Unless some governments get the idea of making the manufacturers responsible for recycling the old batteries...

Still so many issues unsolved in electric vehicles.

cool repost.
https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/yyh3ht/general_motors_says_it_will_stop_burning_cash_on/

Batteries are extremely recyclable and the battery recycling industry is ramping up.

Redwood materials, founded by a former Tesla exec, just signed a multi-billion dollar deal with Panasonic to supply Panasonic’s new Kansas battery plant (currently under construction) with cathode material from recycled batteries.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/alanohnsman/2022/11/15/redwood-materials-to-supply-cathodes-for-panasonics-kansas-ev-battery-plant/?sh=c2fee032cc95

Imho, a replacement for Lithium-Ion is closer than us solving all the issues with them.

Still too many issues with current models. Much to do still.

Actually the lithium from recycle battery's is better than the one from minings. It is more pure and cheaper.

Wait, they're expensive as hell and not profitable? I may be just a country chicken, but in order to make them profitable, prices will have to increase even more, no? I don't see batteries getting any cheaper in under 3 years.

Batteries have gotten cheaper every year for the past 15 years. They're also banking on a 40% decrease in labor costs, which is the real savings to make them profitable.

Thess idiot geniuses finally realized that less parts means less labor means EVs make them more money. Transitioning to EV was always going to be a "we'll do it when it makes us more money". It'd be funny if we hadn't needlessly burned the planet up some more when we could have started making the switch in the 90s.

No. Manufacturing costs will come down as the vehicles ramp up. It’s a big initial investment to get started.

Streamlining processes and expansion of markets for the components and products will bring prices down

Think of it like Ford “inventing” the assembly line process for cars. Was it more expensive to get the technology set up? Absolutely. But as soon as they smoothed out the issues and had an efficient process, they could sell the cars for cheaper due to less time input on manufacture and assembly

Battery prices have dropped a casual 90% over the past 10 years. There's still quite some way to drop. Don't let the high raw material prices fool you. Cost savings come largely from economies of scale - not raw materials.

You've been shown the information, but you still claim not to know. It's solved. The link contains more details.

We might just disagree on the credibility of forbes.

In my experience they only write advertisement-pieces for firms that want their stock price to go up or their competitors to go down.

One of the factors that tell you that this is also true for this article is that it focuses primarily on how big the market is and how much money could potentially be made, while it makes no attempts to speak about the efficiency of the process.

It's also highly unlikely that a centralized plant will have a huge reach on a product that is likely to spontaneously combust, where no known method of extinguishing the flames is known, other than drowning it in water and waiting for the reaction to end.

But if you take it as evidence... Good for you. I don't.

I don't need to take it as evidence, ya spatula. I've followed the industry for years. I've seen dozens of articles.

You're not looking to learn, but smear shit. Go do some reading. You'll see.

You're the only one who did I assume.

No one else in the world has ever read a single article about it....

I just prefer to read the scientific papers that are being released on those topics over the clickbait-articles by papers that take money for favorable articles.

I like to look a bit deeper than fortune-articles...

Then provide some sources instead of telling us how smart you think you are...

EU directives about recycling goals are an indicator

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/ALL/?uri=CELEX%3A32006L0066

But generally speaking, I'm a huge fan of "do your own research" and a huge opponent of "believe random people on reddit because they posted a news article"

I do not expect sources for claims because I'd find my own trusted sources to confirm the statement before deciding on whether I believe it or not.

"Provide me with all that I need to learn that I was wrong or I just keep being wrong" Is not a notion I have ever identified with.

Funny how she says a lot of things but I am struggling to find the truth in any of it. Last year she promised GM would be selling 40 different EV’s by 2023, maybe she meant to say “sell 40 EV’s by 2023?

She can say whatever she wants, media will only focus on when musk makes wildly in accurate predictions. She should be just fine.

Every manufacturers that I know of have written extensively on how they will recycle the batteries. Here is info from VW.

https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/battery-recycling-after-the-end-of-a-vehicles-service-life-7223

Here is Tesla

https://www.tesla.com/en_ca/support/sustainability-recycling

"Extending the life of a battery pack is a superior option to recycling for both environmental and business reasons. For those reasons, before decommissioning a consumer battery pack and sending it for recycling, Tesla does everything it can to extend the useful life of each battery pack. Any battery that is no longer meeting a customer’s needs can be serviced by Tesla at one of our Service Centers around the world. None of our scrapped lithium-ion batteries go to landfilling, and 100% are recycled."

And further there are new companies like Redwood Materials that are doing it.

https://www.redwoodmaterials.com/

This has been thought about and discussed endlessly. The idea that massive battery packs are going to go into a landfill doens't seem reasonable. Even degraded battery packs will be able to be reused for stationary storage. And that an EOL they will be recycled.

Hey, I’ve got some news: he did some things recently that were a bit worse than inaccurate predictions

Omg, ok tell me everything you know!

I hope they put out some good options. I think almost everyone in America is almost now at the point where if they needed to buy a new car.. they’d probably go EV or at very least hybrid.

>Last year she promised GM would be selling 40 different EV’s by 2023,

That's a lie.

I bet I'll see these in my neighborhood before the Cybertruck.

Long list (he called a cave rescue diver a pedophile for example) but the worst thing he did was inspire a small army of annoying sycophants that desperately want him to be the genius Tony Stark CEO he styles himself to be, despite the evidence to the contrary.

oh, they won't end up in landfills... They will just use a ton of energy to recycle them at a low rate, with all that remains ending up in a landfill.

The energy-usage from production to recycling is still very high.

But of course it can be done a lot cheaper if oil is used to get the energy... Very eco-friendly...

No one cares. Just like you were the one sperm out of millions that got into your mom's egg. Many have attempted it, but this one made it. Deal with it

Compared to what? The problem here is you write this out in isolation. Is there a footprint to recycle a battery? Of course. But you know what also causes a footprint? The extraction of oil and the refining of that into gasoline. So sure you have a footprint to build the battery but then you use that battery for years. The only thing that matters is if the one thing is better then another. And in this case every lifecycle study I have read says EVs have lower carbon emissions over their lives.

Carbon emissions just happen to be only one metric. One that ev is good at. Other metrics look worse. There is a lot of pro ev advertisement going on right now, despite the technology not being where we would need it.

But companies have invested money, so consumers need to be motivated to spend now.

You will see in a couple years that things are not as great as you are being told right now.

News just has a pro ev narrative that is blind to the problems.

But your opinion is your opinion. If you care, you look it up, if not. Then not. As will everyone else.

So, you say “long list” as your answer… and of course the cave diving incident, thought you would have gladly jumped in there when I teed you up with an easy chance to back up your bluff, but maybe millionaire Mars Bars isn’t so much better.

Moving the goal posts I see. Either way the data on this is pretty clear based on all the lifecycle studies I have read. Perhaps you need to investigate a little further.

This is exactly the kind of semi incoherent pro Musk garbage that makes his followers so insufferable. What the fuck are you even talking about? You aren’t clever enough to be coy.

Lol you do a really good job of giving non answers. I think Reddit is producing a generation of people who have fake arguments.

Here you go:

Claiming in March 2020 that people worried about the coronavirus were “dumb” Predicting on March 19, 2020, that the U.S. was going to have “close to zero new cases” by the end of April Questioning the safety of the COVID-19 vaccines, and baselessly asserting that there were “quite a few negative reactions” to getting a second shot Likening Canadian prime minister Justin Trudeau to Hitler Saying the U.S. government shouldn‘t provide subsidies to companies after receiving billions in subsidies from the U.S government Using Twitter to engage in securities fraud Tweeting, “Pronouns suck” Tweeting misogynistic things at Senator Elizabeth Warren because she said he should pay more in taxes Writing to Bernie Sanders, who also thinks the richest man in the world should pay more in taxes, “I keep forgetting that you’re still alive” Tweeting dumb, sexist jokes Tweeting a photo of Bill Gates and writing, “in case u need to lose a boner fast” Tweeting in 2018 that Tesla factory workers could lose their stock options if they unionized Baselessly accusing a British cave diver instrumental in rescuing a trapped football team of being a “pedo guy” because he, like others, said Musk’s idea to send in a submarine wouldn’t work

While off-line, and more consequentially:

Reopening a Tesla factory in violation of public health orders, where 450 cases were subsequently recorded Running a company (Tesla) that was ordered to pay nearly $137 million to a former Black employee who said the company ignored repeated complaints that he was called the N-word and that his colleagues “had drawn swastikas and scratched a racial epithet in a bathroom stall and left drawings of derogatory caricatures of Black children around the factory.” (In a message to Tesla employees, a human resources executive downplayed the man’s allegations, noting he was a contractor, not a full-time staffer, and that other witnesses had said that while they heard racial slurs, they were used in a “friendly” manner. The H.R. executive added that the company was “not perfect” at the time of the incidents, and “is still not perfect,” but has “come a long way.”) Running a company (Tesla), where a female worker said sexual harassment was “rampant,” alleging “nightmarish conditions” and a factory that “more resembles a crude, archaic construction site or frat house than a cutting-edge company in the heart of the progressive San Francisco Bay area.” (The company did not respond to multiple requests for comment from The Washington Post, which noted Tesla “does not typically respond to press inquiries.”) Running a company (Tesla) that employees have called a “modern-day sweatshop” (In response, Telsa said it abided by California laws.) Attempting to “destroy a Tesla whistleblower” Reportedly exploding at “executives and lower-ranking workers” alike, and allegedly firing people who disagreed with him (Musk has denied allegations that he goes on firing sprees) Announcing Tesla’s headquarters would move to Texas one month after the state effectively banned all abortions Paying a private investigator $50,000 to dig up dirt on the cave diver he called “pedo guy”

Now did I write that whole list of terrible things Elon Musk is done? No I did not. How did I find it? I simply googled “bad things Elon Musk has done”

You worry about Reddit create a group of people that give non-answers. I worry about Reddit creating a group of people like yourselves who could easily Google the answer to a question but instead expect individuals to hand feed them answers and if those answers are not supplied, they assume the information does not exist.

The Internet has given us easy access to volumes of information but that is meaningless if people don’t take a minute to actually, you know, look it up.

[removed]