Submitted by TonyUncleJohnny412 t3_11sajlb in pittsburgh
The cars then have to pass them.
Comments
Anotherburner42069 t1_jccvrlr wrote
Plus I can generally clear the intersection before the lead car has put down their phone
SewBee_It t1_jccto27 wrote
Also don't want to breathe all that exhaust
Aggravating_Foot_528 t1_jcdemo7 wrote
I do this at certain intersections. Depends on the amount of traffic etc and how narrow it coming up. And if I'm turning or not. If I don't do this, then when I get behind a line of cars at a light I get right in the middle of the lane and then move back to the right after the intersection so I'm not taken out by turning cars or people cutting me off at the other end of the intersection.
nicksloan t1_jccy0oj wrote
Oh wow. I rarely bike, but I’ve always gotten in line with everyone because that seemed safer. The more you know.
chuckie512 t1_jcdovpt wrote
About half of collisions in Allegheny County are red-light rear-ends.
Obviously be aware of the whole situation, but generally you don't want to be last in the line.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfplh6 wrote
In this very sub, over the course of three weeks, you will see posts saying:
A> Speeding is my god-given right as a driver
B> Cyclists need to follow the law
C> Why are cyclists allowed to do this thing that's legal for them to do
I truly do not know what the fuck these people want.
just_an_ordinary_guy t1_jckwko7 wrote
They want cyclists to stop existing and every road to have as many lanes as necessary to allow unimpeded traffic everywhere they go. Every second lost to traffic and bicycles is an infringement upon their personal autonomy.
chuckie512 t1_jcmy2q4 wrote
I have a solution to traffic in the city: if we bulldoze every building for more lanes and more parking then we won't have any more traffic.
Granted we also won't have anywhere to drive to, but why would that matter if there's no traffic?
[deleted] t1_jcedryb wrote
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bill_pgh t1_jcdjtva wrote
As a biker I do it when there’s lots of room. Then I don’t have to worry about people turning right etc. not a good idea when you’re packed in close side by side.
uglybushes t1_jccu43q wrote
Just to upset sensitive car drivers
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfl2ec wrote
So we don't die in squeeze crashes like this lady did.
https://www.wtae.com/article/arrest-in-oakland-crash-that-killed-woman-riding-bike/7479508
This particular thing exemplifies pointless driver rage in this city. Cyclists perform this innocuous act that harms no one in order to keep themselves from getting killed in a rear end crash, and drivers absolutely lose their minds over it. They act like cyclists are somehow doing it at them, instead of doing it to stay safe.
https://www.cbsnews.com/pittsburgh/news/oakland-motorist-bicyclist-road-rage-attack/
As long as drivers act like their commutes are a competition that they have to "win", our roads are never going to get any safer.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcfmt8c wrote
The incident that prompted this post was a cyclist in Sq. Hill going around me at a red light on a residential street when there was nobody else behind me. I then had to drive behind them for a few blocks for no reason. I’m not angry, just wondering why they would do that when there was nobody behind me.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfn9m0 wrote
> The incident that prompted this post was a cyclist in Sq. Hill going around me at a red light on a residential street when there was nobody else behind me.
And there's nothing wrong with the cyclist doing that.
> I then had to drive behind them for a few blocks for no reason. I’m not angry,
Okay.
Just because there was no one behind you when that cyclist filtered up doesn't mean there wouldn't be anyone pulling up behind sooner or later.
Driving is not a competition. You do not have to be first. You do not have to "win". Quit treating it like a competition.
embodiedwoman2 t1_jcixuve wrote
When we have to get to work not an hour late, it actually does matter. Most people don’t drive for recreation we are trying to get to jobs and such.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcj0h0i wrote
Leave earlier, dumbass. Don't make your laziness someone else's problem.
embodiedwoman2 t1_jdaskth wrote
Eeeek so rude for no reason. Cringe.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jdb84yd wrote
Expecting other people to suffer because you can't plan ahead. Cringe.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jdcp2ct wrote
That’s nearly every comment with this guy. Spends his whole day in the Pittsburgh and PA subs attacking people. Doesn’t seem like a happy guy.
[deleted] t1_jcipzhl wrote
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S4ltyInt3ractions t1_jcpe81f wrote
There was something wrong with the cyclist doing that. They were being an unnecessary dickhead
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcq3ts3 wrote
And this is the root of the problem. You, and other drivers, think that a cyclist doing something to protect themselves is being a dickhead. Because drivers in this city are selfish assholes who think their commute is a competition they have to "win".
Cyclists aren't doing it at you, they're doing it to stay safe. Quit thinking everything is about you.
S4ltyInt3ractions t1_jcqc8ec wrote
First off you don't know my bike status I ride in this city. Second, being aware of your surroundings is what keeps you safe not not rigid protocols like some sort of autonomous car. In the instance in reference the cyclist was a dickhead just as in this instance you are as well reddit isn't a competition you have to "win" quit thinking everything revolves around you and stay safe out there.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqrrjc wrote
https://www.cbsnews.com/pittsburgh/news/oakland-motorist-bicyclist-road-rage-attack/
Yeah, the cyclist is the dickhead in this situation.
I'll do what it takes to keep myself safe, including filtering. If that makes me a dickhead to some asshole with terminal carbrain, so be it.
S4ltyInt3ractions t1_jcqt1xo wrote
Yeah the strawman link still makes you a dickhead lol
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqtaij wrote
That dispute was over filtering.
The problem here is that people stuck in their cars see someone moving faster than they are and they get mad over it because it's unfair in their opinion. No more, no less. The arguing over legality is just window dressing for their little baby brains getting mad over being passed.
I don't want to get killed in a squeeze crash so I'm going to filter. Cope and seethe.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqw19u wrote
Maybe people would take your opinion more seriously if you weren’t such an insufferable cunt in literally every comment you post. There’s a reason your history is full of downvotes and arguments.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqwxje wrote
Keep seething.
StreetPedaler t1_jcdsv5v wrote
Have to pass them? In rush hour, biking often takes the same amount of time as driving. The few seconds you take to “have to pass” someone could have easily been spent chillin and you’d get to your destination at the same time, I promise!
I’d like to know why cars pull into the middle of intersections when there’s no room for them to clear it before the light changes.
I drive, bike, and walk. Everyone sucks.
UnaffiliatedOpinion t1_jchvbb3 wrote
> I drive, bike, and walk. Everyone sucks.
Amen to this. Every group feels the need to claim a moral high ground to justify why they should be entitled to special treatment.
We should all be prioritizing "is it safe" and "is it reasonable" as higher priorities than "does it inconvenience me" or even "is it legal" (at least when passing judgement on others).
HomicidalHushPuppy t1_jccqylg wrote
FYI it's called lane filtering, at least when motorcycles do it
Delicious-Newt-5674 t1_jcctipr wrote
Which is illegal in this state
HomicidalHushPuppy t1_jccu7b7 wrote
I found loads of sources that say splitting is illegal but can't find anything about filtering?
Delicious-Newt-5674 t1_jccuebi wrote
Pa vehicle code 3523
HomicidalHushPuppy t1_jccxxjg wrote
Ahh ok, worded as a catch-all. Thanks.
Delicious-Newt-5674 t1_jcd2jlm wrote
Pa loves doing that with codes.
dilladog t1_jcfsdb0 wrote
3304?
Delicious-Newt-5674 t1_jcfsso6 wrote
That's for passing on the right?
dilladog t1_jcft6cd wrote
Wouldn’t that be the same as filtering to a red light?
Delicious-Newt-5674 t1_jcftkjg wrote
No it's only for passing people on the right when they're making a left turn, as long as you're not on a shoulder or berm.
cpr4life8 t1_jcd0le2 wrote
Unfortunately lane filtering is illegal for motorcycles in PA. So is splitting, but I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that until it was legal long enough for car drivers to get used to it. Splitting & filtering are both legal in CA and have been forever. Filtering will be legal in UT soon. I think a few other states are discussing making filtering legal as well.
Filtering protects anyone on two wheels from getting hit from behind and also helps ease traffic congestion.
Big_League227 t1_jcf4uc3 wrote
The only time I was ever hit on my motorcycle was at a stop sign and the yo-yo behind me just bumped into me, but yes, it was startling (only bent my license plate, fortunately.) But when I rode, in traffic at a stop sign or light, I was always taught to move to the left side, within my lane, where I was stopped. That way, I would be right in front of the driver's face behind me (so they would hipefully notice me), and, if a rear end collision was imminent, I would have an escape path closer than being in the center of the lane.
cpr4life8 t1_jcfdvy3 wrote
Sorry that you were hit. Fortunately that has never happened to me. My process is to move to whichever side gives me the best escape route in case someone coming up behind me shows no indication of slowing down. Sometimes the shoulder has plenty of room. Sometimes that's not an option but on the left there's room between cars to shield myself.
I've only had to move into an escape route a handful of times, and in all of those instances the person stopped before hitting anyone or anything But when you're sitting there exposed while stopped, and someone is approaching from behind quickly, it's better to protect yourself from what may have happened rather than regret it later after you've been hit.
I wear a jacket with high viz yellow. There's high viz yellow on my helmet as well. My integrated stop/tail/turn signals are LED. When I brake, the brake light will flash rapidly 3 times before going solid. Sometimes when I stop and someone is approaching from behind I'll squeeze the brake lever a few times to get the light flashing. Especially when I can see they're looking at their phone instead of the road. That seems to help too - but I'm also getting ready to move just in case!
chuckie512 t1_jcdof2n wrote
Penndot pub380 calls out that bikes can.
(EDIT: And that vehicle code explicitly calls out motorcycles, which bicycles are not)
Chapter nine has a whole section on it.
>GETTING THROUGH
TRAFFIC JAMS
Traffic jams do not have to stop
you—that is one of the biggest ad -
van tages of bicycling in the city.
However, in the tight quarters of a
tie-up, take extra care. Stopped cars
in a traffic jam present the same
hazards as parked cars: blindspots,
doors and unpredictable starts and
turns.
If there is an open passing lane,
use it rather than thread between
cars. If the street is completely
plugged, pick your way forward
slowly and with your hands on the
brake levers. Remember, any car
door could open!
If you are in a traffic jam, you
can be sure that the cars will not
move, since they have nowhere to
go. However, if there is an open
driveway or parking space into
which a car could turn, you have to
assume that it will. Look to see
whether the car's front wheels are
turned. Move away from the side of
the car as you pass, and try to get
the driver's attention as you
approach the front of the car.
When cars are stopped, but not
completely bumper to bumper, be
very wary of cars from other lanes
cutting across in the gaps. Stop and
look before you move out into a gap.
Be especially careful if the vehicle
you are passing, like many vans,
does not have a hood you can see
over.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqhr11 wrote
This only applies to “traffic jams” though.
chuckie512 t1_jcqjm6c wrote
What's the law that says they can't?
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqkeie wrote
Are bikes not vehicles that have to follow the traffic laws?
chuckie512 t1_jcqkp0p wrote
Which traffic laws?
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqla13 wrote
Dude you are being intentionally obtuse.
https://www.etownonline.com/sites/g/files/vyhlif3091/f/uploads/pa_bicycle_code_-chapter_35.pdf
Says that bikers are subject to the same duties as cars. I’m not about to find the particular section that says you have to stop at red lights and can’t just pass other cars in non-passing lanes. Like what is your argument? That bikers aren’t subject to the law? Can do whatever they want?
chuckie512 t1_jcqlqu6 wrote
I'm just saying that what you're saying is illegal isn't. You can't even post the law that says it is.
Sorry that a cyclists trying to not die at a red light ruined your day because you were behind them for 3 blocks.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqlzky wrote
Lol ok dude, you’re right, bikers aren’t subject to any laws or regulations. 🤷🏻♂️
chuckie512 t1_jcqmbwp wrote
Fun fact about our government: you can't be subject to a law that doesn't exist.
Hope this helps you pass your elementary school civics test!
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqn2t5 wrote
I’m not about to spend the time finding the exact statute that says vehicles (which bikes are considered per the fucking link above) have to stop at red lights and can’t just cut to the front of the line whenever they want. Feel free to die on the hill that there are no traffic laws. Bizarre.
chuckie512 t1_jcqnfdl wrote
Lol stay mad bro.
I'll be sure to stay in the middle of the lane and pedal extra slow just for you next time I'm in squirrel hill.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcquoas wrote
👍🏻
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqtmb4 wrote
> I’m not about to spend the time finding the exact statute
You've sat here crying about it for three days, so I'm assuming you've already put the time in trying to find the exact statute and couldn't. Because it doesn't exist.
chuckie512 t1_jcqwy6b wrote
Guy probably thinks the bike boxes/advanced stop lines around the city are just green pieces of street art.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqx5qc wrote
The issue here is that I don't think he thinks about it at all. The issue here is "someone is going faster than I am/passing me and that's unfair and makes me big mad."
You see that sort of behavior on the Parkway West going towards Robinson all the time. People will speed and weave through traffic to get to the front of the pack and stay there. Just their lizard brain screaming "I HAVE TO BE FIRST" at them.
Arguing about the legality of it is just window dressing to make his temper tantrum sound reasonable.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqujaq wrote
There’s a link above saying cyclists have to follow the same laws as drivers. Not sure what else I should have to provide but go off king.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqwvl4 wrote
You keep claiming that PennDOT is deliberately encouraging cyclists to do illegal things in their official publications. That's one hell of a claim to make and you've presented nothing that would convince me that PennDOT is actually doing that.
Keep seething about being passed by a cyclist though, because we all know that the actual problem here is that you got big mad about it, not whether or not it's allowed.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcqxp4k wrote
Nobody is “seething” my guy. You come in with a horrible attitude and insult people and expect them to treat you with respect. Don’t know how many times I have to explain that PennDOT says you can lane filter in a “traffic jam,” but it’s clear you don’t want to have a real discussion. We both know you know it’s illegal. I’d respect it a lot more if you just admitted it.
Have a terrible night!
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcqzpbq wrote
> We both know you know it’s illegal.
Then call the cops over it, you big fucking crybaby. Call the cops and tell them you're big mad about a cyclist that delayed you by 18 seconds three days ago.
Or just keep seething, either option is funny to me.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcr6p60 wrote
Lol ok man, keep picking fights with everyone you encounter on the internet. I feel bad for the people who have to be around you in real life. Peace.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcr8hmc wrote
Seethe.
chuckie512 t1_jcqnw11 wrote
And the city is literally installing infrastructure to support cyclists doing it.
Ever see those green painted boxes at the front of the lane at a light? Those are to give cyclists room to wait at the front of the line.
ScrumGuz t1_jcf9yav wrote
Safety, visibility, and keeping the flow of traffic moving. Filtering is legal for cyclists and definitely encouraged. A few years ago a woman died in Oakland after being hit by a driver from behind while waiting at a red light.
lexispots t1_jcd0i1i wrote
Let them go. They move faster and are generally not on their phones delaying traffic.
embodiedwoman2 t1_jcixz2m wrote
They don’t move faster at all
lexispots t1_jcjozkr wrote
Biker to me means motorcycles and crotch rockets, which typically move faster than most vehicles.
JuliaX1984 t1_jcdqig0 wrote
I mean this with 100% sincerity: when the weather gets nicer, rent a bike and ride on a safe road with traffic and traffic lights. You'll understand the instinct.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcdvtcz wrote
I’ll pass.
JuliaX1984 t1_jcdwpj5 wrote
Come on, join the dark side! It's awesome! No need to pay for gas and pumps you full of feel good hormones!
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcjtoid wrote
I have a child, I’m not about to die on the road for no reason.
chuckie512 t1_jcmxrou wrote
Maybe then don't flame a cyclists who's just trying to not die by your hands.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcmzrt1 wrote
Just want everyone to follow the law 🤷🏻♂️
chuckie512 t1_jcn493j wrote
And the law doesn't prohibit cyclists from not dying at an intersection.
JuliaX1984 t1_jcdwk5o wrote
Was that a pun? Sounds exactly like a pun my dad would make, but he's not Internet savvy enough to be on here.
213737isPrime t1_jcdtzl4 wrote
A. for the same reason that motorists obsessively overtake cyclists in traffic, then "force the bikers to have to pass them at the next light anyway". That is, because they can, and they aren't really thinking ahead _at all_. Which one is the "then have to pass them" is just a matter of which side of the lens you're viewing from.
B. for that reason, I generally chose to remain in the order I arrived at *unless* the line was so long it looked like it would take multiple light cycles. In that case, I would try to arrange it to be the last one through on the first cycle, that way I had the road all to myself for the next few minutes. When Irvine St backs up for a 15-20 minute delay at 5 pm, it's just stupid for me to sit there sucking fumes and wasting my time, instead of riding to the front and being gone. It's not little old me causing the backup there, it's all the people in 6 passenger cars, riding all alone.
C. If either one of us has to pass the other twice, we're both doing something wrong.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcdzq20 wrote
Why would a bike have to pass someone when they’re going slower than the average car? Just stay behind them.
As to your second point, we’ll never agree on that. You’re always going to think you should be able to pass people in that scenario, and I’ll always think you should have to wait your turn like everyone else on the road.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfla4a wrote
> Just stay behind them.
Cyclists have no obligation to "just stay behind" anyone. Driving is not a competition. Cyclists filtering ahead aren't doing it just to make you sad. They are doing it so they don't get killed.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcfomj9 wrote
Do you have any source at all to back you up? Lane splitting is illegal in PA.
https://codes.findlaw.com/pa/title-75-pacsa-vehicles/pa-csa-sect-75-3523.html
chuckie512 t1_jchfq0z wrote
When did bikes become motorcycles?
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfp66d wrote
It's posted elsewhere in this very thread that you posted and can see all replies to, my man.
https://old.reddit.com/r/pittsburgh/comments/11sajlb/what_is_the_rationale_when_bikers_go_to_the_front/jcdof2n/
https://www.dot.state.pa.us/public/pubsforms/publications/pub%20380.pdf
Your commute is not a competition. Quit acting like it is.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcfqisz wrote
What am I supposed to be looking at there? You posted a 51 page document.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfqrf0 wrote
You are supposed to look at the permalinked post from reddit user chuckie512 that explains exactly what part of that publication says cyclists can filter.
I'm starting to think that you made this post because you were mad that you were delayed 18 seconds by a cyclist today and you're just playing dumb.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcfsi8a wrote
“These traffic-jam tactics are reasonably safe, but in some cities, it may not be legal for a bicyclist to pass on the right or ride between lanes of traffic.”
How does this ambiguous manual override a statute from the PA legislature?
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfsq28 wrote
Bicycles are not motorcycles, genius. Motorcycle laws don't apply to bicycles. PA statutes that apply to pedalcycles will very specifically say so.
If PennDOT says I can filter, I will filter.
If you've driven over the speed limit today your argument is disingenuous. You don't actually give a fuck about what the law says, you're just mad someone passed you.
Quit acting like your commute is a competition. That sort of behavior gets people killed.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcfusdh wrote
You keep using that word. I don’t think you know what it means.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcfuwt0 wrote
Just drive safely like you promised you'd do when you got your driver's license and quit whining because someone passed you. You aren't the main character.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcg028f wrote
Never said I wouldn’t drive safely you stupid fuck. Your main character comment is ironic. ✌🏻
chuckie512 t1_jchg8e0 wrote
What Pittsburgh ordinance bans it?
They're just covering their butts in case one of the thousands of townships in this state makes a rule that they can't. Pittsburgh doesn't have one.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcjvffp wrote
That post discusses moving through a “traffic jam.” Doesn’t discuss bikes moving to the front of the line at every intersection like you seem to suggest. Bikes can’t just do whatever they want.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jck6tft wrote
Ah, so you are playing dumb.
Do you really think PennDOT would publish illegal advice in an official publication?
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jck751d wrote
I’m saying that the section you cite discusses filtering through a “traffic jam,” where cars are “unable to move.” Not sitting at a traffic light.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcmvimo wrote
Don’t worry, I’ll wait.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcn5ob8 wrote
Do you really think PennDOT would publish illegal advice in an official publication?
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcn6h04 wrote
As I said before, nothing in that manual permits what you’re taking about lol
[deleted] t1_jcn9ai4 wrote
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TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcna5og wrote
Bikes are considered vehicles. Are cars allowed to just skip past other cars because they don’t want to wait? People like you are why everyone hates bikers lmao.
“Pennsylvania's Vehicle Code considers "pedalcycles" as vehicles and provides that every person riding a pedalcycle upon a roadway shall be granted all of the rights and responsibilities applicable to a driver of a vehicle, with certain exceptions discussed below.”
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcnagqj wrote
> Bikes are considered vehicles
Statutes that apply to pedalcycles specifically mention pedalcycles, dingdong.
https://www.legis.state.pa.us/WU01/LI/LI/CT/HTM/75/00.035..HTM
Click on those words up there and hit control F, and type "pedalcycles" for an example.
I can't believe you're this stupid, so I'm going to assume that you're still mad about being made some cyclist's bitch two days later. Get over it and get a life.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnb21y wrote
“Get a life” from the dude arguing with people about PA turnpike road tolls 😂😂😭
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcnbh6f wrote
You're crying about a cyclist owning your ass two days ago. 😂😂😭
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnaxck wrote
Funny how you were so adamant that it’s not a “competition” but once you get proven demonstrably wrong that facade completely crumbles lol.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcnb8lx wrote
Your entire argument rests on the idea that PennDOT is deliberately and willfully telling people to do illegal shit in their manuals.
You have an assumed natural right to move under your own power in western jurisprudence. That which isn't explicitly banned is permitted. The law doesn't need to explicitly say I can filter on a bicycle; if it isn't banned, it's permitted.
You keep pretending to not understand this despite an average twelve year old child in Pennsylvania understanding it.
You're so mad about a bicyclist passing you two days ago that you're pissing your time away today, two days later, arguing about it. Get a life.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnbqn5 wrote
What part of bikes are vehicles don’t you understand dude? You’re acting like traffic laws don’t exist. I genuinely don’t understand your point. Are bikes vehicles or not?
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcnbv90 wrote
Do you think PennDOT is intentionally telling bicyclists to break the law in their publications or not?
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnckj7 wrote
Nothing in that publication says you can just go to the front of the line at every light my guy. It says in “traffic jams” you can. Jesus fucking Christ.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcnd4y7 wrote
The term "traffic jam" has no legal meaning, and the manual offers no definition. The manual is clearly referring to instances where cars are stopped.
I can tell that you have no fucking idea what you're talking about because you don't understand this. Terms like "traffic jam" are defined in a legal context when they're used in legal documents. What you think is a "traffic jam" is irrelevant.
Do you think PennDOT is intentionally telling bicyclists to break the law in their publications or not?
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcndu59 wrote
Today I learned that sitting at a red light by myself constitutes a traffic jam. Not gonna keep arguing with someone making clearly bad faith points.
[deleted] t1_jcndxml wrote
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69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcnf03v wrote
> Today I learned that sitting at a red light by myself constitutes a traffic jam.
Show me where the state defines what a "traffic jam" is. The definition in your head doesn't count.
Your entire argument rests on the idea that PennDOT is deliberately telling cyclists to break the law in their official publications. That is an absurd assertion to make.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcps3y3 wrote
Love how you say that what I think a traffic jam is is irrelevant, but then go on to define traffic jam in the most absurd manner possible. 😂
chuckie512 t1_jcng5vz wrote
Weird, what's the ordinance that they can't?
Fun fact about our country, you can't be guilty of a crime that doesn't exist.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcngj9j wrote
So bikes aren’t vehicles now? Vehicles don’t have to obey traffic laws? This argument is so dumb.
chuckie512 t1_jcnh7h1 wrote
What's the law that says they can't filter at the light? Because the only one mentioned in this thread is about motorcycles filtering. Penndot actively encourages bikes as a way to get through city traffic.
They're just trying not to get killed by ignorant people like you, who feel that being behind a cyclist for two blocks is such an inconvenience you have to flame them online.
If you're going to say it's against the law as your sole argument why 5 min of your time is worth someone's life, at least post the law.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnhbj6 wrote
PennDOT says you can do it in a “traffic jam.”
chuckie512 t1_jcnho3j wrote
Post the damn law, since it's your only argument.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnjeam wrote
Someone else posted it above. Feel free to take a look.
chuckie512 t1_jcnkgd8 wrote
There's no applicable law in this thread.
Sorry 5 minutes of your life can make you this pissed off. Just hope you don't pass me within arms length of your mirror.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnltzo wrote
Im not mad my friend, just curious as to the reasoning. I’ve never advocated for violence against cyclists or dangerous driving in any of my comments. Just looking for reasoning based on something beyond “we feel like we should be able to do this” and not seeing it.
chuckie512 t1_jcno0wb wrote
You have your reasoning, it's the top comment.
The most dangerous place on the road for a cyclists is the last spot in line at a red light, because drivers are inattentive. Which is why half of collisions in Allegheny county are red-light rear-ends.
TonyUncleJohnny412 OP t1_jcnpufp wrote
Fair enough
213737isPrime t1_jcj2nu1 wrote
Bikes in the city are as fast or faster than the average car. (especially e-bikes).
It's been tested quite a bit.
Cars have more horsepower but the constraints of the environment prevent that power from being used.
I literally beat a McLaren down Wilkins one day (yeah, the driver probably didn't even know it was a competition;). Sure, that's essentially a race car, but on a dirt road it could be beat by a donkey cart. Same in the city. Bikes are optimized for city surface streets, cars for highways and rural travel.
[deleted] t1_jcjq3ie wrote
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KentuckYSnow t1_jcdbn0g wrote
If you have some situation awareness, you can expect that guy on the bike you just passed to try to snake up to the front of the line at a red light and prevent it by positioning your car close to the curb or a parked vehicle, and close to the car in front you. The cyclist will need to risk passing on the left or the other side of the road to get in front. Bonus points if you can roll some coal while he's back there.
69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jcflbws wrote
You really go out of your way to be the biggest prick in this sub, don't you?
NSlocal t1_jcgucnp wrote
Ha, that's what bar ends are for.
Biscuit_bell t1_jccqhmd wrote
Mostly visibility. A biker at the front of a line of cars is easier to see for the cars behind them, and to be seen by oncoming and cross traffic. Drivers have a tendency to miss bikers stopped in the middle of a line of cars and crush them into the car in front of them.