece of crap.


The_Yarichin_Bitch t1_isov02i wrote

And they're using HK, which wanted to stop him before they got annexed, to do it. It's fucked up...


Modern_Bear t1_ismyla9 wrote

When I took a poster of Pooh to the Hundred Acre Wood, Rabbit didn't drag me into his hole and beat me up. In other words Pooh should be the leader of China, not his doppelganger.


Homerlikesdonuts t1_ismy6pj wrote

I couldn't imagine posters of Liz Truss being used to bring british consular staff outside their building to confront protestors, in China


CJBill t1_isn4nbu wrote

You should see the latest opposition posters in the UK. A leader can should be criticised in a stable democracy.


TacoMedic t1_isyts3v wrote

>A leader can should be criticised in a stable democracy.

I know this is 2 days late, but you're exactly right. I don't care if your national leader is literally Jesus, I still want there to be people to oppose Him. It's the only way you can ensure you're getting varied, although often flawed, opinions.

Democracies need dissent, it's the only way to ensure they remain democracies.


The_Lapsed_Pacifist t1_isnkknn wrote

You got that right mate and I’m not sure what would. Anti Marmite signs? Even then only half of them would be bothered.


dogsent t1_isn1mrn wrote

> A consulate spokesperson said protesters had displayed an insulting portrait of China's president.

Xi Pooh perhaps?


Sinhika t1_ispwsm3 wrote

Cue more insulting pictures being posted across the street, in full view of the consulate, hopefully. Giant-sized ones.


dogsent t1_ispy1us wrote

Great advertising for Xi Pooh posters and t-shirts. Opportunity for a street vendor near the consulate. But not too close. Those guys can get grabby.


JimBeam823 t1_isoh28v wrote

Dictatorships are getting bolder.


ExpatTeacher t1_isn7qlz wrote

I want to see the portrait.


WeepingAgnello t1_ispvshb wrote

Then watch the full video. It's shown at the end. Is it blocked from your location?


Mikethebest78 t1_isnd3z9 wrote

What are they planning to do drag the entire population of Taiwan onto the grounds one at a time?

I can't wait to see their PR spin on this.


djmaciii t1_isndwqr wrote

Wait for them to come out and return the favor.


akat_walks t1_isnjcaw wrote

The ultra authoritarian government that xi has formed is much more dangerous than I think many in the west really give it credit for. He very driven, very smart and utterly devoted to a world controlled by his personal ideology of modern legalism.


Otherside-Dav t1_isno7u0 wrote

China needs to be looked at, are doing/going to do what Russia are doing


ZeroAfro t1_isokj6a wrote

The UK needs to do something over this but I have a feeling they won't.


hectoByte t1_isoz5jo wrote

If it isn't obvious, it's time the western world start slowing down their business with China and looking elsewhere.


spm7368 t1_isnwtnd wrote

The ccp thugs that did this probably because have low self because their members are so small. They have to beat up protestors to feel good


compassionateasshole t1_isp5e3r wrote

China is the biggest threat to the world and no one is taking them seriously. They are literally pure evil.


eks91 t1_isq1s56 wrote

Consulate are now police offices


rwster t1_isqb5tq wrote

Holy crap. I saw this video yesterday, and just thought it was in China.


randomnighmare t1_isqpfwi wrote

Isn't this an international kidnapping by the Chinese consulate?


DeezMFNutsLOL t1_isp4de6 wrote

so much for China honoring agreements


Skrimpcitty t1_isochzg wrote

So does China own the UK or what?


SouvenirOfTheYear t1_isp9it0 wrote

Lmao, all of this outrage.

Member when Ergodan and his security staff royal rumbled in the USA?

Nothing will happen lmaO


jezra t1_isoygdj wrote

Sorry China, Biden only fist bumps your leader if the protester is beheaded.


Law_Doge t1_isno40g wrote

I swear to Glob, if I find the Chinese “police station” in NYC there’s gonna be a scene. Anybody where it is?


pablonus t1_iso6ca0 wrote

Just leave bags of "fiery poo" at the entrance and then watch stinky feet do their thing. Lol.


[deleted] t1_ismv4nd wrote



[deleted] t1_ismv6gh wrote



Designer-Ruin7176 t1_ismwqed wrote

If you’re not American I can understand not knowing, but on January 6, 2021, thousands of Trump supporters stormed the US Capital in an attempt to stop Joe Biden from becoming President.

There are a whole slew of people facing charges from seditious conspiracy to criminal trespassing, and nearly everything in between.


SpCommander t1_ismydna wrote

Jan 6, 2021*. The riots were a result of the 2020 elections which were held in November of 2020.

Edit: As pointed out, riot is too soft a term for what happened. It would be better termed insurrection/attempted coup.


Ancient-Access8131 t1_ismx107 wrote

In America that's when Trump supporters stormed the US Capital (building that houses the US legislative Parliments) after the 2021 presidential election.


WPGLando t1_ismxnwj wrote

Because people think that other people care about the US burning. cough cough we don’t


CJBill t1_isn54p3 wrote

WTF? Nothing in common; in one case a bunch of right wing Americans tried and failed to storm their government. In this case a bunch of foreign"diplomats" from a dictatorship tried to drag a protester into the grounds of their building to beat them.

China might think that current British political problems mean they can do that; British police think otherwise and they're the power on the ground here.