Submitted by hocumflute t3_11z8lai in television
Black Sails is criminally underrated, and set a solid foundation for the story of Treasure Island. Luke Arnold is fantastic, and I'd image has aged into the part of our favorite fast food franchise quite well.
thoughts?
I kind of agree- Luke Arnold was great, but absolutely all his best scenes were opposite Flint, whereas Flint got a lot of great scenes without Silver.
The show had some of the best character arcs I've ever seen.
Flint's arc was something else I've ever seen on the screen and portrayed brilliantly.
I was floored at the season 2 reveal. Did not expect it whatsoever
> People often say that the first few episodes suck and it takes a while to get good
I agree with you mostly. There is so much good stuff in the first couple episodes that it's hard for me to see why it's called "boring" but I would argue that he doesn't become one of the greatest characters until we learn his backstory at the beginning of season 2. Stephens' performance is great but until we learn that there is a reason for his madness, casted out by the Navy for his love, it all comes together after that and is really my favorite character because of it
Jack Rackham is another for me. Toby Schmitz brings such a charm to the character as the cunning Rackham but until we learn why he's a pirate in season 3, he's just a theiving pirate (albeit a likable guy)
I think Flint has some of the best storylines and his screen presence is undeniable but I really wouldn't hate the same writers coming back and writing something new in the Black Sails world.
i wish
I’d watch it if they did make it.
I agree wholeheartedly that Black Sails was much better than it usually gets credit for.
I don’t think an expensive period piece filming on ships/water will be brought back when the industry is tightening its belt.
:( so sad, but true.
Water is hard to film apparently - and there is only 1 James Cameron - despite the best efforts of 20th Century Studios
Isn't it almost entirely CGI though?
yeah- and a lot of the scenes are on shore
Black Sails wasn't even that successful, it's kind of wonder it got all its seasons to be honest.
Starz also doesn't really have the means to do big things anymore. Maybe if Lionsgate (that owns them IIRC) is bought by a big player ala Apple or Amazon...
I'd welcome anything related to that series. It did end a little rushed
81 percent on rottentomatoes, 8.2 on IMDb, how exactly is it “underrated”?
Perhaps OP thinks it should be 82 percent on rottentomatoes and 8.3 on IMDB
It's not in the lexicon like other comparative shows like breaking bad, game of thrones, or even lost.
And we all know it's better than lost
So what we’re saying is the word “underrated” has no real meaning and can be used to describe anything. Like “Smurf”.
Whichever word is best to describe what I said I meant - that's the word!
Nope
They talked about it at one point and it was definitely rumored, but doubt it’s happening at this point. Loved the show.. I tell people you have to get through the first few episodes where it was still trying to find its footing and was going full Cinemax. But that finale was one of the best I’ve seen in tying things up and just being satisfying. I had nothing to be upset about.
No. The showrunners/creators have moved on to other things (The Old Man, Percy Jackson and the Olympians) and if Steinberg & Levine ain't doing it, I'm not interested.
there probably won't be which is a shame. He was fantastic and i wanted to see where his story went.
That would be epic!! I enjoyed all the pirates story lines, especially black beard, long John silver and of course flint.
i agree that Black Sails was underrated. i think they're done, though. kinda jumped the shark with the gay lover ending, i bet lots of people were turned off by that. if they brought the show back, though, i would definitely watch it. one of the best shows ever.
Gay lover ending?
Bro, where were you from S2 onward?
It's Silver telling that story though....
not that this makes this take any less homophobic, but the show is very ambiguous about whether or not that actually happened
Great storytelling; sealed the deal on a show that knew what it was doing and succeeded
Jumped the shark? JUMPED THE SHARK?
Black Sails didn’t jump the shark although they did eat that damn shark,
‘Nuff said. Jumped the shark, indeed.
yeah, that was out of left field and really softened our hardest and most ruthless character imo. They had already set up a whole romance between him and Barlow - it came across as superfluous and detracted from his clear love for gold.
However, piracy in general is a great opportunity for narratives around slavery, gender, and sexual orientation as pirates notoriously didn't give a shit so long as it earned them money.
This comment is what I expect from a 13 year old boy to be honest. It's so hilariously out of touch with actual life and relationships
How does that twist progress his character?
How does being gay 'progress his character'? Literally everything he does is as a result of his relationship with Thomas and their treatment under the Crown and Thomas' father. His entire character is shaped by that relationship. Black Sails is basically a show about how Flint wants to take down the British Empire, because of how much it destroyed his and Thomas' lives. If you think it is all about his love for gold, you have epically misunderstood the show. The gold is just a means to fight back against an Empire that Flint sees as tyrannical. That whole speech that Flint does in the last episode... Here there be dragons... that sums up the whole point of his character and the show as a whole, it isn't about gold.
>How does being gay 'progress his character'? Literally everything he does is as a result of his relationship with Thomas and their treatment under the Crown and Thomas' father. His entire character is shaped by that relationship. Black Sails is basically a show about how Flint wants to take down the British Empire, because of how much it destroyed his and Thomas' lives
The Barlow relationship did that already. There was no need to add another love interest
You come across as either young, homophobic or a bit heartless by the way. Sure, they could have had that entire arc done through a hetero relationship, but maybe, just maybe, the writer wanted to make the lead character bisexual and have those same things achieved through his love with another man. It wasn't a fucking 'twist to shock the viewers' it was just Flint's written character of being a bisexual man. They do exist by the way and their existence isn't a 'shocking twist'.
>You come across as either young, homophobic or a bit heartless by the way
Stop. I'm talking about the quality of a show.
There are PLENTY that explore sexuality while successfully driving the plot (will and grace, 6 feet under, boondocks saints - off the top of my head)
Attacking me doesn't make ham fisted token characters and plots any more valid.
>Sure, they could have had that entire arc done through a hetero relationship, but maybe, just maybe, the writer wanted to make the lead character bisexual and have those same things achieved through his love with another man.
The question remains - why.
> It wasn't a fucking 'twist to shock the viewers'
It wasn't?
What else did it achieve which the Barlow relationship wouldn't?
>The question remains - why.
Because bisexual men exist and clearly the writer wanted to make Flint one of them. Your dog whistle is really showing using terms like 'ham fisted token characters'. You take issue that Flint loves a man, you even said it makes him 'softer' which is an incredibly honest take to have and actually say publicly, that you believe if a man loves another man that 'softens him'. I would expect to see that take in the mid 70s to be honest. Does Charles Vane's scenes with Elanor also 'soften' him? Or since he is railing a hot blond is that fine?
I'll tell you what it achieved that the Barlow relationship wouldn't. It took one of the toughest characters on screen and said that he can be that tough, that ruthless and that powerful and love a man, and that his toughness, ruthlessness and power can come from his love for another man. That, on many levels, is an interesting thing to do in a TV show like black sails.
And yes, all of that can be achieved through a hetero relationship with Barlow. But if you take issue that it was done through his love for a man, and not a woman, I hate to break it to you, but that is no longer about the 'quality of the show'
>>The question remains - why. > >Because bisexual men exist and clearly the writer wanted to make Flint one of them.
Imagine if Walt suddenly had a romance outside of his marriage and drug empire in breaking bad.
Do you see why that would detract from the story, regardless of gender?
> Your dog whistle is really showing using terms like 'ham fisted token characters'.
I'm not going to respond again if you attack me again.
Stop it. Address my point, or shove off.
>Imagine if Walt suddenly had a romance in breaking bad.
>
>Do you see why that would detract from the story, regardless of gender?
Not really if it was done well? I can't really comment on this without seeing a script with this happening, but I could totally see it working. It's been like a decade since I watched that show so I can't remember it as well as Black Sails, but I'm pretty sure his relationship with his wife heavily influenced the story.
I don't care if you respond or not, you are basically arguing that Flint being bisexual and loving another man makes him 'softer' and takes away from the story. Then you follow it up by saying that everything that the writer added to the story through the relationship could have been achieved by a hetero relationship instead. It's baseless homophobia, you just don't like seeing your macho pirate antihero love a man because in your mind this is a dichotomy, which is probably the whole bloody point of the writer doing it in the first place.
>you follow it up by saying that everything that the writer added to the story through the relationship could have been achieved by a hetero relationship instead.
Imagine making this up, then calling people names from this imaginary argument nobody made.
Seriously - point to where I said anything of the sort, or delete your account.
You are basically arguing that Flint being bisexual and loving another man makes him 'softer'
From your comment earlier discussing the character having a gay relationship - 'yeah, that was out of left field and really softened our hardest and most ruthless character imo'
Then you follow it up by saying that everything that the writer added to the story through the relationship could have been achieved by a hetero relationship instead
From your comment earlier countering me saying that the gay relationship drove the story and character - 'the Barlow relationship did that already. There was no need to add another love interest'
>Then you follow it up by saying that everything that the writer added to the story through the relationship could have been achieved by a hetero relationship instead
You are literally the only one talking about anything hetero.
I never even used the word.
Stop making shit up and delete your account
I'm done arguing with a homophobe. Its 2023, touch some grass
"everyone with criticism that I dislike is a 'homophobe'"
Your persecution complex is showing. Nobody is talking about "heterosexual", or "homosexual" relationships being better or worse on screen.
You need better reading comprehension if you are going to be this childish
I think the big thing you're missing is that Flint's emotional motivation needs to be tied up in Piracy As Revolution, and him being gay long before it's accepted, and persecuted for it, is a great way to tie emotionality to his politics. Flint is nothing if not intensely passionate about his goals to burn The Old World down, and I wouldn't want to lose that fire for something more stoic and pragmatic. Flint's impassioned anger towards the world makes the show work. He becomes The Monster long before Miranda is killed
Why does his gay arc “soften” him, but Miranda/Mrs Barlow doesn’t?
First, any relationship softens the character by humanizing them.
Look at breaking bad - the whole story is about Walts adultery - to building an empire instead of his family.
Had he suddenly had a love interest (male or female), that would detract from his "true" love of building an empire against his love for his family.
The Barlow relationship was introduced first, and was a clear enough motivation for Flint to become what he was - hell bent on chaos against the British empire, exploiting his crews love of gold to get there.
The twist was from out of left field, and (to my recollection) wasn't really spoken of afterwards. It didn't push his character forward, and it "softened" him by diluting his motives beyond piracy and vengeance.
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JBrundy t1_jdbu2r8 wrote
The show is definitely underrated but for me personally, 90% of the appeal of the show was Captain Flint. I absolutely love that character and Toby Stephens phenomenal acting made it an incredibly compelling character. People often say that the first few episodes suck and it takes a while to get good but i was hooked immediately strictly because of Flint. I’m not too interested in anything that doesn’t involve Flint, and given how Flint’s story ended it doesn’t really make sense for him to come back.