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SerDire t1_itklt86 wrote

I fully support any and all war crimes team black will commit in season 2


SofNascimento t1_itlkeeg wrote

War crimes? Why not call it for what it is?



RealJohnGillman t1_itn5kay wrote

As I understand it, they intend for Rhaenyra to gradually, over the next few seasons, become what Daenerys became in two episodes.


SofNascimento t1_ito1r26 wrote

All I can ask is: If you are going to take away her restraints, don't take away her intelligence as well.


RealJohnGillman t1_itpb5y8 wrote

As I understand it, it is underestimating regular people that would prove her downfall — one may have noticed that anti-dragon weapons like those of Game of Thrones have not been invented yet in this series? This series would then be the reason that they are invented.


FrostyD7 t1_itqblww wrote

They haven't introduced the weapons yet, but they exist. Likely not many around in areas conquered by Aegon because people with dragons rule those kingdoms, but Dorne had them.


TinyRodgers t1_itnazlk wrote

Yup. Honestly they have their work cut out for them.



joaommx t1_itpsz9y wrote

> Justice.

I'll like to see you say that when all is over.


JayPtl t1_itkr3jg wrote

I will make the same comment after B&C for the Greens.


FerBaide t1_itkxk0d wrote

Let’s just support all war crimes, chaos is a ladda


[deleted] t1_itlf448 wrote



JayPtl t1_itlg7rt wrote

Entire war started because Vaghar thought they were finally conquering Dorne. /s


Bad_Mood_Larry t1_itlisrl wrote

The war was started by having a power structure based around a system inheritance where political change and stability is impossible without violent action. Either side's family would have died with Otto and Daemon at the head to secure the inheritance (which they are currently depsite the kneeling and oath swearing to Aegon and Rhaneyra). Viserys chose a weak claimant and everyone is surprised a political member in an advantageous position took control. The problem I always had with the Blacks is they always refused the play the political game and rested on their stale oaths to win the day. Its called a Game of Thrones for a reason swearing oaths is great but anyone with any political sense would have shored up their power through practical means.


RunawayReptar94 t1_itlnnk0 wrote

You're taking my joke comment too seriously lol, obviously their system of government is inherently flawed and many people made mistakes to lead here, I just have read the book and hate the Greens haha


dragonmp93 t1_itmtsq0 wrote

Well, if the show had remained accurate to the books, what we would have got is functionally a rematch of Cersei vs Daenerys, but this time, both have dragons.


dragonmp93 t1_itmte14 wrote

This entire mess would have been avoided if Otto Hightower had told to his daughter to comfort Rhaenyra instead of the King.


markyty04 t1_itn6gsm wrote

no it was started by vicerys and rhynera by trying to usurp the thousand of years of traditions and history of the realm. even aegon the conqueror was not that stupid.


spyson t1_itkgy3o wrote

Pretty big spoiler for game of thrones and the 10th episode of HotD, if you haven't seen it, in the article.

> Did you agree with Miguel Sapochnik’s plan to keep “Driftmark” so dark that most people, even ones with a really good TV, could barely see what was happening, if at all?

> The unique challenge of making television post-production is that you’re making it in this highly calibrated facility with millions of dollars’ worth of equipment and high-end professionals. At the end, if you’re making a movie, you turn over those files to movie theaters, where you know that there’s a reasonable sameness in quality in terms of the way the media is going to be exported and the equipment that it’s being seen on. When you’re making television, you’re turning it over to not only tens of millions of different television setups — rooms with curtains and no curtains, lighting and no lighting, speakers and no speakers — but you’re also turning it over to these different distributors who are going to take the file and compress it or not compress, or show it and 1080P or 4K. It’s very hard to account for all those little variables when you’re when you’re making the show.

> What I learned in the making the season is that you do have to take much more into account the fact that we are making the show for people’s television sets versus in a perfectly calibrated movie theater environment. So, you know, look, that was Miguel’s episode, and Miguel and [director of photograhy] Fabian Wagner, they were in charge of posting the episode and color correcting, and they’re geniuses in that way, so they should have. They brought it to a place where they were happy with it and thought it was great and that’s what got released on television.

I'm so freaking glad that Ryan Condal gets it and that Sapochnik and his dark ass taste won't be in for season 2.


xywv58 t1_itl4ruo wrote

More when LoTR Two towers helms deep battle looked great, sometimes blue "night" is better


Gozillasbday t1_itlo699 wrote

Even when HotD did day for night whatever filter they used looked like garbage. I could see the episode fine, but it looked muddy. My TV is good and I've adjusted all the settings as experts recommended it was just bad.


rhino369 t1_itm8bqd wrote

Agreed. The Got 8x03 episode looks great on my OLED TV in the dark. It feels dark, but you can see.

The driftmark episode of HOTD looked weird and gray.


SecretDracula t1_itn7n9y wrote

"Nope" had a ton of night scenes, which were all day-for-night, and they looked great on my cheap tv. So the technology is here to make it look good.


Gozillasbday t1_itn8anx wrote

I don't see what this has to do with my comment? Did you mean to reply to someone else?


SecretDracula t1_itnamp4 wrote

Just agreeing and adding on to what you said. Maybe it wasn't clear, I was talking about how the movie "Nope" knew how to make day-for-night look good, so HotD has no excuse.


neok182 t1_ito97vo wrote

The DP for NOPE came up with a brand new way of shooting night time scenes using a combination of digital infrared and film cameras lined up identically and then edited together in post.

Thanks to this invention the night scenes looked so amazing and that's why the other commenter pointed it out. Hopefully given the praise of NOPE and this system we'll see this type of filming really take off and used in more film and tv. Especially in TV since they always seem to do a horrible job with night scenes.


doktor-sausage t1_itm95pa wrote

Helm's Deep wasn't day for night, though. They actually did 3 months of night shoots for it.


PsyGuy98 t1_itn6rw2 wrote

What a reddit moment. Sapochnik directed some of the best episodes of GoT and HotD ever but you're happy he's gone because he made some scenes dark?


trianglefish_ t1_itop8h6 wrote

It's a bit much to be glad he's gone, but "made some scenes dark" is an understatement. The Long Night is the climax to the show's single biggest storyline and I couldn't tell what happened in most of it. It wasn't just suboptimal, or annoying, or unattractive: it stopped me from understanding the story at the story's apex. I think it's reasonable to complain about that, and to complain if the same person does it again. (The HotD episode wasn't nearly as bad, but I still had to pause and change my TV settings three times to make the episode clear as it went through daylight/unlit/firelit/daylight.)


annoyingrelative t1_itkwdoj wrote

Holy hell, that entire answer is basically:

Miguel doesn't care about the millions of subscribers who aren't watching HotD on 70 inch OLED 4k TVs - He will film the show like you all have Dolby Atmos home theaters

House of the Dragon was very good, but it felt like Season 5 and 6 of Game of Thrones, not quite as great as the first 4 seasons of GoT.

That's when spectacle overtook story, and it seems as though Miguel is about spectacle


Harricot_de_fleur t1_itl056b wrote

>it felt like Season 5 and 6

Wait really we haven't watched the same s5-6 of GoT


Servebotfrank t1_itl4rz7 wrote

Yeah personally I thought season 6 was awful and was saved by the last two episodes. Meanwhile I've liked or at worst, was entertained by every episode of HotD so far.


Snuffl3s7 t1_itl7x6d wrote

The Hodor episode was also pretty good.


BaelBard t1_itl9f8q wrote

The Hodor episode had a banger of an ending, but it also had one of the worst scenes in the whole show - The Kingsmoot (Euron becoming king), which people tend to forget.


ras344 t1_itlf078 wrote

I'll never forgive them for what they did to my man Euron.


Snuffl3s7 t1_itl9mbq wrote

Fair enough, I only started watching the show in season 6 so to me that was the standard of the show.


AzorAhai1TK t1_itlvmq8 wrote

Man Seasons 5/6 get a much better rep than they deserve, they hold up terribly on rewatch especially once you start thinking about character motivations for two seconds


inputfail t1_itlsslo wrote

Hell I have a 77 inch OLED and could still barely see anything that episode. I think it’s he compression that HBO uses is just bad and that doesn’t help with how dark the episode already is.


Radulno t1_itmjvgv wrote

S1 of HotD is extremely low on spectacle (some people even complain about that), it's mostly about people talking and political plays


trianglefish_ t1_itp3vv5 wrote

>it felt like Season 5 and 6 ... That's when spectacle overtook story

Is that an unrelated thought, or do you think HotD places spectacle above story? Because personally, I thought it was very restrained spectacle-wise, especially for a show that has such obvious opportunity for it. The only moment that I think could fit into that category is Rhaenys busting through the floor and threatening Aegon on dragonback, when there must have been some more practical exit. Outside of that, I think the show firmly places story ahead of spectacle, and that all the spectacular moments fit naturally into the story and don't feel like they happen just to have something spectacular happen. They also don't go on any longer than they have to. Scenes like Aegon claiming Vhagar, Vhagar chasing Arrax, or Daemon killing the Crabfeeder are spectacles, but they contribute vitally to the story and/or character development and could have all been twice as long without it being too weird if they wanted to emphasize spectacle more.


InconspicuousRadish t1_itnbfn2 wrote

I have a 65 inch OLED, and even on that, the episode is not visually pleasing. It feels unnatural, like someone cranked up gamma a lot.

I like Miguel's directing generally, but this obsession of his is really weird.


filmfanatic247 t1_itkl4s2 wrote

Hot take: it wasn't as dark as people are making it out.

Plus people are lazy and can easily change picture settings for an hour of their life.


Ballz_McGinty t1_itkzavh wrote

Not hot take: TV has been around for a while. Producers should create TV shows that don't require us changing our backend TV settings just to see wtf is going on in their poorly lit episodes.


lostmonkey70 t1_itli7m6 wrote

You are correct. Its an editor problem since everything has worked fine up until the last few years. Now we suddenly have audio and visual issues.... Because the editors are focused strictly on the highest equipment calibrated perfectly.


Zalack t1_itruzpu wrote

Editors have nothing to do with the color at that level of production. There will be a dedicated colorist doing the work in a program like Baselight or any of the other dedicated professional finishing programs and hardware out there.


Radulno t1_itmk8pn wrote

That's what happens if you want high production quality stuff. It's a good thing IMO


lostmonkey70 t1_itmks6l wrote

High quality requires ruining the experience for many people? Shocking if true


BlobFishPillow t1_itn64ka wrote

What a weird reply. Lots of people watch actually high production value movies on their televisions and have no problem whatsoever.


csdspartans7 t1_itomnkd wrote

My hot take is it looked perfectly fine on my IPhone and the Drift Mark scene was my favorite


Snuffl3s7 t1_itl82of wrote

I mean I didn't change my TV settings, and I have a shit 6-7 year old TV. I had no issues with the episode.


preppytarg t1_itkw6pm wrote

I had my TV optimized and watched in a pitch black room, and yet still the picture was annoyingly dark. I rewatched the episode on my phone(!) and it was just fine.

It is what it is, but please stop gaslighting others who sincerely had issues no matter what they did.


RichestMangInBabylon t1_itm5jir wrote

It's like the Nintendo Switch joycon drift debacle. Everyone who had it knows what it is, and everyone else swears it's made up because theirs are fine.


BeatlesTypeBeat t1_itoa1bw wrote

Especially the pro controller! Less people have experienced that so people tell me I'm lying when mine did in under a year (heavy use)


[deleted] t1_itkwo1e wrote



sucr4m t1_itkxmzo wrote

"compared to a black screen it was fine" thats not any way to measure :P


filmfanatic247 t1_itkzmpc wrote

It looked dusk in most scenes, not the blackness of night. I also watched it on my phone and thought the same.

When I saw the initial complaints Monday I was really confused as to what they were talking about. No joking, it was night and day compared to each other.

If you don't want to compare the two then pick any other film medium that was set at dusk or moon lit.

I think the biggest reason why it wasn't as bad as BoW is that this was filmed during daylight hours while BoW were night shoots.


adgway t1_itl9w37 wrote

That is a hot take. The show is definitely on the darker end of the spectrum. I watched last night on my 155” 4K projector & again on my 75” 4K Vizio. This episode wasn’t as dark are previous episodes but there were a few moments that came across dark.


neversunnyinanywhere t1_itlf5k0 wrote

I messed with the settings for ages, nothing I could do could make the light parts pop out of the black. Contrast, brightness, backlight, vividness, HDR settings, none of these changed a thing. Turning up the brightness just turned it from a black rectangle to a gray rectangle. I have a 55inch 4k TCL Roku TV, it’s not that new or fancy but I wish I could watch my show without having to get a new one.


RealJohnGillman t1_itn5vvf wrote

My solution was watching at night / with the curtains drawn, although I only really found one episode in particular somewhat tricky to see.


HardlineMike t1_itkx19p wrote

I agree, I didn't see the basis for comparison to Battle of Winterfell at all. It seemed like your standard "We filmed this during the day but we have to pretend its dawn or dusk" filter. In Battle of Winterfell even the fire was dark.


thejfather t1_itnszm9 wrote

Watch "hdtvtest" video on YouTube about the Driftmark episode, it actually was objectively way too dark


jrr6415sun t1_itobp7y wrote

I watched on ipad with my brightness all the way up couldn’t see anything.


Sherlockian_Whimsy t1_itlform wrote

My premiere problem with HoD season one compared to GoT season one is this:

At the conclusion of the first season of GoT I felt I knew a number of characters. I was interested in their fates and deeply invested in the conflicts they were part of.

At the conclusion of season one of HoD? Not so much. I mean, take just the young characters. Sansa, Arya, and Joffrey...heck, even Bran were vibrantly detailed by the end of the first season. Ancillary characters like Theon and Littlefinger were sharply drawn. The same just hasn't been true with HoD, and because of that the world hasn't been nearly as sharply realized.

Will I be back for season two? You bet, but HoD has not flown near the level of quality the first season of GoT did.


PorkshireTerrier t1_itlutk4 wrote

this is a gtreat tool/measure to gauge worldbuilding and character dev


half of the side characcters had 30 seconds or were played for laughs, ie daddy strong, the lannister goof, the loyal dead guy on the council, pretty much all the kids except aemond and aegon.


Radulno t1_itmkj21 wrote

> this is a gtreat tool/measure to gauge worldbuilding and character dev

Not really it's trying to compare a show with the standard for another show. It's not the same type of story and by the narrative itself, it had to advance to the point of the real story (which started in E9 really)


PorkshireTerrier t1_itmzkr1 wrote

Idk I get that they’re different but it’s still an entire season.

Even in shows like Parks n Rec, which I love, I give people a heads up that season 1 is a slow start w an unlikeable protag.

Regardless of how good the show gets, and how well they develop characters - at the end of 10ish hours of tv, it’s possible you don’t really connect w any of their characters , bc they’re rushed.

Also, often the show doesn’t follow the logic, worldbuilding and stakes it tries to establish.


Jamaz t1_itobcih wrote

I feel Harwin Strong should have had some foreshadowing or at least a bit of screen time before the time skip just so the audience could know he existed. We just have to accept Rhaenyra was willing to risk her claim and have 3 kids with this random dude that just showed up.


SecretDracula t1_itna6wi wrote

The big problem with HotD's characters is that they have crappy motivation. When the show started, they all kinda sorta wanna be king in a vague, distant way, but they have zero immediate goals.

Compare that to GoT ep 1 where almost every character has a strong immediate, personal goal. And if they didn't have one is ep 1, they got one by ep 2.

And there were mysteries everywhere in GoT that had you begging to know more. HotD has no mysteries at all. None!

There are no white walkers, no "who tried to kill Bran?", no "who killed Jon Arryn?", no unknown schemers in the castle basement, no question of Jon Snow's parentage.

They just don't seem to "get" what made GoT good.


ruxi23 t1_itnqtyd wrote

Exactly. I think out of all adult and young characters we really only know like 5 of them and even them have been either inconsistent, one note or passive or Viserys .The rest barely got anything. At this point it feels more like a plot driven show imo to get to the mentioned moments in the dance/lead up to it than a chracter driven drama and I put this on the writers not being able to fill in the gaps with a lot of new scenes and small inside the episode arcs btw the more significant moments.


Jacadi7 t1_itln74q wrote

The one question I wish they would’ve asked is about why Daemon consoling his daughters was cut.


flouronmypjs t1_itl21b0 wrote

Man, the editors were asleep for this article. Interesting insights into the show, though.


AmishAvenger t1_itlrmxj wrote

It’s awful.

Typos aside, “council” and “counsel” are two different words. Isn’t Variety supposed to be a professional publication? Jesus Christ.


doktor-sausage t1_itm9h4f wrote

It's so widespread even among prestige publications that I wonder if "editor" has largely become a status title and they rarely edit or proofread prose by their staff.


squeryk t1_itnqwye wrote

You're right, and I think it also has to do with the slow decline of standards across society, in all aspects. Primarily with the standards of intelligence and perception driven downwards by social media (and why not, a school system not fit for purpose in the majority of the world) and a culture that celebrates shock, silliness and stupidity packaged in tiny portions.

The increase in films and shows that lack moral nuance and mature perspectives, the lack of hope and a call to higher values of decency and respect, articles with very basic gramatical errors, the hyper sexualization present in music in particular while celebrating it as empowerment, the ever increasing polarisation of individuals in practically all aspects. Black and white, laughter and cries. Empty noise playing from silly instruments while the room dances and dances in the flaming castle, laughter echoing and then stifled by the smoke.

A fitting end, or perhaps reset point, for a species which for all our self importance, is probably not even out of the galactic kindergarten. Would explain why aliens avoid us.


Arbor-Trap t1_itlg0m9 wrote

Who has read fire and blood? I have a few questions


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itlkw0s wrote

I did


Arbor-Trap t1_itllqtf wrote

Is this where the book ends?


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itln3y1 wrote

No this was all just the prologue to the dance of dragons segment of the book. The book isn't just about this particular war so it goes beyond what's going to be in this series, and starts before. The whole 10 episodes of this show was just 2 chapters of the book


Arbor-Trap t1_itlnzdq wrote

Holy crap. As an outside observer I’d say they did a damn fine job of adapting it, but as a book reader, what did you think of season 1?


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itlo88b wrote

I absolutely loved it and was very thrilled to see the barebones events from the book on the screen.


Arbor-Trap t1_itlrgn3 wrote

That’s exactly what I want to hear haha, does this book follow multiple characters POV like asoiaf? Or is it more of like an overview of those events?


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itlv8cc wrote

The book is written as if it were a nonfiction history book so it talks about basic events and does not have any PoVs. It does cite fictional sources of people who were involved in events and compares the way different people describe the events that occurred to try and figure out the "truth."


Arbor-Trap t1_itm16xy wrote

Neat! Is it an easy read or kind of a slog?


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itm1ezl wrote

I liked it but some other people don't. It's nothing like the other asoiaf books. If you like reading history books you might like this. You won't know anything about any of the characters' private thoughts after reading. Only what they did.


Arbor-Trap t1_itm76g4 wrote

I’ve never truly tried to read a history book other than in school but I will definitely check it out when I’m done with the original series. Did you read the novellas as well?


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itmcayq wrote

The novellas are adapted into chapters of fire and blood so I read them basically as part of the overall book. There are some small changes I believe


Arbor-Trap t1_itmorcb wrote

Thank you! Finally, what are you reading now?


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itmp2f5 wrote

I'm not really reading anything at this time, but now I feel guilty about that


Arbor-Trap t1_itmq8k2 wrote

Hahaha I didn’t mean it like that, but if it makes you feel better, I have only read a few books since 2017. I’ve been trying to get back into it and spend much less time on PlayStation


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itmrgod wrote

A good book I read relatively recently is Piranesi by Susanna Clarke. It's about a guy who lives in an endless House filled with mysterious statues, and he has one friend who visits sometimes


Arbor-Trap t1_itmsver wrote

My interest is peaked hahaha thank you for the suggestion!


RealJohnGillman t1_itn6fvu wrote

An interesting thing they did with the finale is that the history book said that Aemond had full control of his dragon and purposefully killed his nephew. Which is of course the narrative they would have to go with publicly, as they couldn’t be telling the public that Targaryens couldn’t control their dragons. So both accurate and inaccurate to the book — the history book element of it all helped the series adaptation greatly.


BFast20 t1_itm8c0o wrote

Listen to the audio book. It's pretty good and the guy reading it really makes me feel like its a historical recollection.


Arbor-Trap t1_itmoxfu wrote

I’ll definitely check it out! I usually throw on a podcast while I’m driving but the audio book could be great for those long drives!


ConeBone1969 t1_itlu1sc wrote

Do we know if the show is the whole book, or just the events that follow this group of ppl?

I got spoiled to the death of a major character (thanks to Joffrey recapping events in GoT) and wasn't sure if that was the ending of the show, the books, or whatever. Now I'm debating reading the book, but I'm unsure bc it seems like the book is a cliff notes version of the show if that makes sense.


CriminalsGetCaught t1_itlvdtt wrote

The first set of seasons of this show is dedicated to the Dance of Dragons war. After that storyline ends it could end, or it could continue, or it could hop to another point of the timeline and be an anthology.

I'd recommend reading the book. If you read the book you get the surprise of reading the events, and then get the surprise for the changes and revelations of the show. If you just watch the show it's one surprise. For instance in the book it doesn't say that Aemond lost control of Vhagar. So the event in the show enhances past the narrative of the book. Just my thoughts.

Edit: the book goes way past the event spoiled by King Joffrey


DMike82 t1_itn7ecm wrote

Also the show changed how Ser CrIncel Cole killed Lord Beesbury during the Green Council meeting. In the books it's debated whether he slit Lyman's throat or threw him out of a window, whereas in the show he just slammed the guy's head into the table.


DMike82 t1_itn74ro wrote

> Do we know if the show is the whole book, or just the events that follow this group of ppl?

Just the events that follow this group of people. Viserys was the fifth king of the Seven Kingdoms and the book covers the first four's stories before we even get to any of this.


ConeBone1969 t1_itna12u wrote

Good to know. Just bought the book. Would have been confused as to when the events of the show were going to start.


DMike82 t1_itnbiqv wrote

Yeah, the succession before the events of the series goes Aegon I --> Aenys --> Maegor the Cruel (Aegon's sons) --> Jahaerys I (Aenys's surviving son) --> Viserys I (Jahaerys's grandson). All of them have their stories told in the book before the events of the Dance of the Dragons even begins to be told.

Fire and Blood is basically a biography of the Targaryen dynasty from Aegon the Conqueror up to one of Viserys's grandsons. The next volume (if it ever comes out) is supposed to follow the succeeding generations up to the events of the books.


DMike82 t1_itn6ted wrote

Hell, the first eight episodes cover one chapter.


TerraInvicta1776 t1_itm56ht wrote

They didn't even start filming yet?! Damn, it's going to be a long wait.


LCJ_ST t1_itlbsw6 wrote

Not sure if it was darkness or just the overuse of green screens. They are not using many sets for this show as opposed to GOT and it shows.


[deleted] t1_itlovwk wrote



__dontpanic__ t1_itlsnsh wrote

Fuck mate, put a spoiler warning up first. Not all of us have read the books.


InnateAnarchy t1_itkm3cy wrote

The show should’ve been named, “The real housewives of kings landing”

So much drama not nearly enough sex or violence.

So many downvotes but you know I’m right.


Thatguyonthenet t1_itku2kp wrote

I'm glad you enjoy shit TV. You're not right because of the downvotes you delusional Season 8 enjoyer.


ericsartwrk t1_itlj02l wrote

Did you watch the show? They were in a brothel multiple times. We see Daemon not being able to finish, we see him almost fuck his niece in a brothel. They even had Larys jacking off to Alicent’s feet for fucks sake. Idk what more you want there

As for violence, there was also plenty of it as well. Daemon uses the gold cloaks to round up and fuck up all the criminals in Lings Landing, he chops a dudes head off in the throne room, Aemond loses an eye, he kills Luke. Laenor(or a man supposed to be Laenor) was burned alive, Laena burns herself alive with her dragon. Rhaenys kills hundreds of not thousands of people when she escapes the dragon pit on Meleys

This is the season they needed to set up all the violence to come. It’s about a civil war with dragons and they haven’t gotten to that part yet. You’ll get much more violence soon my dude


YYC9393 t1_itlagpv wrote

Seriously, besides the Middle Ages bachelorette plot it was painfully fucking boring.