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scyther13 t1_j0v021x wrote

Help me understand how being contentful can bring you peace in life.

For me being contentful now and not regretting any decisions in future is a paradox.

A newbie to stoicism and i can't wrap my head around the idea that materialistic desire are vise and you can't live a happy satisfied life. If any desire you have are vices than isn't desire of peace a vice too? Even if i am satisfied now but what guarantee can be there that it won't bringe me more pain in future. One example i can think of is being contentful of my financial situation now and a decade later regretting that when i don't have the money for my liver transplant that just failed.

And another question i have is shouldn't the purpose of life be just wanting peace why does it matter if it is achieved through materialistic means or you just leaving everything and staying in the woods. For example if a person finds peace travelling won't he/she use materialistic means to get peace.?.

I know i am all over the place but it's new for me so can't collect my thoughts properly :')

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pgslaflame t1_j0vcjoi wrote

Not getting something you want might end up in frustration. Same for wanting peace. It is paradox to most bc humans are purpose oriented beings. I think the paradox only exist for those that believe you need to want peace to get it. If you regret you never reached the stoic ideal in the first place. Also you’ll never know if you’re going to regret, that’s why you should let go of thinking about it. Wanting to live is also a desire btw. To your second question, according to stoicism content comes from inside. External things, like the possibility to travel are never guaranteed and so is your peace.

Remember tho this is just an ideal.

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scyther13 t1_j0x5nic wrote

I agree with what you're saying but the thing that bothers me is that stoicism is hard to practice correct me if i am wrong how i understand stoicism is we should not care and worry about the things which we can't control but how do we distinguish the things that we can control or not . What if i start not caring for things that matter.

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pgslaflame t1_j0ygmu5 wrote

Nothing matters, just as everything. What comes to you comes to you. Stoicism believes In determinism, the choices you’ll make are the ones that you’re supposed to make and there is no right or wrong about it (the physics).

But since stoics do believe in a chain of cause and effect and logic should be used to predict it. But not to your own good, the ideal teaches altruism. You have (conditional) control about the decisions you make, not about the causal chain though.

“When someone throws a roller onto an inclined plane, he does indeed provide the external impetus for movement; but the actual cause of the roller rolling down lies in its shape, that is, in its own essence”

You can’t predict the future. Maybe you’ll regret no matter what you do.

So back to your example with the liver transplant. Stoic ideal would say to give the money away for the good of society. But you also need to accept that you aren’t the stoic ideal, you are selfish and maybe will regret your decisions. So before thinking about “what would a stoic do in this situation” the focus should be on becoming a stoic? I’m not an expert tho so take what I said with a grain of salt.

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scyther13 t1_j0yje91 wrote

Okay i think i am able to understand it somewhat, what i see now is we can somewhat worry about the "what if's" of future but to worry about the "what if's" of past has no point as we can't control it and can't be changed.

And thanks for the time to explain it to my dummy dumb brain

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pgslaflame t1_j0yl3vz wrote

Nono, worry=selfish sensation=Nono in stoicism :D. Only reason.

You’re welcome, I’m also an amateur at best so I hope I was able to help.

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Saadiqfhs t1_j0v99mu wrote

Well peace in life is just the ignorance of external crisis. Most struggle is the attempt to survive in the self made mode of existence. Once you truly take in you can only control so much if even that and reality is a mystery you can not truly understand you have two options, enter despair at your lack of knowledge to reason you exist or or continue onward in the pursuit to learn more. We all must bare a personal manifested Destiny but must realize it is manifested. You have nothing in the beginning and ending but you can find joy in this little while in the attempt to gain something.

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pgslaflame t1_j0vd5wr wrote

How is peace ignorance tho? For some, rather many probably but not necessarily.

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Saadiqfhs t1_j0ve1ul wrote

When I say ignorance I say you set a limit to the full grasp of reality. Because it’s kind of bleak really, we are in a endless void where we likely won’t no the reason for the existence. So best way to avoid external crisis is to piece meal that thought and enjoy a self created reality of the things to can learn and can understand. To the storm instead of battling it

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pgslaflame t1_j0vfqnf wrote

Isn’t the term acceptance more suitable? Also setting the limit is very active, isn’t it rather accepting one’s own limit? Also do you mean internal* crisis?

Bc ignorance is a extreme risky incomplete and therefore counterproductive form of peace to me. It also tends to make external crises worse.

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Saadiqfhs t1_j0vjamv wrote

I think I agree with you and redact my previous stance and terminology

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