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gagrushenka t1_iu4c66a wrote

Reply to comment by FreddyDoLess in How Morality Changes in a Foreign Language - fascinating ethical shifts come with thinking in a different language by fonliahea1994

I wrote my linguistics thesis on a topic that overlapped with this, though I specifically looked at swearing/taboo. Research suggests that there's a bit of an emotional disconnect with L2 - when everyone present understands all languages in use, speakers tend to swear in their 2nd language. There's similar patterns in conversation around trauma - L2 allows people to talk about their experiences/exposure to sensitive stimuli while maintaining their composure. I think that trying to bring morality into would compromise how much the multilingual factor can be considered. We have a lot of ways to pick at language and language in use in linguistics but we can never get deeper than what we can actually see and hear. Internal factors like morality are beyond that. We can see that people tend to do this or that, and we can narrow down to key contextual features that predict when it'll happen, but reading morality into it is a step too far into subjectivity (and not the one we like in linguistics).

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Rickdiculously t1_iu57blb wrote

I'm multilingual and bilingual in French and English, and can guarantee there's the added layer of time and experience. Not everyone is multilingual from being raised that way. Some of us travel to such L2 speaking countries and become fluent there. It's getting to live in a completely different culture, being exposed to new ideas and ways of life. Of course this would affect your morality.

I don't have the same moral compass I used to have 10 years ago when I wasn't multilingual.

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Sand-Witch111 t1_iu5974n wrote

Can you elaborate on what changed for you? In respect to your moral compass, what is one thing you see differently now?

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Rickdiculously t1_iu5q2ik wrote

Coming from France and moving to countries like NZ, Australia and the UK, I was exposed to a LOT of feminism and gender theory that I had simply never had come my way before. It was also due to working and living with a lot of more queer people than I had in France.

Feminism, in particular, was a tough thing at the start. I lived with a Canadian woman who was extremely patient with me. And I'm AFAB! (all that mulling on the topic over years made me realise I'm Agender, which makes so much sense in retrospect..)

I had badly ingrained "not like other girls" mentality, and though I mostly didn't mind people doing their own thing, I had prejudices without foundation that needed to be addressed. I'd simply never had had them confronted before.

There was also the country hopping element. Making a home somewhere, never wanting to leave, and being forced to by visa restrictions... It was a whole lot of emotional roller coaster. Also forced exposure to a lot of different politics and political systems.

And then I lived and worked in a hostel for over 3 years! The tribal dynamics, community life, people coming and going, teaching you things about their culture or themselves...

And them also being way behind on topics you used to struggle with, and suddenly it's your turn to be patient and explain a topic you used to never think about...

Lots of personal growth.

My lifestyle, travelling from one work holiday visa to another, living in people's backyards and hostels and such, leads to a lot of socialisation.

I've also been dirt poor... Like doing the bins and living in a tent poor. 20$ in my bank account and homeless in all but name. That too, really changes your perspective on a lot of things.

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Eager_Question t1_iu7b328 wrote

I find that I feel a lot more gender dysphoria in English than Spanish, and I wonder if it has to do with the role of gender in the language.

When tables are gendered female, it kind of takes the edge off. It feels arbitrary. Compare in English, every instance of people gendering me feels like they're deliberately making some sort of point.

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Rickdiculously t1_iu7vd3z wrote

Hah! I'm the opposite! I hate how in French I have to pick gendered words to refer to myself. Meanwhile I can reach a true neutral when speaking in English and never gender myself... Language is great.

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Eager_Question t1_iu7xp05 wrote

Now that you mention self-description, I have realised that I speak about myself very rarely in Spanish. I wonder if my weird phrasing and generally strange way of speaking has less to do with me being autistic and more to do with me subconsciously avoiding self-description.

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BrellaEllaElla t1_iu74xtq wrote

Its very interesting. Which is why many Latinos like myself reject the whitewashing of our language with things like x. It's human and beautiful as is. And strong.

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OneMonk t1_iu8ak1z wrote

I can’t tell if it is correlation or causation, but as a multiple language speaker I have a seriously overactive empathy impulse and would consider myself highly moral. Empathy generally breeds morality, making the effort to understand other cultures makes you native culture feel less significant, which I think it is part of it. You also have to make yourself repeatedly vulnerable and rely on the kindness of strangers as you learn.

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methnbeer t1_iu5vdh3 wrote

Let alone, simply 10 years less mature. It's very complicated I imagine, moreso than anything here is making it out to be.

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gagrushenka t1_iu7n47r wrote

I can't speak to morality and its progression, but the fact that individuals have so many differences informing/influencing their language choices is why in linguistics we don't quite go so far as to make any assumptions of why anyone says anything or what they intend to mean. All we have is what is actually said and how it is said, and we can look for patterns and points of interest from there.

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