Submitted by rolloofnormandy50 t3_11dfnn0 in vermont
So it seems that Republicans in Vermont are more of the old school Rockefeller New England type Republicans and your current Republican governor Phil Scott wins by some insane margins. What is the general reception to this in Vermont? Especially since Republicans seemed to be favored for the governorship. Will Phil Scott stay in for a couple more terms?
We absolutely do have the crazy Republicans here and they run the Vermont Republican Party. The outgoing chair, Deb Billado, is a hard-core Trumper and I'm not sure the incoming chair, Paul Dame, is any better. It's hard to believe Phil Scott is a member of this party.
She's not the first crazy Billado. I was bullied by a Billado that tried to run me down in his car when I was in high school. I don't know if they're related but from the same area so it's possible.
Massachusetts is the same as we just had Gov. Baker who did 2 terms in an EXTREMELY blue state.
Larry Hogan was a moderate Republican governor in a blue state (Maryland). Similar to Scott for his anti-Trump stance.
> We definitely don't have the crazy evangelical Republicans here that much of the country has.
In Orange County we had our own batshit crazy Republican run for the legislature (won't do the favor of naming him) who is a self-appointed pastor and thinks women aren't designed to enjoy sex as much as men (among other batshit crazy opinions)—equal to any Republican anywhere in the US.
I don't think he's from VT. He could be but I've noticed an influx of crazy Trumpers mixed in with the folks that fled to this area over the past 2-3 years.
Nah, KKKlar has been around far longer than that, unfortunately.
The crazy evangelicals are all in the NEK
And the Southwest Kingdom
Is it more Rutland or Bennington?
Crazy republicans do live in Vermont.
From this article.
“Tarrant and at least two other candidates said the shootings in Buffalo and Uvalde were engineered by anti-American actors that have infiltrated the media, academia and government institutions, as part of a larger effort to usurp individual freedom and install a totalitarian government.”
“It’s the elites. The elites are orchestrating this — they’re throwing money at people and they’re getting desperate because they’re losing,” Tarrant said. “That’s my firm opinion.”
And yes people did vote for Kathy Tarrant. She lives in Waterbury so it’s not just the NEK or rural areas.
Jesus, she's basically describing the modern GOP platform. There are too many stupid people buying this crap.
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I dunno. Vermont as a whole is majority atheist but Essex county is full of fat fundie Christians on welfare who constantly accuse LGBT Black Hispanic people of being on welfare.
"There's no atheist in the foxhole" it doesn't matter if you practice religious beliefs or not at the very core everyone believes in some sort of higher power when put to the test. I don't say this to offend you or anyone else. I say this because at our core as humans we believe that we can transcend our transgressions of the past and become better, and to take it a step further if we can transcend ourselves then we become a higher power to some other living creature. No I'm not saying we become God's just better because we are less ignorant. At the end of the day isn't that how spirituality works.
What is the point of this comment?
Hating women and minorities? 😂
Phil Scott handled the lockdowns with openness and honesty. He ensured the budget was financed and balanced before signing it. He got my vote because of his actions, not because of his party. Frankly anyone who votes by party is a dumbass.
I'd say that applies to local and state level elections, but I would never vote for a Republican to be sent to US Congress because the party whip will have their way with them and compel them to vote for whatever terrifying stuff the national GOP is on currently.
This is the most important comment in this thread. Phil Scott being a rare exception, I would strongly hesitate about republicans at the state level too, because of implications for party power.
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You’re not wrong, he checked and corrected Peter shumlins absurd spending and for the most part only signed in reasonable laws. (Imo the only exception is the wack ammo capacity law a few years back)
Goes to show that if you support sensible policy you could run for under any party you want and Vermont will vote for you if your priorities align.
It's funny. I can't find proof of any budget deficits going back a very long time.
How did he ensure the budget was financed and balanced?
The 2023 budget originated from the governor’s office.
How many changes were there between what he proposed and what was passed?
The end result was a balanced and fully financed budget. Regardless of how many negotiators and changes were made, Scott was clear that everything must be funded with no deficit spending.
Interesting. Maybe you could also tell me the results of Scott’s proposed “lean management” plan?
It seemed you're confused what I'm asking about now.
In 2016, one of the main cornerstones of Phil Scott's campaign was "[reducing] the operational cost of every agency and department by one cent for every dollar currently spent" in his first year in office.
https://governor.vermont.gov/content/program-improve-vermont-outcomes-together-executive-order-04-17
I'm wondering if you can tell me how well that went?
FY18, Scott’s first budget included no new or increased taxes. FY19 saw the legislature overturn two vetos to pass with new taxes and deficit spending. FY20 saw that deficit spending removed. FY21 & FY22 were virtually identical budgets that had influxes of federal money but no deficits.
You obviously have something to say, so get to it and stop with innuendo.
I’m saying you’re giving too much credit for creating and crafting the budget for somebody who doesn’t actually craft the budget.
FY18 passed 9 days before the FY17 budget expired because Scott wouldn’t agree to the House’s demand that school districts “find” savings that would allow the school districts to fund negotiations their health insurance and avoid ACA penalties. Scott asked the House to allow the Governor’s office to do the negotiations which was projected to return 26 million dollars to the state and still allow a single consolidated heath insurance contract. The end result was teachers having health insurance and property taxes being reduced by 13 million.
A massive amount of back and forth occurs during the negotiating. The FY17 impasse was negotiated by Scott and Legislator leaders directly. Did Phil Scott sit and personally write the FY24 budget? Probably not, but since it originated from his office, he bears complete responsibility for it. Then there’s the small bit about the governor’s role in how legislation gets enacted.
Nvm, you have a good one :)
I bet you’re also the type of person to blame the ACA on Obama.
Should I thank Obama for it ?
How cute. You like Phil because the chains he placed on you during the scamdemic matched the color of your shoes. Openness and honesty are two major pieces Traitor Phil is lacking.
The abortion amendment passed in every county by 80%. When it comes to social issues republican voters are vastly outnumbered here.
I also think most republicans in New England are more socially progressive than the republicans from the south and Midwest that you see on the news.
Spent 20 years in Mass, 5 in Cali, 20 in Florida. Couple of takeaways from that experience:. You are correct. Southern conservatives make traditional NE republicans look mighty progressive. Boston gets shit for being racist, but baby, you ain't seen shit.
Ever see an effigy of a black man hanging from a noose on a gallows, in the back of a pick up with the words "Keep the Whitehouse White" above the gallows? No? Collier county Florida, circa 2011.
Fuck that state.
Why don’t you think some of that 80% was Republican voters?
Oh sure, and I’m sure some democrats voted against.
Are you really trying to divorce the Vermont republicans from the national party? I’m a truck mechanic. I’m VERY familiar with Vermont republicans.
Yeah I used deliver auto parts to mechanics in the NEK. I know exactly the type you're talking about.
Feeling out your position with subtle racist "jokes" because you're a white male too. Luckily, they were in the minority, even there.
I'm sure you interact with plenty of democrats too lol. One thing I love about Vermont is people really don't follow stereotypes.
I don’t think VT republicans are much like national republicans at all. I think many republicans voted for prop 5, which means when it comes to social issues they aren’t outnumbered, they are part of the majority 🤷🏼♂️.
I don’t know what your profession has to do with anything…
Profession means proximity. If you work manual labor with blue collar coworkers and interact with blue collar folks you are closer to the poor white republicans. This poster is right that much of the VT Republican Party is as shit nuts as the rest of the national party. Republicans make up 30% of our state. 60+% of them are just as idiotic and insane as the national party.
If you work manual labor then you’re closer to poor white republican? I’m not sure you could be anymore offensive or ignorant.
It’s not ignorant. Or offensive. Poor white people skew more Republican than others, and they tend to work lower paying or manual labor jobs. EVERY Republican I know works a manual labor job, they take pride in “working hard” and say that people in office jobs are lazy. They do things like construction, carpentry, landworks, granite shops, mechanics, truckers. It’s not ignorant to be honest and say that those jobs skew more low income, low education, and in Vermont white and that those people make up the base of our Republican Party. Basically people in the “trades”
A.) you need to meet more republicans, or even just look at what the Republican members of the legislature do for a living.
B.) equating manual labor to being poor or white is offensive and ignorant 🤦♂️
C.) what percentage of POC work manual labor jobs or are poor in Vt? What % of white people? I don’t think your assertion is even remotely close to being accurate.
Policy makers are not average republicans stop being stupid. Pretending that the base of the Republican Party is not poor white non-college educated working class people is moronic. Working manual labor in Vermont means you are white (95% of the population is so fuck off this is a fact) manual labor also pays less than white collar jobs, this is a fact, while some make good money in the trades, on the average a person working construction, or as a mechanic is not making what a person who is a banker, or doctor is making, they tend to be lower middle class.
You said every Republican you knew worked a manual labor job. Don’t tell me to stop being stupid when you make idiotic comments like that….
So 18% of the state is crazy republicans… that leaves a whole lot of normal republicans in addition to right leaning independents that voted for prop 5 and weren’t “outnumbered.”
I don’t think being a truck mechanic is a qualification for political science. It clearly hasn’t helped with understanding how republicans that voted for prop 5 aren’t the same as national republicans 🤷🏼♂️
I mean if 2/3 republicans are the nuts ones, that leaves 1/3 of them as not. That’s not a large portion or large number. Spend 10 minutes on a pro 2a Vermont Facebook page, or go to a Republican rally. They are fucking insane (as a pro 2a liberal who thought showing support at the state house was a good idea, I can tell you that they are INSANE!!!)
Lol… look at a Facebook group? And I suppose you think Reddit is a good indication of political ideologies too people’s opinions too…
You forgot about right leaning independents/centrist, which would make that 18% if the population more of a fringe group. Kind of like progressives don’t represent all democrats…
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You can’t statistically get above 80% with out a majority of republicans and right leaning Independents voting for prop 5 and clearly that makes them different from many of their national colleagues 🤷🏼♂️.
Dude I’m surrounded by Vermont republicans, they despise Bernie, they hate Biden, and they don’t like Phil Scott at all. Every last one of them call Scott a Rino.
Keep fooling yourself.
Your anecdotal experiences don’t seem to add up to 80+% and you’ve offered nothing else in support. Keep believing I’m the one fooling myself though…
If he does a good job, I don’t care that he is a Republican. Although I try not to think about it too much, because I can’t understand why he wants to be part of such a repugnant group.
He will stay for a couple more terms if he wants to. The democrats can’t seem to find a candidate that is electable.
He will continue to be the only Republican that I will ever vote for.
If he leaves, we get Zuckerman. Even the Dems are not happy with that scenario.
Suckerman is your classic neoliberal larping as a hemp farmer. Never liked the guy and found him to be as real as a unicorn. Sick hair tho
I remember testifying before that asshat on school funding and how the funding system was broken. He wrote me off as a schools board member from a “gold town”. Five years later the state did a study and our school was underfunded by 2million on a 11 million budget - the highest underfunded school in the state. Self righteous asshole.
Phil Scott seems to be well liked because he's not radical. He goes and does things that both sides like/can appreciate. This is how most leaders should be imo, we should all work together. Even though hes Republican hes proved himself as a leader so even though hes "Republican" VTers look past the label to the actual person. I hope voting doesnt change in this regard, we need to follow how the person actually is and not how they identify politically, that's how we end up with terrible leaders.
Many Vermonters are in the middle, they agree with both sides/policies. We may be a blue state but we have a good mix of both sides which I think is how things should be
Fun fact: in the movie 'White Christmas' (which takes place in VT), Danny Kaye makes a joke about finding a Democrat, implying that they were hard to come by in that era.
It was historically a red state, for sure. Finding dems then would be like finding the town of Pinetree now
Edit: wording, bad joke, etc
Vermont historically was the reddest state in the union up until 1970-ish, if you look at the voting record.
Really wonder what happened...
Goldwater, southern strategy, Nixon.
My dad says there was a Playboy article about "how to turn a red state blue" back then (yes, there was very scholarly material in between all that lewd stuff). The article used Vermont as an example of a red state. After that, Bernie and his friends "moved in".
But hey, who knows really. 🤷♂️
Wow... Bernie is from NY. Wish he stayed there...
I've always thought that Vermonters are practical, pragmatic, and smart. It's hard to truly BS folks in a small state, and folks like a balance.
That’s because Phil and Joe Benning are pretty much the only VT Republicans that aren’t sociopaths. VT Republicans would be much more successful in VT (we’re not loving a liberal supermajority but it beats the alternative) Google John Klar, Greg Thayer or Art Peterson and you’ll see why they are irrelevant outside of the pockets of poverty (ie, where I live)
Erika Reddic and the flat earther pedophile poacher Kevin Hoyt have entered the building.
Dk him. Where’s he from? I think Klar is the worst of all of them. The farmer that would rather have schoolkids starve than provide free lunch.
Bennington
All you needed to say
Can confirm, Klar is the worst. Even his own family can’t really defend him.
I'd vote /u/crisericson first.
There are plenty of Trump as well as Confederate flags around. I don't think those folks are flying them just for fun.
They are very sparse compared to other states. Truly a minority in Vermont.
thank god
This is true but coming from elsewhere and hearing how tried and true blue VT was my whole life it was still a surprise. It didn't match the reputation.
vermont has a reputation among a lot of progressive americans as being some post-racial paradise, similar to how canada is romanticized. and sure, its a good deal more progressive in vermy than a lot of states, but theres bigoted pricks everywhere on earth.
I’m moving up soon from Mississippi….why in the hell would anyone in Vermont fly a confederate flag?
It’s been adopted by the ‘I am a racist and proud to be’ jerks. See also Ram pickup.
Great question. Looking forward to you joining the rest of us in asking these idiots soon. Welcome!
Thanks! I’m excited to get up there!
The rest of the Republican Party in VT is just as batshit crazy as everywhere else. The chair of the VT Republican Party for example is a far right extremist in the same vein as Jewish Space Laser Lady or Floriderp Sex Trafficking Congressman.
He generally doesn’t act like a Republican to me; at least, he’s definitely on the left leaning side of the right-wing party. He keeps VT’s liberal ideals (mostly), and uses common sense. I vote for him because he acts like an elected official SHOULD, instead of regurgitating party bias.
Phil can stay in office for as long as he wants to keep running. VT generally love incumbents. Our last R governor, Jim Douglas stuck around for 4 terms (2 years apiece), and when he stepped down, he was replaced with a shitshow of a D governor who was even able to manage holding on for 3 terms before Phil took the office.
There are no other statewide R candidates that are competitive, mostly lately because they are strong social conservatives, which doesn't fly with the large part of the electorate.
Anyone who is comfortable being in a political party whose leadership is actively working to overthrow our government, even using violent coups as tactics, should be shunned from decent society. Full stop.
There were about 25 killings last year by extremists in America, every single one of them by someone who is on the "right." Instead of calling for civility, the republican party's leadership and most prominent members continue to throw fuel on the fire while throwing tantrums about people that suggest we should have access to affordable healthcare and things like that. Some of them are even calling for secession right now. I mean, how dumb are these people? And how dumb is anyone in their party who isn't loudly calling them out? Blue states literally fund red states. No one will want to live in their shithole country should they secede. So no, I have zero faith and zero respect for anyone's intelligence that remains a part of that.
Signed, someone who is also not a Dem and quite unhappy with them too. Why? The answer is in MLK's Letter From Birmingham Jail. Highly recommend.
Republicans in VT are old school? Have you been to the NEK? It's Trump land over here. Not a day goes by that I don't hear someone complain how.... "nobody wants to work any more" or some other Fox News talking point.
I have a Republican acquaintance that lives near Milton. He loves to go off and talk about how his daughter wakes at 4am for hockey practice, and although she only plays 1-2 minutes a game, she’s more dedicated than most kids cause she wakes at 4am for practice and then skates on their home rink after school.
One of these days, I’m going to snap, “she’s not special, every person on the team is doing what she does and more. Some have to work after school. Some don’t have the privilege of a private skate rink. Lastly, working with less than she has, nearly the entire team gets more on game skate time than your “hard working” daughter so that should tell you something about her. “
Vocal minority I would say. Essex is a red county to be fair but it's Trump land in Lamoille too and we are still a blue county by a longshot.
“I’m not a regular Republican. I’m a COOL Republican!”
I think most people here hate the republican party and hate the majority of the democratic party. They are both awful, so we tend not to look at the party and just the canidate
I'm of the opinion that if you care about party at the local level you're probably a hack.
I'd never vote for any republican for a federal post but I've voted for multiple republicans within the state, including every governor's race. A lot of them I've known personally since I was a kid (friends of my dad. I don't know anyone my own age who calls themself a republican).
I'm of the opinion that if you DON'T care about party at every level you are a fool. Where do you think the folks that make it to the national level get their feet wet, Nicholas?
You also clearly haven't been paying attention the last whole bunch of years (20+ now) as the extreme right, white supremacist groups, and even the Qanon psychopaths have been encouraging their flock to run for local office and a school board positions. Sheesh.
Jim Jeffords, yo.
Even Jim had the sense to jump ship.
Yeah, and it was a great moment. It was the big news story in the country and then 9/11 hit. I just meant a lot of us were voting for him, that's all.
The Mass and Vermont Governors usually can't actually stop the legislature. Knowing this, they must pick and choose their battles on things the left hasn't solidified on yet or stick to small critiques that can be easily rolled into a bill. This usually makes them very popular as a perceived moderating force. But, their power is limited because they can not be seen as anti democrat as most of their votes are coming from across the aisle.
I think if there’s any modern day republicans in Vermont they’re either very clearly right wing or they use dog whistles and try to pass themselves off as a moderate to hide their meaning and political intentions.
Found an interesting article about this.
A Republican primary for lieutenant governor reveals a broader divide in Vermont GOP
Edit: don’t know why people are downvoting my comment but Vermont definitely has right wing republicans and old school moderate republicans.
You’d be surprised, there’s a good portion of republicans in the state.
That being said most of them are pretty quiet about it or live in more rural settings. NEK currently has the highest concentration of vocal republicans and Chittenden County has the lowest. In chittenden county it’s almost impossible to be a republican without scrutiny from neighbors and other towns folks since it seems a good majority of the community is transplants or college students(Burlington area)
In my experience when talking with other republicans its more about limiting government spending and overreach. I’d dare say that most of the republicans here would be considered independents in other states due to most of them support gay rights, abortion access, and other personal freedoms.
I have noticed the divide is getting bigger though; especially in Burlington. I find that more people are focused on the national level and will outright disregard any opposing argument if it comes from someone whom they deem as republican. Even scarier are the patriot front types and extreme leftist who are spreading their hatred and vitriol to the communities further polarizing moderates.
So quiet they don't vote on secret ballots.
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I visited Vermont in the 1980’s and in November of 2022. I think it has a reputation as a liberal bastion it doesn’t quite deserve. Either my teenage self didn’t pick up on the situation or things have changed over the decades. During my recent visit, I heard blatantly white supremacist advertising on the radio. The NAACP is worried that Vermont is on the cusp of becoming a white supremacist hotbed and the Southern Poverty Law Center says it has more hate groups per capita than most other states (even more than my current state of Missouri, which is really saying something). No place is immune to this, of course, but still. As an outsider living in a “diverse” city, I think it’s easy for people who haven’t been to Vermont and even for many Vermonters themselves to think the state is filled with bunch of hippie progressives when the reality is Vermonters generally don’t have to deal with the effects of racially-based inequality on a daily basis. Beautiful place, though.
The only reason that Phil Scott continues to win in Vermont is because there's enough people that think he'll be an effective check on a Democratic supermajority. The problem is, there are Republicans that are frustrated that he's not more "right" like DeSantis or Trump. Some were already named in this thread and "never say never" when it comes to politics. You don't want to take chances that they would win, hence the need to VOTE.
Scott is done after this term, by choice.
Phil Scott is not a Republican no matter what he says…
Republicans are not republicans anymore. I’d take Phil Scott’s Republican Party any day.
Phil Scott’s Republican Party is called the Democrat party. It is who has the super-majority in this state already.
It is very strange how popular our republican governor is, I think he'll be around a long time. In my opinion as a lifelong Vermonter and democrat, I think part of why people here loved Scott so much was because of his emergence around when Trump rose to popularity. A lot of democrats felt really scared that this is what the Republican party looks like now- that being a Republican meant being a trump supporter. Then here comes Scott who says "yes I'm a Republican but I'm one of the good ones." He made so clear so early on that he was anti-trump. I know a lot of democrats who felt really secure and optimistic about the political future because of that.
Our democrats and our republicans are more or less the same
Omg where is RamaDouchè.. u/RamaShneider
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We have RINOs, not Republicans.
No, we have old-school true, fiscally conservative, Republicans.
Trump and his ilk are the RINOs.
Yeah, ok. Love those oath traitors like Phil, huh?
Eye roll.
Where were you on January 6th?
Scott is a throwback to what Republicans (and Dems too) used to be: people more concerned with doing right by the people they represented than playing political games. He's popular because he uses a rational, common-sense approach to governing and avoids the extremism so prevalent elsewhere. We would all be better off it more of our elected officials would follow suit.
I personally hate Scott, wish there was a half decent alternative!
I hate Scott, and he’s honestly only playing lip service to being “not like the others”. Sure, he’s not actively advocating for hate against other humans, but I consider that the bare minimum for being allowed to interact with society.
21stCenturyJanes t1_ja8gzbq wrote
We definitely don't have the crazy evangelical Republicans here that much of the country has. Our Republicans tend to be more "I don't want to pay taxes and let me have my guns" type than conservative on social issues like hating women and minorities.
Phil Scott opposed Trump's hateful rhetoric from early on, I appreciate that about him. He's not an insane, hateful Republican.