Submitted by greenhousecrtv t3_10lvg0i in nyc
drpvn t1_j5z6zqo wrote
Sure, why not, it’s essentially legal to shoot up in public now anyway. We need to remove all fear of legal consequences from hard drug use.
Hot-Hat-4913 t1_j610hgg wrote
Putting people in jail because they fell into addiction is a bad move. It costs a ton of money and all but ensures those people will be unemployable when they eventually get out of prison which just leads to even more problems.
If someone is engaging in hard drug use, the only compassionate and fiscally sane approach is to do whatever can be done to get them off drugs. Throwing them in jail when the only thing they've done wrong is become addicted to something—often as a result of depression or another mental health problem—is cruel and pointless. If they're a danger to other people, sure, you need to use force, but this is often not the case.
fafalone t1_j61i7di wrote
Compelled treatment is useless. The best approach from a fiscal perspective and external harm perspective is to provide their substance of choice until they're ready to quit. This eliminates property crime, reduces other crimes committed, dramatically reduces ODs, and results in them being far more likely to maintain housing and employment, in addition to defunding gangs and cartels.
actionguy87 t1_j63t9vi wrote
Meanwhile hard drugs become so easy to get that instances of addiction skyrocket. Normalizing drug use is NOT the solution to helping addicts. If I were an addict caught in the vicious cycle of addiction, I'd pray everyday that someone would scoop me up and tie my ass to a bed until everything was out of my body. A system that actively ENABLED my addiction would be a waking nightmare.
supermechace t1_j639l6p wrote
The problem for NYC is that much like homelessness and migrants, other states will shift their problem populations to NYC to handle the cost.
Hot-Hat-4913 t1_j620zq2 wrote
I agree. Opiate addicts can often hold a job and live fairly normal lives if they have affordable access to drugs and if the drugs are what they're claimed to be. So much money and so many lives are wasted on the war on drugs.
supermechace t1_j63af5j wrote
US definitely messed up on war on drugs, but it's actually other countries ways of outsourcing their criminal elements to the US to deal with(or in some cases destabilize and profit off the US). They're protected by borders as the US would prioritize business interests rather than taking nations to task. Gateway drugs lead users to abuse harder substances helping users to eventually become a burden on community.
iv2892 t1_j60xqy6 wrote
Jailing every single drug user is the way to go, not treatment and facilities for people dealing with drug addiction. Got it
shant_jan t1_j61215i wrote
i think he's on to something. just think about it, after a year of prison guards bringing them in new drugs, let's just release them with no support system onto public transit and let the whole cycle repeat itself again!
oh and as a kicker, even if they were to get clean and get their shit together, lets also make sure no one will ever let them rent an apartment because of their record.
RepresentativeAge444 t1_j62gmqs wrote
Yes let’s just continue the failed drug war that has resulted in the untold deaths of thousands, empowered the drug cartels filled out prisons with the highest prison population in the world and a bunch of other negatives I could list. We found out with prohibition that it doesn’t work. It creates a violent black market and had wasted a trillion dollars that could have been used for far more productive things. I’d tell you to educate yourself on the matter but I suspect you have no interest in that.
AmputatorBot t1_j62gntj wrote
It looks like you shared some AMP links. These should load faster, but AMP is controversial because of concerns over privacy and the Open Web.
Maybe check out the canonical pages instead:
^(I'm a bot | )^(Why & About)^( | )^(Summon: u/AmputatorBot)
supermechace t1_j6397vs wrote
Reading some articles the war on smoking is probably a better example than prohibition, as alcohol's detrimental effects are more immediate and increase faster on consumption compared to drugs along with delivery mechanism. The US has definitely messed up on the war on drugs in many ways but it's dangerous not to be aware that it's also a war being waged on America by other countries much like Britain on China with opium. Unfortunately the US priorities business over taking countries to task, it's a war of attrition if drug producers just hide behind borders. The US faltered on anti drug use messaging and was behind the curve on regulating legal opiates
[deleted] t1_j5ztlg2 wrote
[deleted]
[deleted] t1_j5z7tc6 wrote
[deleted]
drpvn t1_j5z7zqu wrote
It fixes the problem of that junkie shooting up on the corner.
Let me guess: you also believe that going after street-level dealers isn’t going to fix anything?
NYY657545 t1_j63hv3h wrote
NYPD needs to target cartel heads, obviously
[deleted] t1_j5z8lws wrote
[deleted]
drpvn t1_j5z8xlt wrote
> No it doesn’t.
>They spend a few days at rikers, get let out, and do it again.
So you arrest them again. We have over 30,000 cops that we pay salaries.
The best policy, in my view, would be to arrest people who use in public and offer them a choice of treatment or jail. Like how they do it in Portugal.
fafalone t1_j61ify0 wrote
> Like how they do it in Portugal.
That's not how it works in Portugal. They're required to undergo an evaluation but enrolling in treatment is optional.
Because compelled treatment is useless and nothing but a waste of money with little benefit over jail.
[deleted] t1_j61jgnd wrote
[removed]
YaBoiChibi123 t1_j5zd7tu wrote
If you’re gonna bring up European model of drug therapy then you should also bring up sites where people can use recreational drugs safely.
Criminalizing drug use literally does nothing but makes the users worse criminals. It literally just inflates the NYPD/prison budget to a level that is unnecessary
Either genuinely offer these people treatment or do nothing (and I quite literally mean do nothing). Those two options are profoundly better options than just throwing people in jail
drpvn t1_j5zdzre wrote
I would support injection sites if it were coupled with a form of coercive treatment. Normalizing public hard drug use is a bad thing for a society.
retiredfromfire t1_j60u2q8 wrote
Alcohol has decimated Russia.
drpvn t1_j60yu41 wrote
Ok?
YaBoiChibi123 t1_j5zelaf wrote
You wanna know what’s worse for society?
Throwing people in jail for drug charges. Those people won’t be able to find good jobs after leaving and will have to become hardened criminals during their stay in order to survive. That outcome is 10x worse for society than a junkie who uses some weird shit recreationally.
drpvn t1_j5zfutb wrote
They won't find good jobs when they're dead or incapacitated from their drug habit, either.
I really do believe the best way to deal with this is Portugal's approach. But it seems like a nonstarter because it involves both policing (which the progressives don't like) and investments in treatment and safe use sites (which conservatives and many moderates don't like).
fafalone t1_j61io9k wrote
They're most likely to maintain housing and employment when enrolled in heroin maintenance programs. No other program is more successful in that regard, especially not compelled treatment (which isn't what Portugal does), which has a success rate in the 1% or less range.
drpvn t1_j61kr7e wrote
I mean coerced treatment in the sense that if you reject services, there are consequences to that. They don’t automatically toss you in jail if you reject services, but you can be required to do community service or pay fines.
allMightyMostHigh t1_j60dhh5 wrote
They just gotta strap them down and force them to go through withdrawals and treatment but of course that will never happen
Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments