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PrettyLittlePsycho16 t1_j5ketct wrote

Finally. To this date such crimes were usually prosecuted as crimes against the government. These people plotted a crime against the entire German populace. Charging right-wing extremists with high-treason is long overdue and portraits them as what they actually are: Traitors. Not just some goofy lunatics.


valoon4 t1_j5kv80e wrote

Its really amazing what this country can do after putting Conservatives out of the government after 16 years


HDSpiele t1_j5t2sst wrote

Non of the right wingers thought the union is conservative tbf I mean they refuse to cooperate with the afd wich makes them unappealing to the more moderate right wingers. The only reason the union held on for so long was because of Merkel. she was one of the most solid uncontrovesial poleticians ever seen. So aslong as they are not rebranding more left or more right they are not gona win anything being a center party is no longer the way to win votes in the current year. Also I remember afd voters shouting down with the Merkel dictatorship.


Entity0027 t1_j5k3j3h wrote

Wish the US would do this with the same gusto.

Instead we treat our domestic terrorists with kid gloves.


valoon4 t1_j5kv9lw wrote

Better, we give them Key Election Oversee Positions


HuckleSmothered t1_j5lrmgh wrote

Thats because our domestic terrorists are white.


nexusband t1_j5m8qjk wrote

What? And the German ones were yellow?


HuckleSmothered t1_j5m9rkf wrote

No, the German ones are in Germany where the government still approximately works.


[deleted] t1_j5l3oog wrote



Entity0027 t1_j5l67dx wrote

Kent state, MOVE Bombing, just to name a few instances where law enforcement killed people just because of their political position.


anpoca t1_j5lbbc3 wrote

I mean... shooting down dissenters is what's going on in Iran and Myanmar and that's... not good.

A wall of cops / military in riot gear is the adequate response, mowing down civilians is a hard stance to defend from an ethics standpoint.


DaNo1CheeseEata t1_j5liy7p wrote

What are some examples of this? Didn't The Oathkeeprs just get convicted? Didn't they execute Tim McVeigh? Isn't the Unibomber serving 8 life sentences?

And articles like these don't exactly back up your claims.

Germany has woken up to a problem of far-right extremism in its elite special forces. But the threat of neo-Nazi infiltration of state institutions is much broader.

Right-wing terror has been generally underestimated by German authorities


phyrros t1_j5lnhkw wrote

Sounds wrong but it would be a grave disservice to the UNA bomber to put them in the same boat as those guys. The UNA bomber is one of the weirdos out there.


SpaceTabs t1_j5nq006 wrote

More recent examples.

January 2022:

February 2022:

August 2021:

Alleged Boise neo-Nazis charged with planning power grid attacks in Idaho, Northwest

A group of men accused of being part of a neo-Nazi movement — including Idaho residents — are facing new federal charges over alleged plans to carry out attacks on energy grid infrastructure in Idaho and the Northwest.

On Friday, members of the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Eastern District of North Carolina filed a superseding indictment against four men: Paul Kryscuk, 35, Liam Collins, 21, Jordan Duncan, 26, and Joseph Maurino, 22. Kryscuk, Collins and Duncan are all former Boise residents already accused of illegally manufacturing and shipping firearms.

The group is accused of organizing on the Iron March forum — a now-defunct neo-Nazi message board — in hopes of creating a “modern-day SS” in the Northwest. The SS was the paramilitary group of the Nazi Party responsible for countless murders in Nazi Germany.

Kryscuk, Collins and Duncan were first arrested in Idaho on Oct. 20 last year, shortly after they were indicted by a North Carolina grand jury. Justin Hermanson, a North Carolina resident, was indicted on Nov. 18, 2020. Maurino, a New Jersey resident and member of the Army National Guard, was indicted in July.

Prosecutors now allege that Kryscuk, Collins, Duncan and Maurino plotted to use assault-style rifles to cause explosions at power substations in Idaho and nearby states. All four allegedly “researched, discussed and reviewed at length a previous attack on the power grid by an unknown group,” according to a news release from the U.S. Attorney’s Office. Authorities did not say where that attack occurred.

Some in the group had specific duties, according to the indictment. From 2017 to 2020, Kryscuk allegedly manufactured guns while Collins allegedly stole military gear and equipment, including magazines for assault-style rifles. Collins took the military gear and gave it to the others in their group, federal authorities said.

In previous filings, prosecutors said that Collins and Duncan were formerly enlisted members of the U.S. Marine Corps assigned to Camp Lejeune in North Carolina. Hermanson was still enlisted in the Marines at Camp Lejeune at the time of the alleged crimes.

From 2017 to 2020, Duncan was gathering a “library of information” — some public documents and some military-owned information — on guns, explosives and even nerve toxins, before sharing the information with Kryscuk and Collins, according to the newest indictment.

The group also allegedly plotted to destroy power transformers using homemade thermite, a material that burns at over 4,000 degrees Fahrenheit. Collins allegedly asked others to each buy 50 pounds of Tannerite — a type of binary explosive that can be purchased in the United States — in order to make the thermite.

Hermanson showed an unnamed individual an animated reenactment of the previous power grid attack carried out by the unknown group, according to the indictment. Hermanson reportedly told the person that if the group blew up a power substation, “it would take down the entire regional or coastal power grid and cause chaos for the country,” the indictment says.

Between Oct. 4 and Oct. 9 last year, Collins, Kryscuk and Duncan discussed plans to take out a power grid, according to federal prosecutors, who said that the damage the group was planning could exceed $100,000.

On Oct. 20, 2020 — the day most group members were arrested — authorities found a handwritten document in Kryscuk’s possession that contained a list of roughly a dozen intersections and places in Idaho and other Northwest states with transformers, substations or other power grid components, according to the indictment.

In the months prior, Kryscuk, Duncan, Maurino and an unnamed person met at Kryscuk’s Boise home to conduct live-fire weapons training somewhere outside of the city, according to previous federal court documents. The group also filmed neo-Nazi propaganda video during the weapons training, where they shot assault-style and short barrel rifles, and the video featured the four giving “Heil Hitler” salutes beneath the image of a black sun, a well-known Nazi symbol, federal officials said.

Members of the group were wearing skull masks, which are associated with the Atomwaffen Division, a neo-Nazi terrorist group in the United States. The video concluded with the display of the phrase, “come home white man.”

Prior indictments outlined how in July 2020, Kryscuk and Duncan discussed the need to watch the social media feeds of Black Lives Matter Boise. Days later, federal authorities reported that Kryscuk was watching a BLM rally at Boise State University. Kryscuk again was seen near a BLM rally on Aug. 18, 2020. In October, before their arrests, Kryscuk and Duncan discussed shooting protesters in Boise and the “end of democracy,” those indictments state.

Instagram messages between Kryscuk and Duncan, which were made public in January court filings, also showed that Kryscuk was trying to get jobs at Idaho prisons, and he was interviewed at least once before his October 2020 arrest. He also said in Instagram messages that he was preparing to take a written exam in the hopes of joining the Boise Fire Department.

As of Friday, Kryscuk and Hermanson have waived their initial appearances in federal court in connection with the new charges. Kryscuk, Collins and Duncan are being held in a North Carolina jail pending trial.

Hermanson was granted pretrial release in February. Maurino was released from custody earlier this week, with a judge setting the conditions of his pretrial release on Wednesday, according to court records.


Ga_Manche t1_j5mtfpc wrote

Too many GOP folks will get caught up in such a dragnet.


Long_PoolCool t1_j5nzn1w wrote

German here: Only reason why it came to this groups emerger was that the German government focuses too much on "Terror of the left" or the Media going wild calling climate activists "terrorists".

Even the former head of "Verfassungsschutz" /"defense of constitution" is heavily right wing and voices are rising to throw him out of the CDU (Christian party) because he is too racist and Anti democratic spreading false Information.


supercyberlurker t1_j5kjetn wrote

I can't tell the difference between Russia, Russia's 'useful idiots', nazis, and neo-nazis.

Maybe there isn't a difference, anymore.


babydick18 t1_j5kk5ze wrote

‘Useful idiots’ you mean Merkel and friends? I still don’t know if she was that dumb or that corrupt


Electromotivation t1_j5knxtj wrote

There was a window of time where it felt Russia could be economically brought into the modern world. But that window was a mirage based on rampant optimism and ignorance given what we (the public) has now gotten to know about Russia. But you expect the experts and those that engage in high-level geopolitics to have far better knowledge and judgement of the situations.

Safe to say your question is open-ended given examples like Putin actually believing his intelligence advisors about Ukraine, when obviously he has set up a situation where they would and could only tell him exactly what he wanted to hear.


circularhorse t1_j5lfxvj wrote

It made perfect sense before 2014. But they kept pumping russian gas for almost a decade after annexation of Crimea that Germany oh so condemned. Even after 2022 invasion, any step away from being buddies buddies with russia came with a massive hesitation and resistance


HDSpiele t1_j5t380y wrote

Germany thought they where engaging in a mutaly beneficial partnership where economics are seperate from poletics. This model can work but only if both partners are willing to play this game. Basicly no matter how dire the political situation gets the gas will flow as it benefits Russia and Germany equally but Russia the bastards that they are broke that unspoken agreement.


TZH85 t1_j5kz1pv wrote

Sure, babydick18. You figured out geopolitics. Wish we had a smart leader like babydick18 to sort things out.


JuniorSeniorTrainee t1_j5odtue wrote

I have a feeling they knew what their name meant when they deliberately chose it, so you're probably not shaming them the way you mean to.


babydick18 t1_j5l9q1a wrote

Schroeder literally got paid by Putin and he never even tried to hide it. How dumb you gotta be, like really.


Benzol1987 t1_j5n85wd wrote

You're getting downvotes but the part about Schröder is correct. This guy was (and still is) closely connected to Russia.


HuckleSmothered t1_j5lrjx2 wrote

Corrupt, always assume corrupt.


ReditSarge t1_j5me0wl wrote

Follow the money.


HuckleSmothered t1_j5mea14 wrote

It points this way 🇷🇺


ReditSarge t1_j5mhwlj wrote

I am shocked, shocked to find out that Russian influence is going on in here.

But seriously, Russian influence has been creeping into American power structures since before the fall of the USSR.


HuckleSmothered t1_j5mm95e wrote

I mean half the point of the cold war was to keep up the cold war. Both sides were making BANK keeping that scam going.


ReditSarge t1_j5pzhoa wrote

Some people on both sides were getting rich, no doubt. Ultimately both nations were eventually going to go bankrupt spending money they didn't have while accumulating debt. The only difference was that the US could afford to absorb the debt while the USSR could not.


Captain_Blackbird t1_j5lij5e wrote

All of these far-right crazies all have the same rhetoric.. to start a civil war in their respective countries... I wonder where all of their rhetoric comes from-

Oh. That's where...


barelylegal_69 t1_j5k3dur wrote

there really are people out there who look at the world and think “i wish things were immeasurably worse here.”


Gammelpreiss t1_j5kffd3 wrote

Yes. Because right now it is those ppl being to inapt to achieve anything in this world. That is why they want to bring it down to their level.


ksck135 t1_j5nrlzf wrote

This. Plus they blame everyone else for their life situation instead of trying to improve it.

Many also find war movies cool, because they never actually had to live through it..


[deleted] t1_j5kenxi wrote

Marjorie Taylor Greene: “Those poor innocent German patriots.”


h3re4thegangb4ng t1_j5ku189 wrote

And then 12 months later: “look, I went down a rabbit hole and got lost. Don’t blame me, blame society.”


[deleted] t1_j5l0cqc wrote

“The media doesn’t want to tell you this: Nazi means national socialist. National socialist literally has the word socialist in it. No one wants to talk about that link. Who are the socialists among us? Not me, not me. I’m not the bad guy here.”


restore_democracy t1_j5kgxzf wrote

If you want to overthrow a government, take out the health minister. They’ll never be able to function.


AmIFromA t1_j5kyxf6 wrote

For context, he's probably the most hated politician in those circles due to his work for strict measures during the pandemic (which was how he got the job in the first place).


Syntai t1_j5lh9dy wrote

This is so true.

I have friends and colleagues all arround the german politics spectrum.

3 people I know, which are very strong AfD supporters, basically dunk on Karl Lauterbach and Baerbock on a daily basis. Did a bit of research and it seems like most AfD supporters hate him because he (and Drosten) are basically the faces of the "Pro-Vaccine" movement regarding corona (you can compare them to Fauci) and most AfD voters are "Anti War" (Which usually means against supporting Ukraine. The classical: Not our problem - rhetoric) and Anti-Vax.

So a dude positivly speaking about the vaccine is a target in their eyes.

I've also heard one of them talking about "How the Reichsbürger are the only ones still being brave enough to speak their mind" and bs like that. The whole far-right/AfD movement here is ... well it's like in most other countries. They are brainwashed bots.


Robw1970 t1_j5kpihn wrote

It would seem much easier to charge treasonous folks with treason in Germany, damn the US could learn something here.


BavarianRedditor97 t1_j5mm00o wrote

At least you have good Secret Services Like the FBI. Our secret service is dependent on foreign intel and also is more focused on busting anti-facists.


Robw1970 t1_j5pad1n wrote

I hope your government works it out, fascists need to plucked from the roots and locked up.


Infinite-Outcome-591 t1_j5lu8xv wrote

Was Russia behind this?


roggenschrotbrot t1_j5ly27g wrote

Hard to say, but likely. "Reichsbürger" are the German monarchist an/or fascist version of the US Sovereign Citizens. Large parts of the far-right extremist scene are financed directly or indirectly by Russia, but a significant contribution comes as informant payments from the domestic intelligence services which have their own issues with far-right extremism. They did get some influx of new recruits during the Covid lockdowns, being mobilized again by (known) Russian financed right wing extremists.


DirkDayZSA t1_j5mkkix wrote

The Russian wife of the third-rate minor noble they wanted to put in power tried to establish contacts with the Russian embassy, but at this point it is unclear if that went anywhere. Also these yahoos planned to get their coup recognized by the Russian government asap after pulling the trigger. So even if Russia didn't pull the strings, the people involved sure did think they would be doing Putin a favor.


autotldr t1_j5k7t6t wrote

This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 78%. (I'm a bot)

> Treason charges have been brought against five people who allegedly planned to overthrow the German government, the federal prosecutor's office said Monday.

> The federal prosecutor's office found that the suspects wanted to take over the state and replace it with an "Authoritarian system of government based on the model of the German Empire."

> Members of the far-right Reichsbürger movement believe deep state conspiracy theories that deny the existence of Germany's post-World War II Federal Republic and reject the authority of the German government.

Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: German^#1 federal^#2 prosecutor^#3 government^#4 Germany^#5


WillCostigan t1_j5lioie wrote

Wow they actually charge their traders with treason unlike here in the states.


sgthulkarox t1_j5lpijl wrote

Seems Brazil and Germany have a leg up on America when prosecuting seditionists.


LookingLikeAppa t1_j5nrnje wrote

Honestly, while this is somewhat daunting as in : other people around me think like this, It's also crazy ridiculous to me that these people assume the German people would get in arms to fight each other over some vague ideology. While 10000 or so of these right wing nutters are a lot, they are a drip in the ocean compared to the general public and most of them aren't even equipped or trained to handle fire arms, or both.

For reference, Germany has about 83 million people and Berlin alone has 18000 cops in active duty on the streets alone.

Nonetheless, I'm glad they're catching up to them a bit more because no life should be lost.