mcs_987654321 t1_ivlp1fw wrote
Reply to comment by PeteButtiCIAg in Reports of alleged voter intimidation and interference in NC ahead of Election Day by Zen1
But even then, the incentives in a functional democracy are actually aligned to avoid collapse, if only because you have enough varying interests within the “concentrated power” crowd that refuse to concede their chance to have a turn at the helm.
Of course if you let enough nihilists who genuinely don’t give a shit either way accumulate enough money, and erode the foundational structures that keep the democratic process on track…yeah, things go downhill pretty fast.
PeteButtiCIAg t1_ivlp96l wrote
What are you citing here? Because I'm getting strong "invisible hand" vibes.
mcs_987654321 t1_ivltu5e wrote
Oh, a super mish mash of classical and modern political theory, probably with some unconscious influence of sub-game economics thrown in… but definitely NOT some kind of Adam Smith “it’ll all work out in the end” blue sky thinking.
But yeah: plenty of supporting evidence - even given the natural tendency for wealth and power to accrue/compound - that democracies can and do hold up pretty well, so long as you have: 1) some level of variation and competition within the 0.01% and 2) a somewhat functional rules-based system that doesn’t have obvious forum shopping workarounds.
There’s also probably a 3) in the mix that involves the relationship between political/financial and military power, but that’s outside my wheelhouse and has its own particular dynamics and forces.
PeteButtiCIAg t1_ivlv9zu wrote
Those are some pretty big caveats. The reason I asked is because I was troubled by the cornerstone of "giving a shit". I'm honestly even more troubled now, haha. I've been looking at what we can expect post QE, especially as sovereign debt crises seem to be popping up everywhere. I can see opposed interests continuing (to some extent), but I'm not sure we have models for this level of accumulation. What are the examples?
mcs_987654321 t1_ivm28zb wrote
Historical examples don’t work all that well as proxies, just bc of the amount of confounding factors and unique tensions inherent to a particular time/place…but feel like the British parliamentary system starting from the Carolean era is a pretty solid example.
Crazy concentrations of power and wealth, all kinds of evil fuckery (many having to do with colonial endeavours), but also a fairly stable country that has mostly rolled with the punches, all things considered.
Of course the UK is also currently shitting the bed, so that’s not exactly encouraging…but yeah: “worst option except all the other ones”.
Still think that democracy is remarkably durable, but also agree that we’re experiencing pretty extreme stresses/conditions, and that structurally flawed systems are going to collapse.
clock1058 t1_ivscmvr wrote
>Of course if you let enough nihilists
i dont think u understand what nihilism means
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