Comments
BelAirGhetto t1_ixub96z wrote
It was common in Rome and Egypt too!
The Jews were slaves.
Since we have this in common we know just how much effort it takes to root out slave apologists everywhere.
Slavery is abhorrent, and excusing it is also a form of hate, can we agree?
monkeypox_69 t1_ixv4vmm wrote
Not to mention native Americans were enslaving each other before the united states' was a thing but the circlejerk here is America bad.
absolutelyshafted t1_ixw7xd6 wrote
Yeah native Americans were branding each other with irons, whipping each other to death, separating families, selling people on auction blocks, transporting tons of other natives in the worst conditions, cutting off limbs for those who escaped
monkeypox_69 t1_ixw8zxa wrote
Terrible stuff, can we all agree this was bad and belongs in the past? But no, America had slaves so bad, evil and wrong. I'm not excusing the ugliness of the past but fuck man if we can't get past those times, there is no future.
billbuild t1_iy2621t wrote
> I'm not excusing the ugliness of the past but fuck man if we can't get past those times, there is no future.
Sounds like you have already.
monkeypox_69 t1_iy266kt wrote
Better report me to the anti racist police
billbuild t1_iy26n9j wrote
There aren’t any so you can just go on being racist and never asking yourself why. It’s your life bud!
unRoanoke t1_ixuc35q wrote
This particular article is about enslaved people in the US in 1860 and the events and systems that led to demand for the labor those specific people were forced to perform.
While it is true that other cultures/races/ethnicities throughout history and geography suffered enslavement or enslaved others, that is not relevant to this discussion about this specific group of people in this specific place at this specific time.
SomewhatIntriguing t1_ixu8dn3 wrote
Sounds like whataboutism to me
colonel_beeeees t1_ixuaga0 wrote
Cool did the Norse redline cities to keep black Americans from homeownership
xdzgor t1_ixucmyi wrote
No black Americans owned homes in the old Norse times. Draw your own conclusion.
billbuild t1_iy25vtv wrote
Were they raped, separated from their families at any time for any reason, thrown overboard in the Atlantic because they were pregnant, hung, burned, breastfed the children of oppressors only to be labeled dangerous when the emancipation proclamation was signed too? Cool story bro.
matbabtob t1_ixuc0r4 wrote
Yes, but there are people alive and kicking that can directly trace their wealth, land, careers, politics, and culture to the slave trade referenced by OP. So it's probably worth being focused on a little bit more than more ancient examples...
[deleted] t1_ixue674 wrote
Oh, shut the fuck up.
SueSudio t1_ixusi01 wrote
People are aware of the ubiquitous nature of slavery in human history. What was the point you were trying to get across with this comment?
ThatOtkauWolf_90 t1_ixusvf8 wrote
No they really aren't.
SueSudio t1_ixuvpxa wrote
Are you aware that the founding fathers were aware that slavery was morally wrong and acknowledged that they personally benefited from it, which made it difficult to undo?
SueSudio t1_ixuu34b wrote
Maybe you need different social circles. It's pretty common knowledge. It's even in central stories of the bible.
I'm still curious what perspective you were hoping to impart on people, comparing middle ages Scandinavia to the USA 150 years ago.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixv5tft wrote
It should be common knowledge but people wanna pretend america not only started slavery but was the only source which is nonsense.
SueSudio t1_ixvj0ex wrote
Didn't start it, just fought a brutal war to keep it long after it was acknowledged how morally wrong it was.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixvounj wrote
Yes, some people fought for that but people wanna act like it's everyone's fault. Forever guilty, never any progress because the past is unchangeable.
SueSudio t1_ixvrhns wrote
Not forever guilty. But make amends.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixvynh0 wrote
The problem with "amends" is it will never be enough.
SueSudio t1_ixvzxv0 wrote
That's a good excuse when you aren't the one that was oppressed.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixw0ipa wrote
Neither were you. Stop playing games.
SueSudio t1_ixw60cs wrote
There's the root. You pretend there is no issue. People in my lifetime were denied home ownership opportunities to build wealth. The government had programs that gave developers incentives as long as they didn't sell homes to black people.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixw77gp wrote
Well in the past it was black folks, now we're all getting screwed. This country ain't perfect, if you don't like it here you are free to leave. Let's see you go to a country without it's share of past and present social and racial problems.
SueSudio t1_ixwk3en wrote
"If you don't like it leave." More often than not that's how these conversations end. So predictable and weak.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixx04ev wrote
So don't leave, stop bitching.
SueSudio t1_ixx5mvv wrote
You may not have noticed due to your seething anger, but I am not bitching, you are. I am stating that I believe measures need to be taken to even the scales due to lingering effects of systemic racism.
monkeypox_69 t1_ixxg82h wrote
Well good luck with your racist witch hunting
rapiertwit t1_ixuhchg wrote
Yeah but Scandinavians weren't keeping slaves in 1850 whole crowing about "liberty" as the basis for their civilization.
That's the difference.
wheresmattynow t1_ixvi17r wrote
Now do Liberia in 2022.
MatiusX t1_iy979lc wrote
Perhaps a little more relevantly, though not as recently,
>It is estimated that at the beginning of the 20th century, up to 40% of blacks in the [United States] South were trapped in peonage.
...a number that, to my limited knowledge, remained at a steady level, particularly in Alabama, up until Bailey v. Alabama in 1911, (which abolished the state's illegal and loophole-y neo-slavery provisions), and after that did not decrease significantly until the signing of Circular 3591 on December 1941, which led to a rapid-fire series of arrests and prosecutions, yadda yadda, last black slave freed in October of 1942. Ignoring modern, more or less color-blind human trafficking, of course.
Very interesting topic, especially if you ignore the happy ending and remember that segregation persisted until 1964, and its effects persists to this day.
wheresmattynow t1_iyc9ibt wrote
Very interesting topic, especially if you ignore than millions of people live in literal slavery in Liberia and the Middle East right now.
absolutelyshafted t1_ixw7pyr wrote
Textbook example of whataboutism
wheresmattynow t1_ixw825t wrote
yes what about the millions enslaved right now in Liberia
what , not convenient to talk about slavery when talking about slavery?
Frosty_404 t1_ixwaphy wrote
People don't wanna think about how bad other people/countries/races are. Only white North Americans and Western Europeans are bad. Never mind the atrocities being committed around the world every day.
absolutelyshafted t1_ixwbmla wrote
White people get a bit more flak than others because they called themselves morally superior for hundreds of years.
You can’t have extremely brutal slavery in the 1800’s, and then prison slavery also targeted at blacks in the 1900’s, and call yourself morally superior. It just doesn’t work
Frosty_404 t1_ixwd23m wrote
Oh don't get me wrong we're awful. We do awful shit all the time. But so does everyone else IIRC Iran is supposed to be executing some 14,000 prisoners from the protests and is saying the virgin women should be raped first so they can't go to heaven. You can't have that going on in the world and say whites are the only bad people
absolutelyshafted t1_ixwomds wrote
Yeah but nobody actually says that
The thing is white people have always claimed to be the better ones in comparison to everyone else INCLUDING in terms of atrocities and whatnot. This was a dominant ideology for the past 100 years and just recently has fallen out of favor. And even today it’s still super common for whites to claim that Africans and East Asians are the most brutal and apathetic races in terms of genocide
This whole thing of “yeah maybe whites did slavery on a mass scale among other thing, but look these other people did stuff like that too” is a classic example of whataboutism
FrankieGrimes213 t1_ixwpxvl wrote
As a white person, I was raised with the idea no matter white people do as a race, Asian people will do it better. I was never taught whites were superior, just typically efficient.
And people who claim whataboutism typically hide behind that word so they don't have to have introspection on their hypocrisy.
billbuild t1_iy25i5b wrote
> I was never taught whites were superior, just typically efficient.
Pretty efficient system of transplanting people across oceans to make their production of cotton, tobacco and sugar efficient for generations. The pretty efficient to call the same people they raped, killed, child molested dangerous when that brutal practice ended creating the highest levels of incarceration in the world for shit like selling weed and drugs that were brought into the country by the heirs of their oppressors. That’s some efficacy right there, be proud and tell your kids how smart great grandma and grandpa were! Or just vote to ban the books, either way.
FrankieGrimes213 t1_iy26278 wrote
Again, look to the Asians for the highest incarceration. They always do things bigger.
Your rants if full of nonsense and just isn't fact. But keep telling yourself that
billbuild t1_iy26jmx wrote
FrankieGrimes213 t1_ixwpgs1 wrote
People who claim whataboutism usually have a hard time facing their hypocrisy
Basinox t1_ixucpzn wrote
TIL more people have died in nazi concentration camps than there were enslaved in the USA at the begining of the American civil war.
FrankieGrimes213 t1_ixwq2gw wrote
There are most slaves right now than in the entire history of the US.
PoopMobile9000 t1_ixwpbhd wrote
Don’t forget the millions of others slaves who lived and died in the preceding 200 years.
Strong-Inflation-776 t1_ixvlaic wrote
There’s 40 million in the world right now
absolutelyshafted t1_ixw7p2d wrote
There’s also way way more people now
As a percent of the population, america had a shit ton of slaves and depended on slave labor a lot
Strong-Inflation-776 t1_ixw8e64 wrote
America still does depend on slave labor; and everyone uses it. If you were the only slave in the world, would statistics matter to you??
absolutelyshafted t1_ixwbft1 wrote
It’s just important to understand slavery in America if you wanna understand Americas history
You keep trying to use whataboutism to distract from the truth: america was essentially built on slavery. Brazil is the only other country that had so many slaves carrying the economy for so long. And even after slavery ended for blacks, most whites didn’t just accept that. Why would they? It took over 100 years for america to actually stop treating an entire race of people like semi slaves
Strong-Inflation-776 t1_ixwfdyy wrote
Nobody is using whataboutism. I’m pointing out that america still uses slavery and everyone in America is an active part of it.
HPmoni t1_iy0vquj wrote
Prison labor is not slavery. This was enslaving innocent people. Not guilty people.
MatiusX t1_iy90fut wrote
And to expand on the above point, guilty of what?
Andy83n t1_ixu7pmu wrote
320m now isn't it
[deleted] t1_ixujecs wrote
We hit 8 billion worldwide slaves today! Please daddy capitalism, please let me suck some more nutritional minimal wage from your nips 🥺
FitPrimary2126 t1_ixvba37 wrote
You're getting downvoted while the Pandora papers were ignored, in Canada, we have Trudeau's family owning 40% of the firm making the lipid particles in the pfizer clot shot, shows why Trudeau already purchased 400 million vaccines for Canada, you know Canada, that country with 35 million people or so... that's roughly 11 doses each...
Doesn't matter where you go, we are all truly slaves to wealthy families and the Vatican hiding behind Blackrock and Vanguard, at this point, IDK what else to say, unless you can explain to me why multiple men need 100,000,000,000+ dollars while 100,000,000+ people starve around the world?
TransformativeOne t1_ixu68r1 wrote
No, no, no. According to the new guidelines by Texas Florida Virginia etc there wasn't slavery it was "involuntary relocation". You can't tell White kids that Black people were enslaved, beaten, raped, murdered, families separated, human beings treated worse than animals because that might make them feel bad. So you have to sanitize it and make up new words and lie and say things like, it wasn't that bad, they kept families together, they were just more like hired hands and they were treated pretty good.
It's disgusting, it's horrible that African-American people had to go through this and for hundreds of years were treated so horrifically. And now to have these POS try to sanitize it and make it something that never occurred because they don't want to look at the history because there's many scholars will tell you when you study your history and you feel bad that helps you to correct it and make sure that it never happens again. But when you sanitize it minimize it lie about it guess what it happens over and over and over.
HPmoni t1_iy0vuio wrote
I've never seen such a history book. No.
Scary_Diver1940 t1_ixu9bu5 wrote
Your numbers should be higher from 1400's till now.
Count all the races that were under some type of, Industrial or Indentured servitude, American Indians, Chinese, Irish and Jewish, Arcadians, Mexican and African slaves of all colors, etc.
It's not going to get better. Now people hate others they have never met or interacted with.
Need to study more history and not destroy any of it good or bad.
There is little difference between subjugation and Subsidization
Just saying InMyOpinon
mysilvermachine t1_ixub6tv wrote
Classic bit of “whataboutery” there.
Scary_Diver1940 t1_ixvxnh2 wrote
And.... If it's right it's right.
PorkfatWilly t1_ixu6qtd wrote
I think you got the political derangement. First step: Stop watching MSNBC. It’ll take a few years, but slowly the conditioning you’ve received at the hands of partisan propagandists will wear off and you’ll realize that one side isn’t evil, but both sides are lying duplicitous conmen who care only about winning office. Good luck!
TransformativeOne t1_ixu76r1 wrote
First of all I don't watch MSNBC, I read books. History books you might give it a try. First-hand accounts of what it was like written by the people who were there at the time. You can spin it any way you want but the fact remains that millions of people were enslaved for hundreds of years. Civil War was fought over whether or not we could continue treating human beings as property. The South likes to reframe it just as they're attempting to do today and say they were defending their homeland but the reality is it was all about whether or not as a country we're going to allow that important policy. So you can spin it any way you want my good friend I know what path I choose.
rraattbbooyy t1_ixu88ve wrote
The partisan propagandists are the ones writing the textbooks. This is why American schools children rarely learn the truth unless they seek it out on their own.
StepOnMeCIA t1_ixvcuu5 wrote
Down to a minimum 2 million now. Thanks prison.
HPmoni t1_iy0w3em wrote
They're not slaves because they're black.
StepOnMeCIA t1_iy0wg0q wrote
They aren't all black. Slavery is allowed when imprisoned in the US.
ActualGiantPenguin t1_ixwbbjn wrote
Nearly 50% of the population of the Deep South, and majorities in Mississippi and South Carolina.
yelbesed2 t1_ixugdlx wrote
The Soviet Colonies in Eastern Europe had 100 million slaves. No one even called them slaves because offivially they were liberated from the rule of Capital.
SpiritOne t1_ixu6jny wrote
Only 2,680,000 according to the census!!
What a fucked up Country we were/are.
edit: looks like people didnt understand the 3/5 rule the government had regarding counting slaves back then.
[deleted] t1_ixu5f6o wrote
[deleted]
ThatOtkauWolf_90 t1_ixu7y8d wrote
Did you know keeping slaves was very common in ancient Norse culture? Which means there are tons of white people today who have the exact same background when it comes to slavery as African Americans... same with almost every race/culture to date. Yes you're very much correct this happend and was awful, but slavery is not exclusively a race thing or unique in our country's history. I'm sure this will be down voted or removed but at least that means people read it.