Good point of view. I like that. I definitely think they are worth the read like you said. I just go into it knowing like hey this isn’t gonna be a super seamless and easy read you’re gonna have to work for this one.

Honestly I find a lot of literary classic tough reads. Which isn’t to say there are bad, it just requires a lot of brain power.

Dostoyevsky is widely considered one of the greatest authors of all time. I wouldn’t say it’s easy to read and it requires more thinking, not to mention it’s translated, but he’s definitely a great author. You might not like him though 🤷‍♂️

Yes there’s a chapter on eye contact

That’s 100% fair too. I appreciate your rational debate and thank you for showing me some of the things he’s said. I wasn’t aware of that and I completely disagree with those statements.

He doesn’t say that in 12 rules. I don’t need a summary for a book I’ve actually read. I’m not arguing about whether Jordan Peterson, the person, is good and above criticism. Im saying 12 rules is not some misogynistic, alt right creed that exists for incels. I’ve read it, it’s nothing of the sort. It’s fairly innocuous. If you want to criticize things that Jordan Peterson said in interviews you’ll get no argument from me.

I didn’t say you did, I was replying to someone else to start with. I can disagree with how people in this thread are portraying his ideology while agreeing with many of the (fair) criticisms of the man, some of which you yourself have just presented. But considering I get downvoted even for that I doubt that same level of impartiality exists elsewhere in this discussion. He’s a flawed man, with flawed views, absolutely. But his teachings aren’t nearly as dramatically awful as some people present them as.

I would agree with your distaste for that quote, but it’s hardly a view propagated and promoted within his book. Like I said there are many fair criticisms of Jordan Peterson, but acting like he’s leading people towards incelhood and the alt right shows a fundamental misunderstanding between random Jordan Peterson quotes and the actual material written in his books. I’m not defending every aspect of his personality, I also criticize him. But that’s not what he writes and the bash fest for anyone who enjoys his teachings is misguided by the flawed man.

Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t think he ever actually said that. If he did, you’re correct that is wrong. But you can be alienated without being oppressed. You can be alienated and not be a minority. I wouldn’t make it into a competition, but there’s nothing wrong with having a different base.

He doesn't encourage people to embrace misogyny... There are a lot of fair criticisms on this thread, but this is perhaps the most off base and blatant hatred by someone who clearly hasn't read him. Which is fine, but don't go around blatantly spreading misinformation simply because you don't like the man.

THATS what you think is the worst thing he said? I mean come on... Some criticisms presented are completely fair, but offering guidance to a base audience that feels marginalized, regardless of whether or not they represent the majority, is hardly something worthy of criticism.

I really appreciate this comment