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get_it_together1 t1_j77ksvr wrote

Reply to comment by contractualist in There Are No Natural Rights (without Natural Law): Addressing what rights are, how we create rights, and where rights come from by contractualist

It seems clear that we only have rights that our society agrees to maintain, both positive and negative rights. This is most obvious with women in the modern era, but certainly throughout history there are numerous examples of people being denied what you might consider to be a right. What then is a right if it is so easily violated and if entire societies can deny their existence?

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contractualist OP t1_j77liom wrote

This is a descriptive account of rights, not a normative one that philosophy focuses on. Rights exist regardless of their violation or their declared non-existence or someone's imagination.

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get_it_together1 t1_j78dcwx wrote

Philosophy focuses on all types of rights and philosophers debate both which sort of foundation is best for supporting rights and which specific rights should be derived from a given foundation. Given this diversity of thought it seems a bit odd to simply proclaim a particular right to exist regardless of circumstance. I agree that in general in every society some rights exist but this is a very different claim.

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VitriolicViolet t1_j792izx wrote

no they dont.

what you are claiming is that all societies in the past were immoral and that any future societies will also likely be immoral (our conception of rights was different in the past and will be different again in the future).

if we all decided tomorrow that all current rights were in fact incorrect then they would be incorrect by definition.

rights and morals are literally determined by popularity and force.

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