Comments
Jazzlike_Leading5446 t1_jahxwug wrote
There are some cities where the cops get 40 or 45 percent of the total budget and people seems to be ok with that.
Cops are super citizens and they can get away with virtually anything, so they will be pushing further and further.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jai2evu wrote
I've seen people in this sub refer to "active duty cops" like they're soldiers and not just regular people with a job like the rest of us.
varzaguy t1_jaio01j wrote
Oh no we are gonna have cop wives now too aren't we.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jaio38e wrote
varzaguy t1_jaio7l7 wrote
Somehow I think I'd rather have a dependa lol.
[deleted] t1_jaioquh wrote
[deleted]
Basic-Lawfulness6974 t1_jaisqo5 wrote
Just like the cops, the refer to their shift as a tour. No bitch, a tour is what a soldier does, and hostile territory, where there’s a legitimate chance they are going to get shot. The culture and the mentality is absolutely off when it comes to policing in the US. Absolute garbage, ask any combat veteran.
[deleted] t1_jaj3mii wrote
[deleted]
Basic-Lawfulness6974 t1_jaj4udr wrote
Tours are for combat vets. Anyone else using the term is a fucking idiot
[deleted] t1_jaj5fmp wrote
[deleted]
Basic-Lawfulness6974 t1_jaj9vk7 wrote
Yes and so are you.
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jal094x wrote
Yeah, no, this is common among shift workers. Typically a tour is a batch of shifts, like if you rotate 1st, 2nd, 3rd, each week of a different shift is a tour, or sometimes the full rotation through all three shifts is a tour and then it repeats. It's not strictly defined and people use it in different ways. Though I'm sure the coppers do love the idea of larping as soldiers and pretending they go on deployment.
apitbullnamedzeus t1_jajeazp wrote
>here there’s a legitimate chance they are going to get shot.
Not the best time to make this point, since five cops have been shot in Allegheny County in two months.
Basic-Lawfulness6974 t1_jajmkz2 wrote
How many people are shot by cops? Statistically Its more dangerous to deliver pizza. Fuck off.
anonymouspoliticker t1_jajz5wz wrote
In the county so far this year, I can count at least two. How many do you know of?
Both of them were actively shooting at cops.
NewUse2430 t1_jamct68 wrote
Man you really must be one bad ass MFer! Probably as hard as you are charming. Your hero must be that idiot kid that lit the Cop car on fire in front of Mario’s statue. Anyway, check with Mommy I think your breakfast might be ready.
Basic-Lawfulness6974 t1_jamd2i4 wrote
I hope you enjoy the boot leather breakfast.
NewUse2430 t1_jamglio wrote
Yeah, thanks bud. Did Mommy have your fruit loops ready for you fruity?
Basic-Lawfulness6974 t1_jamhm1c wrote
Homophobia is ugly dude. Do better.
[deleted] t1_jai3ido wrote
[deleted]
AirtimeAficionado t1_jalfnvc wrote
That cost increase is actually pretty standard for any buildings planned prepandemic to now— new construction is running around 30% more expensive for any big projects. Agree it shouldn’t be spent on this either way, though.
delco_trash t1_jakor5d wrote
The crime is absolutely getting out of hand in the city.
But you know what, stuff like this is why I voted for Gainey
Excelius t1_jahxks6 wrote
Cost overruns have always been the reality for big government projects.
Plus we can't ignore the unfortunate reality that costs for everything have ballooned between when the project was initially planned, and now. The city isn't immune to the inflationary conditions we've all been dealing with.
> Nemacolin for cops
Is there any indication that the proposed Pittsburgh project is needlessly "luxurious" or are activists just lazily parroting the talking points from a controversy in another city?
timesuck t1_jai3bth wrote
It’s a state of the art, top of the line facility they have no pressing need for, so I’d say the comparison to a resort is pretty apt.
I love that you bring up cost overruns and inflation, when my entire comment was about how this facility is not needed. We can easily avoid the inflation on this project by not building it. Would much rather deal with ballooning costs on projects that will actually positively impact the residents of this city directly.
[deleted] t1_jai7ukl wrote
[deleted]
Excelius t1_jaic0rf wrote
Your conclusion that it's unnecessary and fills no pressing need is based on... what analysis exactly?
The city does claim that it would save millions of dollars by centralizing existing facilities, and in theory those freed up properties could be sold off and returned to tax roles. How many of those facilities are at the end of their life and need major renovations regardless?
The shooting range is supposed to be indoors, which would replace the outdoor police firing range in Highland Park which I know has been the source of occasional complaints about the sound of gunshots in this very sub in the past.
timesuck t1_jaii54m wrote
And your opinion that we do need this facility is based on. . .what analysis exactly? The cops saying we need it?
The vast majority of the savings the city claimed they were getting when this project was first proposed were from consolidating all public safety services and the public works facility in The Strip. Those savings are now gone, because those departments are no longer included in the plan.
There are existing plans to enclose the shooting range that don’t involve spending $120 mil on a whole new facility. The cops have also been offered the use of the North Park shooting range owned by the count, but they refuse to use it. So if this were really about solving that problem, we could have done it years ago.
Excelius t1_jaikcw3 wrote
> And your opinion that we do need this facility is based on. . .what analysis exactly?
I've never actually said it was needed. I wanted to know your reasoning for concluding it was wasteful and unnecessary.
timesuck t1_jaioobb wrote
lmao ok, so this is a “I’m just asking questions” situation. Forget it.
I just saw your flare. Maybe you’ve missed most of the news about this over the years because you don’t live in the city?
Zenith2017 t1_jaj53jn wrote
He's obsessed because he's a gun nut so loves cops
Excelius t1_jaiqs31 wrote
What exactly do you think I've missed?
I already know the answer to my question, but I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt and give you a chance to explain your reasoning.
The answer is that any sort of reasoned analysis doesn't exist. It's kneejerk bandwagon activism based on little more than "cops are bad" and the vague similarity to the controversial project in Atlanta. The City Paper article spends more time on the situation in Atlanta than it does reporting anything meaningful about the Pittsburgh project.
I have no idea if the proposal in it's original or current state was a good use of taxpayer resources, and I'm virtually certain neither do you.
timesuck t1_jaivn8l wrote
Explain my reasoning to someone who is ignoring most of what I’m saying and has basically admitted in this last comment they’re debating in bad faith?
Oh boy what a fantastic opportunity how could I pass that up
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jai53rg wrote
>It’s a state of the art, top of the line facility they have no pressing need for, so I’d say the comparison to a resort is pretty apt.
Nemacolin, the famous state of the art, top of the line training facility.
timesuck t1_jai6xqb wrote
Oh, hello again. You know this thread doesn’t have anything to do with John Fetterman right?
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jai8v9y wrote
Neither do most of my posts lol, but I'm flattered.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jaicbdj wrote
> Cost overruns have always been the reality for big government projects.
Fixed that for you
TrippTiggers t1_jaj072m wrote
Go apply to be a cop and be the one that shows the path for change.
timesuck t1_jaj2ds0 wrote
Ohhhhh ok. Great idea. I’ll get right on that.
TrippTiggers t1_jajjpyy wrote
So a correctional officer was killed in a weapons training. And they kill people all the time too. I think you anger is misplaced.
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jal0h6d wrote
Good cops who go against the grain become dead cops.
anonymouspoliticker t1_jak09mr wrote
Well, I think the implication would be for you to apply to work for the Pittsburgh Bureau of Police, not some department 3000 miles away. Unless you're planning to move to LA? Or is there an example here locally?
timesuck t1_jaklz4h wrote
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jal0biq wrote
Get his ass.
anonymouspoliticker t1_jakpv6h wrote
See, you should've just started with this instead of pulling something from the other side of the country. Now your point has credibility!
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jal0epp wrote
Shut the fuck up, we all know that the corruption is in pretty much every single department, and especially every single big city department. Don't be so obtuse.
anonymouspoliticker t1_jao0mwx wrote
That's not very nice, neighbor. Local governments set up and are responsible for the actions of their own police departments, and there's tens of thousands of them. How can you assume there are problems in one because there are problems in another? What other bureaucratic or corporate structure or occupation is held to that standard?
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jao87nr wrote
Yeah, I know it's not very nice. That was the point. We're assuming the same problems in one based on another because it's pretty well documented that it is a systemic issue. Every single time they go looking in any police department in the nation, these problems are found. Every single time, to varying degrees.
burritoace t1_jaqruix wrote
Are you kidding? Basically every public institution is treated this way. Fuck off with this bullshit.
anonymouspoliticker t1_jbiapt6 wrote
If DC city council decriminalizes all violence, is the city-council form of governance systemically corrupt?
If a public university in Florida abolishes their office of diversity, equity, and inclusion, do you think less of the University of Pittsburgh?
Or public transit. Or state government, mostly. Or healthcare- I think Pittsburghers have good experience with identifying problems with UPMC and not baselessly projecting them on, say, AHN.
The only public institution held to this standard I can think of is the judiciary, and they are closely intertwined with police anyway.
TrippTiggers t1_jaj3uue wrote
Got any more?
Zenith2017 t1_jaj5qxt wrote
How come all the past well-intended police haven't changed anything, if that's all it takes? Surely you wouldn't say that this guy would be the very first person to join the police force with positive intent to create change from within. How come it hasn't worked?
TrippTiggers t1_jan357k wrote
Change takes time. Interesting though all this comes up with only one party in charge for the last 100 years. Also corruption plays a part too, however much like the number of key board warriors on this platform, you’re talking about something neither you or I have worked in. So our opinions don’t really matter.
Zenith2017 t1_jan4i35 wrote
Well, since cops' evil and tyrannical actions very much affect us as citizens, I do feel our opinions matter. What do we do otherwise, roll over and let it happen?
The whole thing is corrupt from tip to toe. Don't forget that cops originated as slave catchers, and their role as protectors of the owner class continues to this day. You can't build on a rickety foundation, the whole thing's gotta go and start over.
TrippTiggers t1_janf4k3 wrote
I’d be curious to read your solution. Who would you call if someone breaks into your house? Or someone attacks you or your family…pick your reason to call the police.
Zenith2017 t1_janoq9i wrote
Well, it's not like the police are going to be much help if that does happen. They don't prevent crime, and they only solve around 11% of what they investigate. Seems like not a good solution to me
TrippTiggers t1_jaoyio6 wrote
Ok so what’s the alternative sending in a case worker? I mean look let’s be realistic who’s the solution?
TrippTiggers t1_jaxeicm wrote
So you got a solution or just keeping status quo?
Zenith2017 t1_jaxs8az wrote
My solution to if someone breaks in my house? I'd make my presence known without aggressing, which deters most. If they insist on looting my house, then I'm going to prioritize personal safety over property
TrippTiggers t1_jb04ce7 wrote
So you’re going to do nothing and allow crime to run ram-pit, got it.
Zenith2017 t1_jb0j1ar wrote
What else would I do? Attack them to risk injury or death over... What, my TV? A laptop? That's so painfully stupid
ram-pit
[deleted] t1_jamy1lw wrote
[removed]
YIMBYYay t1_jai283c wrote
The city is currently parking ambulances and dump trucks on millions of dollars worth of Strip District property. How about start with the low hanging fruit and relocate that, and use the process from selling the land towards the training facility?
And $120 million!? Are they building a skyscraper?
LostEnroute OP t1_jaicrex wrote
How about we use the campus for everything but the Cop Lair? That sounds cheaper and more impactful to City services. That Strip District car prison needs to get back on the tax roll ASAP.
[deleted] t1_jaq3r8g wrote
[deleted]
Excelius t1_jaic7r6 wrote
> The city is currently parking ambulances and dump trucks on millions of dollars worth of Strip District property.
I think that was part of the original plan for the site, though from the City Paper article it sounds like that may have been one of the items that got cut due to the cost inflation.
https://pittsburghpa.gov/press-releases/press-releases/5397 > The project will save millions of taxpayer dollars currently spent on leases by relocating public safety operations and public works storage from around the city to the campus. The City plans to bring Emergency Medical Services headquarters from Shadyside, Police Headquarters from Chateau, Police Training Academy from Allegheny West and the vehicle repair shop from the Strip District. The plan also includes building an indoor firing range on the campus to move it from its current location in the Highland Park neighborhood. Locations that will be vacated that the City currently owns can be sold to be put back on the tax rolls and redeveloped to benefit neighborhoods.
Excelius t1_jaj75ef wrote
> And $120 million!?
I'd be really curious to see a detailed breakdown of where the costs are expected to go.
I'm actually wondering if the city might have gotten itself into a bad deal with the free land from the Federal government.
As far as I can tell the original buildings were all left in tact, which probably means the city is on the hook for the demolition costs. That could easily run into the millions of dollars before even talking about building anything new. And those buildings are old enough that I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they were filled with asbestos.
According to the City of Pittsburgh press release when the land was acquired, the facilities would be required to be "net zero" under 2019 city legislation, requiring them to produce as much green energy as they consume. Which sounds nice in theory, but undoubtedly adds substantially to the up front cost, unless they can get some state or federal grants to foot the bill.
YIMBYYay t1_jamyabf wrote
I think that you’re onto something. Asbestos mitigation and demolition alone will be very expensive. And construction costs are up nearly 30% since 2020, so that’s a lot of it.
Also, the city put themselves in a bind with the net zero requirement. It’s one of those things that sounds good but is in fact prohibitively expensive to execute and, frankly, overkill in green building. It’s just another example of the city having outside organizations (GBA for example) and activists craft policy.
Excelius t1_jan35ui wrote
The original press release also noted that the site would include stormwater runoff mitigation measures, since this property is within the drainage area of Washington Blvd with it's flooding issues.
I imagine that retention ponds or whatever probably aren't nearly as expensive as net-zero energy requirements, but it's an added expense none the less. I would argue that's a bit more practical with immediate local benefit, than trying to tie this project in with solving bigger far more complex issues around climate change.
mmphoto412 t1_jaic50x wrote
Why, the city already owns that property. What would be the point in needlessly moving it?
Excelius t1_jaigl6s wrote
Strip district is prime real estate now. Could probably sell the land for a few million to a developer that will put it back on the tax rolls, and then move those operations to a less expensive area.
mmphoto412 t1_jaih1t5 wrote
I understand that point of view. However the city in the past seems to have a habit of selling valuable real-estate far below market value to someone who is politically connected.
Also, by the time the city buys land and builds another facility, they would likely spend more than whatever was made by selling the property.
Excelius t1_jaiibs0 wrote
> Also, by the time the city buys land and builds another facility, they would likely spend more than whatever was made by selling the property.
The city doesn't have to buy land. This site is the former Veterans Administration hospital campus and the federal government gave the land to the city for free.
mmphoto412 t1_jaijil1 wrote
They scrapped plans to do this, and to make it exclusively a cop playground. Meaning this property is no longer available for this. Someone posted this elsewhere in the thread.
Nonetheless, they would likely spend more on a replacement then whatever they would make on a real estate sale.
Excelius t1_jaila52 wrote
The land already belongs to the city, it was transferred in 2020.
They city may have scaled back their initial ambitions for the site given the ballooning costs, but the land will still be there and could be further built out at a later date. Assuming they didn't expand the scope of the police training center to include the portion of the land that would have been used for vehicle maintenance and storage.
OnyxFiskar t1_jajbnim wrote
Part of the stipulation of the federal govt selling the VA hospital and all the facilities was that the city HAS to use it for public safety. They legally are not allowed to use that property for any other purchase. The cost of relocating all of those operations from the strip would dwarf the revenue from what they would recouperate from selling the land and the added tax revenue. Its not even close.
Excelius t1_jajeq99 wrote
> The cost of relocating all of those operations from the strip would dwarf the revenue from what they would recouperate from selling the land and the added tax revenue. Its not even close.
Certainly, I wasn't imagining those things would somehow recoup the entire cost, merely offset it.
Apparently not all of the existing operations are on city owned property, in their press release the city claimed that the move would "allow the City to save millions of taxpayer dollars on leases of private properties used by the Department of Public Safety and to move key City-owned properties and parcels back onto tax rolls".
It didn't specify which operations were on city owned properties, and which are on leased properties, nor the time horizon that the "millions in savings" might be realized.
mckills t1_jaib61c wrote
All I’ve learned from Gainey so far is that the cops have him completely bent over
Ok-Twist921 t1_jaidneg wrote
Same thing happened to deblasio. The police union is the mafia with badges.
johnsonchicklet1993 t1_jajoc76 wrote
He took fuck the police to heart
Zenith2017 t1_jaiaq5i wrote
I'd appreciate them focusing first on providing training along the lines of "don't terrorize and abuse the community" before building the training facility. You do good, and THEN you get the reward.
OrangeSundays19 t1_jai3jeq wrote
$3,000 would change my whole life.
uglybushes t1_jaipz34 wrote
Bc you could use money the city shouldn’t spend money on other things?
Zenith2017 t1_jaj5zm6 wrote
Not if they're not useful and well-justified things, yeah. Seeing as the money comes from us.
johnsonchicklet1993 t1_jajoh36 wrote
Honestly shut the fuck up.
uglybushes t1_jakdeho wrote
Please lie to me
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jai571z wrote
How?
-Zipp- t1_jaiba7u wrote
You can use money to buy things
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jailqft wrote
Life changing things for $3k? Sounds like a great investment.
-Zipp- t1_jair8be wrote
Yeah! Like food.
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jaisrwl wrote
You ever hear the one about giving a man $3000 in fish?
-Zipp- t1_jajin22 wrote
Wait do you think the guy is gonna spend all $3000 on just fish? You do know that some people aren't fortunate enough to always have enough money for food aswell as other things like rent, clothes, etc.
(Not assuming the original replier struggles with food security btw)
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jajjf9t wrote
Giving someone $3k to help pay for their bills is the same as giving them a proverbial fish. It isn't life changing, it's a band-aid at best. You aren't making them more capable of paying for future bills once that $3k runs out.
-Zipp- t1_jakb0td wrote
It absolutely can though? If someone is in a very tight financial position, 3k can get them so much. it could give them breathing room on certain bills, pay of debt, secure FOOD that you NEED to LIVE, keep the rent paid, or even just straight up save/invest, all of this allows them to not be under constant stress and worry that can really hurt their day to day life.
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jakd1ik wrote
Right, and all of those benefits last as long as the $3k. Like giving someone a fish, it only is useful until they've eaten the fish.
-Zipp- t1_jakwz8b wrote
Its quite obvious you never actually been in a position where 3k would be life changing. Like, if someone can have a stable home for a moment, they can make steps to keep it a stable home.
[deleted] t1_jakgyas wrote
[removed]
spookyjeff t1_jal5xxj wrote
A first month's rent for an apartment so they have an address with which to apply for a job.
A beater car to transport them to a job outside of range for public transportation.
A class so they can get a better job.
Medicine or food so they can live long enough to find a job.
Mental health services or medications to make them stable enough to not be fired from a job.
Childcare so their kid won't be left alone while they're at their job.
Now, I can't give you financial advice, but I think those are some great investments with a lot of potential to change someone's life.
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jam1hz6 wrote
Those are paying for someone's costs, not an investment in them. It's once again the difference between giving a man a fish and teaching him to fish.
spookyjeff t1_jam40i4 wrote
"Paying for costs now to allow for profits later" is literally what investment is.
If you teach a man to fish but don't give him a pole or access to a body of water with fish in it, you've done nothing.
OrangeSundays19 t1_jaib457 wrote
Just with rent and expenses. I'm thankfully pretty healthy and don't have dependents, but things are expensive these days, and wages have not proportionally increased.
That tiny bit of breathing room would reduce my stress substantially.
120$ million on a cop playground doesn't help me at all. We spend so much money on police already, and it doesn't seem to have much effect on making things safer. This budget should be slashed immensely and spent on genuine provable community benefit.
imouttahereta t1_jainh3y wrote
Giving random people money for nothing is the exact opposite of something with "provable community benefit". And the last 3 years have made that clear as day if it wasn't obvious enough without it. "things are expensive these days", so let's print more cash and make it worse, right? This project sounds like a waste of money, but what is actually needed in most of the western world is austerity, not replacing counterproductive mass spending with more mass spending.
OrangeSundays19 t1_jaiq8aj wrote
I'm not really advocating for public policy be 'give me $3,000'. It was more of a comment, really.
I don't know if I'm going to solve America's economy in a reddit post, and I'm not really going to try.
I just know $120 million is too much. That we can seemingly agree on.
imouttahereta t1_jairqp3 wrote
Got it. And government inefficiency (or corruption) has been a constant everywhere I've lived. Unfortunately it's all quickly forgotten and there's hardly ever any accountability.
datcheezeburger1 t1_jajhkjo wrote
Got any research to back up those big ideas or did you come up with them yourself? Because I’ve got plenty of studies on deck that show how direct cash payments help communities. The child tax credit was one of the most transformative policies in the country before it was cancelled and that was from a conservative government of all things lol
imouttahereta t1_jajx2sf wrote
Don't tell me you believe the government propaganda about inflation being caused solely by "supply chains" (which I will point out is a problem that was exacerbated by the government paying a lot of people for not working) and "Putin's war in Ukraine".
When you give most people money unconditionally, the value of money goes down, i.e. you get inflation. That is a tautology. Taken to the extreme, unconditional handouts decrease productivity and labour force participation. Can you guess what direction they have been trending in since 2020?
Temporary handouts may have been necessary at the beginning of the pandemic, but they were given to far too many people (I got some and definitely did not need it) and for far too long, and as a result now we're stagflating. I don't see how implementing such programmes permanently could be positive in any way when we have a perfect example of what it leads to right here, today.
datcheezeburger1 t1_jak1rh8 wrote
I’m much less worried about the money we give to regular Americans than I am about the billions we send to military contractors for endless wars, the $30 billion in foreign aid that goes out to help prop up dictatorships in developing countries, or that our government pays to pharmaceutical companies in subsidies and unbelievable drug prices because they know they’ll get a spot on the board of directors after their terms end. There are plenty of pools to pick from, and if you think all that spending is necessary, let’s take a look at the companies making record profits while they pay poverty wages. My taxes just end up subsidizing their shitty wages with social security, medicare, welfare, food stamps and everything else that even a minimum wage job used to pay for 50 years ago. I don’t need to see extra handouts, I’m plenty happy to just redirect some of the ones I see as useless. It won’t introduce any new dollars to the economy, just take them out of the hedge funds invested in these companies.
imouttahereta t1_jak5f2t wrote
Like I said in another comment, replacing bad spending practices with different ones is not much of an improvement. Entitlements (like social security, food stamps, housing assistance, etc.) are one of the top three expenditures of the federal government if I remember correctly, but there's a difference between having programmes to help people who need support, and disincentivising people from working and lowering the value of money by sending everyone a cheque, which screws the people that this is theoretically helping anyway.
I find it ironic that you mention military funding and pharmaceutical companies even though I generally agree with you, considering the last 3 or so years were spent shunning, demonizing, banning, and in some cases firing whoever was critical of Pfizer, Moderna & co. while they were, like you said, making record profits (from our taxes) while lying left and right and asking for more. And military funding? I am not a big fan either, but I'm willing to bet most Americans are in favour of all the aid we are sending to Ukraine, which wouldn't be possible without those investments. So I feel like people point at the spending in those areas pretty often, but when push comes to shove, whether it's thanks to government and media propaganda or simply from circumstances, the public is actually pretty wishy-washy about it. Who would propose cutting military spending in 2023, with even Zelenskyy seemingly laying out bait for World War III? Who would have said anything about pharmaceutical companies in 2021? Definitely not any politician who wanted to get or stay elected. Once federal debt becomes THE big concern, maybe that will change, but I don't expect that to happen any time soon.
datcheezeburger1 t1_jak6zlk wrote
Below this I attached one of the many studies that shows how universal basic income doesn’t raise unemployment, it actually results in more people getting jobs. If you have any research that disputes that point I’m happy to read it but we’re not gonna get very far on just opinions when we’re talking policy.
As for your points about most politicians supporting money for ukraine or for phizer/moderna, I’m firmly against the citizens united decision and think money should be out of politics so those companies can’t own our government in those fields, plus energy, tech, entertainment, etc. Just because they’re corrupt doesn’t give me an excuse to give up on what I think is right
imouttahereta t1_jakbvmo wrote
I'm aware of the small-scale studies on UBI, but firstly I doubt they would be effective at larger scales, and secondly I don't find employment status on its own to be a good measure of productivity. Personally, if I could live reasonably comfortably without investing time and effort into acquiring valuable skills, I probably wouldn't have bothered going to university, let alone migrating to the US for better opportunities. I don't think it's a coincidence that countries with more "socialist" policies tend to stagnate economically, don't innovate as much and fail to remain competitive on the world stage. But of course correlation =/= causation. I would like to see UBI attempted at the scale of a country, but I'd rather see it from a distance than be roped into it.
datcheezeburger1 t1_jalrtd0 wrote
If you have such a problem with stagnation you should be looking towards the ever growing pool of wealth at the top of our economy which doesn’t get spent in communities, it gets shuffled around a dozen hedge funds until we call it part of our GDP. The stagnation has gone on for 50 years now, and it isn’t because of entitlements. Check this out the wages have been flat while productivity is up 250%. They keep our money and then use our taxes to fund our own entitlements. This isn’t even about getting something we “don’t deserve” but getting back our slice of the pie. That money is yours and mine we aren’t doing more than taking it back.
I can accept that you don’t believe in ubi for whatever personal reasons you carry but you won’t convince me for a second that productivity and buying power have ever been related in this country.
burritoace t1_jaqr484 wrote
If you don't think the pandemic fucked up supply chains then you're an idiot
TwinkiePower420 t1_jaklgiq wrote
I owe $3000 to my school, $3000 could help me get a car, $3000 could be a security deposit on a new and better apartment than I currently have, $3000 is a lot of money for some people
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jam2g2i wrote
I understand how somebody can use $3000 but none of those things would change your life.
TwinkiePower420 t1_jamn8ya wrote
I can’t go back to school until I pay off that $3000, so that would change my life by helping me get a degree, thus changing my life dramatically considering I don’t have one. If I have a better car I can get a job at a different place that pays more, cause my current car can’t really make it anywhere so I have to work close to home or within a certain distance by bus. a new and better job with better benefits such as healthcare would change my life. A new car and a better paying job would also let me visit my family more often since they live far away in a town without a train station, leave the country for the first time in my life which would be a life changing experience, and it would generally change my quality of life since rn I’m pouring money into keeping the car running. And my current apartment is poorly built, has mold issues, lead paint, and doesn’t even have enough windows to get sunlight so moving to a new place that wasn’t actively worsening my health would also dramatically change my life. I could also move to a neighborhood closer to the aforementioned better job. Like these are all pretty life changing things, $3000 is a life changing amount of money to most people who make less than say, $20 an hour. Just cause it wouldn’t change your life doesn’t mean it wouldn’t change others
Lil_Phantoms_Lawyer t1_jan96sx wrote
>I can’t go back to school until I pay off that $3000
That's not how student loans work. You can go back to school with outstanding loans.
TwinkiePower420 t1_janyoy4 wrote
They’re not loans big guy it’s money I owe the school itself, can’t get my transcripts transferred till they’re paid off, so if I wanna go back I gotta start from scratch until I get it paid off, but good try anyway. Point is, quit acting like you know more than the lived experiences of the people talking to you
Alt_North t1_jai992o wrote
I bet this proposal is dead, it's just nobody in a position to make that clear has the heart or guts to tell the cops yet.
Vivid-Ice4175 t1_jalchsa wrote
we need better trained police. ok let's build them a training center. no. blue mad bad. but if you have poorly trained police then you have poorly trained police. they need good training to be good police. no. defund the police. no training. blue man bad.
burritoace t1_jaqs139 wrote
They don't need this facility to get proper training, and proper training doesn't prevent them from abusing people. Nice try though
couplenippers t1_jajag1y wrote
Seriously the City Paper doesn’t speak for Pittsburgh, and multiple quotes from the Peduto Administration?
[deleted] t1_jajdj78 wrote
What do you mean?
couplenippers t1_jdj4ftv wrote
I mean that you would be the first pussy to call the police when the shit goes down bro
johnsonchicklet1993 t1_jajok0j wrote
This guy understands how news reporting works.
TheGamerDoug t1_jak7m49 wrote
Fuck the police. Once they stop murdering regular people, we can talk. For now, give us functional infrastructure across the city.
bwetherby1818 t1_jajuo6q wrote
We’re gonna need Sylvester Stallone to take care of that area
Sunglassesatnight81 t1_jaj38ey wrote
That sign is disgusting!
mainelinerzzzzz t1_jaj3pmy wrote
Maybe these training centers will result in a more professional force police serving us. Maybe?
n0noTAGAinnxw4Yn3wp7 t1_jajlmn7 wrote
just like all the other training centers have?
mainelinerzzzzz t1_jajnr0v wrote
Glass half full man.
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jal0sty wrote
That's a silly attitude to have about cops. Nearly all of the cops out here getting into trouble for doing fucked up stuff have gone through multiple "reforms." It's a racket. "Just one more thing" might make them do a 180? They're just training how to better violate your civil rights.
n0noTAGAinnxw4Yn3wp7 t1_jajyl1z wrote
the glass is full of opportunities to believe in things other than police
ohip13 t1_jalb8o0 wrote
I watched them shoot a teenage girl in the leg with a tear gas canister in June 2020 and then fire at the people trying to pull her out of the street so I can’t say I’m inclined towards optimism.
mckills t1_jajq83k wrote
Do you think police training centers are a new thing that don’t exist already
[deleted] t1_jakb8r4 wrote
[deleted]
timesuck t1_jahuhq4 wrote
> Former Pittsburgh mayor Bill Peduto initially proposed relocating police and emergency services headquarters, the police training academy, animal control, and the city’s vehicle repair shop to the Lincoln-Lemington site. Current Mayor Ed Gainey’s spokesperson Maria Montaño tells City Paper the scope of the project has since narrowed to focus on police training facilities, and that, despite the reduction in scope, the estimated cost of the project remains over $120 million.
When this project was first proposed, it was going to cost $90 million dollars and Dan Gilman said part of the money would come back to the city by getting rid of expensive leases held by the city to store large vehicles and house other departments.
So now, let me get this right. . .the project has increased its cost by $30 million AND now won’t be a facility for other departments as originally promised? We’re building a $120 million Nemacolin for cops when the city can’t fix our bridges or fill potholes?
Fuck all of this shit. This kind of nonsense is why our taxes are so high and we get nothing in return. If the other city services don’t need to be consolidated and can be jettisoned from this plan, then the police don’t need a shining murder mansion on the hill just for them.