Comments
Meme_Turtle t1_j218dkm wrote
I get the concept that history repeats itself but this is too soon.
Raletan t1_j20wjv2 wrote
One cost effective policy public health authorities could put in place quickly given the data blackout from China is sequence the SARS-CoV-2 in passengers testing positive. It would help identify any potential variant of concerns spreading in China
green_flash t1_j216v41 wrote
Italy is doing that:
> Italy has ordered COVID-19 antigen swabs and virus sequencing for all travellers coming from China
MidianFootbridge69 t1_j212kje wrote
> It would help identify any potential variant of concerns spreading in China
I agree.
They had better start doing it quickly.
The Indians are getting out in front of their situation by doing ramped - up Sequencing to see what may be coming their way due to what is going down in China.
Able_Golf_7301 t1_j215w70 wrote
- Is this an old varient that other countries are boosted against, or is this a new super varient that could create a problem? How mutated is this? 2. What if this takes hold in Seattle and New York?
green_flash t1_j218jki wrote
It's Omicron, nothing special. We in the West are much better protected against it compared to the Chinese population which has been completely shielded from all COVID variants that have emerged since mid 2020.
The only reason it's running rampant in China is that they abruptly ended their Zero COVID strategy.
cambreecanon t1_j22u5wf wrote
They ended their zero covid strategy when they saw how many people were suddenly testing positive and didn't want to have to deal with taking care of/quarantining that many people at once. They saw the data and the trend about to blow up and decided to just let people deal with it.
Raigerd t1_j20w70t wrote
Hopefully the UK follows suit....
laffnlemming t1_j20y72q wrote
This resuming of tourism is the stupidest thing that I've heard of since Brexit.
Able_Golf_7301 t1_j215q7s wrote
I think Chinese New Year is coming up, yes?
laffnlemming t1_j215uqs wrote
Everybody's new year is coming up.
Able_Golf_7301 t1_j2162me wrote
Yeah, this is how the orginal COVID really spread last time.
green_flash t1_j2180jm wrote
The original variant had spread across the world long before Chinese New Year and even before regular New Year. We just couldn't tell at that point, but later tests showed that it was already in multiple countries including Spain, Italy and the US before anyone even knew there was a new virus.
Able_Golf_7301 t1_j21ekff wrote
True. Wuhan was just where it was first "offical", and there are all of these stories of people who think they had COVID in 2019, before it had a name.
Petrie83 t1_j21whw7 wrote
Yeah, Chinese New year is late January this year.
Able_Golf_7301 t1_j22jn0s wrote
I remember COVID spread in a very big way, because of that almost three years ago.
Petrie83 t1_j24576k wrote
You're exactly right. I'm in China at the moment and very curious to see what happens this CNY. Having said that, apparently less than 10% of pre-pandemic international flights are expected to be running by CNY.
gaukonigshofen t1_j227aqc wrote
$$$$$
Able_Golf_7301 t1_j22joa7 wrote
Should be an intresting January.
WorldlyNotice t1_j25lp3o wrote
And Feb as the international students roll out
green_flash t1_j21697e wrote
Why so? It was necessary for as long as they followed the Zero COVID strategy.
Now that they've abandoned it they can also allow Chinese tourists to go abroad again.
laffnlemming t1_j216jrr wrote
Nobody is required to let them in.
They had sub par vaccinations until recently. Fact check.
green_flash t1_j21cuq8 wrote
Of course. But that doesn't make it stupid.
laffnlemming t1_j21fzi3 wrote
I think it does.
The Hill: US to impose new restrictions on travelers from China amid COVID outbreaks.
appsnaple t1_j216txf wrote
China went from one extreme to another extreme. They went from zero-covid for far too long then opened up quickly without being prepare. Seems that for the past 3 years Xi never made any plans for when he would re-open China and then under pressure from protests and from the business community, instead of a slow re-opening like many other countries in that region, Xi just opened the flood gates without having the hospitals ready, the medication, etc. I wouldn't be surprise if he did it as punishment to the people.
[deleted] t1_j21gfbj wrote
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fit_steve t1_j23xfo4 wrote
The virus doesn't play this way. With an insanely contagious variant like omicron (R number of 18) when you relax the rules you get an explosion in cases, not a slow re-opening. China knows this science.
appsnaple t1_j268s60 wrote
China knows the science and yet they don't have hospitals ready, are out of many medicines, and did a complete reopening rather than progressive opening knowing omicron is very contagious?
Sounds to me like you made up some BS to defend China.
edit: Oh, saw your other comments. You're the type unable to ever criticize the government of China.
fit_steve t1_j26sj5x wrote
Not true, I was a huge critic of zero covid and lockdowns when they were a thing. Now that China made the right decision I'm in favor because I want to travel.
Also there is no such thing as a "progressive opening" when it comes to omicron. Name one country that did so. All of them went through what China is going through now to some extent, just look at the US last year this time. It's because of the population in China and the lack of immunity at present which is why the surge is much bigger than other countries when they had their omicron outbreaks
[deleted] t1_j21xclc wrote
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A_Soporific t1_j22luh8 wrote
China has fewer Covid-rated emergency beds now than they did in 2020. Way more quarantine camps, way less in the way of emergency room beds. But the quarantine camps aren't set up to care for the most critically ill.
China could have announced that they were going to gradually reopen months ago. They could have done it in a phased way, building temporary hospitals (like they did back in 2020) and moving extra doctors and nurses from provinces still locked down to ease the transition in the area. Then, once the situation is stabilized they move to the next province. If they started with the most economically important provinces and saved the most politically sensitive for last they could have gotten everything they wanted out of it.
Instead, they held on to the lockdowns until something snapped. If the protests didn't happen then the horrible economic numbers would have. America is importing something like 40% less year over year. Strategic monopolies are being lost. Unemployment is way up, especially among recent graduates.
The problem isn't too soon or too late. The problem is if they were prepared for it or not. The only reason why they weren't prepared for it is because they didn't do the work while they had the chance.
There are people freaking the fuck out in China because they have been lied to for years about how bad it is in the rest of the world. It's such horrible whiplash to go from "everyone is dying but you because we have protected you" to "bro, it's just a flu". If you believe the Chinese government then of course you want the policy to continue because they told you that Covid is gonna kill everyone and Zero Covid is the only answer. If you really internalized that for years then how could you ever accept "lol, no biggie".
Despite officially hitting targets to vaccinate everyone, a majority of the elderly never got vaccinated. They only approved the more effective mRNA vaccines this month because they had been trying to strongarm the pharma companies to hand over the mRNA tech. They don't have the beds in hospitals prepared. They don't have a ramp up in doctors and nurses. It is too soon because they shit the bed in the planning department, but it was always going to be too soon because it really looks like the very tippy top of the CPC wanted to have covid lockdown powers forever. Unprecedented control over the movements of the people? The ability to turn anyone's code red at any time thus forcing them to come in for testing? The ability to put people in 'quarantine' that is identical to prison, only for your own good? Regular testing that just was between 1% and 2% of the entire Chinese economy that you can skim off the top from? It's a pretty sweet gig if you can get it. But, that just got in the way of unwinding before important bits started snapping and they couldn't stall any longer.
hkzombie t1_j22cp93 wrote
No prep work in mainland China for the case surge. Most of the world has high efficacy vaccinations, high vaccination rate, and treatment options by now.
Pfizer's paxlovid was approved in Feb 2022, but the supply wasn't enough to meet the case load (already sold out). Reports indicate that antipyretics/antifever meds (acetaminophen/panadol/tylenol) are also out of stock.
[deleted] t1_j23x0fx wrote
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hkzombie t1_j244fv3 wrote
>hospitalization and cases per 100k were driven by the vaccinated and two months after it was pretty clear no one was safe from it.
I have the feeling that you are going in a completely different direction, with your argument about the omicron impact on a population with high mRNA vaccination rate.
I'm not arguing about whether the Covid is here to stay or not, or about the impact of policy on infection rates. I'm arguing that the Chinese government made a major mistake because they didn't prepare for this scenario despite having an additional year to prep (unvaccinated hospitalization rate for Omicron is ~10x the hospitalization rate for mRNA vaccinated according to the US CDC).
pouredmygutsout t1_j22s6m7 wrote
Chinese nationals are in for a surprise walking into an American emergency room with COVID. Hopefully, they bought travel insurance.
autotldr t1_j20y1k0 wrote
This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)
> Earlier on Wednesday, Wang Wenbin, China's foreign minister spokesman, accused Western countries and media of "Hyping up" and "Distorting China's Covid policy adjustments".
> EU member state Italy - once the global epicentre of the virus after it spread from China in late 2019 and 2020 - has already imposed restrictions on people arriving from China.
> In India, people travelling from China and four other Asian countries must produce a negative Covid test before arriving.
Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 Covid^#2 test^#3 country^#4 passengers^#5
milkteaoppa t1_j225051 wrote
Tests upon arrival are the way to go. I'm certain you can easily make or purchase a negative COVID test in China and use that to get onto the plane.
Sea_Perception_2017 t1_j218wyb wrote
As it should be.
whsftbldad t1_j23dfl2 wrote
Other countries need to do the same, otherwise travellers from China can hit another country, and then enter the U.S.
anna_pescova t1_j21n9rq wrote
China lost it's way a while back with COVID. They have only realised it now. The deaths start very soon in massive numbers. Worldwide consumer products and logistics will be hit big time. We will all feel the consequences.
[deleted] t1_j2226qw wrote
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The-Brit t1_j22cz6i wrote
Controversial?
If they have Omicron or another variant that we already have hurd (?) immunity to then is this a real problem or just media hype?
A_Soporific t1_j22n07t wrote
So, lockdowns don't get you herd immunity. Lockdowns slow down exposure rates, if you're not exposed or vaccinated you don't develop natural immunity. If you don't have natural immunity you will transmit it to others. If you are immune then you create a "wall" that the disease can't use to reach the next guy. Herd immunity is when you have enough immune people that the disease can't find enough vulnerable people to create a major outbreak.
Many Chinese people haven't been exposed before, so they're going to go through now what we went through two years ago. It's going to be really rough on them.
It's less a question of timing and more a question of preparedness. China didn't do the logistical work to prepare for the outbreak that was inevitable once they eased. The sudden flipping off of the policy instead of a phased, managed repeal is setting them up for a much harder landing than they needed to have. That's the controversial part, the fact that you can't stall forever and the only thing that lockdowns accomplish is to stall until something else is accomplished. So, the lockdowns had to end sooner or later. Early lockdowns were a great idea. We didn't have vaccines and treatments, so stalling until we had them was great idea. No one stalled better than the Chinese. It's just that once we had the vaccines and the drugs they didn't stock up on them and didn't distribute them effectively. They rejected the far more effective mRNA vaccines until this month despite being far more effective than local variants. Something like seven out of ten elderly Chinese didn't even get the local stuff.
They bought themselves two years, and did nothing with it. That's why people are pissed.
[deleted] t1_j23ipq9 wrote
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kingmoobot t1_j20vh6s wrote
China: "you can leave the country now we're tired of trying to control it"
Rest of world: "hold up!"