Tearakan t1_je6tnil wrote

That would've been good 2 decades ago. We can't wait for that now.

Realistically we should be nationalizing most industries, completely shutting down useless ones, removing all non essential travel, ripping up roads and putting in massive rail networks in place with massive increases in nuclear plant construction.

Moving people from suburbs into either high density cities or rural areas used to support said cities, like we had before cheap oil.

And also providing people with the essentials to prevent mass civil unrest.

This is similar levels of effort that WW2 required.

Anything less at this point is just inviting disasters on a scale our species has never seen.

Edit: having renewables are great but they have a limit. They are good auxiliary power but cost compared to battery plants vs nulcear power favors nuclear fission. We can even add in further breeder reactors to get more energy out of previously spent fuel.


Tearakan t1_je6rvvx wrote

I hope it's only that small. I figure we will see large scale modern war with small and medium size nations fighting for what's left of arable land and water resources in their territory within 5 years.

A big one would be Ethiopia vs Egypt. Both rely heavily on the nile and have issues with food already stoking conflict.

I just hope it wont spread like wildfire across the planet.


Tearakan t1_je6rltg wrote

I hope you're right. But I'm afraid I am. With el nino coming this summer it'll wreak another toll on our agricultural regions across the globe. We already had issues last year.

Just one more year of that and wars will start popping up in poorer nations across the planet. Lack of food creates insane amounts of political instability.


Tearakan t1_je6r7lg wrote

Which would've worked had this happened a decade or two ago.

It's too late for this slow shit now. El nino is coming and it'll supercharge the warming in key agricultural regions. We already had issues with farming yields last year. Another bad year or worse and we will see wars popping up all across the planet. Especially in poorer nations.


Tearakan t1_je5jh3d wrote

Lol. No they aren't. The people who are currently hopeful and optimistic are okay with slow progress, which isn't nearly fast enough anymore.

The people who started the french revolution vs their king were scared and had hatred for their rule, MLK and his followers were scared and hated the oppression.

Hopeful and optimistic people don't want change because the status quo is working great for them.

There is the threat of falling into authoritarianism. But that's always a threat as the US government is showing now with our shitty recent Supreme Court decisions.


Tearakan t1_je5ijqu wrote

My argument is the whole idea of "take it slow" would've been fine 2 decades ago. We past that point. We need drastic changes on the level of WW2 now.

Not this slow plodding shit.

Yep the economy would be drastically changed and frankly that needs to happen.

The US just authorized even more oil drilling in alaska and the gulf of Mexico.

I'm a pessimist now though. I don't think we get our shit together until a majority of humanity dies due to starvation and war.


Tearakan t1_je3yzfp wrote

Yes there is. Far too many people don't seem to understand what happens during massive famines. They forget the war and horror that quickly follows regardless of how "civilized" a country used to be.

People need to be scared and frightened. Or they won't change.

That "investment" thought is part of the problem. There won't be any worthwhile investments if countries end up tearing each other apart for food and water.

As for mental health yep I agree it sucks. But that's pretty much an expected symptom of our fucked up civilization at this point.


Tearakan t1_je3y63j wrote

That's not my argument. Mine is clearly our current economic and government systems are failing to slow climate change. Technology wont save us from civilization collapse alone.

It will require drastic changes now. WW2 levels of international effort in a very short amount of time.

We already had issues with farming in a huge number of significant regions last year. If that continues we will end up seeing the largest famine in human history in a decade or two.

El nino is coming this summer and it'll supercharge the warming we already see.


Tearakan t1_je35xhs wrote

This is great but humanity literally had revord CO2 emissions in 2022 as well. Renewable energy being used in greater numbers only helps if CO2 emissions start to decrease.

Right now it looks like it's just adding more power on top of traditional carbon emitting sources.


Tearakan t1_j9ykwk1 wrote

Definitely nope. Then we will end up crazy house fires all the time with subcontractors hiring out their cousin to do electrical then only announcing it to the foreman who would conveniently forget it later.

And that's just the residential problems from unlicensed electrical work.

Imagine unlicensed civil engineering killing dozens a few years later and you find out that company already folded and the person who fucked up is already effectively gone.


Tearakan t1_j61g14l wrote

By overall GDP we are. I only went into GDP per capita when discussing actual effects on the population.

My argument about climate change is we can't keep global capitalism which is defined by endless economic growth. That's incompatible with actually surviving climate change.

Endless economic growth requires either energy increasing endlessly or increasing efficiency.

We literally cannot get to 100 percent efficiency thanks to thermodynamics.

And endlessly demanding more energy will just lead us back to climate change and resource depletion on this planet.

Finally, healthcare and life expectancy are two very important parts of a good human life. You can't just throw them away from the whole "people are getting better due to increasing GDP" argument.


Tearakan t1_j61ab4c wrote

No it doesn't. Our GDP is the best on the planet in the US. Life expectancy has dropped for the past several years. This includes before the pandemic.

There are many countries with much less GDP per capita that do markedly better on Healthcare for the majority of their citizens. As just one example of better lives.

Sure it's gotten better for the 1 percent and Americans and up. But again not better for the majority.

Wage growth for the majority of Americans has not beat inflation.

Yeah maybe look up climate change. It's a civilization ender. Especially if we can't farm because of wildly swinging temperatures and weather.


Tearakan t1_j5xiekk wrote

Constant economic growth does not mean constant progress. Unlesd of course you are counting billionaires wealth growth and inequality being the worst its ever been.

Oh and this little thing called climate change which we keep ignoring in favor of more economic growth.

So about 500 years of progress leading us to utter ruin. Not a great run for an economic system compared to the rest of human civilization's history.