Comments
Aronomous t1_ixzwxn9 wrote
> this thread really brought the climate change deniers out of the woodwork lmao
Lol right? It’s kind of a trip. Arm chair scientists who have never baled hay, as they say.
I for one am 100% going to listen to the person on Reddit who uses the word “lemmings” in his climate dissertation. /s
Walruzuma t1_ixxv6hv wrote
Please define 'climate change deniers'. There are very few people who would deny the climate was different during the Triassic, Jurassic and Cretaceous. The question is, whether the population has been so brainwashed by media and political agendas to believe the last 150 ish years is anything other than coming out of 'The Little Ice Age', a period that culminates 'The Renaissance' where temperatures were over 2 degrees higher than today.
Twombls t1_ixxw3sh wrote
Ill explain it super simplified so that climate change deniers with less than a 3rd grade education can understand.
Carbon is trapped underground. In the form of coal and oil.
This got trapped long before humans existed. Before decomposers existed really.
Humans dig up and burn oil and coal releasing the carbon.
This warms the planet back up. Sadly none of the animals from the jurassic and cretatious period still exist. So the current ones really aren't adapted to survive it. And humans are making the climate change on a human scale of time. Historically climate change would be on a geological scale.
Walruzuma t1_ixxyxe8 wrote
I'll agree, that's a 3rd grade understanding. Because Graduate School will teach you that increased carbon in the atmosphere will increase the number and size of plants. This is real and if you deny this, you have no merit.
EDIT: Also, your understanding of how all this works is clearly from a Politicians syllabus, not a Scientists.
[deleted] t1_ixxol87 wrote
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Walruzuma t1_ixxookg wrote
Global cooling would be more devastating to world populations, food and water supplies than global warming. Change my mind.
EDIT: Interesting people are just downvoting and not trying to change my mind. Sorry folks. Uninformed Straw Man arguments won't change my mind.
Twombls t1_ixxrmsq wrote
But its not just warming. Weather increases in volatility. Sometimes it also increases cold. Look at what happened in texas last winter.
Walruzuma t1_ixxthzh wrote
Actually not true. Our reporting on it has increased. Storms are great for the media. Lemmings eat that shit up. Let's talk hurricanes. We've had decent satellite since the mid 80's. But if you look at landfall data, which would have been the only indicator prior to that period, the 80's and 90's were a minimum period. Landfalls were less than at any time on record since 1900. Yet, since then they have increased, right? WRONG. The total number has increased, because we see more from the sky. But, at best, the annual number for CAT 2+ that have made landfall is at best even. We just hear about every named storm that years ago no one knew about.
Twombls t1_ixxwzak wrote
Oh this totally changed my mind. I have decided to run out and invest in ocean front property in Florida. Wanna buy some from me?
Walruzuma t1_ixxzmir wrote
Not yet. The earth has at least 2 degrees to go to hit the temps of less than 1000 years ago! You must have a limited mental capacity, so give me about 350 years and YES. I'm a buyer. That's what the normal climate cycles of earth tell me the seas will again be receding.
Walruzuma t1_ixxp7x0 wrote
Replying to my own comment here:
The written/retrievable historical record indicates that the times of greatest achievement, such as the Renaissance and our current situation, are when the planet is coming out of cooling periods (the dark ages and the little ice age, respectively). Did you know that the average world temperature was more than 2 degrees higher during the renaissance than it is today? The Media and Politicians are lying to you. Learn and lead. Don't believe and follow.
EDIT: Had to add 'and Politicians are' as that is the root of misinformation.
YOurAreWr0ng t1_ixwpqed wrote
I for one love the warmer winters. Adapt of die.
HappilyhiketheHump t1_ixuu5q1 wrote
Oh no. Out of state rich white folks can’t skate. SMH
Aronomous t1_ixv0coc wrote
As a Vermonter who skates and pucks on lakes and ponds this is an extremely unnecessary hot take.
Not to mention the minimizing of the damage being done to our trade and agriculture sectors. Go back to bed and wake up on the better side of it bud.
Walruzuma t1_ixxqkpw wrote
This is a terrible take. Humans have done substantially better during warming periods (the Renaissance coming out of the Dark Ages, when Global temps were 2 degrees higher than today) and our current period starting around 1850 when we started coming out of 'The Little Ice Age'. Increased temperatures release non saline water from Ice Caps and increased tillable land mass. If you understand what it takes to feed people, you understand these are not specifically unwanted attributes.
Aronomous t1_ixzw0rq wrote
Every inch of gained tillable land will be offset by the coastal saltwater intrusion due to rising sea levels. Nice try though. I would venture a hypothesis that humans do better during warming periods not because of arable land growth but more because of new technologies put forth to grow, adapt and overcome with the changing soil. More recently, it was the Industrial Revolution for god sakes. I don’t know enough about this topic to argue, but any conversation with a generational farmer I’ve ever had does not sound like whatever nonsense you just put forth.
Walruzuma t1_ixzxsp1 wrote
A generational farmer in the US started when? Early 1800's? Just as we were coming out of the little ice age? The climate has been warming since then. Since a couple decades BEFORE the industrial revolution. Sea levels have risen since that period and populations have boomed. Why? Because the climate is more conducive to growing food to sustain a larger population. Sea levels during the last full blown ice age (12000 ish years ago) were at the continental shelf of each continent, some 200-2000 feet farther out than they are now. Where was the population growth with all that 'tillable land'? It didn't exist because even though there was more land it was too cold for food species to thrive. How do you think a population can endeavor something as huge as the industrial revolution? How is it possible? It's because food was becoming more abundant. Some portion of the population can be dedicated to food while other subsets can do things like engineering and building because they aren't spending their time looking for food. Just like it was during the Renaissance. But then the temp dropped 4 degrees and things were thrown back and we end up with the plagues of the Medieval era. There was no food so populations were weak. It's astonishing to me how people can't think critically for themselves any more. They lap up 'expert' narratives that in and of themselves make sense only through the narrow view of their expertise. The big picture almost ALWAYS tells a much different story.
nolabitch t1_ixvcill wrote
This is actually pretty devastating from a climate and economic viability perspective.
HappilyhiketheHump t1_ixvdnyf wrote
Yes, climate change is a serious problem.
That Lake Morey Resort can’t have their wealthy, carbon spewing patrons skate?
Not so much of a problem.
nolabitch t1_ixve2yt wrote
It does, though. It reflects a coming, likely pattern of shuttering tourism and a changed capacity for Vermont to bring in money from the industry. You may not care about a ski resort - and, nor do I - but you might care about the Vermonters who may be out of the job when the tourist season dies.
Many, many people depends on these 'carbon spewing' patrons to keep their bills paid.
Loudergood t1_ixx98ip wrote
Very few tourist jobs pay anything livable
nolabitch t1_ixx9bxc wrote
Mmm-hmm. I'm sure the vacuum will pay even more.
Loudergood t1_ixxa40l wrote
Keep sending those bucks to Vail.
Upthespurs1882 t1_ixvkytz wrote
If you’re mad about tourists, Vermont isn’t the place for you
b1ack1323 t1_ixw2ehq wrote
Yeah fuck the VT economy. Who needs revenue to feed their families and pay for infrastructure?
CHECK_FLOKI t1_ixuvcyd wrote
So you're worried about out of state tourists when you're facing the damaging effects of climate change in Vermont?
You think this is a joke? Ice fishing season used to start late September and now it's almost December but the lakes aren't frozen.
Broomepower t1_ixv4ekk wrote
Ice fishing NEVER started in late September.
[deleted] t1_ixv67p0 wrote
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Loudergood t1_ixx9dmb wrote
Snowy Halloweens have always been rare enough to be commented on.
Walruzuma t1_ixxqvaz wrote
Exactly.
Walruzuma t1_ixxr2sz wrote
Our first snowfall was right on time.... It should have been later, considering we are still coming out of 'The Little Ice Age' which ended in the mid 1800's. We have more than 2 degrees to go to reach the AVERAGE global temp of the Renaissance.
[deleted] t1_ixxr4f3 wrote
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Walruzuma t1_ixxrohm wrote
I don't deny there is a climate, and I certainly do not deny it changes. I do deny the political and media NARRATIVES of climate change, which make absolutely NO SENSE in the records we actually can put a name to. Most 'Climate Scientists' use very vague interpretations of millenia old ice cores. I would argue those are deliberately ignorant.
CHECK_FLOKI t1_ixxs0dj wrote
I'm not going to listen to someone denigrating climate scientists.
I ice fish, I ski, I skate. My favorite sport is hockey. My hobbies revolve around cold snowy weather and I'm worried about the future. I've seen changes from even when I was growing up.
Climate scientists are not using vague interpretations. We're on borrowed time regarding climate action.
The end.
Walruzuma t1_ixxsx9k wrote
I'm not denigrating. I'm elucidating. The US Federal Government has prioritized CO2 and CO2 only research. Thus, these 'Scientists' are narrowly focused and thus apply a 'constant' to a plethora of other real factors, such as solar activity, earth magnetic shifts, etc. etc. I'm sure you have already studied and understand each of the 100+ discounted factors. Have fun skiing.
Walruzuma t1_ixxu3mr wrote
LOL @ your 'borrowed time' comment. The planet was over 2 degrees warmer during the relatively recent "Renaissance" than it is today ffs. The 'crisis' is manufactured.
cblue413 t1_ixuweex wrote
Not to mention the loss of tourism $ when people don’t come to VT for things like this.
Loudergood t1_ixx9eve wrote
Offset by a longer summer.
mycophdstudent t1_ixv60k2 wrote
Been here since 1983 and never has ice fishing season started before peak leaf peeping season. That would require a quarter inch of lake ice in late September which is early autumn before the leaves fall. 78% of the state agreage is woodland acres which sinks most of the state's carbon emissions so dont beat us up too hard for breathing.
[deleted] t1_ixv6hcm wrote
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birdshitluck t1_ixv13o7 wrote
Ironically you can certainly point to tourism as a factor in climate change
YOurAreWr0ng t1_ixwpw46 wrote
We’ll be ok. Rich resorts lose income and the rest of us don’t lose our homes due to heating costs.
[deleted] t1_ixwqsa2 wrote
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HappilyhiketheHump t1_ixv3sq2 wrote
Lake Morey resort is the focus of the piece. Who do you think uses that resort CHECK?
meinblown t1_ixva5gg wrote
Ur mum?
hideous-boy t1_ixvkwpb wrote
holy shit touch some grass. Luckily you still can at this point in the year because of climate change
Walruzuma t1_ixxqtcj wrote
The climate changes. All the time. We are at lower than 'normal' temps for November this year. Yet people are freaking out. Ridiculous.
VermontZerg t1_ixv5nx8 wrote
How fucking short sited can you be?
Falconlordhank t1_ixvhjur wrote
apparently very. "idc if i cant enjoy my hobbies, so long as the damn out of staters cant either!"
HappilyhiketheHump t1_ixvddf3 wrote
Article is about not being able to skate at Lake Morey Resort due to climate change. Who do you think stays there? Did you read the article or are you just being by obtuse?
Aronomous t1_ixvkn9f wrote
I go skate the track at Lake Morey often and so do a lot of other locals I know. Plus it’s owned by locals who are going to have a rough time, on top of the already had rough time of the last two years, that should be enough for you to care. I’d arguably take a wealthy flatlander over your attitude anyday. Get off it.
Man_On_Mars t1_ixvpzh7 wrote
Do you think global warming is isolated to this particular resort on this particular lake, while all the other ponds and lakes in Vermont and on Earth are spared?
HappilyhiketheHump t1_ixvvlac wrote
Nope. Never said that. Just stating how silly it is to worry about rich tourists skating at Lake Morey Resort.
b1ack1323 t1_ixw2lnx wrote
You mean the ones that give piles of money to your state? Tourism is the only thing holding the state together financially.
YOurAreWr0ng t1_ixwq3ee wrote
Not true at all. Tourism helps the 1% who run them and the 2% of people in the state they employ.
b1ack1323 t1_ixx0fkg wrote
Restaurants, stores, inns, campgrounds, rental shops, all the people that work at these places….
Who the fuck do you think buys are the syrup that’s being produced?
Those are all run by normal people but okay.
$3 billion spent on those things by tourists every year.
That’s 30000 jobs or 10% of the workforce.
YOurAreWr0ng t1_ixx380n wrote
Wow, I really hope your insider stock trading is paying off more than your Tucker Carlson style reply’s. Yes some local businesses profit off of the 2 months a year ski season. Maybe they shouldn’t be leaches hoping the fat cow come into town and make a real business that can stand the tests of time.
b1ack1323 t1_ixx4k9u wrote
Right, no one camps or hikes.
It’s pretty wild that you think straight stats are FAUX news. Its delusional to think that nearly $400 million in tax revenue and 10% of the workforce is a drop in the bucket. Things like restaurants and shops, are not seasonal. Places like Burlington and Brattleboro are huge hubs for travelers in the summer.
Denying that one of the oldest business models in the world is “not a real business” is just hilarious all by itself. If you just want the whole state to turn into factories and warehouses instead of trees that’s your prerogative because that’s the other big employer of VT.
It’s okay man, the world revolves around you and you get to keep a whole state to yourself, you own it not the fat cats. You and your entitlement.
twowheels t1_ixvqwsf wrote
Living in Vermont, I’m saddened by this news…
Twombls t1_ixxrr6w wrote
this thread really brought the climate change deniers out of the woodwork lmao