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Em_Adespoton t1_ivilwr8 wrote

He’s not wrong, but it’s not new. It started around the time the UK gave Hong Kong back to China, and has just gained enough strength in the past 5 years to be blatant. Things like the CCP telling Canadians with Chinese relatives how to vote, social police stations in major Canadian cities staffed with Chinese police, property ownership, etc.

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Sensate60 t1_ivjc439 wrote

Just WTF? Why is Canada allowing illegal police stations in Canada?? Quote from article: "Beijing had funded a “clandestine network” of candidates in Canada’s 2019 election and just days after the federal police force said it was actively investigating a secret network of illegal Chinese “police stations” in Toronto."

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Em_Adespoton t1_ivk4461 wrote

The stations aren’t new, but surprisingly their discovery is… and they aren’t just in Toronto. They’re in every major Western city, plus most African cities and probably others we’re still unaware of.

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JohnnyOnslaught t1_ivkcubm wrote

> Why is Canada allowing illegal police stations in Canada?

Because they're not actually 'police stations'. This article actually has pictures of them. One is a convenience store. Another is a 'business association'. It's kind of like saying, "Illegal gambling dens? Why are the police allowing it?!" The reason is because they don't generally have signs on the front door saying, "ILLEGAL GAMBLING DEN HERE".

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Salty-Pack-4165 t1_ivkix81 wrote

They are using the same loophole made for and used by certain tiny country since 60s. Same loophole is used by number of other police forces to operate in Canada. Until gov changes law there is nothing illegal about it.

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WhipTheLlama t1_ivmkkfi wrote

> Beijing had funded a “clandestine network” of candidates in Canada’s 2019 election

Political candidates found to be taking foreign money or under foreign influence should be punished with 20 - 30 years in prison. It has be be severe enough so that very few people would be willing to take their money.

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Cap10Haddock t1_ivkbsxy wrote

I saw a Chinese police car looking thing in California this year.

https://i.imgur.com/gTuEcLg.jpg

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WhipTheLlama t1_ivmksvb wrote

They don't drive around in obvious vehicles. The whole point of their operation is to stay under the radar.

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Cap10Haddock t1_ivn89od wrote

That sounds sensible. However you can see on my post what I saw and took picture of.

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WhipTheLlama t1_ivn96hi wrote

Yes, which means that car is not driven by a clandestine Chinese police officer. It's probably owned by someone who's into weird cars.

Considering how far they're going to hide "police stations" inside convenience stores and other fronts, they are definitely not using cars like that.

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Cap10Haddock t1_ivn9lg0 wrote

You seem way too confident in your hypothesis.

It may be or may not be. Hard to tell.

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Other-Bridge-8892 t1_ivmbd9o wrote

I think that’s just the Griswalds heading out for another vacation trip to Wally World…./s

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ShanghaiCycle t1_ivnx132 wrote

  1. That's not what Chinese police cars look like

  2. Are you just looking at Chinese writing on red and suspecting the worst?

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Cap10Haddock t1_ivozjes wrote

It doesn’t matter if general public doesn’t know what a Chinese police car in China looks like.

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evorna t1_ivjazz4 wrote

People from authoritarian regimes who are against democracy should never be allowed to vote in democratic countries as a national security measure

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Em_Adespoton t1_ivk4ckh wrote

Most of the people doing the voting are only Canadian. The problem is that they have relatives who aren’t in a Democratic country, and they’re being used as leverage.

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DukeOfGeek t1_ivrm4e5 wrote

It's a secret ballot, vote how you please, then lie.

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senorbolsa t1_ivmyc0e wrote

Ohhhh boy that's a fuckin can of worms right there.

There's no way to do that and not also be living in a fascist hellscape yourself.

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ShanghaiCycle t1_ivnxvva wrote

I don't know who needs to hear this, but people in China don't give a thundering fuck about how other countries run their government (until it affects China).

Chinese people aren't losing sleep at night over police brutality in the US, or whatever the fuck is going on in Canada's First Nation community. Those are US/Canada problems to fix.

So if a Chinese person is given the option to vote, who are they going to vote for? The person who's trying to scapegoat their race for a failure in the system? Or someone who wants better relations with China, their homeland.

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evorna t1_ivnz25q wrote

Taiwanese should be encouraged to vote in other countries where they live, it’s not a race thing so don’t try to pretend the racism card. Equally Japanese, Koreans should be encouraged to vote

It’s deliberate Chinese/Russian dictatorship meddling and sabotage from brainwashed or corrupted members of those systems that need to be blocked from voting and let’s face it unless you have connections or benefitting from those dictatorships then you wouldn’t likely have had the means to leave those countries to go abroad in the first place

It’s also not a failure of the system that you conveniently added there, the system should be refined and improved, as should all systems… at least democracies can admit their failures and wear them on their slieve unlike dictatorships who have to censor mistakes and even disregard for sovereignty and ip

https://safeguarddefenders.com/en/blog/230000-policing-expands

Their disregard for other peoples hard work and investments

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/chinese-hackers-took-trillions-in-intellectual-property-from-about-30-multinational-companies/

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ShanghaiCycle t1_ivo2j7y wrote

Okay, a few things. You're saying Canadian citizens born in the mainland shouldn't be allowed to vote, because just by the nature of them being in Canada means they're already compromised.

Taiwan makes up 0.16% of China's population, so good luck. But all the hate crimes Asians suffer is just sticking it to Xi! Not like Canada has a history of rounding up Asians who might not be loyal enough.

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evorna t1_ivo5siv wrote

I’ve seen the Chinese wumaos and nationalists call for the glassing of Taiwan just because it’s just a small amount of people (25 million) since they are expendable as there’s plenty of Chinese people who can take their place… I see indications of this leaning from your comment too

Taiwan is a separate country to china and is a flourishing democracy with high tech capabilities, decades ahead of china and its infantile authoritarian views…

There’s already been plenty of evidence of Chinese censorship attempts of spreading to free countries, meddling in democracies etc whereas there has not been evidence from Taiwan, japan, Korea etc

Also it’s Chinese dictatorship lies to associate anything negative toward them and their crimes against humanity as asian hate in a desperate attempt to deflect away from the truth of their own actions and you are a spreader of this disinformation

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ShanghaiCycle t1_ivr90js wrote

> I’ve seen the Chinese wumaos and nationalists call for the glassing of Taiwan just because it’s just a small amount of people (25 million) since they are expendable as there’s plenty of Chinese people who can take their place

Cool anecdote. I'm sure there are, but I heard some Canadians call for the ethnic cleansing of all Arabs.

> I see indications of this leaning from your comment too

No. You're saying you want the Taiwan diaspora vote to compete with the mainland vote (assuming you don't get your wish for them to be stripped of voting rights) when it is less than 1%.

> Taiwan is a separate country to china

Oh cool, maybe going by Republic of China, celebrating China's national holidays, using China's flag, holding China's place in the international community for decades, using the map of China on all official military logos, holding a piece of mainland China, sticking Sun Yat-Sen's face on everything (who has never been to TW), etc. might lead people to believe they have been trying to be the real China.

> and is a flourishing democracy with high tech capabilities, decades ahead of china and its infantile authoritarian views…

Good for them, I like Taiwan. I like Taiwan more when they have amicable relations with Beijing, who they do most of their trade with. Before COVID, you could fly direct to Taiwan from mainland China, and even still you can find thousands of Taiwanese working in cities like Shanghai and Wenzhou. That's much more healthy than, let's say, America and Cuba, who are in a similar geographic situation.

Taiwan's democracy flourished during that time (1990s-2010s), before then it was a military dictatorship hell bent on taking back the mainland and holds the world record for longest martial law period.

Also, it's easier to develop a liberal democracy on an island half the size of Ireland, population of a Chinese city, homogenous population and a head start (untouched by WWII, part of Japanese Empire). And again, I'm not shitting on Taiwan.

> There’s already been plenty of evidence of Chinese censorship attempts of spreading to free countries

Try to make that sentence make sense.

> meddling in democracies

Ask any country in South America or Africa, and it's not China they're worried about in that regard. Name any coup in the past 30 years with China's fingerprints on it...

> whereas there has not been evidence from Taiwan, japan, Korea

Maybe you're too young to remember the Moonies, a South Korean cult that dominated the American and Asian far right. Taiwan is tiny as I said, but they have ordered a hit on Henry Liu in the 80s.

And Japan, if this was the 1980s, you'd be talking about the Japanese menace just as you are talking about China. Whenever a country looks like it's going to be a competitor of the US. Japan is now a subservient where they just let US military personnel have their way with the locals, because what are they going to do about it?

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evorna t1_ivra5yf wrote

Haha what a pile of nonsense and deceptions… I’ll just highlight one refutal from personal experience. You cheated by omission…

My Chinese wife needed to go to Taiwan last time she was in china and she could not as a PRC passport holder leave china to fly directly to Taiwan over a year before Covid. We had to go to another country and fly to Taiwan from there due to the Chinese dictatorships infantile totalitarian approach to things when it doesn’t get its way - stop the normal Chinese people from flying directly from china to Taiwan

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ShanghaiCycle t1_ivrc6fk wrote

Chinese citizens don't use their passport to fly to Taiwan, since neither side recognises eachother as a foreign country.

> All Mainland residents cannot travel to Taiwan on their passports when departing from Mainland China and must hold a Travel Permit to and from Taiwan (往來台灣通行證), colloquially known as Mainland Resident Travel Permit (大通證), issued by the Chinese authorities.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Taiwan

So the five times I was on a plane from China to Taiwan full of PRC citizens doesn't seem to match your girlfriend's experience.

If we are using anecdotes, my Indonesian friend was blacklisted from Taiwan and was given no reason.

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troublesome58 t1_ivjewur wrote

Isn't that undemocratic?

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Jabberwoockie t1_ivjg9kg wrote

Strictly speaking, it speaks to the criteria for citizenship, if citizenship is required to vote.

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Outrageous_Heat_4529 t1_ivj8be7 wrote

He’s not, so if Canada doesn’t do something about it… it’s on Canada. Yes, something should be done, and it’s not my job to think of what that should be.

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Em_Adespoton t1_ivk4has wrote

The first bit is sunlight. People need to know these things are happening.

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JohnHwagi t1_ivk73ze wrote

It seems obviously illegal for China to run social police stations in Canada. If they know they’re there, their equivalent of the FBI should be kicking doors.

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WhipTheLlama t1_ivmkwv8 wrote

They're hidden and difficult to find. One was a convenience store.

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EasySundayz t1_ivk9xxd wrote

I think it's starting in America too, but no one seems to care.

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WirelessBCupSupport t1_ivlmkok wrote

Dunno about police stations but the indoctrination of American children at these Chinese Schools, that are funded by China's PRC, to promote "Chinese Culture" to young American children (Asian-American and others...).

Even their teachers are hired and required to sign paperwork NDAs about where their funding comes from.

How can you have "tuition-free" charter schools in the US? They are funded by China.

"Indoctrination starts at a young age..." ... and the spin now is more about books but not that there is a Mandarin school setup in most counties...

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ShanghaiCycle t1_ivnxduk wrote

Actually, Hong Kong wasn't a democracy while being a UK colony. They had a governor appointed by London, and universal suffrage as they know it now didn't start until between 1985 and 1995. That was after the handover was set in stone.

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Em_Adespoton t1_ivoqfqo wrote

While true, what you said has no bearing on what I said, which was not about democracy in Hong Kong but about CCP belt and road strategy that began influencing foreign policy around the same time as the handover.

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ebicat t1_ivimf2o wrote

If only he had the power to do something about it.

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[deleted] t1_ivixnwb wrote

[removed]

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HildemarTendler t1_ivj9qee wrote

It's amazing that you think this is a reasonable response. The Chinese people are not the CCP. Those moving to Canada typically want to escape the bullshit. Pushing them away when they're in Canada is what gives the CCP the opening it needs to influence them.

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thudly t1_ivk13l2 wrote

I see by the upvotes the racism gets, and the downvotes to your very rational and reasoned response that xenophobic idiots are out in full force today.

These people don't see nuance. They see "our team" and "the enemy". Everybody is all catagorized into broad groups and painted with the same brush, becuase anything deeper than that requires critical thinking.

Getting Chinese people the fuck out of an authoritative regime and into our culture gives them less power. We just have to stay on top of our policing in case a few bad actors slip through. That would have been true anyway, no matter what the immigration policy.

But try explaining all that to a racist.

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Axes4Axes t1_ivkbno3 wrote

In theory anyways.

The amount of them that show up to shut down pro-HK Canadians, or Uyghurs is alarming. The amount of CPC activity by Canadian Chinese is alarming. Part of that might be that they still have family back in China so they’re under threat, or they’re still the victim of communist brainwashing.

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King_of_Ooo t1_ivl9wok wrote

I am super pro HK, and strongly anti mainland Chinese. Does that make me "racist"?

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[deleted] t1_ivmffi6 wrote

I mean you literally labeled millions of people “them” and painted them all with the same insanely broad brush.

There’s obviously various issues here but this lack of nuance isn’t helpful.

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Constant_Curve t1_ivjc7j8 wrote

But what if they aren't in Canada? Your point makes no sense.

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oasisOfLostMoments t1_ivjwvtp wrote

Saudis influence US politics all the time with money alone. Going full Trumper mode about immigration will only lead to racism and won't solve anything.

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[deleted] t1_iviqoog wrote

[deleted]

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CptPottawatomieBrown t1_ivko5fb wrote

It’s never “our incompetent institutions and rampant corruption” are destroying democracy. No it’s Russia and china.

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magnaman1969 t1_ivji4ru wrote

President Xi told Biden that Democracy is dying and Authoritarian government is inevitable.

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spzcb10 t1_ivl7i2b wrote

I mean maybe but these things hardly turn out the way people think. The fewer people that you concentrate money and power towards the less predictable the outcome is really. Historically it ends up being power struggles between god emperors like in the Roman Empire

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[deleted] t1_ivijmn2 wrote

[removed]

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JohnHwagi t1_ivk7otu wrote

It seems the article is about the Chinese government threatening Canadian Chinese people. I would hope people don’t blame Canadian Chinese folks for things like this, when they’re the ones being victimized.

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Other-Bridge-8892 t1_ivmcbn5 wrote

Well, at least y’all flavor those mind altering drugs in amazing fashion! I’m willing to accept the brain washing as long as it comes with a side of crab Rangoon and some vegetabl lo mein! 😂

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solarpropietor t1_ivlcrj4 wrote

Military personnel should be storming these stations and arresting everyone there.

It should be treated no different than an armed intrusion into another country’s borders.

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tingulz t1_ivmfds7 wrote

The CCP can go fuck itself already.

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OMakiRi t1_ivn32wj wrote

China is a non-partisan issue for just about every country to worry about. They are legitimately fascists. Genocide, hurting democracies, command economy, etc.

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g1immer0fh0pe t1_ivjng67 wrote

To have it's democracy gutted, Canada would first need to become a democracy, not the plutocratic oligarchy it, and every other nation on earth, is. 😓

#AMoreDirectDemocracy 🖐🖐🖐

Power to the People ✌🙂

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hawkwings t1_ivjokmu wrote

It is beginning to look like democracy has died.

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grumpy_hedgehog t1_ivipbkb wrote

I mean, we literally have three-letter agencies dedicated entirely to subverting their government. We do not hide this in any way, and our politicians openly call for regime change in their country (and many others). How is their reaction at all a surprise?

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Vast-Cantaloupe-306 t1_iviqn5o wrote

I’m not Canadian so I don’t know about these agencies, but I’ve always assumed you had some. What kinda alphabet boys do you guys have, and would you like to trade?

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Dultsboi t1_ivistm2 wrote

The RCMP and CSIS are the major ones. The Nova Scotia shooting a couple years ago has all the hallmarks of an intelligence operation. The suspect was even drawing money from Brinks, something only assets of the RCMP and informants do.

But at the end of the day, the CIA and FBI likely control Canada far deeper than anything China could ever dream to achieve

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EvangelineOfSky t1_ivj3zey wrote

We also have the CSE, which runs parallel to CSIS.. CSIS looks a more into domestic security, CSE focuses more on foreign intelligence

While CSIS was founded as a result of the RCMP detachment responsible for their job before them going AWOL and commiting domestics terrorism after the FLQ crisis, CSE traces its roots to Canada's cryptography researchers in the second world war

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RideauLakes t1_ivjbugm wrote

We won't follow in America's Republican's foot steps!

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nuge08 t1_ivik4zy wrote

Let me guess....was it the freedumb convoy truckers that the chinese were trying to sway? If so then is that the best they got?

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pattydickens t1_ivin5l7 wrote

Last I checked there weren't any Chinese trucker convoys in Canada threatening to storm Parliament.

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ChalupaCabre t1_ivio3u0 wrote

Both are working to subvert democracy.

Don’t have to be on the same team to have the same enemy.

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