alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy3t7a6 wrote
It's hard to have intellectual discourse when one side literally hangs flags outside their house saying f'ck your feelings.
pjdog603 OP t1_iy3vyko wrote
It doesn’t seem this group attracts that type of person, and if it does, it doesn’t seem they stick around:
“‘There are some people on both ends of the political spectrum who are unable to have a civil conversation, to disagree without being disagreeable, and they pretty much self-prune,’ said Pipes, 59, a retiree who spends hours in his orchard at his home in Fairfield.”
alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy3xxx9 wrote
In all sincerity all of my 45 years of life experience leads me to believe this will be a one sided discourse selling single sided perspectives to try and convert people to more conservative thinking.
hideous-boy t1_iy3yk64 wrote
the article pretty much says that overtly
the whole point of this group is to bring in conservatives who feel alienated by left-leaning views. It's not to find some mythical common ground. It's to dilute any progressive view into something worthless that's palatable and unthreatening for conservatives
alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy3yr9w wrote
And this is why I'll stay in the woods. The last thing we need is a more selfish world.
[deleted] t1_iy434qp wrote
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patriarchgoldstien t1_iy4gbg2 wrote
45 years and still equating "one side" to a flag saying "fuck your feelings", still got some growing up to do I see.
alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy4kkfb wrote
Trump had a.n 81% approval rating amongst Republicans, the other 19% were complacent with his behavior. Try all the bs you want...they are and will always be the "fuck your feelings crowd" only some are dumb enough to hang a flag about it.
lookaflyingbuttress t1_iy3ywrx wrote
If this conservative group is "enlightened" and not MAGA cultists they wish to disassociate, then their time is much better spent talking down cultists instead of trying to split progressives from Democrats.
That is, if you and this group are honest about your goals. The fact the goal of this group is to have "discussions" with progressives (but not Democrats) is telling. Why reach across the divide to only one group, and not the largest opposition group? Nah, not even the most outlandish would think conservatives would help further their goals more than Democrats.
You're transparent.
NowIAmThatGuy t1_iy4cd2g wrote
This person gets it. Fix your own house before you try and have conversations with others. If conservatives want to be legitimate then confront the racism and fascism in their own party. Otherwise no thank you. I realize not all conservatives are racist fascist, but it’s hard to know. So fix that and I’m happy to listen and share.
hideous-boy t1_iy3xrr1 wrote
this is drawing the same false equivalency though
one end of the spectrum refuses to have civil conversation because the other side thinks it's entirely valid to debate their right to exist and live like everyone else.
the other end of the spectrum refuses because they actively threaten marginalized groups and are responsible for a vast majority of the domestic terrorism vs these groups
[deleted] t1_iy41v5x wrote
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5teerPike t1_iy43duv wrote
See that's the problem though, one side is actually disgusting and the other is not.
Edit: can this "both sides" guy ensure an environment where I won't be called slurs, or worse, for being queer & Jewish?
Can they explain how it's valid to call me a gr**mer just for being non binary? Despite the fact that this is just plain libel/ slander?
After the ensuing conversation I'm going to assume the answer to my questions is a No.
Edit 2: it won't let me respond to another comment, so I'll just add it here
Racism, sexism, anti semetism, and hating LGBT people is disgusting.
And asking me "do you think you will win anyone over" is assuming I haven't ever tried being nice. I have. It doesn't work when the other person says "fuck your feelings".
Oh and these aren't teams. This isn't some game to me. Personal politics fall on a spectrum, and I just don't believe in the "both sides" horseshoe fallacy. Many people I know who aren't disgusting have views I don't agree with, and I have thoughtful, kind conversations with them nonetheless. It helps a lot when the core beliefs of the person you disagree with don't involve dehumanizing myself or others.
Links added. Facts cited.
[deleted] t1_iy45tkv wrote
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you_give_me_coupon t1_iy90di5 wrote
> See that's the problem though, one side is actually disgusting and the other is not.
Without getting into whether or not you're right - let's say you are - what's your intent here? Do you think you will win anyone over to your team by calling them disgusting? Or is that not the point, and this is aimed at your own team?
InThreeWordsTheySaid t1_iy40sht wrote
If it's a group that doesn't attract or keep around the loud and willfully ignorant contingent of conservatives steering their party toward religious fundamentalism, white supremacy and baseless conspiracy theories, then it already failed to achieve it's objective. We already know there are self-proclaimed moderates and independents who think we should all "just get along." They are useless.
EstablishmentHappy38 t1_iy7umtm wrote
It actually does, Dan Pipes, the organizer, is far right in many ways.... He just doesn't like Trump (probably because Trump isn't effective, not because he says anything far right).
brothermuffin t1_iy4av2j wrote
So how would you like we handle it, then? Wait around doing nothing until there’s a goddamned civil war? These people aren’t your enemy, they’re your countrymen. Fathers, brothers, FAMILY. Stop painting them like they’re all regularly in the streets committing acts of terror. 99% of them are benign and merely victims of an infectious cult like ideological phenomenon. We’ve been, as a species, resorting to violence to solve ideological disputes for… forever! Fuck me for celebrating trying something NEW
alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy4l7qv wrote
Unfortunately I think the US has to crumble to be re-built. I feel we are all standing outside of a propane tank on fire asking how we can stop it...we can't, it's time to seek cover.
triptopdropblop t1_iy51i6z wrote
Go outside. Talk to your neighbors. The word is not as bad as your screens are telling you
alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy52sun wrote
I live in the woods and work to co-opertism. My focus is how to survive regardless of what happens in the rest of the world. My freezer is full and my concerns are little
Jessica_T t1_iybsnpw wrote
Yep. I'm not going to try to reach out to the people who want me dead for being a disabled trans lesbian. If I wasn't white and was an immigrant I'd be their ultimate nightmare.
Live-Vermicelli-8771 t1_iy7prex wrote
Lmao you could be talking about either side. Your own bias is what makes it obvious to you😂😂
alwaysmilesdeep t1_iy7q1ut wrote
I have yet to see a liberal hang a "fuck your feelings" flag on their vehicle.
But keep hating those co-exsist subaru's...Cleary it's getting you all the farm girls.
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