1 year old leaking roof

Submitted by berrylover6020 t3_zphoun in pittsburgh

Backstory: We bought our house in March 2022. We lived 0.2 miles away and moved down the street to a larger house. We originally put in an offer but were outbid. The person who outbid us backed out over a sewer line repair and the sellers contacted us. We ultimately got the house. This is when the market was insane and it was almost impossible to get a house so we had to agree to use the first buyers inspection reports. Turns out their home inspector wasn’t great and as we’ve lived here we have come across a lot of obvious misses. But the biggest we have just learned was the new roof installed in Jan 2021. I can confirm it is a new roof and was installed then as I often drove by and saw it happening. After moving in we discovered the yard was full of roofing debris, nails, shingles, and trash. Since then we have been questioning the quality of work performed.

Current: When we were hanging Christmas lights we noticed the one gutter we could see into was full of roofing nails and shingle debris. We had a guy up the street who cleans gutters and also happens to be a roofer come to clean the gutters out for us. He said they were all filled with roofing debris, which he noted is illegal because it can get into the storm sewers. He also noted the flashing didn’t all appear to have been replaced and that many shingles have nails popping up. Additionally our house had the attic expanded with dormers to create living space and that 3rd floor roof, which is flat, has shingles (cannot be seen from ground level so we had no idea it was shingles up there instead of a standard flat roof). This was all very disappointing news to learn as we thought we were set on a roof for years to come. But to top it all off, it started leaking this weekend in the first floor family room which is an addition over a garage so it has roof directly above it.

I’m here to ask if anyone knows if we have any legal action available to us against the contractor? We didn’t hire him, the sellers did, they signed the contract and paid him. I contacted the sellers and asked about the warranty and they sent the contract, a Microsoft word document, that has no mention of a warranty. Im thinking we are basically screwed and will need to get a new roof. I plan to contact our insurance broker to discuss homeowners options tomorrow. If only money grew on trees.

Thank you from a very stressed homeowner.

EDIT: House was not a flip, current owners had lived here since 2018. They had a roof leak in the one bedroom so knew they had to repair that and replace the roof before listing.

EDIT TO ADD: We are not looking to go after the sellers or the home inspector. I am aware we agreed to terms and the transaction closed and thats that. I am more interested in if we are able to hold the roofer accountable for bad work, especially since we weren’t the ones who hired them/signed the contract. The sellers responded promptly to my request for the roofers info and sent the contract to us immediately.

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Vast-Support-1466 t1_j0t8wof wrote

I'm a Realtor, and would happy to review all the parameters with you and offer my advice for resolution.

Not offering services for payment. I get off on this stuff, and I couldn't legally anyway!

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vwpmq wrote

Thank you! I truly don’t think there is much that can be done in regard to the real estate transaction. I just don’t know how much authority we have to go after a bad roofer when we weren’t the ones who signed the contract. I did contact the borough and left a message to see if a permit was required and if one was obtained. I know a lot of places don’t for replacing existing roofs, but thought thats a easy check I can make on my own.

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Maumee-Issues t1_j0t857z wrote

You can call the alleghany County bar association and they could set you up with someone in this area. Check and see and they could at least tell you your options and how much it would cost for legal action.

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seg321 t1_j0sze1a wrote

Sure you can call the company and complain. I'm sure they will gladly take your money to work on it. Sue them and you will probably spend a lot of money. If you win, it will be a hollow victory because the owner technically has nothing to his name. Pay for a repair and talk to legit companies....an almost impossible task in itself. You are ultimately on the hook for it so come up with a plan of action based on that assumption.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0t3omq wrote

Ha yeah, i’d never trust the original company to work on it again. It just sucks you can do such awful work, get paid, and have no ramifications. I’m hoping our homeowners should at least pay for the amount to fix the leak and damage to our interior ceiling. We luckily do have a reliable roofer we trust and have used for 8 years coming in the next week or so to look everything over himself.

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Urbanspy87 t1_j0ty5nl wrote

I don't see why the previous homeowners would pay. It isn't like you can prove they intentionally misled you, just the opposite, they were probably conned themselves. Unless you have a home warranty, this expense is going to be on you

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0uvl3n wrote

I was referring to my homeowners insurance not the prior homeowners. But unfortunately no home warranty either

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mmphoto412 t1_j0vk3eg wrote

Your right in not trusting whoever did the roof to come back and make repairs.

You'll have as much luck getting the previous owners to pay for repairs as you will for getting blood out of a stone. Its on you to do your due diligence, thats why home inspections are such an important part of the home buying process. FWW, you did not have you use the previous inspection. The seller called you out of some bit of desperation, after a seller backed out. You didnt realize it, but you had the upper hand in that negotiation, especially considering the previous buyer backed out over repairs.

The only way you can go after the seller, is if they knowingly hid something from you.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vw21c wrote

We are not looking to go after the sellers or the home inspector. I am aware we agreed to terms and the transaction closed and thats that. I am more interested in if we are able to hold the roofer accountable for bad work, especially since we weren’t the ones who hired them/signed the contract. The sellers responded promptly to my request for the roofers info and sent the contract to us immediately.

As for us having the upper hand I have to respectfully disagree. The market in early 2022 was so far in the sellers favor, buyers had nothing to negotiate with. We were lucky to even get a copy of the prior bid winners inspection report. Mostly the only offers being accepted on houses for awhile were ones without inspections and a lot without appraisal contingencies. The sellers were not left too desperate after they other buyers backed out, they could have re-listed and honestly gotten more than we paid. They did do us a favor by reaching back out to us first.

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kistner t1_j0t55i1 wrote

Did you get a home warranty when you bought? They are very common these days.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0uvtsh wrote

No, unfortunately. The market at that time was so insane those weren’t offered. And when we bought our first house 8 years ago we bought one ourselves, from a reputable company, and they went out of business before our coverage period ended and we lost our money and did end up having things we could have claimed. So we opted to not buy one this time around

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kistner t1_j0vferd wrote

Was your house listed with a real estate company when you bought it? If you'd like me to look it over I can. I am a local real estate broker.

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Parking_Elephant_848 t1_j0tu3lq wrote

Contact your insurance company and get an inspection. It may be covered (with your deductible). Then bring the contractor to court. Also the home inspector. Also find out if the home inspector and roofing company know each other.

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hypotenoos t1_j0ue1n9 wrote

The home inspector really has no obligation to them as he did not prepare the report for their use.

Probably a good chance the report has a paragraph in it regarding intended use and intended users- which probably doesn’t include the seller or these buyers.

Same goes for the contractor when there was apparently no warranty provided to the customer let alone the next owner.

The right person to pursue if anyone is the seller.

They had to provide a seller disclosure which is essentially a warranty that they are not aware of issues and/or a disclosure of those they do know of. It also covers if proper permits were pulled.

If no permit in the roof but they claimed to have pulled one, that’s a problem for the seller.

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Courageous_Chameleon t1_j0utmo0 wrote

They'd have no case against the seller. The roof was replaced in January. OP bought the house in March and agreed to use the old inspection report. The sellers would just say (whether it's true or not), "We had no idea there was a problem. The roof was just replaced and the inspection report said it was fine." OP would have to be able to prove the seller knew the work was shoddy.

I'm not a lawyer, but I went through the same thing as OP, so I heard this from several lawyers I consulted.

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hypotenoos t1_j0uu2tc wrote

If they disclose it was replaced and state that permits were pulled or were not due to not being required- they are- then they have an issue.

If they disclose it was replaced and say nothing on permits, then it’s more gray but still a problem.

Thing sounds like a flip situation and the seller disclosures on those tend to be mine fields.

And again the inspection was done for the other buyer, not the seller. Another murky area.

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kistner t1_j0vio1l wrote

Everything you noted is what I would surmise as well. The permit thing is iffy; a lot of times no permit is required to replace an existing item like a roof (or windows, or a furnace, etc).

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hypotenoos t1_j0vk2oz wrote

I think most areas around here and the City require a permit for a new roof anymore unless it’s a re-roof over existing. Once you tear off it tends to be a permit.

In the City I believe it’s considered a “minor alteration” so long as nothing structural is modified but it’s still a permitted item.

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kistner t1_j0vom1o wrote

City definitely does. I don't think that's universal tho. I've never been required to get a permit for roofing on several houses and rentals (not in City of Pgh).

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hypotenoos t1_j0vp88a wrote

Enforcement is definitely varied throughout the area, but I think it also depends on who you ask.

A lot of contractors might tell you it’s not required, but it might be a different story at the code enforcement office.

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kistner t1_j0vvz5s wrote

I don't trust contractors to do what they should because in my experience they usually don't. I have verified not needing a permit for replacement of like items. As a real estate professional I can't let myself be cited for something ridiculous.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vxj23 wrote

I contacted our borough and left a message asking if permits are required for new roofs. Waiting to hear back. If they are, I do not believe they obtained one per the seller disclosure, but they may not have been required to.

If no permit is required, I don’t think there is anything else we can go after the sellers for (just my non-legal educated guess). I think the main action here is going after the contractor but not sure thats possible when we didn’t hire/sign the contract.

Have calls in for roofers to give use multiple estimates and opinions. Called our insurance broker today and she said to wait for that info and then we can file a claim. She also advised seeking possible legal advice for going after the contractor because a 1 year old roof, with no storm damage, should not be leaking if properly installed.

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kistner t1_j0vz0ky wrote

When you talk to them they should be able to verify if one was issued, in addition to your other questions.

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GburgG t1_j0txdl2 wrote

Just wanted to share to commiserate a bit, we also bought a house in March 2022 and the roof started leaking in April. Roof was from 2015.

It ended up being that when the previous homeowner had the siding replaced in 2021, the contractors screwed their pump jacks right into the roof and through the shingles in 10 spots. They filled the holes with brown caulk.

Took three roofing companies looking at the roof for them to even find these holes but we finally got the shingles replaced in November right after Thanksgiving and before this constant wet weather. Went with the company who’s guy found the holes and we were really pleased with their work!

Buying a home in 2021 and 2022 was a crapshoot. And I’d say 7/10 contractor in Pittsburgh are either not good, cut corners, or do things 25 years out of date, so always use diligence when choosing one!

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vzguu wrote

Its amazing how many awful contractors there are. And its even worse they all keep getting away with it! Im sorry you went through similar, it sucks.

And you are so right, buying a house in 2021-2022 was awful. The sellers had all the power and if you were lucky enough to get a bid accepted you basically had to agree to anything.

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kds5065 t1_j0txolj wrote

Very sorry to hear this. Which roofing contractor did that bad job?

I had my roof replaced in March of this year. I'm really hoping it wasn't them.

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-Milky t1_j0ueixo wrote

Ugh this sucks so much to hear. We had a super similar experience. Closed on 2/18 and the roof leaked on 2/19. We managed to figure out who did the roof originally (DM for name) and contacted him. He was a “handyman” who subcontracted the work out and it was terrible when we had real roofers look at it.

After living with it for a year and constantly asking the original roofer to come out and him “doing repairs (aka caulking a seam)” or blaming someone else’s work, we were going to bite the bullet for a full replace through a reputable company. He said he would do the replace himself since he always backed his work. But we had to threaten him with going to the BBB and AG since he delayed for another two months. He did end up actually showing up with some subcontracted roofers who had a business and they replaced the shingles and redid the chimney flashings which were wrong originally.

This was about 6 months ago and so far so good. Our next house will definitely have a roof inspection done by a roofing company.

Wish you the best!

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vy5ft wrote

Im so sorry to hear you had a similar experience! Its so nerve-wracking trusting someone to do a job that you have no expertise in and costs so much! I’ve spent the day searching roofers to try and a find a couple to add to our list to get estimates from. This is not an expected expense so really want to make sure we end up with the best quality and price

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-Milky t1_j0vypcg wrote

Resnick roofing seemed to be super reliable and reputable. They were definitely on the highest end of the spectrum but seemed to do quality work. We had them inspect other areas of our attic/roof once it was fixed (more ventilation) and they said not to worry about it when they could’ve easily recommended pricey upgrades which I really respected too.

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hypotenoos t1_j0uen9b wrote

Look at the seller disclosure. See what the sellers actually claimed on that document in regards to the roof.

Do they say it was replaced? Did they get a permit? Did they disclose any current or prior roof issues?

If they didn’t do any of the above the seller is who you should be pursuing.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vzxj0 wrote

They did disclose prior roof issues, that is why they got a new roof before listing. I know it was replaced because I saw it happening when driving by since the house is just down the street of our old home. Checking into permits now with the borough!

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hypotenoos t1_j0w0rlp wrote

That’s all you can do at this point. Try to verify if what was claimed is what actually happened.

Which borough if you don’t mind?

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burritoace t1_j0uihpk wrote

Was any of this noted in your inspection report from your purchase? I see no reason this isn't fully on you, unfortunately. This is the kind of risk one incurs when buying a property.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0vyrxp wrote

No, nothing negative about the roof was noted on the report. I know it is a risk when buying a property, we were previous homeowners for 8 years prior to this. Im just frustrated an inspector could miss hundreds of roofing nails and shingle debris in the gutters which would have raised a red flag for me that the roof was not done by a reputable company. But being familiar with how home inspectors work, its pretty hard to legally fault them on anything. Im more interested in faulting the roofer for a shoddy job.

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burritoace t1_j0x2qcw wrote

There is no realistic chance you're going to get something out of the roofer here

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odog9797 t1_j0vktqn wrote

All the realtors around here are in cahoots with the lenders and home inspectors. Get individual inspections for all home systems.

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Formal_Development_4 t1_j0w3sn1 wrote

Never trust the inspectors recommended by realtors. I swear they're in cahoots to get a sale. Contact an inspector on your own. I have heard of stuff like this so many times.

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iSoReddit t1_j0tktv3 wrote

You have about two years to sue iirc as I had a similar problem in the 2010s and looked it up and I was just out of that time period. Shitty roofers abound, had similar problems with shingles Improperly added to a roof with a low slope angle, and badly weaved together where slopes met. The best but was they covered a big hole where a chimney used to be with just shingles so if anyone had stepped on the spot they would have fallen through.

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berrylover6020 OP t1_j0w1ind wrote

Oh hey, they covered an old vent or attic fan hole on the 3rd floor with just shingles that we discovered when we took the ceiling down the replace it!

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