Murpydoo t1_iu2kpyf wrote
People will get Marijuana whether it is legal or not. Kids too.
Honestly easier for kids to get it if it is illegal, because the black market is bigger and they don't care who they sell it to.
shamus727 t1_iu3ojc4 wrote
Not to mention this is the true gateway. If I was able to buy weed from the store when I was 19 I never would have gotten an offer to buy some cocain from my dealer, and chances are the next 5 years of my life would have been much different.
OperationMobocracy t1_iu3wkvr wrote
I also suspect that lumping together all drugs as catastrophically dangerous by anti-drug propaganda. A person consumes some cannabis and finds that its not dangerous and then begins to think that the dangers of other drugs must be grossly exaggerated as well.
Plus the fact that until fentanyl, most recreational drugs at common potency and doses could be sampled without much immediate risk. Heroin might be the asterisk to this statement, but I'd wager that more often than not it wasn't at a potency that posed a high overdose risk.
Of course this kind of discounting of risk didn't take into effect the cumulative consumption risks of addiction or tolerance, but that's generally not what the propaganda tried to spell out. Plus most people aren't instantly addicted with one or two initial doses of anything, so its easy to see people using coke a couple of times and thinking its not a big deal and not realizing maybe it is a big deal some many doses in the future when they find out they can't go without.
admiralwarron t1_iu41hic wrote
I wonder if it would make sense to have something like a driver's licence for hard drugs. They first have to learn what the drug does to the body, how to be safe with it, what to do in case of overdose, how to spot a bad batch and so on.
If they have the licence, they can legally buy and carry a certain amount of hard drugs.
OperationMobocracy t1_iu42cw7 wrote
I think it probably makes perfect sense. There's all kinds of dangerous things we want or need people to have access to and a common solution is a licensing process which controls access to the thing and tries to guarantee that such use is reasonable and responsible -- explosives, radioactive materials, dangerous chemicals. Even a lot of gun permit laws require some kind of classroom instruction on law and safety and a basic functional test of gun use.
I think the problem with a "drug user license" is avoiding the diversion risk. It would probably be tempting to get your license, buy the drug and resell it. It's way lower risk than reselling your sample of U-235 or blasting caps.
AberrantRambler t1_iu4c47b wrote
The only people that it would be worth selling to would be the people that couldn’t get the license - you know, exactly the type of people society has said we don’t want to have this drug.
Funnily enough, this is exactly the type of person who would turn on their dealer in a heartbeat if they got caught and were promised some of their drug. Then they can go in the same treatment program as all the people who are denied the license.
OperationMobocracy t1_iu4kgns wrote
Part of me wants to believe that that this would work and that there's some mix of rules and enforcement that would solve a diversion problem, but part of me also thinks that it could just devolve into a drug prohibition 2.0 cat and mouse game.
Probably a low barrier to entry for obtaining licensing would prevent a lot of diversion, basically excluding people considered too at risk (teens, mentally ill, etc). But there's always the risk of some meaningful number of people who are just non-cooperative with obtaining a license.
It's still an interesting idea.
weareeverywhereee t1_iu4ut7h wrote
I mean this is kind of happening via doctors. Check out like mindbloom or nuelife…doctor checkup via phone to ensure it will be ok, pay some money…boom ketamine at your door
Oh_My-Glob t1_iu5bqxp wrote
> Heroin might be the asterisk to this statement, but I'd wager that more often than not it wasn't at a potency that posed a high overdose risk.
I'd say crystal meth should have an asterisk there too. Personally I think coke, meth and heroin are too damaging and risky to ever be fully legalized. Coke mostly for its cardiovascular risks. Cannabis, psilocybin, LSD, DMT and MDMA are all pretty safe if done responsibly and have medical significance
OperationMobocracy t1_iu5iu8v wrote
The funny thing about amphetamines is how they seem to be just fine to feed to kids with ADD. I know they kind of process them differently neurologically but still.
Some people manage maintenance doses of opiates for years, even decades without problems. But there’s segment of the population that will want continually escalating doses and end up overdosing.
ked_man t1_iu2o582 wrote
Exactly. Kinda hard to buy booze underage since all of it is at regulated businesses that check ID. Being illegal, yet readily available increases access. Drug dealers are already breaking the law by selling it, so you think any of them care the age of their buyer?
KallistiEngel t1_iu2y7ur wrote
Speaking from experience, when I was underage we could often find someone who would buy us booze. But it was still much easier to buy weed even though it wasn't legal.
OperationMobocracy t1_iu3voyi wrote
When I was in high school the demand for alcohol was broader than the demand for cannabis -- ie, more students were interested or willing to drink than they were interested in smoking pot.
What's curious, though, is that there wasn't really a black market for booze. As in, someone of legal age who bought booze specifically to sell it to underage high school kids. You can almost imagine some person with a couple of cases of half-pint vodka bottles and cases of beer who sells them off to high school kids, either direct consumers or as a wholesaler to some enterprising high school student.
Everyone seemed to have some inconsistent access to someone of age who would buy booze, but it was really inconsistent as I remember it. You mostly couldn't call them up and say you needed a hookup tonight. I even remember a couple of times where my circle of friends went through the motions trying but getting turned down by everyone.
LightningSmyth t1_iu3o888 wrote
I’m more worried about vaping still being a thing when my toddler grows up…
Tony2Punch t1_iu4cdou wrote
Don’t let these people drop your guard. I went to school as smoking was falling rapidly. Sometimes we would even talk about how cool it was that our generation had basically cut smoking off by 80%. The ads they used against us must have actually worked. They generally focused on how bad you would smell, teeth yellowing, bad breath, being broke, bad smelling car etc.
However, Big Tobacco just created a smoking device that mitigates some of those problems and now everyone is hooked. Even people you wouldn’t expect like the book worm is hooked.
Also, these vapes use Salt Nic solutions, which are 30% stronger and more addictive than the cigarettes with the same amount as before.
Fortunately, people are also quitting. A number of people are super casual about quitting and it isn’t some weird thing to not smoke. If I’m at a party and everyone’s vaping and I get offered, I genuinely feel like no one has ever felt off by me turning it down. I usually just throw out “I’m quittin” and sometimes they will just say good luck and leave it at that.
So I think this generation will have more quitters and more absolute fiends who will be miserable without constant nicotine.
drock42 t1_iu4bl92 wrote
I'm for legalization but disagree. There's a lot more floating around Michigan now that it's legal. Is it better quality and safer (less shady shit going on, lower police tension, etc) absolutely! But it is definitely more plentiful and easy to get.
Wolfenberg t1_iu4enw4 wrote
The worst cases of kids doing it have been doing it because it's illegal..
Kind_Sceptre t1_iu4qfid wrote
Precisely. When the black market is booming kids can so easily get it. I started at 14 in an illegal state. Never had a problem getting my hands on it but I did get laced and probably cancerous stuff multiple times. It needs to be legalized. These kids today are smoking black market cartridges which are filled with mystery oil full of pesticides/carcinogens. Those things are so damn dangerous and could cause a big rise in cancer rates in the future. Kids need to be protected through a government which is understanding of reality and not hurt through the denial of reality..
Legalizing it addresses the reality that kids who want to smoke will smoke regardless if it's illegal or not. The only question is if you want those kids to be risking getting diseases/laced because the powers that be are too stupid and old to understand that by not legalizing it all they are doing is contributing to the poisoning of kids.
I hate these black market cartridges and am thankful they were not around when I was a kid. I fear for the kids who smoke these things because the government is too incompetent to actively protect them from the poison. No kid should smoke so young but the reality is they do and they will continue to wether we want them to or not. We have to look reality in the face and make decisions to protect humans from human nature. Wether it's something we like or not it doesn't matter because we are dealing with reality and the reality is these kids are poisoning themselves because of the futile attempt to make cannabis illegal.
[deleted] t1_iu3qnfs wrote
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Drink_in_Philly t1_iu4ia8m wrote
So, I smoked weed as a kid in the 90's and have kids now. What you say seems logical but in fact is just preposterously wrong. It is far, far easier for kids to get weed now. I'm California, Oregon at least, it's everywhere. Everywhere. Y kid finds discarded pens with plenty of THC left lying on the ground where teenagers hang out. It's damn near impossible to avoid.
I also supported and support legalization. But don't fool yourself. In states where it's legal-recreational, weed is everywhere from middle school on up. And with the pens it's harder to know if your kid is using it.
Our kid had depression and anxiety and it's an issue we are dealing with at 13. Personally, based on what I know now, I would recommend every parent test randomly once in a while for the combo nicotine and weed tests. Even if you think there's no way. Don't make it emotional. Just let them know it's a thing that will happen from time to time so that they can tell friends "oh my parents suck, they don't trust me, ill get caught if I try it. " It gives them another tool to resist peer pressure if nothing else. But we live in a very affluent, high expectation neighborhood in Northern California and in middle school the rate of kids who have tried weed is over 60% easily. Easily. My kid thinks its closer to 80%. I know for sure some kids are regular users and their parents would never imagine.
[deleted] t1_iu4q3mb wrote
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LowKeyRebelx t1_iu9tqs1 wrote
Nothing like encouraging your kids to go no contact with you when they hit 18. Treating your kids like prison inmates isn't the way. Sorry.
weareeverywhereee t1_iu4um42 wrote
This…growing up drugs were always easier to get than alcohol.
Murpydoo t1_iu4x0i5 wrote
Yes, I found the same.
bohemiantranslation t1_iu5nctp wrote
I remember when i was younger getting weed was wayyy easier then getting booze. It was probably cheaper too in the long run.
DillaVibes t1_iu5pjpo wrote
> Honestly easier for kids to get it if it is illegal, because the black market is bigger and they don't care who they sell it to.
Making it legal does not mean it will be more difficult to get illegally. Minors can get cigarettes and alcohol the same way.
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