Just a person who cares

Submitted by AGirlsThoughts_ t3_zkgdu3 in providence

What is wrong with all the people in this state who have no empathy for the homeless community. Disgusted that so many would prefer that people DIE before the state extends any kind of support.

ALSO, what McKee did last week is not how it appears in the media. That man moved people from where they were staying, making false statements that they would be taken to a shelter but refused to disclose which. THEN people were taken to hotels and told they could stay for “a couple of weeks” what’s the plan after that? I’ll tell you what nothing because there are simply NO BEDS AVAILABLE & HOUSING IS TOO EXPENSIVE

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BOKEH_BALLS t1_izznj9r wrote

We live in the United States which has allowed 1,000,000+ die from a preventable illness in order to make money and boost sales. A country which has bombed the rest of the globe for the last 70 years and displaced/murdered tens of millions. Why do you expect empathy from such a place?

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AGirlsThoughts_ OP t1_izzuyhu wrote

You’re absolutely right I’m just tired of the same political bullshit year after year you know

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LilOrganicCoconut t1_j03fawr wrote

Your frustration is heard. I’m wrapping up work for a DEI org in the state that runs workshops on teaching empathy, anti - racism, etc. The CEO just fired me for requesting disability accommodation. This is an org that partners with public schools, is politically active in RI, and receives many grants from high profile donors… and yet, I am one of many employees who have been retaliated and discriminated against. All to say, I expect empathy from absolutely no one but am grateful when it’s given. So even those “doing the work” aren’t actually walking as they talk.

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dionidium t1_j0l6zxo wrote

This sophomoric anti-Americanism really has no place here and it’s going to have the opposite of its intended effect, anyway. You’re not going to get literally anybody more interested in helping the homeless with this trite rant.

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BOKEH_BALLS t1_j0ng4kx wrote

The point is nobody is going to help the homeless bc this country sustains itself on the homeless and the poor. Might as well give up the humanitarian façade. It's funny how averse most Americans are to the truth and reality.

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Moonracerrex t1_izznl9e wrote

Agreed, but camping at the state house in winter is also not a long term solution.

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commandantskip t1_izzrjbw wrote

Agreed, but there doesn't appear to be a long term solution in place. It's a circular issue.

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dionidium t1_j0l7zvi wrote

The long-term solution is the solution that nobody wants, which is to allow a whole bunch more housing of all types and forms. I’m not talking about an “affordable housing project” here or there. I’m talking about permitting the construction of tens or hundreds of thousands of new market rate units of all shapes and sizes. Allow SROs. Allow triple-deckers again. Allow dense, small, cheap housing.

Do you want this on your block? Do you want somebody to tear down the single family home on the lot next to you and build a 50 unit apartment on it? Do you want your block of single-family homes to be demolished and turned into triple-deckers?

Everybody says they want to do something about the cost of housing, but nobody wants it on their street. Nobody wants it on their block. Nobody wants it in their neighborhood.

Imagine you’re a 46 year old guy with a criminal record and a manageable heroin addiction. Realistically, where are you going to live? Where people like this lived in the past is an SRO. Cheap, single rooms often with shared kitchens and bathrooms. It’s not luxurious, but it’s better than the street.

And it’s basically illegal to build. And if somebody proposed one on your block, the statistical likelihood is that you would oppose it. So people talk about cheaper housing, but for the most part, they are not at all serious about doing what it would take to make that happen over time.

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whatsaphoto t1_j01rnlc wrote

Right. I understand the optics of the situation aren't great, but jesus what else did you expect to happen? Shits about to get real cold real fast. Allowing people to camp out on marble and brick right outside the state house was just not an acceptable option when there are warming stations at just about every couple miles throughout the city and beyond.

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AhChingados t1_j01u2q9 wrote

Remember this happened last year after promises to find solutions were made. Everything was forgotten until this year. The approach seems to be “out of sight out of mind” and I think they are trying to keep it “in sight”.

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frenetix t1_izzufd6 wrote

"Rhode Island has dedicated $221 million of the $1.1 billion in “American Rescue Plan Act” (ARPA) State Fiscal Recovery funds it received toward affordable housing and homelessness prevention in its fiscal year (FY) 2023 budget. The investment builds on an initial allocation of $29 million for housing that was approved by state lawmakers in January 2022, bringing Rhode Island’s total investment to $250 million, or nearly one-quarter of the state’s ARPA allocation." -- National Low Income Housing Coalition

I wonder where that money is going.

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Proper_Boss523 t1_j006a93 wrote

i can assure that it's not being spent wisely or efficiently.

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Parlor-soldier t1_j006w0u wrote

Definitely wasn’t spent on vetting the RI Energy contract. We know that much.

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Alphanerd0515 t1_j00mvz8 wrote

Rhode Island housing provided some of the funds to renovate the Superman’s building for affordable housing… don’t think that’s going to happen

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AhChingados t1_j01tsoj wrote

Affordable in this case meant 5% of units for people making $42,000 per year and 5% for people making $42,000-72,000 per year. You should watch the video with Joan Ryan’s smug face dismissing people testifying against it. Or how Goncalves talked about homelessness to justify pardoning taxes for this building. Our city council is just a bunch of puppets.

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Hanamii- t1_j02lrj3 wrote

About $25 million is going to Newport Housing for the construction of 6 new multi-family townhouses in Newport

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jakejanobs t1_j02ra44 wrote

That’s awesome, Newport has a massive housing shortage and more people are becoming homeless by the month. Anywhere to find more information on that?

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Hanamii- t1_j03989b wrote

It’s awesome but it’s not any additional homes lol, they are knocking down existing town houses and just constructing new ones

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Hanamii- t1_j038q94 wrote

Try googling “Newport Housing Authority Park Holm Phase IV”

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OpticalFlatulence t1_j006t10 wrote

The Mathewson St Church feeds the homeless for an early dinner from 330 to 500 PM on Fridays and from 700 to 900 AM on Sunday mornings. They have a need for help on most days.

You can find more information here: https://www.mathewsonstreetchurch.org/

Please register if it says so on the website. I'll be there to help out. Bring friends if you can, and let's build out this network that is trying to help the people who need it most.

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mrs_peterparker t1_izzz7sl wrote

I agree with you on this…how can we just treat people like trash? Broke my heart when I walked around KP last week and saw homeless people huddled near doorways of buildings like come on man.

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radioflea t1_j00qcmv wrote

We have space around the state (memorial hospital for example) where permanent housing could be easily established.

The state has the most money we’ve ever had and yet the state still can’t get out of its own way.

In addition to housing we also need to put some focus on workforce development. I realize not every homeless individual would be eligible for this but many could benefit from job carving.

This is just one example of creating a workforce and simultaneously addressing a sanitation issues: https://www.governing.com/work/harris-county-looks-to-expand-homeless-payment-program

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Moonracerrex t1_j022eem wrote

When that has been attempted before (NyLo) the neighbors lost their minds.

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radioflea t1_j025w1k wrote

Speaking from personal experience a big part of a new program is how it’s rolled out to the community. I’m not surprised to hear it wasn’t well received in Warwick, I wouldn’t consider that part of the state to be progressive.

Nearly every city/town in the state now has a homeless population and could benefit from permanent housing. If housing is established they also have to also pair it with medical, education, and workforce opportunities.

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MusicNerdDavid t1_j01og2i wrote

I work at Eastside Marketplace and I see so many homeless people who live in tents behind us on the bike path. It's very sad.

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canibringmydog t1_j028yvm wrote

I don’t know. Some of the people I know here have so little, and yet they have no empathy for people with even less. It’s so hard for people with a level head, no addiction, no mental illness, a family support system, a job, a home, friggen food… I can’t imagine what it’s like to have none of that. And then have everyone around you think you are the problem. Bananas.

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nixiedust t1_j03430w wrote

We are a country that judges success by the bottom line. How much profit we generate. It only helps our numbers to slaughter the poor.

Look at countries that grade themselves on quality of life. We could have that, but most Americans will bitch about taxes before improving the country for anyone but themselves. That's unfettered capitalism and it blows. I believe there is a better way, and I'm not even saying socialism per se, but it won't happen here as long as there are ultra-rich people and poor people who worship them. The system is currently working as intended.

Anyway, sorry this isn't Providence-specific but most states aren't doing any better.

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Locksmith-Pitiful t1_j01ohrw wrote

McKee once again shows how he's low-key a Republican. But hey, this is what people in the state wanted. Progressives are constantly shut down and people vote defensively here... nothing will ever change in this fucking state.

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acacase t1_j01seg7 wrote

Most elected democrats in RI are low key republicans. It’s an illusion that we are a blue state.

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Fgw_wolf t1_j02z1lc wrote

I feel like that’s something we could probably fix though.

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SgtRockyWalrus t1_j01uebf wrote

The alternative was a non-RI transplant con-artist who had no business trying to run for Governor.

McKee was an extremely weak candidate, but RI repubs ran a garbage candidate.

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Locksmith-Pitiful t1_j01wa8u wrote

There were many other candidates other than Mckee and Kalus. It's unfortunate that most RI'ers only saw them.

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Fgw_wolf t1_j02bii4 wrote

This is really the thing that needs fixing.

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Locksmith-Pitiful t1_j02c7h1 wrote

It's weird. When I voted, I saw many other names... Folks seem to think McKee was the only democrat running.

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Proof-Variation7005 t1_j02vnhj wrote

There is not a single person in the state that thought McKee was the only Democrat running. People who've been in comas for years could still name "the CVS lady with all the commercials" if you pressed them.

Hence why McKee barely squeaked out a plurality in a low-turnout primary against a field of 4 flawed candidates who didn't really have great campaigns.

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Locksmith-Pitiful t1_j02xew3 wrote

My experience was "if you don't vote for mckee, another person might get elected and lose to the Republican" and "there's others besides mckee? I don't know or care."

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Proof-Variation7005 t1_j032vla wrote

I'm sure people had opinions but I think nearly 7/10 democratic voters not voting for McKee spot volumes and just the low turnout in general.

McKee was about as vulnerable as any primary candidate could be. He just rode a slow wave of indifference past weak competition. If Foulkes had even 10 seconds worth of public policy experience or 1 of the 2 no-chance protest candidates realized the stakes and drops out? I don't think McKee wins.

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jakejanobs t1_j02tqsx wrote

The recent homelessness crisis was just discussed in this article in The Atlantic. TLDR: high rates of homelessness is caused by the high price of housing. US cities with high rates of poverty, drug use, and mental illness also have the lowest rates of homelessness, so the problem isn’t caused by those. Most homeless people are locals who have been in the area for a long time, so the idea that they moved here because we treat them better is also baseless. Legalizing more types of naturally affordable housing would mostly fix the crisis and help the rest of people struggling with high rent. An apartment block on your street might be an eyesore, but it’s a hell of a lot better than a tent city

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FrutaFertil t1_j02u435 wrote

I saw a car on the East Side deliberately run over a homeless man and then drive off. I circled back to find the victim while I was on the phone with 911 and the offending driver had fled the scene. The cop who came to “investigate” literally said “nothing to see here”.

So yeah I would say the people here don’t care. But they sure do like to look like they care.

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abovaveragefox t1_j03qowq wrote

It comes down to this. Anyone that wants to help the homeless is actually free to do that. Open your door and get them back on their feet. Don't rely on the state to do it. Be the change that you want to see. If people don't care as much as you do to stop homelessness then they should be taken out of the equation of solving the problem.

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Parlor-soldier t1_j01w2y8 wrote

I’d like to take a moment to mention the bike lane for some reason.

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nixnaught t1_j07bi0u wrote

I've been busy both with work and life in general as of late and haven't been able to keep up with local news like I would like, so I admit I am not as knowledgeable about the whole situation as I would like... But does this also play into the VA hospital on Chalkstone Ave expanding their fencing further into Davis Park so that it now runs through what used to be the homeless camp that was located on top of the hill at the corner of Pleasant Valley Pkwy (Raymond St) and Valley St?

I was floored when I saw them putting that new fence up the hill and what appears to be through the middle of where that camp is. That camp was the perfect place - not visible from the street(s) so no one would bitch about it being there AND secluded from any assholes who may have wanted to mess with them, yet central enough that anyone staying there still had access to the local area/public transit.

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Proof-Variation7005 t1_j02tya2 wrote

>Disgusted that so many would prefer that people DIE before the state extends any kind of support.

Are these people in the room with you now?

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mightynifty_2 t1_j02yo5d wrote

I think a lot of it is the harassment some have faced from some homeless people here and there making them look bad as well as the false notion that they're all just lazy and refuse to work. The thing is, that's not entirely untrue. I know some people who complain about the cost of housing yet refuse to consider living with a roommate or simply living outside of the city.

None of this excuses a lack of empathy or the kind of hatred and vitriol directed at the homeless population in this state. Instead, I think a good solution would be to find out which towns need extra help with work and create homeless shelters to give free or extremely cheap housing to people where they're needed (as well as free transit). It wouldn't fix everything, but it could help out a lot of people.

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Mountain_Bill5743 t1_j057clo wrote

I mean, to be fair, even the roommate costs are pretty untenable. For years, it was easy to find a one roommate situation for ~600ish per person and wages were manageable. This was in a desirable enough neighborhood. Now, that same living situation is 1k minimum in an undesirable neighborhood. I see people looking for roommates in a run down 4 bedroom at 800/per person. Yeah, that works for college kids, but most of those people don't want to be living with a 40 year old. It also weirdly doesn't get any better if you move out of the city unless you move into rural Connecticut (or maybe Fall River?).

I honestly have no idea how hourly wage workers do it-- how many bedrooms can you fit into 1 house to lower costs? I have absolutely no idea how middle class single parents do it because you'd need to make close to 6 figures to afford a 2 bedroom and $250/mo utilities.

I can't really fault anyone complaining when it's a lot more than tightening the belt and cutting back.

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Cycledrome t1_j033hht wrote

There is plenty of help available for those who want it. All these people do is wallow in squalor and abuse drugs and alcohol. Take a stroll along the bike path by the Seekonk River sometime. The area was cleaned up beautifully this summer by many hard working volunteers and within just a couple of months it’s been befouled with refuse again.

It’s time we became less tolerant of public degeneracy like this.

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Ernesto401 t1_j01x41c wrote

They shouldn’t be on the state house grounds they should go somewhere else.

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leavingthecold t1_j02e8rk wrote

While I do have sincere empathy for certain homeless people such as handicapped, diagnosed mental illness, loss of employment, ageism, etc. There are a bunch of people that are homeless currently that have made really bad decisions for themselves that I really don't have any empathy for.

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riotous_jocundity t1_j02fm72 wrote

Lots of people make really bad decisions for themselves at various points in their lives. But people who start out wealthier, with a stable family and support system, access to education and healthcare (including mental healthcare), are far more likely to be able to recover from those mistakes without serious consequences.

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leavingthecold t1_j02klg7 wrote

I definitely don't feel sorry those that came from well to do families. Oddly enough I think the influx of homeless I have seen in the past 10-15 years coming into Providence are all from the suburbs.

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airforcereserve t1_j01yfo4 wrote

I'd rather the money go to Ukraine. The last thing a 40 year old fentanyl junkie ex-con wants is to pay bills.

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LilOrganicCoconut t1_j03e4yw wrote

Uhhhhh, this isn’t the hot take you think it is. You can extend empathy to a country being ravaged by an unjust war but not for your neighbors, all fighting every day, in front of you? The US didn’t build a system to support or sustain the most marginalized. As someone who has been unhoused, due to an incredibly abusive household, I thank God that there are kinder people than you in this world. Gain perspective outside of your limited views.

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Moltoconfusion t1_izzzteh wrote

The people removed from the state house weren't homeless, they were protesting or some garbage. This happened earlier in the year. Actual homeless people are sleeping in the parks. On the border of state and city property. Around India point park, Gano st park, behind East Market, off the bike path. Etc etc etc.

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AGirlsThoughts_ OP t1_j00081i wrote

That’s false and protesting isn’t garbage, find another post to talk this nonsense

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Moltoconfusion t1_j000uqb wrote

It's not false. And yes, protesting isn't garbage, I agree. But those people are not homeless. They were using personal time off from their jobs to camp on the state house lawn, in $1000 tents.

I work in Providence. I have unfortunately had to remove actual homeless people from city parks and city buildings. Those people on the state house lawn were not homeless.

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AGirlsThoughts_ OP t1_j0018i7 wrote

Do you know those people personally? Because I do and not a single person there was there on their “free time” who would decide to do this in the middle of December? Are you dumb?

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Moltoconfusion t1_j001knp wrote

Nope, not dumb, just someone that was there and watched as they were removed. Your stance and wanting for justice for the homeless is admirable and needed. But maybe go check out the parks around Kennedy plaza before you blow smoke about the state house lawn.

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AGirlsThoughts_ OP t1_j005431 wrote

As was I, and I work with people experiencing homelessness throughout the state so I know what I’m talking about thank you

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AhChingados t1_j01v51e wrote

Last year protest was started by advocates and a senator. I found out about it and joined. I slept there and got up in the morning to go to work, then came back to teach a class and then went back to the camp to sleep. The worry was that the state would try to arrest houseless people and having “less vulnerable” people there would bring attention and not put people with limited resources in jail. It was weird to hear or this conspiracies, and then come back to the state house and talk to case workers, veterans, people who used to be houseless, and young people who were in the foster care system. Because of this criticisms, homeless folks decided to set up tents out there this year. If you want you can go out there and bring coffee in the mornings or food. Come and listen to their experiences. And not make shit up. Houseless folks set up tents all around the city all the time, and people don’t give a flying fuck. Maybe if they embarras the people mishandling housing funds, maybe then we will see something done.

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Beebeeleen t1_j00fbki wrote

Get a job; get a place to live. If you can't get either in a certain state then you got to move where you can get both. I have little empathy for people who make poor life choices then continue to make them then seek others foot the bill.

Now, if someone is legitimately plagued by mental illnesses (such as schizoprenia not drug addiction) or physical handicaps then I do have some empathy (especially if their families do not help them). However, people's families need to step up.

You have no right to live anywhere as you please. Either pay rent or mortgage or go somewhere else to do just that.

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Dopey-NipNips t1_j018kjs wrote

Drug addiction is a mental illness according to literally every doctor

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Beebeeleen t1_j01oy3a wrote

Yes. But it differs from say schizophrenia. Most people choose to consume drugs. They do so knowing they risk addiction. It is not like other mental diseases like schizophrenia, parkinson's or dimentia.

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Dopey-NipNips t1_j01pb0m wrote

That's contrary to what doctors say. Your feelings aren't facts

Where's your PhD again?

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Beebeeleen t1_j01pyd2 wrote

No. You are conflating two different types of phenomena.

Schizophrenia is a disease. People cannot avoid it.

Doctors have categorized drug addiction as a disease. It is avoidable. It can be overcome.

Try to overcome dimentia or parkinson's.

Have you ever known anyone with these diseases? I know addicts who get better then lead productive lives... and know people who eventually die from parkinson's, fade away with dimentia, and live in perpetual care with schizophrenia.

Sure, some addicts end up dead. But with help they can live better lives. The other three diseases differ in all respects. Even if someone takes meds for schizophrenia, said person is never really ok and must continue taking meds.

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Dopey-NipNips t1_j01setl wrote

That's how you feel. You're not a doctor

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Beebeeleen t1_j01vhce wrote

How I feel? On what grounds do you label my comments based on feeling rather than empirical observation?

Also, what doctors consider drug addiction the same at all levels to parkinson's, alzheimer's, dimentia, and schizophrenia?

You are clueless.

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Dopey-NipNips t1_j02m70a wrote

The dsm-5 literally the thing that all healthcare professionals use to define diseases

There's not levels of disease. It is or it isn't. And according to the dsm it's a disease

Now you may feel differently but nobody gives a fuck about your feelings.

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Beebeeleen t1_j02nkj8 wrote

So, cancer and aids is the same as addiction? Anything categorized as disease is the same? Do you see the error in your reasoning?

Or, let's stick to psychological diseases: are you telling me that alzheimers is the same kind of disease as addiction?

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Dopey-NipNips t1_j02oigu wrote

Of course it's not the same as alzheimers that's why it's called substance abuse disorder and not alzheimers

You said it's not a disease which you've learned through your "empirical observation" aka your feelings

Cancer is a disease. Alzheimers is a disease. Addiction is a disease

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Beebeeleen t1_j02p1g7 wrote

I said no such thing. You've been arguing against a strawman.

What I have wrote is that it is a different type of disease than say Alzheimers or schizophrenia, which is a fact.

I have also wrote in posts with others that researchers in medicine have debated whether they should continue categorizing addiction as a brain disease (or disease at all).

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=addiction+is+not+a+brain+disease&hl=en&as_sdt=0&as_vis=1&oi=scholart#d=gs_qabs&t=1670952588039&u=%23p%3DksQ1XshGG6MJ

You have attempted to portray my posts as conveying "feelings." That is nonsensical. My only subjective position was directed at OP--withholding empathy from addicts (I should have been specific about the types of addicts too).

You have conveyed emotionally laden attacks and strawman arguments. Calm down and read more carefully.

There are different kinds of diseases. And the kind I mentioned are worst in every way to addiction.

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NinjaSant4 t1_j01t77t wrote

You know addicts who get better, but they are never cured. Its always one bad day away from relapse.

You aren't a Doctor, your feelings aren't facts.

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Beebeeleen t1_j01udq3 wrote

Sure, but an addict's plight differs from the schizophrenic's.

Addicts can attend meetings. People suffering from schizophrenia, alzheimer's, parkinson's and dimentia can't just get better.... medication only helps them so much.

If you know people with all the aforementined diseases then you will understand this intuitively.

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NinjaSant4 t1_j01uxcr wrote

I know people with all of the diseases listed above. And guess what - drug addiction doesnt "just get better". That's an ignorant, naive statement.

If you knew people with any of the diseases you mentioned, you would understand this. But its apparent you do not.

You aren't a Doctor. Drug addiction is a disease. Your feelings aren't facts.

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Beebeeleen t1_j01w25t wrote

So we are on similar grounds.

As you've seen, a person with drug addiction doesn't get better over night. But, if said person seeks help and sticks to that help, said person can live a stable life.

However, the person with dimentia, alzheimers, and parkinson's can't just go to AA meetings or stop taking a substance to get better.

How do you know what I am?

You are not a doctor neither, so we must dismiss your posts?

yes, many in the medical field categorize drug addiction as a disease. However, the disease differs in many important respects from the mental illnesses I listed. It doesn't take a doctor to notice that fact. The key word is fact. The only non-fact I have shared was my initial view of withholding empathy for certain homeless people.

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NinjaSant4 t1_j01wo41 wrote

You seem to think medicine isn't an effective solution for schizophrenia, which tells me you've never actually experienced living with someone with that disease. It lets them live a stable life, so long as they continue to follow through with it.

And if they stop, the stability will often come tumbling down. Just the same as when a drug addict falls off their plan. "Not taking a substance" isn't all it takes to be cured of drug addiction. Its a struggle - every day.

I know you aren't a Doctor, so I don't need to worry about that. I trust medical professionals when they call something a disease. Facts are facts, drug addiction is a disease. Treat it like every other disease and stop trying to act like its some special circumstance that only some medical professionals refer to as one.

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Beebeeleen t1_j01xqdv wrote

Have you ever known someone who takes meds for schizophrenia?

They are not the same. And by failing to take it even once they fall into delusions. It is not pretty.

That differs in most respects from addicts.

How do you know what I am?

Do you think all phenomena labeled "disease" are the same? Try reading peer-reviewed articles in medical journals where doctors argue whether addiction is a disease at all. Or, read descriptions about the very real differences between addiction and the others diseases I listed

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NinjaSant4 t1_j022dso wrote

Yes. I have known and lived with someone who took their meds. They were totally functional and lead a productive life, when they did not take their meds they did not have a productive life. Almost like a drug addict who isn't actively using can have a productive life and then when they are using can not. Shocking how similar they are!

A disease is a disease. You aren't a doctor. I know this because you are claiming drug addiction isn't a disease. And the differences between diseases doesn't magically make one not a disease. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it isn't a medical problem.

Edit: Love when people make grand statements and then block you because they can't be bothered to learn that they are wrong. The person arguing with me was ignorant, thinking that drug addiction can just be magically turned off. Addiction is a life long DISEASE.

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Beebeeleen t1_j028bxa wrote

You are almost providing a false equivalence. The qualifiying word "almost" in your statement appears to downplay the real differences between schizophrenics and addicts.

Some addicts are in very bad conditions and others not so much. A schizophrenic on meds is still not the same person as once before pre schizophrenia.

And a schizophrenic cannot just stop being mentally ill unlike the addict. An addict's illness differs in important respects form that of the schizophrenic or of someone suffering from alzheimer's or dimentia. Why are you to trying desperately to depict them as the same kind of phenomena?

First, I have not claimed addiction is not categorized as a disease.

Second, not all phenomena under the category of disease are the same. Addiction is not like aids, cancer or alzheimers. They are different types of diseases.

Third, you are not a doctor. You continually make that claim as a means to dismiss my claims but fail to realize the irony of that rhetoric strategy: it also dismisses your views!!!

Doctors themselves do not conflate addiction with other ailments labeled as diseases. Yet, here you are doing just that.

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Dopey-NipNips t1_j02pdqa wrote

Meetings do not cure addiction regardless of whether you feel they do

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whatsaphoto t1_j01sjer wrote

> I have little empathy for people who make poor life choices then continue to make them then seek others foot the bill.

A profound percentage of the homeless in RI and MA became that way through no fault of their own through simply experiencing a medically traumatic event and subsequently trusting their doctor and their pharmacies who over prescribed them opioids during their recovery. Once that shit grabs hold, it's damn near impossible to live without a constant supply. Particularly when it does actual good for your physical ailments that just wont go away unless you take whatever drug it is you're addicted to.

This was by design, and the victims were lied to when it was purposefully advertised as non-addictive. Mix that with lack of support systems (i.e. family support)and in many, many cases, it can lead to a vicious, endless cycle of addiction that can plague a person right into homelessness.

I highly urge you to reconsider your view on homelessness. It's so much more complicated than simply telling them "Get a job" or "Stop doing what you're doing" without considering what needs to be done in order to get them on their way (safe injection sites, drug treatment centers, sober houses, compassionate job programs that invite those who have previous convictions or wrong doings, etc).

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Beebeeleen t1_j01vadm wrote

I have actually spent time with homeless people. Have you? If so you'll find some are military vets. Others are civilizians who choose to live on the streets despite pleas from their family. Some have no option because they burnt bridges. There is no one size fits all.

Opioid addiction is not new. Your post appears to present it as such.

You should reconsider your views. Not all homesless people are the same. Some can, and do, make better choices that lead to a stable income and housing. Others can but don't. Others can't.

Obviously, my initial post "get a job; live where you can pay rent" is directed at people who can do both. Some people can't. They suffer from schizophrenia, parkinson's, alzheimer's, dimentia or another mental illness.

People suffering from drug addiction can get better. This situation differs from people suffering from the aforementioned diseases. Of course, the situation is even more complex when a person with schizophrenia is also an addict!

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whatsaphoto t1_j01w99b wrote

My point was in regards to you claiming that homelessness is caused by poor choices, and your lack of sympathy for those who live on the streets. Many (Not all, but many) people who are homeless are in that situation through no fault of their own, and we live in a country with far too little reliable options to pick yourself back up again and simply "get a job" in order to get approved for a mortgage and start your life again. If it were that simple then we wouldn't be in the epidemic that we're in right now.

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Beebeeleen t1_j01x2q7 wrote

You misread my post or I did not clarify my position.

As you just read in my latest post, I am well aware of the various causes of homelessness.

I withhold my empathy from certain cases. I am more compassionate about people suffering from mental illnesses outside of addiction.

When it comes to addiction, I am more of a case-by-case basis guy. For instance, I knew an addict whose family wanted to help him. He was from an upper middleclass family. He choose to stay on the streets. That differed from some of his addict buddies who had no where to go. Their situation was far worst. He could pass as a normal guy and used that to his advantage to enter and exist places and stores to steal to support his habit. The others couldn't exit and enter as they pleased.

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canibringmydog t1_j029aqh wrote

How is it 2022 and people still don’t recognize addiction is a disease? Like open a book.

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Beebeeleen t1_j029su1 wrote

It is 2022! And how is it that reading comprehension is so poor. I know that the medical field categorizes addiction as a disease. Did you know researchers (people in medicine such as doctors) debate whether it is or not?

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walkskylurker t1_j021zmk wrote

As someone who has been homeless and is now very not homeless, your take sucks and you lack basic emotional intelligence and empathy. I hope you and everyone in your amazing family (where everyone helps each other, and nobody is unwell or mentally ill) stay healthy and never find yourself in a situation where you need help and there is none or you’re sick and uninsured or underinsured. Being housing unstable is not a choice, but being ignorant and arrogant is.

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Beebeeleen t1_j03d0qi wrote

Do you also suffer from poor reading comprehension skills? I ask because my comment is nuanced. I wrote I have "little empathy" for a type of person displaying a set of behavioral characteristics. I also wrote I empathize with other cases. Yet, you read into my post a claim against all homeless people.

Re the rest of your comment. Spare me the rhetorical flourish. My family is fine. I am a responsible adult who makes good life choices. We were born and raised in third world poverty then US urban ghettos but pulled ourselves out of all that. Imagine that.

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walkskylurker t1_j03hqkr wrote

Okay, then you can also spare me your self congratulatory masturbation. Good for you - I’m sincerely happy for you. I’m also happy that you don’t decide who is or should be afforded basic human dignity at any material scale. Different people come from different circumstances and and different situations befall them. Responsible adults catch a raw deal every day, regardless of their decision making skills. None of them deserve to literally freeze to death. The implication that your circumstances have everything to do with work ethic and decision making skills and zero to do with catching some dumb luck along the way is pure hubris.

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Beebeeleen t1_j03isqv wrote

Spare me your sob story and "hopes" for my family. What's wrong with you?

Most responsible adults do not find themselves homeless, but some do. And you know what? They usually get out of that unfortunate circumstance relatively quickly.

You remain under the impression that I am painting homelessness with a broad brush. Learn to read.

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walkskylurker t1_j03kbtk wrote

Someone with poor reading comprehension might suggest the mere mention of experiencing homelessness with absolutely zero detail or context was a “sob story”. Good day to you, and I wish you luck responding to everyone who thinks your hot take is trash.

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Beebeeleen t1_j03m49b wrote

Yawn. Ask someone to explain my posts to you. You clearly suffer from poor reading comprehension. But, since you were once homeless that makes you an eternal victim worst off than even people born into third world poverty and residing in the ghetto. You need to travel more.

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walkskylurker t1_j04uepi wrote

I love how in one breath you're saying the mere mention of homelessness in one's past is akin to "eternal victimhood" and then in the very next you're describing your own past plight for the second time. Your lack of self-awareness is outstanding. You start comments by saying the word yawn like a total wiener. Lastly, if you need to tell multiple people they lack reading comprehension skills and that your comment is super nuanced and on top of it you're getting plowed with downvotes - maybe it's you. Anyway, you have fun with whatever you're doing here. You sound like a total ass and I'm thankful I don't know you in person.

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Beebeeleen t1_j085bp1 wrote

I am perplexed by this comment. Did you write it under another account or copy and paste? In my email, I received a message by another person verbatim. Then, hours later, you post the same message.

Creepy.

My responses only occur with respect to your initial message in which you mention having been homeless. In the same message, you misrepresent my initial post. Many people have done so. They claim my post is a direct attack on all homeless people. My post as written specifically states that I withhold empathy from a person exhibiting particular behaviors. That's it. Hence, you and a few others do display poor reading comprehension skills.

So I respond to you then share some of my experiences too. I did so pointing out that I (but indirectly others) have endured conditions most people here cannot fathom. Yet, the tone is not one of "victimhood." I only mention it in response to your rhetorical strategy: claim I lack some types of emotions, mention your experience to try to display your perspective as both accurate and knowledgable but also dismiss mine, and also distort my position.

Yawn. Any one of you sheltered Whites with money can come see me in Olneyville. I will be the Brown guy who made something of his life despite the hate you all direct towards my people.

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walkskylurker t1_j09rw0t wrote

Holy shit - it must be exhausting to be you.

At no point in your comments did you “reserve empathy” (how magnanimous, btw - thank god shelter beds aren’t funded by your empathy) for:

-Anyone who had to leave an abusive living situation (physical, financial, sexual) -Anyone who is a minor -Anyone who has an undiagnosed learning or cognitive disability or impairment (these things fly under the radar all the fucking time, and can appear to the ignorant as “poor decision making skills”) -Anyone who suffers from severe PTSD, which would predispose them to chemical addiction as a coping mechanism -Children of literally any of the above because not everyone has a family that can “step up”. Jesus - that shouldn’t even need to be said.

Obviously this list isn’t exhaustive in terms of reasons one might be homeless, I’m also not suggesting any of these situations are insurmountable - nor is homelessness itself. However, some of them might take more than a year to overcome. In the meantime, none of these people should freeze to death - and those are the stakes. Thankfully nobody needs to justify to you why they are hard up and have to sleep the fuck outside.

And sure - you can say “just move”, but we both know that’s disingenuous because it’s unrealistic with limited funds. Your overarching mantra seems to be “fuck you, I got mine” and that just simply comes from a place of willful ignorance. You’re ignoring and dismissing the life experiences of others, and projecting yourself and your life onto people and circumstances you know nothing about.

Also, you don’t know dick about me. My race, ethnicity, religion, other lived experiences are a mystery to you because you do not know me. Volunteering your skin color and neighborhood was an odd choice given nobody asked you, but anyway I guess hey neighbor 👋

I’m not responding to any more of your aggressively ignorant comments, so you can feel free to keep them coming or not. You keep accusing anyone who responds to you of using logical fallacies, but then you just go off the rails and try to gaslight them about shit you just said two comments up. I’m probably also going to block you because you’re profoundly annoying and this response is already time I can’t get back.

Stay fresh out there

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Beebeeleen t1_j09wrgb wrote

I am a very productive person, so I do get exhausted. You’ll be happy to know that I get sufficient rest at night. Isn’t it the same for most responsible and productive people?

My initial comment explicitly states I have “little” empathy for a certain type of person before explicitly stating I do lend empathy towards another type. Please note the key word is “little,” which means some not none. Yet, my clear and concise prose evades your grasp; hence, I have begged you to get someone to help you understand my simple posts.

I'll cite myself below:

"Get a job; get a place to live. If you can't get either in a certain state then you got to move where you can get both. I have little empathy for people who make poor life choices then continue to make them then seek others foot the bill."

In the text above, I do not make a claim against "the homeless." I do not collapse all people without homes as if all their cases were the same. You and others have done that, but not I. I explicitly state I have LITTLE empathy (a better choice of word is compassion) for a person who makes poor life choices, seeks to remain in place, and seeks others to foot their bills--in other words, someone who is able-bodied, employable, unwilling to make better life choices, neglects responsibility but seeks others pay for their daily expenses. That is a specific type of person. Yet, you and the other raging morons on this thread have misconstrued an explicit statement about a particular type of person to mean "the homeless."

If local or federal authorities provide shelters for people in need, these refuges are funded with tax dollars. All people who pay taxes contribute. I include myself among those millions of people.

You appear to misconstrue my comments as ones that seek to deny any and all funding for all homeless people. I have made no claims about funding or shelters at all. My comments only dealt with empathy, which is the ability to understand or share another’s feelings. I only played along with OP’s choice of words, when I think the better word would be compassion. OP appears to mistakenly believe that the local or state government must allow people to live wherever they choose. That is unrealistic and not grounded in law. Hence, my comments “get a job; pay rent” and “go where you can work; go where you can pay rent.”

This is not a novel approach. And some of the poorest working-class people do follow the work trail until they can settle. Ask me how I know.

You wrote a very long list of different scenarios. You for some odd reason believe I am against all people in those cases, which for the most part—I admit to finding your posts insufferable and boring so I kind of have to sip coffee to get through them—fall outside the parameters of the type of person I withhold compassion for.

By writing that list of scenarios, you are trying to portray me as dismissing all those lumped homeless cases together. Again, you seriously misunderstand my point.

And moving is not difficult for individuals. Have you ever hanged out around a greyhound station? People of the lowest income brackets travel across country. Ask me how I know. It is much more difficult for households to do so.

Finally, I can tell you are White. Most of the people posting on this Reddit page are White. You are no different. Spare me the social justice rhetoric of “lived experience,” which is redundant since an experience itself is lived.

The only ignorant person here is you. Do you even know what a logical fallacy is? I doubt it because you just mentioned it without pointing one out.

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mightynifty_2 t1_j02xl2w wrote

To a degree I agree. I think states should identify which towns are in need of workers and set up homeless shelters there along with free transport. Everyone is entitled to housing in the modern world, but you are not entitled to decide where that housing will be. You can choose to be homeless in the city or go where you're needed. Yes, housing is expensive, but many (not most) people who complain about high rent refuse to live with roommates or think they need to live in the city.

That said, this should still be done with empathy. Not everyone who's out on the streets made poor choices and many are just unlucky. Some came from nothing and never got an opportunity to move up. Some made a single major mistake and can't recover from it. None of these scenarios change that people should be treated with decency and respect.

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Beebeeleen t1_j031fn2 wrote

I think it sounds like a good idea that everyone should have housing. It just appears unrealistic. Real world conditions complicate a scenario where society makes that idea a reality. For instance, Is there a law that guarantees it? Who foots the bill? Also, why provide someone with housing if said person can provide themself?

Respect is earned. You are correct in pointing out the different nuances of homelessness. But, it is also a given that some people made very poor choices-- even some who came from nothing (very rare as that is) did little to nothing to improve their circumstances, some make plenty of mistake even when one is enough, and some can recover but fail to do so.

We can behave proactively by displaying respect and decency, but that does not mean we continue doing so when receiving the opposite. For instance, people across this thread have showed me little respect instead they have attacked me for sharing my perspective with OP. So, I withhold my respect in my interactions with them.

In realworld conditions, a person is not entitled to housing in this country. That might be a sad fact but it is a fact. If it isn't please let me know.

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mightynifty_2 t1_j0365nq wrote

>I think it sounds like a good idea that everyone should have housing. It just appears unrealistic. Real world conditions complicate a scenario where society makes that idea a reality. For instance, Is there a law that guarantees it? Who foots the bill?

The bill would be footed by taxpayer dollars. The accommodations would be the bare minimum (shared rooms, hallway bathrooms, etc. Think of a college dorm). There is no law, but there should be. They should be available to everyone, no matter their means.

In the modern US we have more than enough tech and wealth to do this bare minimum. Along with free healthcare and education. And if we can get people into jobs where they're needed in the process then the system may just end up paying for itself.

>Respect is earned.

True, but there is also a baseline amount of respect that all people deserve from the start. When you start off your comment by stating that you have no empathy for the homeless, you have already shown yourself to be disrespectful and have waived your right to respectful discourse in the process. Think for it this way: replace 'the homeless' with 'disabled veterans' and tell me you don't sound like kind of a jerk in your first comment (keep in mind, vets chose to join the military).

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Beebeeleen t1_j03727x wrote

Yeah, I would be happy with tax dollars going to accomodate people in need. We seem to share that sentiment, but I know for a fact others will reject it.

Per my initial comment: I disagree with you. My initial post was not disrespectful.

Please reread it. I wrote," I have little empathy for people who make poor life choices then continue to make them then seek others to foot the bill."

That statement is qualified. It has nuance since it refers to a person displaying a specific set of behavioral characteristics. OP painted homeless people with a broad brush, but I did not.

Now, reread my post then reevaluate yours. You claim mine sounds like a jerk based on something I didn't even say. That is ironic. Think about it.

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Dinosquid t1_j0d7c7q wrote

How much you wanna bet this dipshit calls himself a Christian. 😂

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Beebeeleen t1_j0duoso wrote

Another racist with a low IQ and nothing substantial to contribute.

Are you religious? I am not. My people live life in harmony with other beings. Your people colonized the lands and tried to destroy my people. Your people forced my people into Christianity by murdering our elders and torturing and raping my people for living as we have for thousands of years.

You are a horrible human being.

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I_am_the_robot_man t1_j0ei1ub wrote

How does it make you feel to know your opinions on homelessness align with Right Wing “Religious” Republicans, O Harmonious One?

1