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geographresh t1_jb23gik wrote

Doesn't surprise me given the increase in average age of drivers license obtainment, as well as increasing urbanization of the country and cost of vehicle ownership.


Lyzer_In_Space t1_jb4f17d wrote

The cost especially. Sometimes I have to do a double take on exactly how much it costs me to own a vehicle


Notspherry t1_jb4rmgh wrote

This is one of the reasons good bike infrastructure is so important. A very large percentage of trips within cities are distances that are easily doable by bike. A nice electric cargo bike like an urban arrow costs 5k or so, but if it allows you to get rid of a second car it is insanely cheap to own and run.

One of the reasons that Copenhagen is a cycling city these days is that it was broke and could not afford to maintain the level of car infrastructure it needed. So they decided to encourage cycling. Basic cycling infrastructure is cheap and much more efficient than roads for cars.


LawHelmet t1_jb4shnz wrote

I used to cycle to work when work had showers that were worth a damn.

Europe’s need for space efficiency vs America’s space availability is what decimates cycling as a normal mode of transportation.

Average commute time for an American is an hour. An hour in a car in traffic, is probably 2ish hours by bike. 12-15 miles an hour over any terrain on a bike is sweating, generally, and a respectable exercise pace.

Imagine doubling your commuting time. Where’s the time come from?


No_Maines_Land t1_jb4vrzn wrote

I bike to work and metro in the winter/poor weather/don't feel like biking days. Both these methods are 50 min flat. The drive into work is 25 minutes, the drive home is 30-70 minutes.

So let's call it an extra 50 minutes to not drive. On bike, this time comes from my gym time, since I knock out some cardio. On metro this time comes from TV or reading time, since I read if I get a seat or watch TV if standing (and also sometimes sitting).


Episimian t1_jb657fn wrote

Many European cities are far less sprawling than in the US and encourage a mixed mass transit, cycling and walking commute - catch the train/tram/underground/bus for the longer part of your journey and then use a shared short rental bike to get to where you need to be. It's not perfect but it makes getting to work pretty easy where it works. Except in a Northern European winter - cycling in the pissing rain in the dark is never easy or fun.


Upstairs_Maybe_8598 t1_jb5tpc4 wrote

my electric cargo bike (radio flyer) was about $2k i believe?


Notspherry t1_jb5ympq wrote

There are definitely more budget friendly options like yours. The point I was trying to make that even a high end cargobike is a lot cheaper than even a basic car.


distortionwarrior t1_jb5711t wrote

This just encourages cost escalation and pushes the nuclear family further and further from mainstream. Nuclear family is absolutely essential for the responsible growth and sustainment of a superpower country, and forcing bicycle use is telling people they really can't have a family, or they can't work where the good jobs are, or they can't live where they can have a family because there isn't enough bedrooms or house space, and no one with a baby wants to commute hours to the daycare in a bicycle then to work. There literally isn't enough time for a busy family to fart around with making bicycles a viable primary transportation source while still being forced to have two incomes and keeping all the family tasks done. In the unique pockets where you can walk to many places, like New York, very expensive to live. Can't reasonably buy property. Bicycles are really not a viable option for most people.


moeru_gumi t1_jb5rrsu wrote

I lived in a city of 10 million people in Japan. You regularly see mothers with babies in the bicycle baskets and groceries on the back.


distortionwarrior t1_jb6c62l wrote

In JAPAN. Not everywhere, some cities in JAPAN.


moeru_gumi t1_jb6i901 wrote

Yes, and if a city of 10 million can do it, it is possible. Humanity has found a way to do it. It can be implemented in other places if we actually would want it and accept that it’s possible.


Notspherry t1_jb5y33r wrote

There are a lot of assumptions here that I do not agree with.

Full disclosure: I live on the outskirts of a 70k town in the netherlands. Definitely not in a big city.

First, giving people the option to ride for transportation does not equate forcing people to ride. If your local steakhouse adds burgers to the menu they are not forcing you to only eat burgers.

Second, dropping off my kids at daycare/school has never been more than a 10 minute detour. The way towns are set up here means that most daily destinations like schools, shops, doctors and sports facilities are always close to residential area's. This means chaining several trips together by bike is very easy.

Third: cars coststake up a large part of the budget of young families. Cutting (a part) of these costs means being able to afford a better house, or working less. I see lots of mothers who cycle everywhere, with or without kids, because it is the most convenient way to get around.


distortionwarrior t1_jb6arqe wrote

What you're saying is that you want people to completely blow up their lives and cities so they can take up your hobby of bike riding, whether it works for them or not. As with all conversations like this, I say you can do whatever you want up to the point that your freedoms do not take away other people's freedoms. You can be a gun owner, you can be a bike owner, you can be a presbyterian, you can be a vegan, but don't force any of that on anyone else. You are free to ride your bike and set up your life in any way you like, but where I live, it doesn't work for me or my city, and the juice just isn't worth the squeeze. Childcare is horribly expensive and waiting lines are months or years long, jobs are far away, housing in the city is small and horribly expensive, and the government should not be in the business of taking away thousands of our very limited parking spots so some people can have the privilege of riding their bike on the main road instead of one block in either parallel direction.


drl33t t1_jb5el51 wrote

The average annual cost of new vehicle ownership is almost $10 000 a year. A small sedan is the cheapest at $7000 a year.

Yes, this average cost takes into account loan interest, depreciation, fuel, insurance, maintenance and fees.

If people knew how damn expensive car ownership was upfront, we’d probably have less cars and more public transit.



guy_guyerson t1_jb4tkns wrote

> increasing urbanization

That's exactly what jumped out at me when I read 'since 2001'.


xmorecowbellx t1_jb4upjp wrote

Those things, and also just the increasing difficulty to find free parking in major centres, along with the rise of Uber/Lyft, lowering cab prices a bit.