NessyComeHome t1_iudb4oz wrote on October 30, 2022 at 1:48 PM

Reply to comment by Suessbot in Ozone Hole Continues Shrinking in 2022, NASA and NOAA Scientists Say | Annual Antarctic ozone hole over the South Pole was slightly smaller than last year and generally continued the overall shrinking trend of recent years. by yourSAS

Has nothing to do with patents. It has to do with the ozone depletion and greenhouse warming potentials.

Phase out started in 2010 and no new manufacturing as of 2020.* of HCFC'S like r-22.

R-22 is being phased out in HVAC. Prices for reclaimed r-22 shot up because there is no new manufacturing of r-22 as of 2020. Hcfc have a lower Ozone Depletion Potential than cfc's, but it isn't a perfect 0, for r-22 it's .05 with a Greenhouse Warming Potential of 1700, where r-134a has an odp of 0 and a gwp of 1300.

Bergensis t1_iue1t1c wrote on October 30, 2022 at 4:59 PM

> Phase out started in 2010 and no new manufacturing as of 2020.

The phase out started much before that. In 1978 the use of CFC as a propellant for aerosol cans was banned in the USA.

> R-22 is being phased out in HVAC. Prices for reclaimed r-22 shot up because there is no new manufacturing of r-22 as of 2020. Hcfc have a lower Ozone Depletion Potential than cfc's, but it isn't a perfect 0, for r-22 it's .05 with a Greenhouse Warming Potential of 1700, where r-134a has an odp of 0 and a gwp of 1300.

I'd like to add that the phase out of R134a in favour of R1234yf in car A/C began in 2012.

NessyComeHome t1_iue2tjw wrote on October 30, 2022 at 5:06 PM

My apologies, I was adding stuff around and meant to say r22 phase out began in 2010 with no new manufacturing of r22 since 2020. I will add a * to make it more clear.

Getting my cert, you learn a lot.. like just how bad cfc's were. If I remember correctly, it was 1 molecule of cfc destroyed 100,000 ozone molecules.

Suessbot t1_iufa6fp wrote on October 30, 2022 at 9:52 PM

> Has nothing to do with patents. It has to do with the ozone depletion and greenhouse warming potentials

It has everything to do with parents. Sure, they tell a nice story about saving the ozone (that was already closing) but it's convenient that every time the parents run out, it gets banned and there is a shiney new refrigerant that is "so much safer".
Whether it really is safer or not, they come up with a new one everytime patents run out.
R12 ran out in the 90s. R134 ran out in the 10s. The new one will run out in the 30s.

NessyComeHome t1_iufaov7 wrote on October 30, 2022 at 9:56 PM

Ozone hole was closing due to banning of CFC. CFC was extremely harmful to the environment.

R-22 is less harmful but still has an ODP, and a stronger GWP than r134a.

Not everything is a corprotacracy conspiracy.

Suessbot t1_iufcxzd wrote on October 30, 2022 at 10:12 PM

> R-22 is less harmful but still has an ODP, and a stronger GWP than r134a.

Nobody is disputing that.
Just pointing out that it's very convenient for the parents. If you think corporate America gives a shit about anything but their pocketbook then you need a serious reality check.
Also, the ozone hole was closing before the cfc ban.