EarnestPhilosophy OP t1_j887xes wrote on February 12, 2023 at 11:00 AM

Reply to comment by CortezsCoffers in Meaning in life is a powerful source of motivation and profound experiences, but I argue that it cannot justify suffering. by EarnestPhilosophy

My intention was to show why everything is not meaningless. The experience of suffering has a quality that is intrinsically bad for any subject that experiences it. This is an objective statement (pinch your skin with your fingernails and you will clearly recognize it). There is no intrinsic value in a value judgement reached through reasoning or "what your emotional state tells you", just like there isn't intrinsic value in a computer deciding what instruction to execute based on input.

Your judgments certainly have instrumental value, as they are a form of attachment which gives rise to positive or negative feelings when things go or don't go as you would prefer them to, and they guide your behavior, which causes feelings to (not) be experienced in you or other sentient beings.

CortezsCoffers t1_j894sfy wrote on February 12, 2023 at 4:10 PM

Oh, I misread you. Often meaning and purpose are used as synonymous terms. I assumed that's how you were using them, so when you went on for a few paragraphs about how nothing has objective purpose I assumed you also believed that everything is meaningless.

Still, I don't think you've actually presented a good argument for suffering being objectively bad. "Pinch yourself," you say. Well, I did pinch myself. Many times, willingly, even knowing it would hurt, though not to an unreasonable degree. What exactly is that supposed to prove? Is an aversion to something a sign that the something is intrinsically bad according to you?

EarnestPhilosophy OP t1_j89pfwg wrote on February 12, 2023 at 6:30 PM

Do you think there would be anything of value going on if no one had the ability to feel? Do you think that escaping from danger without feeling anything isn't fundamentally different from being filled with fear during it? What would good and bad even mean if they weren't inextricably tied to pain and pleasure? If feelings didn't and couldn't exist, everything would truly be meaningless. It wouldn't matter at all what you choose to do or what is happening in the world.