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SignificantView1671 t1_j5kawlj wrote

Luckily for him, his employer did not demand at least 4 years of experience with Cubism.


deaddonkey t1_j5ljyo6 wrote

I bet he could’ve done just fine as a Cubist, had the idea ever been introduced to him


Aurakeks t1_j5nbu9h wrote

da Vinci definitely was the kind of guy you'd only need to explain board game rules to once, forget to mention half of them and he'd still play it better than you.


AnglerJared t1_j5ngoyq wrote

He’d just castle intuitively. And don’t even get me started on his en passant.


__erk t1_j5movi6 wrote

“We apologize for the inconvenience, but you must fill out an application and piss in a cup just like everyone else, ye entitled millennial!”


baelrog t1_j5np8at wrote

Millennials are pushing 40 now, can we finally pass the torch of things blamed on us to genZ now?


Pfeffer_Prinz OP t1_j5k2z6i wrote

The letter:

> My Most Illustrious Lord,

> Having now sufficiently seen and considered the achievements of all those who count themselves masters and artificers of instruments of war, and having noted that the invention and performance of the said instruments is in no way different from that in common usage, I shall endeavour, while intending no discredit to anyone else, to make myself understood to Your Excellency for the purpose of unfolding to you my secrets, and thereafter offering them at your complete disposal, and when the time is right bringing into effective operation all those things which are in part briefly listed below:

> 1. I have plans for very light, strong and easily portable bridges with which to pursue and, on some occasions, flee the enemy, and others, sturdy and indestructible either by fire or in battle, easy and convenient to lift and place in position. Also means of burning and destroying those of the enemy.

> 2. I know how, in the course of the siege of a terrain, to remove water from the moats and how to make an infinite number of bridges, mantlets and scaling ladders and other instruments necessary to such an enterprise.

> 3. Also, if one cannot, when besieging a terrain, proceed by bombardment either because of the height of the glacis or the strength of its situation and location, I have methods for destroying every fortress or other stranglehold unless it has been founded upon a rock or so forth.

> 4. I have also types of cannon, most convenient and easily portable, with which to hurl small stones almost like a hail-storm; and the smoke from the cannon will instil a great fear in the enemy on account of the grave damage and confusion.

> 5. Also, I have means of arriving at a designated spot through mines and secret winding passages constructed completely without noise, even if it should be necessary to pass underneath moats or any river.

> 6. Also, I will make covered vehicles, safe and unassailable, which will penetrate the enemy and their artillery, and there is no host of armed men so great that they would not break through it. And behind these the infantry will be able to follow, quite uninjured and unimpeded.

> 7. Also, should the need arise, I will make cannon, mortar and light ordnance of very beautiful and functional design that are quite out of the ordinary.

> 8. Where the use of cannon is impracticable, I will assemble catapults, mangonels, trebuckets and other instruments of wonderful efficiency not in general use. In short, as the variety of circumstances dictate, I will make an infinite number of items for attack and defence.

> 9. And should a sea battle be occasioned, I have examples of many instruments which are highly suitable either in attack or defence, and craft which will resist the fire of all the heaviest cannon and powder and smoke.

> 10. In time of peace I believe I can give as complete satisfaction as any other in the field of architecture, and the construction of both public and private buildings, and in conducting water from one place to another.

> Also I can execute sculpture in marble, bronze and clay. Likewise in painting, I can do everything possible as well as any other, whosoever he may be.

> Moreover, work could be undertaken on the bronze horse which will be to the immortal glory and eternal honour of the auspicious memory of His Lordship your father, and of the illustrious house of Sforza.

> And if any of the above-mentioned things seem impossible or impracticable to anyone, I am most readily disposed to demonstrate them in your park or in whatsoever place shall please Your Excellency, to whom I commend myself with all possible humility.

(note: a trebucket is a trebuchet)


Juicet t1_j5k83fg wrote

A particularly baller resume. And with some baller lines - “ Likewise in painting, I can do everything possible as well as any other, whosoever he may be.”


TheoremaEgregium t1_j5llpjf wrote

"Especially that bastard Michelangelo"


badpeaches t1_j5m5h8m wrote

"I'll paint your church, gonna paint a bunch of dudes with they dicks out on the walls tho."


RedJorgAncrath t1_j5m18g5 wrote

He doesn't even mention that other than Andreas Vesalius no one else knew jack shit about human anatomy and he's producing detailed drawings that were groundbreaking.


KonkeyDongLick t1_j5nb2j6 wrote

It was highly illegal to dissect and examine the human body in Leonardo’s time. The body was thought to be sacred, and holy, and shall not be messed with. This thinking did not dissuade Leonardo and others to fully examine corpses hidden in the basement...


brkh47 t1_j5kpkhp wrote

>5. Also, I have means of arriving at a designated spot through mines and secret winding passages constructed completely without noise, even if it should be necessary to pass underneath moats or any river

What does he mean by this? He builds tunnels without noise?

>And if any of the above-mentioned things seem impossible or impracticable to anyone, I am most readily disposed to demonstrate them in your park or in whatsoever place shall please Your Excellency, to whom I commend myself with all possible humility

Such a nice little paragraph. Highly confident in demonstrating his abilities but commending himself with all possible humility.
Well balanced, Leo.


LordAcorn t1_j5kqzbs wrote

>He builds tunnels without noise?

Yep. Mining was a widely used siege tactic where you dig a tunnel under the enemy walls and then collapse the tunnel to bring down the wall. However, this activity could be heard from the defenders on the surface who would then dig counter mines to fight the miners.


Quelchie t1_j5l3x57 wrote

ok but where does the lack of noise that Da Vinci was talking about come in? That shit doesn't even exist today.


sirophiuchus t1_j5l6ydf wrote

I read it as him saying he had a quiet enough method that it couldn't be (easily) detected. No idea what that method was, though.


obscureferences t1_j5lc4hi wrote

Probably something based on his other disciplines, like saturating and collapsing the ground, or a lightweight portable bronze meerkat on a stick to deflect suspicion.


sunsetclimb3r t1_j5myoul wrote

"fun fact! The enemy cannot hear you mining if you simply kill them all first. Allow me to demonstrate! I shall need a volunteer..."


Wirse t1_j5m8w2o wrote

It’s likely to have involved some men aboveground who would, at the opportune moment, clear their throats quite loudly and boisterously - thus masking the sounds of the miners belowground.


seakingsoyuz t1_j5la4r5 wrote

This is total speculation, but anyway:

Underground warfare made a brief resurgence in WW1, because the front lines in Flanders were on top of soft chalk and the trench lines meant that the Western Front devolved into siege warfare. Counter-mining was also a serious concern, so the troops digging the tunnels would sometimes drill holes, soak the rock with vinegar to soften it further, then scrape away the top layer and repeat. This was a lot quieter than just hacking away with a pick.


SeiCalros t1_j5l80l4 wrote

its easy you just put pillows over the rock and the fortress thinks somebody is having a pillow fight instead of invading from underground


oh3fiftyone t1_j5mbdy3 wrote

Salesmanship, probably. His “covered vehicle” designs don’t seem particularly practical either.


neoplastic_pleonasm t1_j5lfcau wrote

Or if merely collapsing the mine wasn't enough, they'd pack explosives in it and set them off. It's where we get the word landmine.


Daniel_The_Thinker t1_j5lnv8r wrote

One of those held the record for largest non nuclear explosion for most of the 20th century.


Clewin t1_j5lim43 wrote

In fact, it has a name - sapping and is done by sappers (trench diggers). Digging under enemy fortifications is called undermining and is where that word originated. Neither undermining or taking down walls was used all that often from what I've read - laying siege and starving the enemy was easier and less deadly (and if that fails, salt their fields and poison their wells before you leave...).


ericbyo t1_j5mkpf3 wrote

Probably well known because it was used in some extremely famous sieges. Constantinople, Siege of Vienna etc


CreepingFog t1_j5mj93g wrote

The response:

>Thank you for taking the time to consider Duke of Milan. Our hiring team reviewed your application carefully and we'd like to inform you that we are not able to advance you to the next round for the military engineering position at this time. We wish you the best of luck with your job search.


Blazing1 t1_j5ox93p wrote

Then they proceed to hire the worst possible candidate who bs'd the most


nomnomnomnomRABIES t1_j5kooqz wrote

> Moreover, work could be undertaken on the bronze horse which will be to the immortal glory and eternal honour of the auspicious memory of His Lordship your father, and of the illustrious house of Sforza.

Uh oh


Greene_Mr t1_j5m7knc wrote

You know what happened to that horse, right?


radio_allah t1_j5mvjhx wrote

"Also, if Your Excellency should desire the covert elimination of certain unwanted persons, and without undue resort to sound and fury, I count among my closest associates a certain Signore Auditore, who shall no doubt find it an utmost pleasure to expedite Your Excellency's enemies' journeys to the Lord's side."


Pterritorialdactyl t1_j5k3h89 wrote

I would like to know who pioneered the cover letter


Nazamroth t1_j5kctxw wrote

You know what I hated when learning english? Motivational letters for pretend job interviews. Who came up with that shit?

"Why do you want to work for our company?"

"You offer an acceptable amount of money in exchange for an acceptable amount of work and acceptable conditions"

But noooo, I had to be passionate about manufacturing cardboard or something.


bigbangbilly t1_j5kg0d0 wrote

This is why I have a hard time with job interviews. This sort of honesty is not what hiring managers are looking for


omar1993 t1_j5lsgkq wrote

Amen. YES, Mr. Doe, I CLEARLY have a passion for flipping burgers. What is this nonsense about a wage needed to LIVE?


__erk t1_j5moi1v wrote

Gotta remind us from the get-go who’s in charge, lest we rise up and rebel.


PreciousRoi t1_j5kguvt wrote

Employers want to know if you're motivated enough to get this job that you'd make up a plausible lie.

Otherwise, what separates you from Rico Pendejo? He likes money too, you should hang out.


deaddonkey t1_j5ljunf wrote

If Rico Pendejo is qualified and competent he should be a candidate for the job too 🗿


Love4KittyButtholes t1_j5km0zb wrote

I did hiring for most of my management career. I never asked these bullshit corporate drone questions. Mine were like "here is a difficult client situation, how would you handle that?" I just want to go home and play video games after work, want to make sure people can withstand the BS I have to put up with in an interview and somewhat have the aptitude to not absolutely hate the work. That's it.

When companies ask that question it's a red flag for me. It means their corporate compensation model is railing the "money isn't how you keep employees" Kool aide and that kind of shareholder capitalism will never get my talent.

Vote with your labor. Don't work for assholes.


tordrue t1_j5lopu9 wrote

“I’ve always been passionate about having enough money to eat”


SeiCalros t1_j5l8d8z wrote

the thing about the cover letters is that every once in a while you end up with somebody who actually IS passionate about manufacturing cardboard and the chance to hire a guy like that akes all the other bullshit worth the time it all took


AgentElman t1_j5kj4q0 wrote

If your answer is "You offer an acceptable amount of money in exchange for an acceptable amount of work and acceptable conditions" they don't want to hire you.

Why hire someone who will leave as soon as they can? The interview question is doing its job - it is keeping them from hiring you.

People seem to think that the goal of interview questions is to hire them. Whereas the goal of interview questions is almost always to not hire people like them.


Nazamroth t1_j5kkhw9 wrote

Why would I leave as soon as I can? As long as the conditions remain the same(ideally relative to the world around us), I will stay. Obviously.

Hell, I had a job for 6 years, and I hated both it, and my employer after the first 2. But the conditions remained acceptable for another 4 years (and did the job with high enough quality to get commended by higher ups), at which point they went far enough with BS that I left.


GrandmaPoses t1_j5l89pm wrote

"It says here on your resume that from 1490 to 1491 you 'crushed it'?"

"That's actually an old resume. It should also read that I crushed it from 1493 to present."

"So are we to understand that you did not 'crush it' in 1492?"

"There was a medical situation preventing me from crushing it to my usual standards. So I had to take some time off until I was able to crush it at 100%, at which point I resumed crushing it full-time."


Juicet t1_j5ltra9 wrote


"I hate witches. Do you burn witches in this kingdom?"

"Oh yes, we hate witches here too."

"That's not what I asked. Do you burn witches?"


UntakenAccountName t1_j5kr71k wrote

Leonardo was taken on as a courtier and mainly worked as a painter, stage designer, prop maker, and entertainer. He did not work in an official military capacity until much later in his life and he did not seem to enjoy it and left shortly thereafter (at that later time he worked for Cesare Borgia of all people, yikes). This letter was an attempt by him to branch out and away from painting, but it did not really pan out that way.

At this time, his painting skills were already well-known and he was of aristocratic class, though illegitimate. Beyond painting, he enjoyed experimenting and creating curios. He even used to make fake mythical animals out of other animal parts (and various other things) to wow and amaze people.

Italy at the time, especially Milan, where he was hired in this instance, used art, stage shows, and spectacle to express power and wealth. Leonardo was a useful courtier to have around for the purpose of helping his patrons showcase their sosphistication and nobility. In Italy at the time, the ruling class was intellectual and invested in the arts and learning, so commissioning and funding sources of community pride and respect was a way to gain authority and power. Leonardo was already an accomplished painter and therefore a practical asset to secure.

Milan at the time had a newly installed and wealthly ruling family led by Ludovico Sforza, who needed to consolidate his power, express his authority, and make Milan proud to have him in power. So naturally, he commissioned many works of art and theater—most glorifying his own family and Milan. During these years that Leonardo worked for the Duke of Milan he created stageshows, theater props, portraits, poems, and was even commissioned to make an enormous equestrian statue to honor the family. It was to be the biggest equestrian statue in the world and would have brought great renown. 70 tons of bronze was secured for its construction—it would have been monumental, quite literally. Leonardo worked for a long time perfecting various casting techniques and furnace arrangements that would be needed to successfully mold and pour the statue. He even made a full-size clay model of the statue, which drew crowds from all over Italy. Unfortunately, the lingering conflict with France got worse before its completion and the bronze was used for cannon.

On that note, shortly thereafter the French invaded and captured Milan. Leonardo was friendly with them during their occupation, so before Ludovico Sforza recaptured the city he fled to Venice to avoid his wrath. He then moved around a few times and ended up settling back in Florence, where he had begun his career as an apprentice before starting his employment with Ludovico Sforza. After several years had passed, he moved back to Milan in 1506, now under French influence, where he stayed and worked for some time. Then he moved to Rome in 1513 at the bequest and patronage of the legendary Medici family, who employed him for several years. He finally moved to France in 1516 to live closely with King Francis I, officially as a court painter, but mainly as an advisor, tutor, and friend. King Francis esteemed, adored, and treasured Leonardo and took very good care of him until Leonardo’s death in 1519 at the age of 67.

One part of Leonardo’s life that seems to never be talked about is that he was gay. Not privately either, he was openly gay. Florence and Milan (and other places in Italy and France) at those times were more progressive in many ways than we are today.

I made this comment because it often is said that Leonardo was a military engineer when in truth he rarely worked in such capacities. He was a painter and artist, an impresario, a valued courtier, and a man always esteemed for his great experiential knowledge and abilities of detailed study. His work as a military engineer were mainly a couple stints surveying fortifications, a mere blip in a long life of artistic creation and beautiful academic study.


RodneyDangerfuck t1_j5l78qs wrote

How was those very catholic city's/states okay with open homosexuality?


UntakenAccountName t1_j5lox96 wrote

With the revival of Greek thought and custom that marked The Rennaissance also came the practice of pederasty, although the full picture is much more complex than just that. The understanding of sexuality was different then, as well as the understanding of masculinity and femininity.

Further, Florence, Milan, and several other city-states were rather progressive and accepting of much, even while the church was not. It was a time of great change and great acceptance. There were traveling foreigners, ideas and goods from faraway lands, many new customs and practices, constantly-emerging inventions and improvements, massive public works projects, and a whole mindset of growth and permissibility. Leonardo himself was a bit of an eccentric dresser and took great pride in his beautiful clothes; it was not a time of timid conservatism.

Also, people like Leonardo, Michelangelo, Botticelli, Raphael, etc were rockstars. The fact that they happened to have same-sex romances was not a scandal like it would be today (or, say, 50 years ago). People would hear that they had a new painting or sculpture completed, or anything else, and they would come from miles to look at it and be entertained, moved, etc. Punishing them for pursuing same-sex love would be counterproductive and massively unpopular. Although it did happen, just typically not to people with such stature and public admiration. Theater was popular, as was poetry and music, but for the visual arts the best artists were like the celebrities of their day.

So I guess a more concise answer would be that a) the sexual landscape was more complex and not as focused on the whole 1 man and 1 woman thing, b) many powerful Italian city-states weren’t bothered by same-sex relationships, and c) people like Leonardo had a bit of a free pass anyway due to their celebrity status. He used his political connections and clout to secure royal intervention for family members’ financial squabbles even.

I would like to add to this picture that this is not to say that homosexuality wasn’t criminalized. For example in Florence there was a police organization nicknamed “The Office of the Night” whose task it was to find those committing sodomy. However, it seems as though they mainly just issued small fines—many of which were never even collected. It is unclear what the exact climate was in Florence, but it was certainly more libertine than many other places in Europe.


Landlubber77 t1_j5k7h88 wrote

"And what would you say is your biggest weakness?"

"I mean, the Mona Lisa is an overrated piece of shit."


GreatBlueNarwhal t1_j5kdtvb wrote

“My pectorals; they are not strong enough to flap.”

cut to sad da Vinci in an ornithopter


Mad_Bad_Rabbit t1_j5khkfi wrote

I suspect that buried somewhere in the Iraqi desert is a 6000 year old cuneiform resume.


_-__-__-__-__-_-_-__ t1_j5l9ipq wrote

Ea-nasir’s fake-ass resume


visope t1_j5lrxaw wrote

"We provide best bronze delivery in this land since the end of the Great Flood. Satisfsction guaranteed"


deaddonkey t1_j5lk4i2 wrote

“I can write!”


frogandbanjo t1_j5lx6vv wrote

"And if you could read, BOY would you be... uh... less impressed by that, I guess? Shit. I think Imma smash this one."


krukson t1_j5kodcm wrote

Imagine being a Joe Schmoe trying to find a job in a tough market, only to find out Leonardo da Vinci also applied for it.


LeTigron t1_j5mcdaj wrote

That's not true, unfortunately.

This practice existed way before and is called a "theatre of machines" : a book in which you expose your inventions and capabilities, as currently we do with "portfolio".

Konrad Kaiser Kyeser and Hans Tallhoffer are two persons reknown for theirs and they predate Da Vinci by more than a century.

Edit : mistake on Kyeser's name.


Pfeffer_Prinz OP t1_j5md60y wrote

oh interesting, I was just going off the article & wikipedia...

Do you have any sources? I googled "machine theatre" (and added "Konrad Kaiser" then "Hans Tallhoffer") but couldn't find any descriptions


LeTigron t1_j5meg3k wrote

Sorry, I wrote "Kaiser" by mistake, it's Konrad Kyeser.

Hans Tallhoffer is most reknown for being a fencing master, so I advise you to add "inventions" in your google search to see his book.

Use quotation marks around the terms, like this : "theatre of machine", so that google looks for exactly this expression, or else you wilm have results like "new machines in theatres around the globe are bla bla bla" that we don't care about.


Pfeffer_Prinz OP t1_j5mgpqw wrote

hmmm... the Tallhoffer search had 0 results:

> Your search - "theatre of machine" hans tallhoffer - did not match any documents.

for Kyeser I found Bellifortis, which wikipedia describes as "the first fully illustrated manual of military technology" ... Is that what you meant? it's cool, but it doesn't mention anything about applying for jobs...

Are there any links you can share for what you mean?


LeTigron t1_j5mhlds wrote

Bellifortis is indeed the theatre of machines of Kyeser. If you didn't find anything on Talhoffer - and I made another mistake, there's only on L - , which seems weird, you can try a video on youtube explaining everything called something like "Talhoffer's weird inventions".

I don't have any ressource at hand in English, unfortunately, but the term isn't that rare, you will find easily.


Pfeffer_Prinz OP t1_j5mmjjw wrote

are you just talking about military manuals... or about job applications specifically?


LeTigron t1_j5mn74v wrote

Both. The theatres of machines were resumes.

You publish the book with pictures and small descriptions of what you devised and let it spread around. You take care to not say everything so that, if someone wants something from the book, they can't do it by themselves and have to call you, because you're the only one who know what the drawings in the book miss.

And there, you have a job. That was the normal way for engineers to get jobs during late Middle-Ages, many did so.


Pfeffer_Prinz OP t1_j5mqrwl wrote

interesting... I guess that's more of "advertising" than an application... like having a website of your work, so people could check it out and then reach out if they need your work.

It makes sense to me that Leonardo's letter would be considered unique from that, since his document was specifically written for someone who was trying to fill a specific position. That's what we still do today with résumés.

of course we also do websites, but that's a separate thing


LeTigron t1_j5mrca5 wrote

Indeed, in such case I have no previous occurrence in mind.


SteO153 t1_j5kf96v wrote

Well, it was Italy during the Renaissance, you don't keep your power with just paintings and party machines (Leonardo was also a great party organiser), they have much less business value than a giant crossbow.


VentureQuotes t1_j5ldlg4 wrote

this is that dwight-schrute-style resume. mostly trebuchets, some talk about how awesome i am


gomaith10 t1_j5l007s wrote

'In painting, I can do everything possible' - definitely underselling himself.


vbrimme t1_j5ljb52 wrote

So the reason I have to type-up and format an entire page of bullshit, only to put the exact same bullshit into some online form, is Da Vinci?


daveashaw t1_j5mdaj7 wrote

Resume has not been topped since.


Syndicatalyst t1_j5neyjo wrote

The number of jobs da Vinci did and excelled at is astounding.


Useless_Lemon t1_j5nonz1 wrote

Imagine if they sent a letter saying, "Sorry, requires more experience."


LifeBuilder t1_j5kh47m wrote

Bullshit. Can he paint with all the color of the wind? Doubtful. If not, then LDV was a hack.


DanYHKim t1_j5lkhtw wrote

Mr DaVinci, can you tell us what is your greatest weakness?


NightSpirit2099 t1_j5lpu6o wrote

That was veiled threat, nice move on Leonard part.


LupusDeusMagnus t1_j5mkn0j wrote

It’s not a resume, it’s more of a proposal.l to sell your stuff to the government.