Submitted by giuliomagnifico t3_zy5sef in todayilearned
The Dutch Sinterklaas had its roots about that time as well - similar thing
Pretty sure Santa Claus is actually an anglicized version of the name sinterklaas.
TIL Santa is roughly about the same age as baseball
Our modern conception of Christmas as a whole is fairly modern.
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Pretty sure you are right :)
Just gonna throw this in: reindeer love Amanita Muscaria mushrooms (the famous red one with white dots that smurfs live in?) and they get fuuuuucked up. That mushroom is so potent, Shamans in Scandinavia and Siberia would feed them to their deer, collect the urine, boil it down and drink it and also get fucked up. That's my flying reigndeer reference.
It's less about the strength and more that the deer filter out the good compounds while harmlessly absorbing some of the compounds that fuck up a human stomach pretty bad.
Ahh. Mushroom tummy, that sounds more accurate. Thanks for weighing in.
Funny how messy this is in Germany:
on 6th of Dec: St Nikolaus brings some small presents. An old man with a white beard, dressed in red and white.
on 24th of Dec: in northern Germany the "Christmas Man" (Weihnachtsmann) brings the presents. Basically Santa Claus. In roughly southern Germany the "Christ Child" (Christkind) brings the presents. It's not baby Jesus, and is instead portrayed as a girl with long, curled, blonde hair, even though it is generally considered genderless.
It is known that the image of Santa Claus came from Saint Nicholas (of Myra), which to this day is said to visit kids on Dec 6th to bring small gifts.
The myth developed as a mix of Saint Nicholas stories, Roman Saturn and Norse Odin.
In some european parts, the role of the gift-bringer was replaced with baby jesus (which is also false, since the gifts were brought by the 3 wise men on Jan 6th... babies generally don't gift anything). Until recently it was quite common, for example in spain, to give gifts on jan 6th, not on christmas.
With colonization, the Dutch version of "Sinterklaas" was spread to the colonies.
The first appearance of Santa flying a wagon was in 1809 by Washington Irving. In 1822 a Poem by Clement Clark Moore went viral, spreading the idea further.
Coca Cola just took those mostly regional stories and put them on nation-wide stage first and world-wide stage later, spreading the idea around the world and establishing it further.
I'm pretty sure that some people learned about the stories from the coca cola commercials, but they merely adopted it and gave it a bit of their own spin (like santa wanting you to put out a coke for him instead of milk and cookies)
From what I've seen the red suit of Santa was first mentioned in 1881 when Thomas Nast, illustrated the earlier Clark poem which only mentions a fir clothed Santa from head to foot.
As to Coca-Cola it did not hurt them to present Santa to the world in their ads in their own corporate colors.
So what you’re saying is one day we could get a game where Kratos fights Santa.
Pretty sure it's Irving Washington
David Sedaris has an absolutely amazing story about dutch Santa. Go on YouTube and look up "David Sedaris - 6 to 8 Black Men"
Three wise men is false. There were three kinds of gifts however. Having said that, your detail goes into more depth than the "article."
You could have just asked
https://www.coca-colacompany.com/faqs/did-coca-cola-invent-santa
Oh I didn’t know, thanks. Anyway if you search (also in this subreddit), you will find lots of posts/info about “how Coca-Cola created the modern Santa Claus”.
Do you believe everything a corporation tells you?
If they have no reason to lie, and they have the records of exactly what happened... Yes I believe them.
No, I wouldn't believe "everything" that anyone told me.
Do you just believe everything the internet tells you?
Did Coca Cola manipulate the zeitgeist in order to better push their highly addictive and horribly unhealthy products on the world even harder than they already do?
No, says Coca Cola.
Even if it is true, the last people I would ask are the accused in this case
You sound angry, did they hurt you?
The Coca-Cola company made me obese and I now have diabetes II
You sound like a halfwit. Have you anything to actually add here?
Are you suggesting that they are lying?
Are you suggesting they wouldn't?
You're saying that Coke did indeed invent the modern Santa Claus despite them saying they didn't. What evidence do you have to support this claim?
> You're saying that Coke did indeed invent the modern Santa Claus despite them saying they didn't. What evidence do you have to support this claim?
I'm not saying anything of the sort. It's offensive for you to put words in my mouth.
I'm asking if the above user is trying to suggest that the Coca-Cola corporations wouldn't lie.
Coke says they didn't invent Santa. You say we should not believe them when they say that.
>Coke says they didn't invent Santa. You say we should not believe them when they say that.
What the FUUUUCK are you talking about? Who said they invented Santa clause?
>You say we should not believe them when they say that.
Where did I say that?
> What the FUUUUCK are you talking about? Who said they invented Santa clause?
You don't realize what thread you're in do you?
Bro you're arguing a troll just drop it
Why would they have any reason to lie about creating the neo-modern Sinterklaas*? This is flat earther levels of conspiracy
> Why would they have any reason to lie about creating santa clause?
People complain about the commodifying of Christmas all the time. It's really not crazy to think a company wouldn't want to be the go-to example.
(Also who the fuck said anything about "creating Santa clause")
>(Also who the fuck said anything about “creating Santa clause”)
The modern image of santa claus*. Thank you for being pedantic, I'm sure that was cathartic for you.
> People complain about the commodifying of Christmas all the time. It's really not crazy to think a company wouldn't want to be the go-to example.
>It’s really not crazy to think a company wouldn’t want to be the go-to example.
Of course its not, but why would coca-cola see themselves this way? I don't see much criticism of their supposed creation of what I have dubbed The Post-Modern Sinterklaas, though I have seen much nostalgia.
Last? Bro, asking the accused is the basis of justice. The accused can provide facts that support a defense or could be damning. You shouldn't make judgement calls on gut feelings.
Aah yes, big corporations never lied. Lmao
What do you think they are lying about in that link?
Not lying about one thing does not Change the fact that we should not trust them
And to add, the link from this trustworthy company does not say the same thing as the link from OP from the guardian.
But Please go ahead and gobble on coca cola propaganda as you wish
So... they're not lying? What was the point of your comment then?
This is a weird thing to get your panties in a twist about. Chill, it's just a story about a made up dude.
*I didn't see anything inherently contradictory in either articles
Coca Cola claims that there were many depictions before their ads, when it’s not true. If you read the guardian piece and compared what is on the Coca Cola website you would see the difference.
There were many depictions though...
German saint Nicholas (although similar) was skinny with a tall hat for instance. In Norway he wore green, in some English depictions he didn't have a white beard. It doesn't say they created the image, only that they popularized the image that is now what most people think of as Santa Claus. And they did by putting that image in all their advertising that was put everywhere.
My great grandma had a couple dozen Santa statues from all over the world, they varied quite a bit.
>Not lying about one thing does not Change the fact that we should not trust them
That's... not a very useful way of looking at things. Whether or not you trust what someone says should be based on a number of factors, their trustworthiness, sure, but also their motivations and what they would gain by telling the truth or lying.
Coca Cola would probably have a lot to gain by pushing the idea they invented the image of Santa Claus. The fact that it would so easily disprovable if they were to claim that they did is also another reason to expect them to be telling the truth in this instance.
That said they do seem to push the idea that they somehow solidified his appearance from a number of other depictions, which isn't really true, or at least they're vague enough in their wording to imply it without stating it. The modern image of Santa existed before Coca Cola began advertising.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/the-claus-that-refreshes/
>There was a period of overlap during which the modern Santa Claus character coexisted with other Christmas figures and other versions of himself, as his now-standard appearance and persona jelled and his character grew in popularity to become the dominant (secular) Christmas figure in the western world. However, that period had ended before Coca-Cola began utilizing Santa for their holiday season advertisements. As noted in a New York Times article published in 1927, four years before the appearance of Sundblom's first Santa-based Coca-Cola ad, the Santa Claus figure rendered by Sundblom was based upon what had already become the standard image of Santa:
>
>--
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>Coke's annual advertisements featuring Sundblom-drawn Santas holding bottles of Coca-Cola, drinking Coca-Cola, receiving Coca-Cola as gifts, and enjoying Coca-Cola became a perennial Christmastime feature which helped spur Coca-Cola sales throughout the winter (and produced the bonus effect of appealing quite strongly to children, an important segment of the soft drink market). One might therefore fairly grant Coca-Cola some credit for cementing the modern image of Santa Claus in the public consciousness, as in an era before the advent of television, before color motion pictures became common, and before the widespread use of color in newspapers, Coca-Cola's magazine advertisements, billboards, and point-of-sale store displays were for many Americans their primary exposure to the modern Santa Claus image. But at best what Coca-Cola popularized was an image they borrowed, not one they created.
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Sorry for trusting guardian more than coca cola. And as I wrote in the comment you replied they are not saying the same thing. Cocacola claims it popularized the santa claus in the current form, when guardian says that this form was almost in every portrayal in the XIX century.
Weird thing to get your parties in a twist just because someone does not trust your beloved corporation.
It says what the top comment in this thread said, like quite literally in the first 2 sentences. They said they didn’t invent Santa Clause but helped shape it. Taking a bunch of regional ideas and putting it into one character and because it was nation wide advertising that idea spread everywhere.
People thought Coke invented the modern Santa? That's news to me
I see this myth regularly. Several times every year at Christmas.
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Yea first I’m hearing of this “myth”
There were a few posts on this sub claiming this ‘myth’ was true
Isnt the narrative that they got his "Jolly look" refined to what it is now? And since cocacola had the means to advertise with posters and magazines, the image was dispursed worldwide. Before Coca-Cola's ad campaign, he was portrayed in many different iterations with no standardized look. Even in night before Christmas he is described as a little elf on a miniature sleigh and eight tiny reindeer.
Watch out... one of the links that was supposed to take me to a Santa image took me to some sort of anime-chat thing.
In Eastern Europe Saint Nick is often portrayed with heavy furs, which are brown. Or in very thick winter clothing. If he is portrayed in colors, blue is usually his color of choice. Because blue is associated with winter and frost.
Coca-Cola didn't invent the modern Saint Nick, but they did a hell of a job to popularize a version of him that matched their color scheme. You don't see Saint Nick associated with Heineken for example. Or Mountain Dew.
In Western Europe he's either in white or red, considering the Dutch immigrants brought him over, it's only logical that he was red from the early 19th century, considering the Dutch Saint Nicholas outfit had red in it
I always thought his red suit was the Coke contribution as he was usually depicted in green prior to the 1930s.
Santa Claus comes from Sinter Klaas in the Netherlands, who wears red as well.
Nikolaus von Myra (altgriechisch Νικόλαος Μυριώτης Nikólaos Myriṓtēs who is from turkey.
The Dutch don’t even celebrate sinter Klaas on the right day (5/6 December)
But yeah, the red Color is old:
This town has st Nicolaus in red (but white and green also existed)
Ok the dutch might got it from turkey but dutch immigrants brought it to America.
Lots of interesting fact in the linked article, the first myth debunked:
> 1 Coca-Cola designed the modern Santa Claus as part of an advertising campaign > >This is one you always hear at dinner parties. It makes the speaker sound rather clever and cynical. Except it’s tosh. Coca-Cola did start using Santa in advertising in 1933. But Santa had been portrayed almost exclusively in red from the early 19th century and most of his modern image was put together by cartoonist Thomas Nast in the 1870s. Even if you were to confine your search to Santa in American soft drinks adverts, you would find a thoroughly modern Santa Claus in the posters for White Rock that came out in 1923.
Thomas Nast is also the guy who drew a donkey for the Democratic Party and an elephant for the Republican Party.
Huh! You know, I'd heard the same myth and believed it until today.
IT's not entirely untrue.
Here's another interesting view of santa through the ages. https://erinsweeneydesign.com/news/the-history-of-santa-claus/
"While Coca-Cola didn’t invent the modern day Santa, Sundblom’s paintings are believed to have strongly influenced the way other artists have depicted Santa ever since."
One thing to notice is that throughout history santa has changed drastically, but since 1931, Pretty much every santa at every mall and every commercial and tree ornament looks identical.
In 2500, people looking back will probably look at a collection of what santa looked like through the ages and the 21st century will have a coca cola santa. It's the santa that (currently) defines what santa should look like.
That’s an excellent article. While it’s probably correct to say that an ad campaign popularized his look, it’s clear from this article that his look as we know it today went back as far as 1902.
That Boys Life from 1913 would have had a huge distribution too. It’s not as if it was some obscure depiction.
I would say that boy's life looks very similar. Probably 90% of the way there.
Which is why I say that it's mostly a myth that coke created santa.
But, the differences are pretty important. The coke center has the giant thick conveyor belt, the boys life has a regular belt. The BL has some kind of fencing gauntlets? And the coke Santa has the trademark white trim on his sleeves. The BL Santa looks pretty average sized overall, but the coke Santa is the massively obese jelly bellied Santa...
And those small differences have really become characteristic. What I mean is that if you ask somebody to describe or draw Santa 90 years later, it's going to have those characteristics of the coke Santa.
And while there have been plenty of changes throughout the centuries, some big some small it really hasn't been any change in Santa since 1931.
So the reason it's not a total myth is that they did cement the characteristics and refined the image of the modern Santa.
Though I wouldn't be surprised if he looked completely different than another 100 years.
I tried to make this same point and kept getting downvoted by dullards.
He's red like the mushroom that grows only beneath deciduous trees.
With white sprinkled in, he fly's with agate unmatched.
It's not about red.
It's about the plump dude wearing exactly that outfit.
That was inspired by a cartoonist named Thomas Nast.
https://france-amerique.com/the-invention-of-santa-claus-from-thomas-nast-to-coca-cola/
Saint-->Nast-->Nast imitators-->Coke ad
Hopefully David Harbour's Santa will address it and put this to rest once and for all in a "Violent Night 2" movie.
Santa was a commie from the start
My article on this subject;
https://fakehistoryhunter.net/2021/12/03/coca-cola-did-not-create-santa/
Neat. I'll have to own up to spreading the myth, but at least I learned something new.
You made this?
...
I made this.
Santa Claus was bff's with Krampus.
Sounds like Coca-Cola hired a PR person
I did not know that Coca-Cola did not design the modern Santa Claus.
Coca-Cola made him red and white, instead of black fur.
Nope. See images from 1902: https://erinsweeneydesign.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/1012548_1100449943328358_2349550661352163719_n.jpg
narrative?
People complain about the commodifying of Christmas all the time. I don't think a company would want to be the go-to example.
I’m not sure if this article is completely true. I remember an old Christmas ornament my parents had that was from the 70’s of Santa dressed in green. I think from the 80’s onwards Santa is depicted wearing only red.
Republicans! tut
Fk the klaus
Morall_tach t1_j23wssr wrote
The poem "A Visit From Saint Nicholas" from 1823 created a lot of what we now think of as canon Santa lore. First mention of a sleigh pulled by reindeer, for example.